New stadium - Okay, let's just suppose for a moment (1 Viewer)

[bigfatronssba]

The same as we keep hearing about why Wasps had to move I guess from the same people who are saying we have to stay at the Ricoh and Rent off Wasps...

Wasps are a Rugby team, Ccfc are a football team. To compare their financial models doesn't work.

The most successful sports team in this city doesn't own its venue.

 

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[Nick]

Overall it costs less to build a big stadium than it does to build a small, and then expanded stadium.

Ah ok, happy to be corrected

Does it not depend on the types of stadium and the way they are built though?

Just seems a bit pointless them going and building a 30,000 seater stadium for 12-15k every week doesn't it?

 

[skybluebeduff]

If SISU left, the crowd would come back. Could anyone try to disprove it?

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Wasps are a Rugby team, Ccfc are a football team. To compare their financial models doesn't work.

The most successful sports team in this city doesn't own its venue.

Both were losing money though, Wasps 3 million a year at Adams Park I think and us however much at the Ricoh in the championship.

 

[Samo]

If SISU left, the crowd would come back. Could anyone try to disprove it?

We don't need to, its just an opinion. We weren't exactly queuing outside HR though.

 

[AndreasB]

If SISU left, the crowd would come back. Could anyone try to disprove it?

Maybe they would - the evidence of the return from Northampton would suggest otherwise wouldnt it.

How "good" do you think new owners would have to be to generate an extra 10,000 season tickets? I would suggest that anyone who bought us would not be in that league and the growth would be gradual rather than dramatic as you all seem to think.

 

[Speedies_Chips]

If SISU left, the crowd would come back. Could anyone try to disprove it?

No-one can prove it either way.

If I had to guess though, I would say that people would not come back in their droves because they have already got used to doing something else.

The only way people will come back in numbers is if we have a winning team. Even if we get new owners, this will take a long time to achieve because of the state of what they would be inheriting from our current owners.

 

[Astute]

Surely it would make no sense financially to build a whopping great big stadium for the PL while we are in League One? Surely you would build it with expansion and growth in mind to make it easily upgradeable during a close season if we got promoted.

You keep going on about Wasps being interested to help and your figures but in all honesty it is just feeding as much bullshit.

You are saying it would make sense to build a PL standard stadium straight away to fit 12,000 fans in on a good day?

12,000 wouldn't be big enough as soon as we had a side that has a chance of winning something. Those that I know that have stopped going recently will be back once they don't feel like we will struggle to get shots on target each game. All we need is a promotion push. And how much would be lost to segregation?

And how can someone say that we need as much income as we can get so we need to move out of the Ricoh then say a small ground not big enough for us would be a good move?

 

[AndreasB]

..oh and who exactly would buy us whilst our stadium is owned for ever by Wasps?

 

[Ashdown]

Not sure I ever base my support on the "proclamations of the owners" - they are all usually chancers or bullshitters in my experieince. Support is a lot more fundamental than that - you go because you go. If you choose not to then fine as well, but please dont justify it by blaming anyone else.

Some seasons at the RSC re shit - Im not going to fork out for the fucking Winters Tale or Pericles or a Russian version of Cymbeline but I dont BLAME the owners of the RSC do I?

Don't you come on all sophisticated with me !!

 

[skybluebeduff]

No-one can prove it either way.

If I had to guess though, I would say that people would not come back in their droves because they have already got used to doing something else.

The only way people will come back in numbers is if we have a winning team. Even if we get new owners, this will take a long time to achieve because of the state of what they would be inheriting from our current owners.

Surly new owners would breed back the trust and confidence that City fans have lost since the SISU saga begun?

 

[Speedies_Chips]

Not straightaway. no.

 

[AndreasB]

Surly new owners would breed back the trust and confidence that City fans have lost since the SISU saga begun?

enough to sell 10,000 season tickets? dream on.

 

[Astute]

..oh and who exactly would buy us whilst our stadium is owned for ever by Wasps?

So clubs only get taken over when they own their own ground?

Which ground did we own the last time we were taken over?

 

[Grendel]

So clubs only get taken over when they own their own ground?

Which ground did we own the last time we were taken over?

We didn't - that's why we went bust and were taken over by a hedge fund.

 

[Samo]

So clubs only get taken over when they own their own ground?

Which ground did we own the last time we were taken over?

Stop the fight, he ain't getting up from that!

 

[italiahorse]

And how does our future look if we stay at the Ricoh with zero income?

You show me why it's better to build a new stadium, but please don't quote TF as I need to see facts.
I would like to see how financing and maintaining a new stadium is cheaper than an advantageous rental and access to some of the incomes.

 

[skybluebeduff]

enough to sell 10,000 season tickets? dream on.

why the specific mention of 10,000 season tickets? If you can't see why the fans have left, then you never will.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Cellino brought Leeds and they don't own Elland Road, or didn't at the time if they do now..

 

[skybluebeduff]

Not straightaway. no.

It would take a few months, but it would progress as long as we had owners who were the opposite of SISU, I.E transparent with us. Owners who care about their support.

