Preferred Team and System (7 Viewers)

[shmmeee]

Yeah. Thats my thoughts, but the only difference is we now have Grimes instead of Eccles. Is changing one player going to make it work effectively?

I think that depends on the defence TBH and whether they’re better trained now or Kitching makes a big difference. Tomorrow will be a huge test of our new system defensively.

 

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[Sky Blue Pete]

Would always look to play 4-2-3-1

So everyone fit it’s

Dovin
Mve Thomas Kitching Bidwell
Grimes Sheaf
Saka rudoni Wright
Simms

Bench

Wilson
Lati
Jds
Allen
Bta
Emc
Eccles binks or bassette or Patterson

Gosh there’s players missing out there.
Saka the only place up for grabs for me

 

[shmmeee]

Why drop Rudoni? Sheaf getting a free pass again?

Because in a two man midfield you generally play two defensive minded midfielders. If you put Rudoni in there we’d get overrun IMO. Of course you could play him LWB but that didn’t work out too well for the last guy.

 

[JSL]

I think we will stick with 3 5 2 tomorrow night but debut grimes in place of either Torp or Allen

 

[lord_garrincha]

Would always look to play 4-2-3-1

So everyone fit it’s

Dovin
Mve Thomas Kitching Bidwell
Grimes Sheaf
Saka rudoni Wright
Simms

Bench

Wilson
Lati
Jds
Allen
Bta
Emc
Eccles binks or bassette or Patterson

Gosh there’s players missing out there.
Saka the only place up for grabs for me

Torp says hi, Pete

 

[shmmeee]

I think we will stick with 3 5 2 tomorrow night but debut grimes in place of either Torp or Allen

I think you might be right, especially with three games in a week and Grimes cup tied. Think there’s merit in keeping him on the bench as motivation for players to keep playing well and hold their place though. Also we’re likely to lose which gives you a free chance to change things without upsetting anyone.

 

[JSL]

Changing formation whilst we are on a roll would be almost suicidal IMO

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Torp says hi, Pete

I knew it
Bloomin eck
Imagine fl doing that and getting a knock on the door
Torp has to be at least on the bench

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I think you might be right, especially with three games in a week and Grimes cup tied. Think there’s merit in keeping him on the bench as motivation for players to keep playing well and hold their place though. Also we’re likely to lose which gives you a free chance to change things without upsetting anyone.

Grimes for Allen or Torp to rest them wouldn’t upset anyone woood it

 

[robbiethemole]

Keep Allen in for his output and harrying, use Grimes for the progressing forward, then Torp in the second half. Allen is like the Duracell bunny!

 

[Chicken Mcgraw]

Dovin
MVE Thomas Kitching Bidwell
Sheaf Grimes
Sakamoto Rudoni Wright
Simms

Collins, Lati, Dasilva, Eccles, Allen, Torp, Mason Clark, Asante, Raphael

When you see it like that, we are lacking a forward option from the bench. Paterson doesn’t fit the bill as he is (like EMC) incapable of playing on the right. Seems like Raphael is being preferred on that side too which is worrying.

 

[skybluecam]

This obsession with 4 at the back from some is odd considering we are looking so much better with 5 atm. Why change formation?

We're not looking better with 5, we looked better with 4. More chances created and about the same conceded.

The main reasons behind our form in the 5 back haven't been the formation, it's mostly actually having a competent keeper and a reduction in individual errors plus generally better luck.

 

[SBT]

The main reasons behind our form in the 5 back haven't been the formation, it's mostly actually having a competent keeper and a reduction in individual errors plus generally better luck.

Don’t understand this mentality at all. I personally think that both Simms and BTA look much more threatening playing as a partnership than as lone strikers. I think the CBs look more comfortable playing the ball out with extra options in the back 3. And I think Torp and Rudoni look much more effective when given freedom to drift out wide and not worry about shoring up the middle of the park. None of that is possible if we play 4ATB with wingers.

 

[napolimp]

Just watched the Leeds Cardiff highlights, and Cardiff were completely overrun in midfield playing 4-3-3. Think keeping the same system with wing backs is the way to go for this next one.

