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[clint van damme]

This is a murderer. So you'd consider all murders on a case by case basis. Perhaps mass murderers get a certificate of excellence and single murderers get tagged so they get another opportunity.

think his point is this fella wasn't deported for his initial offence because he didn't get a sentence of 12 months or longer so rather than having that mandatory line in the sand maybe look at cases on an individual basis or relate the condition for deportation to the type of offence rather than the length of sentence.

 

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[Grendel]

In the end I don’t think anyone would argue against the death penalty whatever their political spectrum for this individual

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

In the end I don’t think anyone would argue against the death penalty whatever their political spectrum for this individual

For vicious crimes like this where guilt is beyond doubt and there is no remorse, yes I agree.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

In the end I don’t think anyone would argue against the death penalty whatever their political spectrum for this individual

You'd think so wouldn't you ? However.....

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

For vicious crimes like this where guilt is beyond doubt and there is no remorse, yes I agree.

He stabbed lots of people sitting in a circle on the grass in a park. What's remorse got to do with it ? What a terrible thing to suggest - say sorry and we'll make life better for you.

 

[hill83]

I’ve always been against the death penalty in general. But beyond all reasonable doubt in a case like this pop the c**t.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Obviously this was going to be terror related just from reading what happened. Jail or deport the c**t.



Can you explain what you mean by this please?

When it is not a white person committing the crime the reaction is totally different.

Shouldn't it all be despicable?

 

[hill83]

When it is not a white person committing the crime the reaction is totally different.

Shouldn't it all be despicable?

Thought you meant that.

 

[clint van damme]

When it is not a white person committing the crime the reaction is totally different.

Shouldn't it all be despicable?

nonsense.
There is a growing threat from extreme right terrorists and there are a growing number of incidents. They rarely get mentioned and they definitely don't get their own thread.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

nonsense.
There is a growing threat from extreme right terrorists and there are a growing number of incidents. They rarely get mentioned and they definitely don't get their own thread.

You're just proving my point and that's why people get frustrated.

A terrorist attack has happened, quick let's talk about right wing terror.

It's all fucking awful and trying to have a reasoned debate on here is impossible.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

When it is not a white person committing the crime the reaction is totally different.

Shouldn't it all be despicable?

If a white bloke had done this we'd be on here saying shoot the bastard / string him up / put him in prison til he dies.
When this news broke, did anyone on here ask his skin colour, whether he was a Muslim , Sikh, Hindu, church of England etc ?
Now gives similar attacks in recent years one might be forgiven for thinking it might me a Muslim extremist , given what has gone before. Let's face it, if a bomb went off at the NEC at a gig in the 1970s it would be assumed it was the IRA. In 2020 it would be assumed , rightly or not to be a Muslim extremist.
When I heard about this my first thought was Muslim extremist. I wasn't in possession of the full facts but thinking of mass stabbings we've seen and heard about in recent times it was my gut feeling. It still is. I don't know if he is a Muslim extremists but as mass stabbings go I don't know if any other motive for such carnage on this scale.
If he isn't and is just a complete psycho then I jumped to conclusions and got it wrong.

 

[hill83]

You pair have lost it. Bet my posts on this matter have confused and annoyed the fuck out of you.

 

[clint van damme]

You're just proving my point and that's why people get frustrated.

A terrorist attack has happened, quick let's talk about right wing terror.

It's all fucking awful and trying to have a reasoned debate on here is impossible.

all I've done is prove you wrong.
You said when a white person commits a crime it gets treated totally different, well it does but not in the way you're alluding to.
.
We basically are up against two main terror threats in this country, the biggest threat, Islamists, (mainly non white), and next, the far right (mainly white), we don't have threads on the extreme right threat, that's a fact. The police have foiled far right terror plots in this country, we don't have threads on them. So your point is wrong.
You were the first person on this thread to mention left or right so therefore were the first person to weaponise this attack to make a political dig.
And we're 9 pages in and I have mentioned skin colour for the first time in response to a post from you mentioning skin colour. You bring up race quite often i'm beginning to have suspicions about you.
But yeah, you're the only one who can have reasonable debate.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

He stabbed lots of people sitting in a circle on the grass in a park. What's remorse got to do with it ? What a terrible thing to suggest - say sorry and we'll make life better for you.

