Indeed and one thing that should be out in the open is what's been agreed regarding the stadium.
One thing any investor would demand to know is that so I'm sure a deal in principal is agreed.
It could be the funds are required to pay an increased rent over a long period - in which case we'd be condemned to where we are now.
Mortgaged to wasps and mortgaged in the future to sisu.
Exactly. She can just sit on it until some mug comes along- or Hoffman and co come up with enough money to put us, and themselves as fans, out of our misery.
Is anyone talking football/going to the match today or are we all going to the City Arms for a mass debate about takeovers?
Because the answer would be scary.
Who's this mug then? How can she just sit on it? That may have worked last season but next season is going to be a different kettle of fish. Between the way they've derided this offer that's given fans hope and the pathetic open letter all she's done is promote a boycott. No way we'll be able to break even next season. It's going to cost her money. MR isn't going to be given the tools to do the job, we're not going to get promoted, I'd be surprised if MR is still here by the end of next season and the downward cycle will continue costing them more money, stacking even more debt against the club, making the club even more worthless than it already is.
Your prediction that she can just sit on it is naive to say the least. Maybe even more naive than your £10M up front valuation. If Joy shares your sentiment that probably goes a long way to explaining how things have decayed so much and so quickly under SISU.
We would get 20k+ once maybe twice maximum look at when we returned to the Ricoh.[/QUOTE
Its all about opinions - If the manager was given the funds and the club was stable and we were top of the league -we would sell out every away ground (and more) and would have regular attendances hitting 20,000 + as the potential is massive
I wonder if Hoffman has actually asked Joy what she would accept or he is just fishing? She might not tell him anyway, of course.
So it's not Joys job to finance them but it's their job to bail Joy out?
You do realise that not that long ago Chinese paid £30M for a championship club, with a championship squad, their own stadium, their own training ground, their own cat2 academy, pretty sure they were debt free and in profit also.
Based on that what makes you think that a failing league 2 club with no ground, rents space for their academy, is in debt, is barely breaking even and is basically a shell of a company run by an idiot is worth a third of that?
I think you and Joy for that matter need to go out and look for the yard stick.
This offer (unless GH comes back again) is probably as good as it's going to get for Joy. She's a hedge fund boss. She's used to taking gambles with other peoples. How is this any different? Except she doesn't have to even get involved with managing this.
apologies got my banks mixed upHoffman had nothing to do with HSBC (who have never needed getting back on their feet).
Hoffman was head of Barclaycard and Barclays UK. Was appointed CEO of Northern Rock after their difficulties then left to NBNK Investments (which failed - not sure he was still involved at that point). Believe he's currently CEO of Hastings Insurance. The guy will have plenty of wealthy contacts.
SkyBlue Kid you're such a drama queen. Go outside and have a beer mate.
I don't get the "no proof of funds, and no transparency over the identity of would-be ‘investors’ "
Doing any sort of buying you don't reveal your hand to at the start.
The identities could give a lot away about how much money each one have. Its not hard to do a full search on somebodys finances. Inc current net worth house price and all the other information you could ever need.
Think about buying a house, Once you have an offer excepted thats when you show your proof of funds not before.
Why would he? It's so much more fun playing the Machiavellian game.
Most of the above is true - but the premise is false.
In your example the club was 'for sale' - apparently our club is not.
So totally different pricing principles.
How much do you think she wants for the club?
If nobody is prepared to pay what she wants, then what? Keep hurting the club in the hope she at some point accepts defeat?
Christ almightyExplain how the others I assume you are referring to Gary Hoffman and Joe Elliott have failed in the past ?
It's not really. We keep being told Ryton is worth more than what is being offered. So what, that's clearly not how valuing football clubs work. The example I gave was Wolves. £30M paid for the whole party. Their ground, training ground, academy and squad are worth considerably more than that and then you have to consider that this is a club (IIRC) that is in profit, higher up the pyramid and hasn't decimated it's customer base, sponsors and burnt every bridge in the process. The ground is possibly worth the £30M in real estate on it's own. Consider that and then explain how anyone could claim that someone should offer £10M up front?
