BackRoomRummermill
Well-Known Member
I still can’t figure out if out of Coventry I should call it a Batch , roll , barm or cob .
Match Thread Polite Notice (AKA Grendel, Nick & Orca's Argument Thread) (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter mark82
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fatso
Well-Known Member
Tell us all then, what did you expect the council to do with an empty stadium, which was a burden on the rate payers and needed costly maintenance and upkeep, and how where the council to cover the hole in their finances due to the lost rental income?
Skyblueweeman
Well-Known Member
Agree with your first two sentences...spot on.
But your 3rd, I'm not so sure about. I think every party is getting shit for their part in this mess...and everybody will have fairly have differing views on how much is apportioned to whom and to what degree. How it all started can also be up for debate - the proverbial chicken and egg situation - 'yeah but if SISU had not gone to Northampton', 'yeah but if the council weren't trying to shaft us' etc etc etc. That's all up for debate.
The one thing that **shouldn't** be up for debate, is how catastrophic the councils decision to sell to Wasps has been - regardless of how we got to that situation.
shepardo01
Well-Known Member
That's what the coucil would like views to be... but it is extremely well known that they were courting W**ps and trying to shaft CCFC well before rent had stopped being paid and well before we went to Northampton and there was an "empty staduim".
shepardo01
Well-Known Member
While we are on the subject of the council, it is worth looking at these tweets from Tom Clarke about them harassing him/cov public about paying parking fines that have been illegally handed out... a bloke called covroadsafetyblog is all over them on twitter too...
More underhand tactics from our beloved CCC by the looks of it...
More underhand tactics from our beloved CCC by the looks of it...
bawtryneal
Well-Known Member
Offer CCFC the same deal that they offered Wasps
fatso
Well-Known Member
Catastrophic for the football club yes, but the council wont give a shit, and wasps are smug as fuck in their shiny new gaff.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
How was the tax payer burdened?
The rental income was to a private company not the council
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
Since leaving cov 20 years ago, 2 things that I don’t hear anywhere else
1) the entry
2) gambole
Orca
Well-Known Member
I don't think it's OK at all. Don't want Wasps here and won't ever be going a game they play in.
The fact they are here is because the football club, for whom the stadium was built, said they didn't want the Ricoh any more. Now, we all know now the mythical stadium won't be built, but at that time, Fisher had made it very clear there was a plan and land and a new stadium. The Council cannot act upon "we think it's bullshit", they have to act on the information available. Their duty as a Council was to not make a massive loss of taxpayer money, and whilst I don't like it, the Council did its job. I'm not for a second saying its a situation I'm happy with, I'm saying I can understand why it was done.
I'm sure someone will come back as shout "GIDNEY EMAIL!!!!" as some sort of counter point to the above. However, ACL looking to buy Wasps, from its previous owners, is very different to selling Wasps new owners the Ricoh. I don't know of a cohesive argument that outlines how ACL *owning* Wasps could have been detrimental to CCFC, other than the fact the pitch would be shit because a bunch of peanut-huggers ran around on it every other week.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Firstly for the stadium to be a burden on the tax payer means that the constant claims from Lucas that ACL was 'washing its face' were false. That can only be because she was either outright lying or had incorrect information supplied by Reeves and West. Either scenario is concerning and should have led to action being taken yet as far as I'm aware nothing was done.
If we then assume the council has no option but to sell the stadium and looking at it purely as a taxpayer with CCFC completely removed from the situation the first step should have been to increase the lease to 250 years to increase the value of the asset.
They should then have conducted an open and transparent sales process with the stadium marketed by specialists to achieve the best return for the taxpayer.
MusicDating
Euro 2016 Prediction League Champion!!
Much like SISU's decision to break an unsustainable lease that the holder refused to negotiate?...
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Would also be interested to know why the council had to cover a hole in their finances due to lost rental income? What rent was lost? Certainly not the football clubs as they paid rent to ACL not the council.
Orca
Well-Known Member
Cov Road Safety blog was started by Richard Henegan and Les Reid.
fatso
Well-Known Member
That would of been ideal. But once sisu had tried to financially distress the council by deliberately withholding rent, I'm afraid the council were reluctant to even engage with them (this is where in starts to become personal with ego mania taking over)
I have no doubt that ccc could well of been looking to off load the ricoh to any other interested party.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
The withdrawal of rent was known and accepted by the council
Skyblueweeman
Well-Known Member
It's the whole ethical point though, isn't it...why be party to ripping a club from its community in London? Yes Wasps might have been fishing for a move after the approach in 2012, but why get involved in something that could prove so divisive?
They (Council/ACL) would've known forecasted revenues from the Ricoh venture before it opened. Were they doing it raise more money...ie, getting in another sports team to bring more cash in? I just don't get their motives. We were paying a good whack when they approached Wasps. It was a personal move, not a business move, to bring them here.
Ultimately, ACL and Wasps tore a club away from it's community and moved them permanently approx 100 miles away. I'm sure if we moved to Bury or Bolton, there would be uproar. Not so much when it's Wasps coming to Coventry...
richnrg
Well-Known Member
ah, gamboling down the entry...sweet memories.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
Would have resulted in either dogshit in my hair or a rollicking from Albert at number 37.
