New cars (4 Viewers)

[Mcbean]

Got a petrol Auto Skoda love it - both of us wouldn’t go back to a manual - also got an old diesel does 600 miles on a tankful - hybrids probably a better bet than an EV currently as running costs for EVs are about to go up with our new generous government

 

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[Nuskyblue]

There are 2 major reasons at the moment why I'm sticking to a petrol car - please feel free to dispel my thought if I'm wrong which is more than likely:

1. My parents live in Devon and is a good 200 mile drive. I don't like to stop on the journey as I just want to get there (and back) so do it in one go. When I'm there, there's nowhere near their bungalow to charge an EV.

2. I heard from a few sources that an EV is far from Carbon Neutral. Maybe when you are driving it it is but the damage it causes to make the batteries, ship the batteries etc means it takes years to make the car as "clean" as some claim.

Happy to be proved wrong on both points.

As I only bought my car about a year ago, I have 3 years left on the PCP agreement. By then, hopefully, things will have changed a lot and I might consider an EV (not ruling anything out at this stage as it's too early). I do like the look of the Nissan Ariya.

It depends how often you drive to Devon I think.

I have an EV, it pisses me of in the winter but that is only because I regularly drive 250miles plus in a day.

For most people and EV with a modest range of about 200miles would be absolutely fine.

Regarding the carbon credentials I think it is widely accepted that the carbon cost to make an EV is significantly greater than ICE but over time (and miles driven!) EVs will be better.

EVs are also way more reliable.

Edit: they're cheaper to fuel if you mostly charge at home, otherwise they are at least as expensive to run as ICE cars

 

[MalcSB]

It depends how often you drive to Devon I think.

I have an EV, it pisses me of in the winter but that is only because I regularly drive 250miles plus in a day.

For most people and EV with a modest range of about 200miles would be absolutely fine.

Regarding the carbon credentials I think it is widely accepted that the carbon cost to make an EV is significantly greater than ICE but over time (and miles driven!) EVs will be better.

EVs are also way more reliable.

Edit: they're cheaper to fuel if you mostly charge at home, otherwise they are at least as expensive to run as ICE cars

Road pricing for EVs could have quite an impact on running Costs.

 

[Nuskyblue]

Road pricing for EVs could have quite an impact on running Costs.

No idea what is in the pipeline tbh. I'm insulated from all these costs having had a company car for so long!

 

[wingy]

Got a petrol Auto Skoda love it - both of us wouldn’t go back to a manual - also got an old diesel does 600 miles on a tankful - hybrids probably a better bet than an EV currently as running costs for EVs are about to go up with our new generous government

Hopefully they're confident the manufacturer can afford to compensate, it's about time they became affordable to the average Joe?

 

[wingy]

Road pricing for EVs could have quite an impact on running Costs.

How would it be implemented,all roads or partial, how much a mile, what happens to existing?

 

[MalcSB]

How would it be implemented,all roads or partial, how much a mile, what happens to existing?

If they did similar to France, but using ANPR rather than toll booths, could start with motorways and major A roads. That would make finding the most scenic routes fun. Who knows how much, and it would be totally wrong to charge in addition to the level of existing taxes, including VED.

They can easily argue that VED is no longer a hypothecated to fund roads. It would be very difficult to make that argument with a straight face for road pricing, especially if there was a link with size/ weight of vehicle.

Its all being discussed behind closed doors.

 

[wingy]

If they did similar to France, but using ANPR rather than toll booths, could start with motorways and major A roads. That would make finding the most scenic routes fun. Who knows how much, and it would be totally wrong to charge in addition to the level of existing taxes, including VED.

They can easily argue that VED is no longer a hypothecated to fund roads. It would be very difficult to make that argument with a straight face for road pricing, especially if there was a link with size/ weight of vehicle.

Its all being discussed behind closed doors.

Of course it will be set at a rate that appears affordable for a few year's but,god inflation s a bugger ain't it!