I didn't suggest anything of the sort.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

For vicious crimes like this where guilt is beyond doubt and there is no remorse, yes I agree.

No ? Then you mean something else then .

 

[David O'Day]

all I've done is prove you wrong.
You said when a white person commits a crime it gets treated totally different, well it does but not in the way you're alluding to.
.
We basically are up against two main terror threats in this country, the biggest threat, Islamists, (mainly non white), and next, the far right (mainly white), we don't have threads on the extreme right threat, that's a fact. The police have foiled far right terror plots in this country, we don't have threads on them. So your point is wrong.
You were the first person on this thread to mention left or right so therefore were the first person to weaponise this attack to make a political dig.
And we're 9 pages in and I have mentioned skin colour for the first time in response to a post from you mentioning skin colour. You bring up race quite often i'm beginning to have suspicions about you.
But yeah, you're the only one who can have reasonable debate.

The number of people in jail convicted of far right terrorism related offences has increased 6 fold in 5 years.

Still I don't see people starting threads on National Action et al.

 

[Ian1779]

This is getting boring now

It’s only boring because you’ve got nothing to add outside of shitty sound bites and whatever Boris tells you.

This guy should never have been able to commit this crime in the first place - ask yourself where the failing is.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

all I've done is prove you wrong.
You said when a white person commits a crime it gets treated totally different, well it does but not in the way you're alluding to.
.
We basically are up against two main terror threats in this country, the biggest threat, Islamists, (mainly non white), and next, the far right (mainly white), we don't have threads on the extreme right threat, that's a fact. The police have foiled far right terror plots in this country, we don't have threads on them. So your point is wrong.
You were the first person on this thread to mention left or right so therefore were the first person to weaponise this attack to make a political dig.
And we're 9 pages in and I have mentioned skin colour for the first time in response to a post from you mentioning skin colour. You bring up race quite often i'm beginning to have suspicions about you.
But yeah, you're the only one who can have reasonable debate.

I said the reactions are different, which is totally true. If they weren't we wouldn't be seeing so much arguing here.

You've also proved my second point which is to suggest I'm racist because of what I posted. That isn't an argument, and it isn't true anyway. But you know that.

If you want to open a thread on right wing terror attacks then go for it, I'll be happy to denounce all of it. The difference being that there is a lot less to talk about because it is a significantly lesser threat than option number 1.

I guess I'm racist for highlighting that too?

 

[clint van damme]

If a white bloke had done this we'd be on here saying shoot the bastard / string him up / put him in prison til he dies.
When this news broke, did anyone on here ask his skin colour, whether he was a Muslim , Sikh, Hindu, church of England etc ?
Now gives similar attacks in recent years one might be forgiven for thinking it might me a Muslim extremist , given what has gone before. Let's face it, if a bomb went off at the NEC at a gig in the 1970s it would be assumed it was the IRA. In 2020 it would be assumed , rightly or not to be a Muslim extremist.

think most people were saying wait and see though the suspicion would be that it was a Muslim.

Remember two girls got stabbed to death in a London park a few days a go and there has been no suggestion from the police that that was a terrorist attack.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

No ? Then you mean something else then .

What are you on about? This guy carried out a vicious mass murder in broad daylight and has no remorse. It's a literal description of what he is and why I think the death penalty would be appropriate. What did you think I meant?

 

[David O'Day]

think most people were saying wait and see though the suspicion would be that it was a Muslim.

Remember two girls got stabbed to death in a London park a few days a go and there has been no suggestion from the police that that was a terrorist attack.

I mentioned the man who stabbed a load of people at the Manchester Arndale, that wasn't a terrorist attack.

 

[clint van damme]

I said the reactions are different, which is totally true. If they weren't we wouldn't be seeing so much arguing here.

You've also proved my second point which is to suggest I'm racist because of what I posted. That isn't an argument, and it isn't true anyway. But you know that.

