Portsmouth- what on earth (40 Viewers)

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

agreed about Appleton, but the sad thing is you can see it happening...

Grendel · Feb 16, 2012

Is there not some obscure ruling that still allow emergency loans if the club in administration can prove they are unable to fulfil fixtures due to injury - or does that apply to goalkeepers only?

covcity4life · Feb 16, 2012

btw how can the adminsitraters get rid of players if transfer window is closed?

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

covcity4life said:
btw how can the adminsitraters get rid of players if transfer window is closed?

yer, that loophole is open as well as the "emergency loan" one...

I'm not sure how the emergency loan one can stand up, because despite our squad looking threadbear, if absolute worse came to worse, we have 11 kids playing against kettering last night who come into the team, surely thats the same for pompy ?

Jack Griffin · Feb 16, 2012

oldskyblue58 said:
Just as an aside - it seems that the SFA do not have the concept of football debt taking pecedence over other debts in their rules. I really cannot see the justification for it in the FA rules

The rule was originally brought in to protect the integrity of the league against the odd financial failure and stop bad debt spreading to other clubs, but now failure is endemic the rule has had its day & if HMRC don't win their cases the government will legislate if necessary to make the FA change it.

It will mean that to avoid getting caught out by bad management elsewhere future transfer deals will tend to move away from the installment model towards bigger up front payments.

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

on their books they have...

Jamie Ashdown
Stephen Henderson
Ricardo Rhoca
Aaron Mokoena
Jason Pearce
Greg Halford
Tal Ben Hiem
Adam Webester
Joel Ward
Liam Lawrance
Kelvin Etuhu
Hayden Mullins
David Norris
Futacs
Huseklepp
Luke Varney
Dave Kitson
Benny Mwaruwari
Kanu

oh, and a small matter of 20 man academy squad

so that makes 39 players....

Surely they cant plead that they cant field a team ?????

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

oh, and heres their team in the last league game, which they lost 0-1 to Ipswich

Portsmouth

13 Henderson
02 Ward
03 Rocha Booked
05 Pearce
15 Halford Booked (Webster - 90' )
26 Ben-Haim Booked
07 Lawrence (Kitson - 44' )
08 Mullins
10 Huseklepp
09 Futacs
14 Etuhu (Mwaruwari - 79' )

Substitutes

01 Ashdown
31 Webster
04 Mokoena
18 Kitson
25 Mwaruwari

Guess what, not ONE youngster in the SQUAD

They just cant and shouldnt be able to get away with this.

Brighton Sky Blue · Feb 16, 2012

ccfcway said:
oh, and heres their team in the last league game, which they lost 0-1 to Ipswich

Portsmouth

13 Henderson

02 Ward

03 Rocha Booked

05 Pearce

15 Halford Booked (Webster - 90' )

26 Ben-Haim Booked

07 Lawrence (Kitson - 44' )

08 Mullins

10 Huseklepp

09 Futacs

14 Etuhu (Mwaruwari - 79' )

Substitutes

01 Ashdown

31 Webster

04 Mokoena

18 Kitson

25 Mwaruwari

Guess what, not ONE youngster in the SQUAD

They just cant and shouldnt be able to get away with this.

Whereas with our squad against Leeds, the only player on the bench older than 23 was Freddie...

EleanorRigby · Feb 16, 2012

Big day for Pompey tomorrow, a winding up order is not out of the question. The various finance experts seem to think it is 50-50. How do we fare if that happened and the points expunged and would it still be 3 down ?

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

Brighton Sky Blue said:
Whereas with our squad against Leeds, the only player on the bench older than 23 was Freddie...

exactly !

technically on our bench, everyone was less than 23, apart from Eastwood, who is 24..........................STONE

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

EleanorRigby said:
Big day for Pompey tomorrow, a winding up order is not out of the question. The various finance experts seem to think it is 50-50. How do we fare if that happened and the points expunged and would it still be 3 down ?

APrrarently we would come of that gaining over our rivals, seemed to remember somewhere Bristol City had taken at least 4 points off them this season

Astute · Feb 16, 2012

And FF was only on the bench because we ran out of young players as they were all either playing or on the bench.....

oldskyblue58 · Feb 16, 2012

Could have sold a player or two during the transfer window and paid their debts but took delight in saying they kept everyone :facepalm:
Sooner the "football debt" rule is abolished the better - there is no justification for it and it is the likes of you and me that carry cost whilst those that created the mess get their debts paid ! Immoral

I think that there are special provisions to sell players under embargos within the FA rules. But then again I thought there were rules that placed clubs under embargo if they didnt pay their tax bills - Pompey owe HMRC 1.9m ?????? !!!

FL rules should require clubs in Pompey's position to play their academy players not bring in more players (debt/cost )

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

50/50 it wont be...

With Premier League looking like they will bend over backwards for them, they will be saved somehow..

Cant help thinking the PL are to blame in a lot of this...

The parachute payments are allowing clubs likepompy to do this, West ham to pay 60k a week in this league for Nolan etc, whilst Cov, Barnsley, Peterborough etc have to "get by". The parachute payments should be for 1st year and all players in the prem should have a reduced wage clause in their contracts should they drop down a league.

You dont see Blackpool "blowing" the parachute payment money in the hope of getting to the promised land again, do you ?

Astute · Feb 16, 2012

EleanorRigby said:
Big day for Pompey tomorrow, a winding up order is not out of the question. The various finance experts seem to think it is 50-50. How do we fare if that happened and the points expunged and would it still be 3 down ?