 

[Grendel]

17.8% of car registrations this year are EVs - that’s grown from 6.6% in 2020. It’s clearly a growing market as more choice evolves especially as cheaper new cars and the second hand sector grows.
If you think there’s nothing negative about burning diesel and petrol then I’m afraid you’ll probably never be convinced. I‘ve already said there are negatives about EVs -if I couldn’t charge from home I wouldn’t purchase. I see more EVs everyday and definitely more aware of the stink and noise from ICE cars especially diesel when I’m sitting in traffic.

I would before you mock somebody for stupidity get done understanding of how the industry actually works.

Manufacturers create a production model and in the case of electric cars clearly have to stick rigidly to that model.

Franchised dealers then have wholesale targets. In times of declining demand manufacturers “encourage” continued uptake and creation of additional “demonstrators”

In the early 2000’s Jaguar had hit one of many crises points and there was a bottleneck of the X Type model with dealers having already a glut of unsold models.

I visited a small northern franchise that had from memory around 50 cars across two retails - I “encouraged” them to register every one of them to get the wholesale stock through. It shows as sales but there wasn’t one single customer for any of those cars.

The same manufacturer has £10k retailer support on its electric model.

All retailers are dreading the return of the first round of PCPs as customers will find they have to hand vehicles back as they are now worth significantly less than the calculated value.

This then will distress enormously the market as the cars have to be auction in the trade and values become distressed and the new car problem gets worse.

The UK is out of step with Europe in demanding pure EV only from 2030. It’s stupid. Also given Ireland is 2035 I look to see record ICE sales on the Emerald Isle in those 5 years.

 

[MalcSB]

I would before you mock somebody for stupidity get done understanding of how the industry actually works.

Manufacturers create a production model and in the case of electric cars clearly have to stick rigidly to that model.

Franchised dealers then have wholesale targets. In times of declining demand manufacturers “encourage” continued uptake and creation of additional “demonstrators”

In the early 2000’s Jaguar had hit one of many crises points and there was a bottleneck of the X Type model with dealers having already a glut of unsold models.

I visited a small northern franchise that had from memory around 50 cars across two retails - I “encouraged” them to register every one of them to get the wholesale stock through. It shows as sales but there wasn’t one single customer for any of those cars.t

The same manufacturer has £10k retailer support on its electric model.

All retailers are dreading the return of the first round of PCPs as customers will find they have to hand vehicles back as they are now worth significantly less than the calculated value.

This then will distress enormously the market as the cars have to be auction in the trade and values become distressed and the new car problem gets worse.

The UK is out of step with Europe in demanding pure EV only from 2030. It’s stupid. Also given Ireland is 2035 I look to see record ICE sales on the Emerald Isle in those 5 years.

Exactly.
Some early adopters with what was then a reasonable but now shown to be a high “bubble” payment will end up having had a near miss (lower monthly payments - no equity but not having to fund the difference) . I can only imagine those bubble payments will have to be set at a more realistic level, making monthly payments higher.
I was told that at one point Porsche dealers were refusing to take the Taycan in as part exchange because of the likely loss sitting on their forecourt. No choice with PCPs of course.

 

[MalcSB]

I would before you mock somebody for stupidity get done understanding of how the industry actually works.

Manufacturers create a production model and in the case of electric cars clearly have to stick rigidly to that model.

Franchised dealers then have wholesale targets. In times of declining demand manufacturers “encourage” continued uptake and creation of additional “demonstrators”

In the early 2000’s Jaguar had hit one of many crises points and there was a bottleneck of the X Type model with dealers having already a glut of unsold models.

I visited a small northern franchise that had from memory around 50 cars across two retails - I “encouraged” them to register every one of them to get the wholesale stock through. It shows as sales but there wasn’t one single customer for any of those cars.

The same manufacturer has £10k retailer support on its electric model.

All retailers are dreading the return of the first round of PCPs as customers will find they have to hand vehicles back as they are now worth significantly less than the calculated value.

This then will distress enormously the market as the cars have to be auction in the trade and values become distressed and the new car problem gets worse.

The UK is out of step with Europe in demanding pure EV only from 2030. It’s stupid. Also given Ireland is 2035 I look to see record ICE sales on the Emerald Isle in those 5 years.