If you want to open a thread on right wing terror attacks then go for it, I'll be happy to denounce all of it. The difference being that there is a lot less to talk about because it is a significantly lesser threat than option number 1.

I guess I'm racist for highlighting that too?

but we don't even discuss them, or very rarely.
So how can you say the reaction is different, (in the way you're allusing to), , it's absolute nonsense.
I agree it's a lesser threat and have said so numerous times but it's still a far bigger threat than something like antifa or BLM who regularly get attacked on here but who are at worse thugs and vandals, don't think they've ever plotted to bomb or kill people.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

What are you on about? This guy carried out a vicious mass murder in broad daylight and has no remorse. It's a literal description of what he is and why I think the death penalty would be appropriate. What did you think I meant?

So what's remorse got to do with it? Why have you mentioned remorse? Or am I seeing things ?
I hope your lesson plans are better than the crap you write on here.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

For vicious crimes like this where guilt is beyond doubt and there is no remorse, yes I agree.

This apology of yours implies that remorse is a factor in the punishment for this type of crime. Its there. You wrote it.
It implies if there is remorse, the punishment might be different.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

So what's remorse got to do with it? Why have you mentioned remorse? Or am I seeing things ?
I hope your lesson plans are better than the crap you write on here.

Because genuine remorse points to some hope for long term rehabilitation, though it would again need to be proved beyond all doubt.

I don't know why you then jump to more personal insults. Not getting dragged into that.

 

[Grendel]

Because genuine remorse points to some hope for long term rehabilitation, though it would again need to be proved beyond all doubt.

I don't know why you then jump to more personal insults. Not getting dragged into that.

He can throw himself on the Koran and plead repentance but personally I would not want him back on the streets so we end up with a character whose likely to spend 60 years in prison

 

[clint van damme]

He can throw himself on the Koran and plead repentance but personally I would not want him back on the streets so we end up with a character whose likely to spend 60 years in prison

no way he gets out after this surely?
So yeah, going to be paying to keep him inside for a long time.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

He can throw himself on the Koran and plead repentance but personally I would not want him back on the streets so we end up with a character whose likely to spend 60 years in prison

I don't believe this man had any and as an extremist would say the texts justify what he did. No problem with him getting the sentence.

 

[Deleted member 4439]

In the end I don’t think anyone would argue against the death penalty whatever their political spectrum for this individual

The last polls on this had us split 50:50. Were the right for the state to take an individual's life ever reintroduced then I'll know that the country's well and truly fucked.

 

[Tommo1993]

Maybe someone will kill him on the inside. Can live in hope.

 

[Nick]

Maybe someone will kill him on the inside. Can live in hope.

Nah he will be protected.

 

[Tommo1993]

Nah he will be protected.

Shame.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

Because genuine remorse points to some hope for long term rehabilitation, though it would again need to be proved beyond all doubt.
.

It can never be proved beyond all doubt. Would you let Peter Sutcliffe out if he showed genuine remorse ? After all, he's done a fair stint already.

 

[OffenhamSkyBlue]

He'll get sent to the extremist unit at HMP Long Lartin, near Evesham, where he can spend his time radicalising other innocents.
Personally, i don't think it is particularly helpful pinning a label on something like this as being "terrorism". It doesn't make any difference to the atrocity of the crime to know that he subscribed to an ISIS online magazine, and it shouldn't make any difference to the length of time he serves.
It's the same as the tariff for sentences for racially-motivated crimes and "hate crimes" is increased by 50%. I don't think that should be the case. The outcome of a murder is the same no matter the race, gender, belief of the victim, so the sentence should reflect that.
In my view.
The problem i have is that he will have to serve his sentence here before he can be deported. He should have to serve his sentence in downtown Tripoli.

 

[stupot07]

It's now been confirmed that he was known to M15 in 2019, I wonder what impact Boris not re-establishing the Intelligence and Security Committee had on this.

For info

The committee oversees the policies, expenditure and operations of MI5, MI6, GCHQ and other national security bodies, but has still not reconvened since it was dissolved six months ago at the general election.

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