If Portsmouth were no more then all results and points would be scrubbed. Only 2 teams would go down. An extra club would go up in each division I think. Don't want this myself.

ccfcway · Feb 16, 2012

I do

oldskyblue58 · Feb 16, 2012

but Blackpool are in the mix to get promoted wheras Pompey are not - fair play and respect to Blackpool

Astute · Feb 16, 2012

Players can be bought in cases like this. They are treated as being out of contract, but with a fee payable. Will go for less money as well as then they are known to be desperate

Brighton Sky Blue · Feb 16, 2012

HMRC represents the taxpayer. If Portsmouth owe £2m and haven't paid it, that's £2m that could've been used on public services or in reducing our national debt-which is far more important than Pompey holding onto a few players they can't afford anyway.

Astute · Feb 16, 2012

The taxman will get his cash. They will challenge soccer first debts if needed, but their players will go for a few quid. They will have to sell and then beg some loans if they survive.

Brighton Sky Blue · Feb 16, 2012

Astute said:
The taxman will get his cash. They will challenge soccer first debts if needed, but their players will go for a few quid. They will have to sell and then beg some loans if they survive.

The bigger problem for them is the much larger sums they owe to Chainrai and Gaydamak-you're looking at around £25 million on those two. Speaking to a Pompey fan this morning, he says if they don't stump up a grand for the electric bill, they won't be allowed to use the floodlights...can it really get that bad?

BurbageSkyBlues · Feb 16, 2012

Why don't they attach a generator to that guy with the bell, he keeps going all game.....free electricity for them?

BurbageSkyBlues · Feb 16, 2012

Come to think of it, why don't we turn the Ricoh roof into one giant PV cell and get solar power, before the feed in tariffs are reduced?

EleanorRigby · Feb 16, 2012

BurbageSkyBlues said:
Why don't they attach a generator to that guy with the bell, he keeps going all game.....free electricity for them?

Like that..

Astute · Feb 16, 2012

Brighton Sky Blue said:
The bigger problem for them is the much larger sums they owe to Chainrai and Gaydamak-you're looking at around £25 million on those two. Speaking to a Pompey fan this morning, he says if they don't stump up a grand for the electric bill, they won't be allowed to use the floodlights...can it really get that bad?

It can get worse. The fans could lose their club.

Are we supposed to now be thankful that SISU have kept us going?

oldskyblue58 · Feb 16, 2012

Does Appleton never stop whining ??? !!!

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11674/7524863/Pompey-expecting-no-sympathy

Jack Griffin · Feb 16, 2012

Pompeys players were not paid in January, they have about £3M in the bank the administrator is likely to be able to use to keep the club going to the end of the season, but currently their bank accounts are frozen.

20point deduction tomorrow please...

OyJimmy · Feb 16, 2012

Jack Griffin said:
Pompeys players were not paid in January, they have about £3M in the bank the administrator is likely to be able to use to keep the club going to the end of the season, but currenly their bank accounts are frozen.

20point deduction tomorrow please...

Not sure they can pay the players before HMRC. As I understand it because HMRC got in there first they may have to now pay HMRC. But if they pay HMRC then their chances of avoiding liquidation lessen.

They may well be liquidated tomorrow. Anyone know the Odds the bookies are giving on this?

Astute · Feb 16, 2012

Jack Griffin said:
Pompeys players were not paid in January, they have about £3M in the bank the administrator is likely to be able to use to keep the club going to the end of the season, but currently their bank accounts are frozen.

20point deduction tomorrow please...

Why not pay the taxman if they had so much in the bank? Maybe 3m od?

Jack Griffin · Feb 16, 2012

Treating football debts as preferential over other debts including tax is exactly what is being challenged in the courts.
I couldn't find a judgement, but a case of HMRC vs the Football League was heard in November 2011.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/nov/30/hm-revenue-customs-football-creditors-rule

They have so many debts & whatever they've got has go into day to day running.. they are in an utter mess.

ashbyjan · Feb 16, 2012

As I understand it Jack the judge in the test case has delayed judgement for some reason and HMRC are getting sick of football clubs and this preference rule. Portsmouth may well be the first of many to be hammered if HMRC wins the case, which logically they should but hey when has the law had anything to do with fairness or justice.

Real · Feb 16, 2012

I don't want City to stay up due to another clubs misfortune, no matter how badly the club has been run. If we are incapable of surviving in a league with as many teams as the Championship has without the need for another club to go to the wall or have points deducted then we don't deserve to stay up. And if we do stay up as a result of Pompey's misfortune, we are surely only delaying the inevitable by another season?

@richh87 · Feb 16, 2012

kingharvest said:
Why can't you feel sorry for the fans?

Because they'll be able to remember winning the FA Cup through massive overspending.

Brighton Sky Blue · Feb 16, 2012

Astute said:
It can get worse. The fans could lose their club.

Are we supposed to now be thankful that SISU have kept us going?

If the club went bust they would almost certainly reform and start again-and a fanbase of that size would make it no problem at all to do so. As for ourselves-I don't blame SISU for wanting to cut costs and make things more affordable, but as I said in my 'Tory government' analogy in a different thread, they've simply gone way too far, too fast. At least, for now anyway, we don't have the taxman banging on the door

Brighton Sky Blue · Feb 16, 2012

Real said:
I don't want City to stay up due to another clubs misfortune, no matter how badly the club has been run. If we are incapable of surviving in a league with as many teams as the Championship has without the need for another club to go to the wall or have points deducted then we don't deserve to stay up. And if we do stay up as a result of Pompey's misfortune, we are surely only delaying the inevitable by another season?

Couldn't you argue that other teams are benefitting from CCFC's own misfortunes this season?

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