Player Ratings (4 Viewers)

[luwalla]

Can I just say this summed up my previous point. It's great that you support Burge but can you honestly say he's a good goalkeeper at this level? And 7 really? Did you not see any of his kicks or do you not qualify as a part of goalkeeping in your book?

yeah i watched the match... I think league 1 is about his level right now to be honest. League 2 - he was one of the best, League 1 - he will be about your average keeper. Kicking is massive part of being a keeper... if he was better at kicking & caught the odd cross he misses then he'd most likely have be in a higher league by now.

Think it was the last match against rochdale, their keeper made a couple of terrible kicks.. much worse than burge's

 

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[SkyBlueCRJ]

yeah i watched the match... I think league 1 is about his level right now to be honest. League 2 - he was one of the best, League 1 - he will be about your average keeper. Kicking is massive part of being a keeper... if he was better at kicking & caught the odd cross he misses then he'd most likely have be in a higher league by now.

Think it was the last match against rochdale, their keeper made a couple of terrible kicks.. much worse than burge's

I agree League One is his level and I wouldn't necessarily say he looks out of his depth but like you said he's your average keeper. He's come on leaps and bounds since he first started consistently playing but his development has probably peaked and I cannot see him improving from now on.

Of course he would be in a better league but you could apply a similar logic to any player. If Willis was stronger and taller he'd easily be playing in the Championship but the fact of the matter is he isn't.

It might not sound like it but I'm completely behind Burge but that doesn't mean I don't think we could do better with regards to bringing in a replacement. It seems as if we're resting on our laurels with Burge as over the past few seasons it's a position we've failed to address and at the end of the day teams aren't promoted on the back of managers resting on their laurels with a player just because he's 'fine' for the respective league they ply their trade in. MR now has time to identify someone to compete with Burge in that position and I hope that individual will be brought in, in January. If we were in Rochdale's position where they probably consider a good season to be mid-table then stick with a player of Burge's quality but I'd personally rather this position be addressed.

 

[speedie87]

No way is burge 5:10 and Obrien 6:4. Look at the team picture Obrien is almost the same poss only inch inch taller. Now Addai is tall!

 

[Esoterica]

You clearly know nothing about goalkeeping. If you can't catch and have to parry it has to go to the side, away from goal.

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Ridiculous confirmation bias. No chance to parry that out wide because of the angle and speed of the strike and as @mds says, there's a player hovering for exactly that.

 

[luwalla]

I agree League One is his level and I wouldn't necessarily say he looks out of his depth but like you said he's your average keeper. He's come on leaps and bounds since he first started consistently playing but his development has probably peaked and I cannot see him improving from now on.

Of course he would be in a better league but you could apply a similar logic to any player. If Willis was stronger and taller he'd easily be playing in the Championship but the fact of the matter is he isn't.

It might not sound like it but I'm completely behind Burge but that doesn't mean I don't think we could do better with regards to bringing in a replacement. It seems as if we're resting on our laurels with Burge as over the past few seasons it's a position we've failed to address and at the end of the day teams aren't promoted on the back of managers resting on their laurels with a player just because he's 'fine' for the respective league they ply their trade in. MR now has time to identify someone to compete with Burge in that position and I hope that individual will be brought in, in January. If we were in Rochdale's position where they probably consider a good season to be mid-table then stick with a player of Burge's quality but I'd personally rather this position be addressed.

We seem to be agreeing in general I think but your points also seem to contradict each other...

"Of course he would be in a better league but you could apply a similar logic to any player. If Willis was stronger and taller he'd easily be playing in the Championship but the fact of the matter is he isn't."

So does willis need replacing too then ? as we could get better & we are aiming for championship quality not league 1 ... genuine question ?

Your point is bang on... we could apply the same logic to any of our players, but we are not! we are only applying it to Burge all the time, why ? which I guess is the point I was making.

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

We seem to be agreeing in general I think but your points also seem to contradict each other...

"Of course he would be in a better league but you could apply a similar logic to any player. If Willis was stronger and taller he'd easily be playing in the Championship but the fact of the matter is he isn't."

So does willis need replacing too then ? as we could get better & we are aiming for championship quality not league 1 ... genuine question ?

Your point is bang on... we could apply the same logic to any of our players, but we are not! we are only applying it to Burge all the time, why ? which I guess is the point I was making.