 

[PVA]

And I think Torp and Rudoni look much more effective when given freedom to drift out wide and not worry about shoring up the middle of the park. None of that is possible if we play 4ATB with wingers.

If we go to 4 at the back then I'm not sure Torp starts anyway. I think it would be Grimes and Sheaf, which is a considerably stronger midfield two than we've put out all season and more defensively solid, so Rudoni can still roam and pick up the pockets.

Grimes will also be more willing to pick the ball up off the CBs than any other midfielder so whilst I agree the CBs currently look more comfortable playing out in a 3, Grimes could ease that issue in a 2.

 

[skybluecam]

Don’t understand this mentality at all. I personally think that both Simms and BTA look much more threatening playing as a partnership than as lone strikers. I think the CBs look more comfortable playing the ball out with extra options in the back 3. And I think Torp and Rudoni look much more effective when given freedom to drift out wide and not worry about shoring up the middle of the park. None of that is possible if we play 4ATB with wingers.

BTA and Simms won't both be playing when everyone is fit. Yeah, it is easier for the CBs but it makes us slower going forward. I thought Torp and Rudoni looked highly effective in the 433 when they were getting into the half spaces and making late runs into the box.

Generally I just thought our chance creation was better and we were only marginally worse defensively.

 

[SBT]

BTA and Simms won't both be playing when everyone is fit. Yeah, it is easier for the CBs but it makes us slower going forward. I thought Torp and Rudoni looked highly effective in the 433 when they were getting into the half spaces and making late runs into the box.

Generally I just thought our chance creation was better and we were only marginally worse defensively.

Hmm - I feel like we’re getting the ball forward quicker and more direct now, rather than passing endlessly around the back like we did at the start of Lampard’s tenure. And I think Rudoni and Torp are easily playing their best football of the season at the moment.

I guess people can disagree on these things but we’re also winning points at a better rate than we did with 4ATB so yeah…

 

[Cov98]

I'd love to see us go back to a 4-3-3 or a 4-2-3-1 and play some nice football, and get the likes of EMC, Saka and Wright back in when they're fit, but in reality for the players we have (those 3 aside) a 3 at the back with wing backs seems to suit us very well.

I do wonder if we could maybe go with a 3-4-3 to accommodate EMC, Saka and Wright, but I feel we'll lose a bit in midfield as we'll have to drop Rudoni you'd imagine and go with Grimes & Sheaf or Grimes & Torp.

The other side of the 3-4-3 is Simms and BTA would get less minutes and they've both been very impressive as of late.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I probably agree the formation is not as important as confidence but which came first and why?
The bigggest difference is Dovin saving a few Allen being everywhere and Kitching showing everyone how to defend

 

[shmmeee]

We're not looking better with 5, we looked better with 4. More chances created and about the same conceded.

The main reasons behind our form in the 5 back haven't been the formation, it's mostly actually having a competent keeper and a reduction in individual errors plus generally better luck.

That and playing three of the most out of form sides in the division and stopping AAATB

 

[skybluecam]

That and playing three of the most out of form sides in the division and stopping AAATB

Keep seeing that acronym, what does it mean again

 

[shmmeee]

Keep seeing that acronym, what does it mean again

Its BSBs. Stands for arsing about at the back

 

[skybluecam]

Stat	433 FOR	433 AGAINST	Diff	532 FOR	532 AGAINST	Diff
Goals	1.38	1.25	+0.13	1.60	0.60	+1.00
Shots	13.50	9.75	+3.75	12.20	13.20	-1.00
SoT	4.63	2.75	+1.88	3.00	3.80	-0.80
SoT%	33.50	26.88		26.18	26.14
Dist	15.01	18.06	-3.05	16.82	16.02	+0.80
xG	2.00	0.84	+1.16	1.46	0.94	+0.52
npxG	1.80	0.84	+0.96	1.46	0.94	+0.52
npxG/Sh	0.14	0.08		0.16	0.07
G-xG	-0.63	0.41		0.14	-0.54
np:G-xG	-0.55	0.41		0.14	-0.54

Knocked up some quick stats to show what I'm talking about. "433" is stats from Cardiff H to Cardiff A. 532 is stats from Norwich A to Swansea A.