 

[italiahorse]

Surely it would make no sense financially to build a whopping great big stadium for the PL while we are in League One? Surely you would build it with expansion and growth in mind to make it easily upgradeable during a close season if we got promoted.
I just need to see the plan that includes expansion and financing.
You keep going on about Wasps being interested to help and your figures but in all honesty it is just feeding as much bullshit.
I don't know but at least ask them as they have inferred it's available. If they say no then tell us and we can see them for what they are.
You are saying it would make sense to build a PL standard stadium straight away to fit 12,000 fans in on a good day?
Show the final PL stadium then and as long as the new stadium 'is' expandable to 32K that will sell it to most fans.

 

[AndreasB]

why the specific mention of 10,000 season tickets? If you can't see why the fans have left, then you never will.

Because unlike you, we have to start with a realistic number. If we were to have 12-14000 season ticket holders this could mean average gates of 15k-18k, sort of where we were in the early Ricoh years.

Our problem has long been converting the walk up support into season tickets - no owner has grasped that - we needed to sell loads more STs when we moved to the Ricoh than we ever did but the club was greedy and charged too much initially.
Hence, we have been reliant for years on a fickle walk up which dries up far too easily when things are a bit grim on the pitch.

OR we could take your approach of thinking everything will suddenly be fine if SISU go. Like I said, dream on.

 

[italiahorse]

..oh and who exactly would buy us whilst our stadium is owned for ever by Wasps?

The same people who would buy us with the stadium owned by Sisu.

We will NEVER own our own stadium in the foreseeable future.
Even the new stadium will be owned by Sisu and rented back to us in some way. FFS get real.

 

[AndreasB]

It would take a few months, but it would progress as long as we had owners who were the opposite of SISU, I.E transparent with us. Owners who care about their support.

they could be as fluffy as you like but I fail to see why this would generate more ticket sales if the team and performances remained the same?

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Any new owners(With the proviso of not changing our name or colours, and putting their money where their mouth is, plough in good money to buy good players unlike SISU, would get my vote and I would end my self inflicted exile and attend all home, and away games again.) and yes, I think there would be an almost immediate return of self exiled fans to the tune of about 18-20k. my opinion of course, but it's as good as anyone elses guys

 

[Grendel]

The same people who would buy us with the stadium owned by Sisu.

We will NEVER own our own stadium in the foreseeable future.
Even the new stadium will be owned by Sisu and rented back to us in some way. FFS get real.

So in the same way wasps don't own their stadium or Southampton or - well every other club you mean?

 

[italiahorse]

So in the same way wasps don't own their stadium or Southampton or - well every other club you mean?

Swansea don't own their stadium the council does :facepalm:

 

[bigfatronssba]

Cellino brought Leeds and they don't own Elland Road, or didn't at the time if they do now..

Let's not forget Man City.

 

[Samo]

Any new owners(With the proviso of not changing our name or colours, and putting their money where there mouth is, plough in good money to buy good
players unlike SISU, would get my vote and I would end my self inflicted exile and attend all home, and away games again.) and yes, I think there would be an almost immediate return of self exiled fans to the tune of about 18-20k. my opinion of course, but it's as good as anyone elses guys

18-20k? All Sisu haters and just straining at the leash to come back? If you say so SBK.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Because unlike you, we have to start with a realistic number. If we were to have 12-14000 season ticket holders this could mean average gates of 15k-18k, sort of where we were in the early Ricoh years.

Our problem has long been converting the walk up support into season tickets - no owner has grasped that - we needed to sell loads more STs when we moved to the Ricoh than we ever did but the club was greedy and charged too much initially.
Hence, we have been reliant for years on a fickle walk up which dries up far too easily when things are a bit grim on the pitch.

OR we could take your approach of thinking everything will suddenly be fine if SISU go. Like I said, dream on.

I'll continue that dream of SISU leaving until it turns into reality, and it will

As far as numbers of season tickets sales, I honestly couldn't give a shit, but we'd have more if SISU left... My opinion.

The hatred for our owners stems very far unless you haven't noticed.

 

[Grendel]

Swansea don't own their stadium the council does :facepalm:

No its on a lifetime lease to the management company. Also interestingly it sold some of the land around the stadium and gave an equal share of the proceeds of sale to the football club as in its view that was not breaching regulations that our council deemed they would be when creaming £60 million for the sale of the land to Tescos.

 

[Astute]

So in the same way wasps don't own their stadium or Southampton or - well every other club you mean?

Man City?

It is as much about a clubs owners and how they run a club as much as getting a good rental agreement.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Let's not forget Man City.

Man City's is a strange one though, due to that sponsorship deal with Etihad.

 

[RFC]

Nick just out of interest the new stadium is likely to start with a capacity of around 18,000 and expand as and when the club becomes more successful!

 

[italiahorse]

No its on a lifetime lease to the management company. Also interestingly it sold some of the land around the stadium and gave an equal share of the proceeds of sale to the football club as in its view that was not breaching regulations that our council deemed they would be when creaming £60 million for the sale of the land to Tescos.

Err ........................ and the evidence ?

Swansea own 25% of the management company Ospreys 25% and the council 50% IIRC