I don’t think the 2030 has actually been adopted yet. I think it was an aspiration. It would be ridiculous to have a different date and not in keeping with Starmer’s desire for closer alignment with Europe.

 

[nicksar]

Worthwhile watching this video.

 

[napolimp]

in relation to car parks and EVs, it’s the weight that worries me, just not sure how many early 60s multi-storey will remain standing when full of EVs. And, yes, they do come in various sizes but if you want a realistic range of more than 100 miles or so they are going to tend to be bigger.

car batteries ar a bit bigger than the one in my iPhone,

Wouldn't worry about that mate, those older concrete structures were massively over engineered.

 

[wingy]

Wouldn't worry about that mate, those older concrete structures were massively over engineered.

I thought you had to go back to the Victorian era for mass over calcs, like the Clifton suspension bridge? Or is that the wrong era?

 

[MalcSB]

Wouldn't worry about that mate, those older concrete structures were massively over engineered.

Let’s hope you’re right.

 

[Sick Boy]

I was over in England earlier in the week and the number of EVs there compared to Italian cities is way higher.

 

[Macca]

Cars are a depreciating money pit. Unless you are doing a lot of miles or a petrol head I'd go as cheap and economical as possible. Amount of friends I have paying 500 quid a month for something to make driveway look pretty is ridiculous.

 

[Nick]

The New Renault 5 Electrics are a nice nod to the old Renault 5 but not sure 30k up front is justifiable?

 

[San Francisco]

The New Renault 5 Electrics are a nice nod to the old Renault 5 but not sure 30k up front is justifiable?

Looks great but a 200 mile range in 2024 for a 30k price tag is ludicrous really.

 

[ccfcno9]

My last 2 cars were Toyota Avensis manual, it was excellent next to nothing replaced in 150k miles. I was hooked on presumed Japanese reliability so replaced it with a 3 year old Lexus LS auto 30k on the clock, it was again a fantastic car to own and drive for 18 months and about 22k miles later the worse happened, I broke down on the motorway going to Heathrow airport. 2 months off the road 3 grand thrown at it just to get it going(payed by warranty) and a suggestion a new engine may be needed at a cost of circa 10k (over limit of warranty cover).
I dropped that car quickly and entered the EV market buying an MG zs (i couldn't afford Tesla or the like). I've now done 19k in it, I save the best part of £200 a month charging at home. Its got 7 years warranty next to nothing for servicing (£80, 1st year £162 2nd year). Its not as refined as the Lexus but its got more gadgets auto drive, adaptive cruise control, anti-collision this and that and generally does what it says no the tin. Would I go back to ICE, the answer is not a chance.

 

[Mcbean]

My last 2 cars were Toyota Avensis manual, it was excellent next to nothing replaced in 150k miles. I was hooked on presumed Japanese reliability so replaced it with a 3 year old Lexus LS auto 30k on the clock, it was again a fantastic car to own and drive for 18 months and about 22k miles later the worse happened, I broke down on the motorway going to Heathrow airport. 2 months off the road 3 grand thrown at it just to get it going(payed by warranty) and a suggestion a new engine may be needed at a cost of circa 10k (over limit of warranty cover).
I dropped that car quickly and entered the EV market buying an MG zs (i couldn't afford Tesla or the like). I've now done 19k in it, I save the best part of £200 a month charging at home. Its got 7 years warranty next to nothing for servicing (£80, 1st year £162 2nd year). Its not as refined as the Lexus but its got more gadgets auto drive, adaptive cruise control, anti-collision this and that and generally does what it says no the tin. Would I go back to ICE, the answer is not a chance.