I don't understand how you think that is contradictory when I was applying your own logic to any player within the team? I was merely expressing that your view is cliche as if any of our current squad corrected their flaws they would be in a higher division, I think that goes without saying. That doesn't mean those such as Willis aren't good enough, it means if every player improved their all-round game they would have been picked up by a higher placed club already. Not sure that's contradictory as that is nothing to do with the players' own ability, that's just an obvious statement.

No of course not because he's a player that could make the step up and is still learning - unlike Burge. I merely used him as an example as he's one of our best players and even Willis could improve. There is always a better player out there so if someone such as Liam Moore from Reading became available and was desperate to join the club then I wouldn't batter an eyelid at Willis being replaced with him.

Burge is always targeted because if we're aiming for promotion he's simply not good enough. You said it yourself he's found his league - but the Championship is a different ballgame altogether. Look at the goalkeepers who played in the promoted teams from League One last season - none were replaced. Now that doesn't necessarily mean they're top Championship goalkeepers but their respective managers consider them good enough to make the step up. I can confidently say MR knows that Burge will need to be replaced or another goalkeeper will need to be brought in, if we are ever successful in promotion from League One.

He is bringing in better than what we already have though? Well the jury is still out there on that one for some of his signings but he's tried to anyway. For instance, he brought in Sterling who was supposed to be a better replacement for DiKE, Mason who was a better replacement for Haynes, Brown who was a better replacement for Stokes etc. etc. etc.

 

[fernandopartridge]

I don't understand how you think that is contradictory when I was applying your own logic to any player within the team? I was merely expressing that your view is cliche as if any of our current squad corrected their flaws they would be in a higher division, I think that goes without saying. That doesn't mean those such as Willis aren't good enough, it means if every player improved their all-round game they would have been picked up by a higher placed club already. Not sure that's contradictory as that is nothing to do with the players' own ability, that's just an obvious statement.

No of course not because he's a player that could make the step up and is still learning - unlike Burge. I merely used him as an example as he's one of our best players and even Willis could improve. There is always a better player out there so if someone such as Liam Moore from Reading became available and was desperate to join the club then I wouldn't batter an eyelid at Willis being replaced with him.

Burge is always targeted because if we're aiming for promotion he's simply not good enough. You said it yourself he's found his league - but the Championship is a different ballgame altogether. Look at the goalkeepers who played in the promoted teams from League One last season - none were replaced. Now that doesn't necessarily mean they're top Championship goalkeepers but their respective managers consider them good enough to make the step up. I can confidently say MR knows that Burge will need to be replaced or another goalkeeper will need to be brought in, if we are ever successful in promotion from League One.

He is bringing in better than what we already have though? Well the jury is still out there on that one for some of his signings but he's tried to anyway. For instance, he brought in Sterling who was supposed to be a better replacement for DiKE, Mason who was a better replacement for Haynes, Brown who was a better replacement for Stokes etc. etc. etc.

Burge (or even worse RCC) was goalkeeper when the side spent half of the season top of the league wasn't he?

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

Burge (or even worse RCC) was goalkeeper when the side spent half of the season top of the league wasn't he?

RCC was the No.1. I believe.

 

[Greggs]

Goalkeepers get better with age.

 

[luwalla]

I don't understand how you think that is contradictory when I was applying your own logic to any player within the team? I was merely expressing that your view is cliche as if any of our current squad corrected their flaws they would be in a higher division, I think that goes without saying. That doesn't mean those such as Willis aren't good enough, it means if every player improved their all-round game they would have been picked up by a higher placed club already. Not sure that's contradictory as that is nothing to do with the players' own ability, that's just an obvious statement.

No of course not because he's a player that could make the step up and is still learning - unlike Burge. I merely used him as an example as he's one of our best players and even Willis could improve. There is always a better player out there so if someone such as Liam Moore from Reading became available and was desperate to join the club then I wouldn't batter an eyelid at Willis being replaced with him.

Burge is always targeted because if we're aiming for promotion he's simply not good enough. You said it yourself he's found his league - but the Championship is a different ballgame altogether. Look at the goalkeepers who played in the promoted teams from League One last season - none were replaced. Now that doesn't necessarily mean they're top Championship goalkeepers but their respective managers consider them good enough to make the step up. I can confidently say MR knows that Burge will need to be replaced or another goalkeeper will need to be brought in, if we are ever successful in promotion from League One.