Nick
Administrator
The Jitty.
Ricketts
Well-Known Member
When I am in Spain I call it a batch. I then have to try and explain what I want using various words and phrases, with much gesticulating and pointing.
In fact anywhere 10 miles outside the city centre I have to do the same.
Ricketts
Well-Known Member
Jetty was my Grandmas word, in Wyken. Entry for me (west side of town)
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
I’ll help you out: the people on this site are CCFC fans, not Wasps fans.
Some of us saw this coming a mile off when we gambled on a rent strike and leaving the Ricoh to get us a better deal.
Don’t blame everyone else your hare brained plan backfired. Take some responsibility. Neither Wasps nor CCC have maintaining CCFC as their primary objective as much as you may wish otherwise. Put your big boy pants on.
If you want us to have special treatment ahead of any other business, you should probably be backing the Trusts attempts to get some level of fan ownership. Until then it’s down to Sisu to set our business strategy for better or worse.
What boils my blood is the likes of Nick, Grendel, etc going on and on about how the rent strike was genius and no one would want the Ricoh and the Council would come crawling back. Then getting pissy that the entire world isn’t playing along with their delusion. Now, like Brexit, it’s endless backtracking and distraction to avoid facing the fact they backed a stupid idea that’s made us homeless.
For the slow ones at the back: yes the rent was too high. At that juncture Sisu had several options, they chose the high risk one of legal action and rent strikes. It hasn’t worked.
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Tommo1993
Well-Known Member
Carlisle away when we tonked them 4-0, I asked the woman in the burger van outside for a bacon batch. You can imagine the looks I received. May as well have asked in Swahili.
BigadamL
Well-Known Member
I live in Walsall and it’s called a gully, wouldn’t want to gambol down the gully or I might get dog crap or glass in my chip cob before I fell in the cut (canal)
Tommo1993
Well-Known Member
Crikey, that all sounded like a mental euphemism.
fatso
Well-Known Member
W
You could also say that if wasps didnt happen to be looking for a stadium to buy at exactly the same time (coincidence?) That the only buyers would of been sisu, which is exactly what sisu were relying on.
But as we all know, the appearance of the egg chasers on the scene changed things dramatically, and the council will argue (rightly or wrongly) that they were under no obligation to include sisu in any dialogue once sisu had broken their rental agreement.
Oh and buy the way, I wouldn't believe a single word that Lucas says personally.
I totally agree that ccc could have conducted the sale of the ricoh in a much more open and transparent way (this is the crux of Sisu's legal case) but unfortunately it appears from the outside, that ego's and individual vendetta's had taken over, and this is where the council were at serious fault, imo.
You could also say that if wasps didnt happen to be looking for a stadium to buy at exactly the same time (coincidence?) That the only buyers would of been sisu, which is exactly what sisu were relying on.
But as we all know, the appearance of the egg chasers on the scene changed things dramatically, and the council will argue (rightly or wrongly) that they were under no obligation to include sisu in any dialogue once sisu had broken their rental agreement.
Oh and buy the way, I wouldn't believe a single word that Lucas says personally.
hill83
Well-Known Member
The mrs nan calls it a ginnel.
skyblueinBaku
Well-Known Member
It was either entry or jetty for me.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
I would have assumed the primary objective for CCC should be the people they are elected to represent. Maybe you could explain how the manner in which they conducted the sale achieved the best return for the taxpayer. Maybe you can also explain how the loss of the football club is a good thing for the people of the city and the local economy.
As for Wasps I would have thought their primary objective should be their fans but they happily abandoned them to move across the country.
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
None of which explains the extension of the lease to 250 years, probably the most damaging action in this whole saga.
A pure act of spite which CCFC will be feeling the effects of long after sisu have fucked off.
ohitsaidwalker king power
Well-Known Member
Yep...
Judge Hickinbottom concluded at JR1 that:
"iii) SISU distressed the financial position of ACL by refusing to pay ACL any rent or licence fee. That made ACL commercially vulnerable, because it could not service its Bank loan. It also had the effect of reducing the value of the share in ACL that SISU coveted. SISU imposed more commercial pressure on ACL by indicating that they were prepared to see CCFC put into administration or liquidation, which (SISU believed) would have a cataclysmic effect on ACL because of ACL’s inability to service its loan without revenue from the Football Club. SISU’s strategy of distressing ACL’s financial position in these ways was quite deliberate. They considered this strategy was necessary if they were to recover their investment in the Football Club" ?
fatso
Well-Known Member
I think the council/ACL may have known that ccfc were struggling with the rent for some time.
The rental agreement was only really affordable while we were in the top flight, and once we sold our rights to match day revenues the writing was on the wall.
But ACL had budgeted for that level of income, and if ccfc couldnt pay it, they needed another or a second tenant in place.
As for wasps, I'd argue whether they were ever part of a local community as such, always more of a franchise situation than part of a community like a major football club, but I may be wrong.