It goes to show that EVs definitely suit some people ! But not everyone - going to run my diesel into the ground

 

[MalcSB]

My last 2 cars were Toyota Avensis manual, it was excellent next to nothing replaced in 150k miles. I was hooked on presumed Japanese reliability so replaced it with a 3 year old Lexus LS auto 30k on the clock, it was again a fantastic car to own and drive for 18 months and about 22k miles later the worse happened, I broke down on the motorway going to Heathrow airport. 2 months off the road 3 grand thrown at it just to get it going(payed by warranty) and a suggestion a new engine may be needed at a cost of circa 10k (over limit of warranty cover).
I dropped that car quickly and entered the EV market buying an MG zs (i couldn't afford Tesla or the like). I've now done 19k in it, I save the best part of £200 a month charging at home. Its got 7 years warranty next to nothing for servicing (£80, 1st year £162 2nd year). Its not as refined as the Lexus but its got more gadgets auto drive, adaptive cruise control, anti-collision this and that and generally does what it says no the tin. Would I go back to ICE, the answer is not a chance.

What range do do you get from the MG, or do you never drive long distance?

 

[ccfcno9]

What range do do you get from the MG, or do you never drive long distance?

I get 280 miles in the summer which gets me to Heathrow/Manchester airport and back.
In the winter, making full use of heating/lights etc, range can drop as low as 190 miles so when doing above journeys I stop before getting there and charge for 15-20 minutes so I don’t have to stop on way back

 

[ccfcno9]

What range do do you get from the MG, or do you never drive long distance?

I should add if you like to drive above 70 it also kills range as the motor just draws so much more power, it’s quite the opposite to ice car, as when driving around town with constant braking the energy is reclaimed by the battery management system making possible to get above the 270 miles quoted life

 

[MalcSB]

I get 280 miles in the summer which gets me to Heathrow/Manchester airport and back.
In the winter, making full use of heating/lights etc, range can drop as low as 190 miles so when doing above journeys I stop before getting there and charge for 15-20 minutes so I don’t have to stop on way back

That’s interesting. I thought that ev batteries should only be charged to 80% which would have given a theoretical max of 216 miles.

 

[ccfcno9]

That’s interesting. I thought that ev batteries should only be charged to 80% which would have given a theoretical max of 216 miles.

It’s not advised to continuously change to 100% and leave it in that state but the option is there to use for long journeys I think most batteries are happier with change cycles 20 to 80%. The latest composition can be charged to 100% everytime. Time will tell if this has an effect on their lifespan

 

[OffenhamSkyBlue]

A couple of years ago, i came into some money and needed to change my car. I wasn't originally looking at EVs, but i test drove the Toyota RAV4 PHEV and i was immediately sold. It has a range of about 50 miles when driven sensibly, which caters for my commute, and i can charge at home for 8p per kW on the overnight rate (about £1.20 for 50 miles). It is about 20% of the cost of petrol, but it has a 50 litre fuel tank too, which means none of the range anxiety you get with a pure EV. When on long journeys, i just drive in ICE mode (which is actually a conventional self-charging hybrid) and save EV mode for urban areas to reduce my emissions where people live and work.
It has a 10 year, 100k mile warranty and the batteries are guaranteed for 15 years. Green credentials come from my energy provider supplying 100% renewable electricity.
Auto gearbox with electronic constant velocity transmission which is smooth as silk. Even conventional autos seem rough by comparison. But it also does 0-60 in 6 seconds when you want to take out the boy racer in his Beemer or Subaru!
Not sure what resale value it will have, but will deal with that when the time comes.

Love it!

 

[ccfcno9]

A lovely car but a bit out of my price range as a private buyer. I bought cheap Chinese new for warranty(7 years) as worried about reliability. Now though after 2 years driving it I'd have no hesitation in buying second hand and save the massive depreciation these cars suffer in the 1st 18 months as long as full main dealer history and warranty is intact. That said I'd exclude the Porsche Taycan as my gaffer as one, its been a nightmare, tires last 5000 miles at £600 a pop(design issues with suspension), he's had 3 heaters(big job to replace) and various other bits and pieces hence the reason dealers won't have them back. Its not that their EV, its because their a pile of shit. The boss was offered 60 grand less than he paid for it 2 years ago.