He is bringing in better than what we already have though? Well the jury is still out there on that one for some of his signings but he's tried to anyway. For instance, he brought in Sterling who was supposed to be a better replacement for DiKE, Mason who was a better replacement for Haynes, Brown who was a better replacement for Stokes etc. etc. etc.

you support burge & agree he is A league 1 keeper, but say "Burge is always targeted because if we're aiming for promotion he's simply not good enough" why isnt it he, he's a league 1 keeper. about as good as the others we have seen so far this season ? our goals conceded ratio is in the top half of the league id suggest & most of those were conceded by LOB!

You are confident MR knows that Burge will need to be replaced ? loads were confident he'd be gone this season... yet it 's one of the positions MR didnt touch. Guess he didnt see a problem OR did look around and couldn't see anything better out there , within our budget.

your right, the championship is a different league... and its one we are not in. We are in league 1, with mostly league 1 quality players , and a league 1 budget. yes he 'MIGHT' have to go if we got promoted... along with others in the current squad id say. But who knows.

He is a doing a decent job and shouldn't be targeted any more than defenders that conceded silly goals, Wingers that cant get a cross past the first man or strikers that dont score goals for weeks on end. So my original point remains, if he was championship quality then he wouldnt be playing for us in this league.. He'd be signed be a reading or a Norwich etc! and yes, I agree, thats the same as the other players in our squad... which is exactly the point im making! he needs replacing ( or not ) as much as they do...

 

[ccfcway]

Goalkeepers get better with age.

burge will be fab when he's 90 then

 

[Westendlad]

Goalkeepers get better with age.

True but few get chance to gain experience at one club these days. Everyone wants the best NOW. I like Burge and given time he will prove what a top goalie he may be.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

We seem to be agreeing in general I think but your points also seem to contradict each other...

"Of course he would be in a better league but you could apply a similar logic to any player. If Willis was stronger and taller he'd easily be playing in the Championship but the fact of the matter is he isn't."

So does willis need replacing too then ? as we could get better & we are aiming for championship quality not league 1 ... genuine question ?

Your point is bang on... we could apply the same logic to any of our players, but we are not! we are only applying it to Burge all the time, why ? which I guess is the point I was making.

I think if we got promoted then, as with this season, you don’t replace the whole team. I think Willis would be one of the players that you would hope could step up to the next level. Under Billy Frith and then Jimmy Hill, George Curtis played in all divisions, fourth to first and didn’t look out of place. There were quite a few players who played in the third division who were still there in the first. I think a few of this team could play higher, I hope it is with us!

 

[stupot07]

I think if we got promoted then, as with this season, you don’t replace the whole team. I think Willis would be one of the players that you would hope could step up to the next level. Under Billy Frith and then Jimmy Hill, George Curtis played in all divisions, fourth to first and didn’t look out of place. There were quite a few players who played in the third division who were still there in the first. I think a few of this team could play higher, I hope it is with us!

I think Leon Britton played all 4 divisions for Swansea and was quality in the PL when they first went up.

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[fernandopartridge]

I think Leon Britton played all 4 divisions for Swansea and was quality in the PL when they first went up.

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Joe Allen played in 3 leagues too. Swansea are still the model to follow imo.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Our GK is being blamed for conceding a free header from a corner. Christ, that makes no sense. It’s pretty basic football that if you lose your marker in the box, you really ought to score that opportunity. The fault for the goal was Sterling losing his man!

This obsession with needing a new GK is getting out of hand.

 

[Skybluefaz]

Our GK is being blamed for conceding a free header from a corner. Christ, that makes no sense. It’s pretty basic football that if you lose your marker in the box, you really ought to score that opportunity. The fault for the goal was Sterling losing his man!

This obsession with needing a new GK is getting out of hand.

What is his positioning all about on corners?

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Joe Allen played in 3 leagues too. Swansea are still the model to follow imo.

Absolutely.

We don’t have the most resources and Robins approach has been a shrewd one. We’ve got plenty of young players who will (hopefully) improve and take us to the Championship, eventually. This season is about consolidation in L1. A top half finish would be a good one and with a few more experienced players brought in for next season, then I feel like we can compete.

Too many people are expecting us to be the finished article this season.