So he should have offered the most he could straight away?Exactly. They seem to totally ignore that SISU are not interested in a deal that will force them to realise a huge loss in exchange for a few pounds and promisses of more if the future is bright and positive.
To me it underlines that Hoffman is the wrong man for the job. He need to understand SISU, how they work and - most importantly - how they make their money - before he can table a bid they would listen to.
It doesn't matter one bit if the club is worth more or less the offer - it's all about what SISU will potentially gain or lose overall.
It would be different if SISU were acitvely seeking a way out and put the club up for sale. Then it would be about assets and debt write off - like when SISU came in.
But they haven't put the club up for sale, and they won't have to, even if the club is losing its home at the Ricoh, must close down the acadamy, faces less revenues in league 2 and sees a huge drop in ST sales. SISU will cut costs as they have since 2010 and maybe be forced to make additional, but small loans to the club. It won't force them to sell.
But the club will suffer even more and make it even less likely for serious investors to work up an appetite.
He is repeating past mistakes of believing SISU can be forced out by urging fans to deprive the club of money or create loud sisu-out-campaigns. It didn't work in 2013 and it won't work in 2017.
He need to rethink his strategy.
Of course they willThere is no doubt season ticket sales will recover to pre SISU levels.
No you complete buffoon, we've been down the only game in town road before to disastrous consequencesIs there any point in the fans now uniting behind Gary Hoffman to provide a united front to oust SISU ? Could be a powerful way ?
I don't think anyone was really said that, have they? Some are just curious and rightly questioning a takeover.
You know why? Because the last takeover we all thought would be rosy turned out to be really shit. It's natural for people to question these things, especially when they've already been stung once.
This seems so blindingly obvious, I feel ashamed for liking it!I hope something good comes of this in particular that Sisu and fisher go sooner rather than later. But we would be wrong after all we have been through to simply accept or assume. The fans need to question to challenge to demand transparency and detail, a robust well thought out and planned bid should have no problem in proving that or the reasoning behind any decision
50% of transfer fees for 5 years sounds good. Who said they have to sell? If they wanted us to compete they would keep our best players.That worries me. Sounds like OSB was correct in his concern that Hoffman and his consortium don't have the funds themselves. We're hardly flush with money as it is, promising to give up 50% of future transfer fees and selling the training ground (where would we train?) surely has implications moving forward.
I'm getting the impression that the £1.2m is the figure for the lot and he expects to get the club debt free for that.
Hopefully Italia will now reveal where he got his information from.
50% of transfer fees for 5 years sounds good. Who said they have to sell? If they wanted us to compete they would keep our best players.
Or have all transfers as undisclosed and tell SISU it was a tenner.
You are very likely right to do so Which is precisely why there must be fans asking questions. Not because in all likelihood Hoffman is not the better option but because the future of the club is so precarious the next owner has to be the right one not just a better one.I'd choose Hoffman over SISU every time on every parallel universe I live on.
You are very likely right to do so Which is precisely why there must be fans asking questions. Not because in all likelihood Hoffman is not the better option but because the future of the club is so precarious the next owner has to be the right one not just a better one.
Anyone reading this thinking I am putting his bid down or fighting against it would be quite wrong and should read my posts more carefully
Just want people to go in to ownership change with eyes wide open
Just need Sisu to allow the first domino to fall and everything else falls into place.
Delay buying your tickets to further pressurise Sisu.
Keep badgering Sisu by email and phone and lets use tomorrow to verbally let our thoughts be known.
Keep off the pitch though as Wasps have a big couple of games coming up
What is your beef with Gary Hoffman, 4 years ago he fronted a consortium to try and take over the club, it failed which I thinks proved to be a great shame, we had our own ground then and a secure venue for our academy and a training ground.And the last takeover involved... Gary Hoffman.
So is it any wonder people would question who he judges appropriate this time?
Just had a warning of my "Account being restricted because of swearing"...... Deal with some of these other posters that swear on a regular basis too...Including your own Moderators. Ban me if you like.
So he should have offered the most he could straight away?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?