 

[eastwoodsdustman]

A lovely car but a bit out of my price range as a private buyer. I bought cheap Chinese new for warranty(7 years) as worried about reliability. Now though after 2 years driving it I'd have no hesitation in buying second hand and save the massive depreciation these cars suffer in the 1st 18 months as long as full main dealer history and warranty is intact. That said I'd exclude the Porsche Taycan as my gaffer as one, its been a nightmare, tires last 5000 miles at £600 a pop(design issues with suspension), he's had 3 heaters(big job to replace) and various other bits and pieces hence the reason dealers won't have them back. Its not that their EV, its because their a pile of shit. The boss was offered 60 grand less than he paid for it 2 years ago.

I know someone who had one and took it back after 12 weeks and forced Porsche to have it back. Lost £20k on it but he was just glad to get rid.

 

[Kneeza]

I love autos (proper autos, not that DSG shite) having driven many through working for Jag for thirty years until I retired 12 years ago.
However, I've never owned one as 'er indoors didn't want one... until early this year, ironically because the dragon decided she wanted one!
The reason? Her knees are shot so she didn't want to drive our manual (FIAT) moho any more. So that went, and was replaced with a much smaller Toyota-based campervan (I've had many Toyotas as, well, you can't beat 'em).
It's old, thirsty, but immaculate, and drives and rides so bloody nicely - and she loves it!
There are no gimmicks either unless you count the electrically-driven rear side sliding doors.
Now I need to persuade her to ditch her nearly-new Kia Ceed Sportswagon and get another auto Toyota Avensis or suchlike.
Good luck with that though...

 

[nicksar]

I love autos (proper autos, not that DSG shite) having driven many through working for Jag for thirty years until I retired 12 years ago.
However, I've never owned one as 'er indoors didn't want one... until early this year, ironically because the dragon decided she wanted one!
The reason? Her knees are shot so she didn't want to drive our manual (FIAT) moho any more. So that went, and was replaced with a much smaller Toyota-based campervan (I've had many Toyotas as, well, you can't beat 'em).
It's old, thirsty, but immaculate, and drives and rides so bloody nicely - and she loves it!
There are no gimmicks either unless you count the electrically-driven rear side sliding doors.
Now I need to persuade her to ditch her nearly-new Kia Ceed Sportswagon and get another auto Toyota Avensis or suchlike.
Good luck with that though...

I worked for JLR at Gaydon and latterly Whitley for 16 years as a development engine fitter/tester on the test beds.
Loved working for JLR and tbh hugely regretted taking voluntary severance to work for myself.
When they were looking to employ Engine fitter/testers again my old boss tried everything he could to re-employ me but JLR have a (stupid) policy of not taking on anybody who's taken V.R.

 

[Kneeza]

I worked for JLR at Gaydon and latterly Whitley for 16 years as a development engine fitter/tester on the test beds.
Loved working for JLR and tbh hugely regretted taking voluntary severance to work for myself.
When they were looking to employ Engine fitter/testers again my old boss tried everything he could to re-employ me but JLR have a (stupid) policy of not taking on anybody who's taken V.R.

I was at Radford to start with; then Browns Lane, Whitley, and finally a very short spell at Gaydon before VR and early (56) retirement. All Service Dept based.
I'm very happy to get my monthly Jag Pension (and BMW Pension - previous employment at Climax; it's a convoluted process!), and wild horses couldn't drag me back

 

[JAM See]

I was at Radford to start with; then Browns Lane, Whitley, and finally a very short spell at Gaydon before VR and early (56) retirement. All Service Dept based.
I'm very happy to get my monthly Jag Pension (and BMW Pension - previous employment at Climax; it's a convoluted process!), and wild horses couldn't drag me back

Radford (14 shop)
Browns Lane (GEC block)
CB (Z block)
Solihull (FA 2)

Various placements in Whitley, Gaydon and Ryton.

Miss the people, but not the stress.

 

[Kneeza]

Radford (14 shop)
Browns Lane (GEC block)
CB (Z block)
Solihull (FA 2)

Various placements in Whitley, Gaydon and Ryton.

Miss the people, but not the stress.

Y'know, I have no idea what our bit of Radford was called, but it was just behind the showroom and up a set of very dingy concrete stairs. Long demolished of course.
We moved to the GEC block (upstairs to the right of the main entrance stairs).

 

[Grendel]

I have no words