All per 90, sourced from fbref

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Stat	433 FOR	433 AGAINST	Diff	532 FOR	532 AGAINST	Diff
Goals	1.38	1.25	+0.13	1.60	0.60	+1.00
Shots	13.50	9.75	+3.75	12.20	13.20	-1.00
SoT	4.63	2.75	+1.88	3.00	3.80	-0.80
SoT%	33.50	26.88		26.18	26.14
Dist	15.01	18.06	-3.05	16.82	16.02	+0.80
xG	2.00	0.84	+1.16	1.46	0.94	+0.52
npxG	1.80	0.84	+0.96	1.46	0.94	+0.52
npxG/Sh	0.14	0.08		0.16	0.07
G-xG	-0.63	0.41		0.14	-0.54
np:G-xG	-0.55	0.41		0.14	-0.54

Knocked up some quick stats to show what I'm talking about. "433" is stats from Cardiff H to Cardiff A. 532 is stats from Norwich A to Swansea A.

All per 90, sourced from fbref

Dovin

 

[clint van damme]

Stat	433 FOR	433 AGAINST	Diff	532 FOR	532 AGAINST	Diff
Goals	1.38	1.25	+0.13	1.60	0.60	+1.00
Shots	13.50	9.75	+3.75	12.20	13.20	-1.00
SoT	4.63	2.75	+1.88	3.00	3.80	-0.80
SoT%	33.50	26.88		26.18	26.14
Dist	15.01	18.06	-3.05	16.82	16.02	+0.80
xG	2.00	0.84	+1.16	1.46	0.94	+0.52
npxG	1.80	0.84	+0.96	1.46	0.94	+0.52
npxG/Sh	0.14	0.08		0.16	0.07
G-xG	-0.63	0.41		0.14	-0.54
np:G-xG	-0.55	0.41		0.14	-0.54

Knocked up some quick stats to show what I'm talking about. "433" is stats from Cardiff H to Cardiff A. 532 is stats from Norwich A to Swansea A.

All per 90, sourced from fbref

What's the PPG comparison?

 

[skybluecam]

What's the PPG comparison?

not the point is it

 

[SBT]

Knocked up some quick stats to show what I'm talking about. "433" is stats from Cardiff H to Cardiff A. 532 is stats from Norwich A to Swansea A.

All per 90, sourced from fbref

Cheers, I see what you're saying better now.

For me, the standout is the goals against column - literally conceding half as many GA/90 in this current formation than we did playing 433. I know Dovin has been much better than Collins, but surely that can't be entirely down to one player?

 

[skybluecam]

Cheers, I see what you're saying better now.

For me, the standout is the goals against column - literally conceding half as many GA/90 in this current formation than we did playing 433. I know Dovin has been much better than Collins, but surely that can't be entirely down to one player?

tbh I think that is like 90% the keeper swap. Our xG against stats have actually got marginally worse. Collins PSxG stats were by far the worst in the league. 5 at the back has probably helped slightly in terms of having more bodies back to block and pressure though.

 

[SleepyGinger]

really hard to leave Torp out, this just shows our strength in the middle now

 

[clint van damme]

not the point is it

When debating which system is best, determining which one harvests the most points isnt relevant? OK.

 

[Chicken Mcgraw]

really hard to leave Torp out, this just shows our strength in the middle now

Sheaf looking a lot better than Grimes

 

[skybluecam]

When debating which system is best, determining which one harvests the most points isnt relevant? OK.

point tallies over such a small sample of games aren't necessarily representative of actual performance

 

[clint van damme]

point tallies over such a small sample of games aren't necessarily representative of actual performance

I agree, and there's a whole host of other factors which can skew such a small sample size, though that could also go for the stats you put up.

 

[skybluecam]

I agree, and there's a whole host of other factors which can skew such a small sample size, though that could also go for the stats you put up.

true but points are much more variable/chaotic than underlying stats

 

[SBT]

really hard to leave Torp out, this just shows our strength in the middle now

Grimes and Eccles clinging onto those X and Y axes like goddamn barnacles