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Shitsu Offloading Revenue (1 Viewer)

  • Thread starter skybluetony176
  • Start date Aug 29, 2013
Forums New posts

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #1
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323324904579043023358294120.html

Shitsu are looking to off load revenue tied up in an eastern Europe telecoms company.

Just business or do they need to raise capital? fingers crossed the later.
 
T

Tonylinc

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #2
What makes you think that any capital raised will be sunk into CCFC? I would think that we would be the last of their concerns.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #3
Tonylinc said:
What makes you think that any capital raised will be sunk into CCFC? I would think that we would be the last of their concerns.
Click to expand...

i don't think it will be sunk into ccfc, that has never been their business model for our club.

the point i am making is that our club must be a big drain on them at the moment so is it possible that they need to sell other assets to cover losses on ccfc? ie could it be an indication that NOPM is working?

i'm not saying its the case but if they get in a position where they need to start off loading assets to maintain their interest in ccfc and what ever their end game/exit strategy is, they may decide enough is enough, cut their losses and sell the club.

its only a theory but its the 1st news story i have ever found about them where they are selling assets other than our star players, so its worth keeping an eye on them in the press and online to see if a pattern is emerging that can give us a better idea of what may or not be going on behind closed doors.
 
J

Jack Griffin

Guest
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #4
Translated from German in article http://www.faz.net/agenturmeldungen...euer-osteuropa-strategie-kreise-12552360.html

Netia has long been in the sights of Telekom, the people say. The publicly traded cable operator is almost half owned by financial investors. Two of them, Third Avenue Management and Sisu Capital have already hired the investment bank Morgan Stanley to hold out for prospective buyers, said a person familiar with the process.
Click to expand...
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #5
Any business would realise they need to get out of ccfc
Loss of confidence by its customers and huge outlay required in future years in addition to a huge fight with planners and appeals.
Forget the Ricoh Sisu that option has gone for you.

PUSB NOPM
 
R

RPHunt

New Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #6
Maybe an indication that investors in the hedge fund are getting nervous as SISU's incompetence is being laid bare in the media.

If the investors in the hedge fund are trying to get out, then SISU would have to sell off assets to be able to pay them.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #7
RPHunt said:
Maybe an indication that investors in the hedge fund are getting nervous as SISU's incompetence is being laid bare in the media.

If the investors in the hedge fund are trying to get out, then SISU would have to sell off assets to be able to pay them.
Click to expand...

another interesting view point that i hadn't considered.

is it possible to get a list of their investors? we could start badgering them directly. i have had a little look on the internet but have drawn a blank.
 
G

georgehudson

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #8
exactly sbt176, to identify their investors & then ask the investors whether they are happy with the way THEIR money is being used
 
R

RPHunt

New Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #9
skybluetony176 said:
is it possible to get a list of their investors?
Click to expand...

No, it is not something that they are obliged to publish. Most institutional investors would disclose any holding, but I have never come across such a disclosure.
 
C

CarpyCov84

New Member
  • Aug 29, 2013
  • #10
Concrete evidence their flapping pulling money out of other busines....

Get out while you can Sisu before you have nothing left !!!
 

singers_pore

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #11
One of the key points of a hedge fund is to keep their investors strictly anonymous. You'll never get that information unless someone from within SISU chooses to leak.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #12
How do we know the money isn't coming to build a stadium or if it is even coming to ccfc?
 
C

CarpyCov84

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #13
Nick said:
How do we know the money isn't coming to build a stadium or if it is even coming to ccfc?
Click to expand...

You been drinking tonight Nick ???

 

Nick

Administrator
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #14
CarpyCov84 said:
You been drinking tonight Nick ???

Click to expand...

No but things are being read into, it also says another company is looking to sell not just sisu.
 
R

RPHunt

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #15
Nick said:
it also says another company is looking to sell not just sisu.
Click to expand...

Not surprising really as the shares have gone down by 1/3 in value this year - in a rising market. Looks like another very poor investment decision by SISU.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #16
RPHunt said:
Not surprising really as the shares have gone down by 1/3 in value this year - in a rising market. Looks like another very poor investment decision by SISU.
Click to expand...

Was hoping somebody would be able to look a bit deeper, I thought they didn't sell when it was at the bottom of the sequence or whatever it was that was said???
 

ESB

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #17
Funds sell when the cost financing is higher than their projected returns (simple explanation).

Investors will expect a target return (performance is usually published monthly), if the investment portfolio is not delivering this there'll be pressure to make corrections.

Add in the need for liquidity (cash flow problems), the chance to realise gains above long term projection (making a quick buck) or the investment portfolio is un balanced either through concentration (too many assets in one place) or being on the wrong side of the curve (short ~ long of assets when the markets moving against you).

Long and short there's no way to tell unless you have complete disclosure of their strategy and transparency of all the legal entities that make up their investment portfolio.

Looking at the economics of the CCFC deal I cannot see what they're trying to achieve, but I take this as I don't know all the facts.

I do know NOPM is the best protest we have, they are a financial beast don't feed them.
 

mrtrench

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #18
ESB said:
Funds sell when the cost financing is higher than their projected returns (simple explanation).

Investors will expect a target return (performance is usually published monthly), if the investment portfolio is not delivering this there'll be pressure to make corrections.

Add in the need for liquidity (cash flow problems), the chance to realise gains above long term projection (making a quick buck) or the investment portfolio is un balanced either through concentration (too many assets in one place) or being on the wrong side of the curve (short ~ long of assets when the markets moving against you).

Long and short there's no way to tell unless you have complete disclosure of their strategy and transparency of all the legal entities that make up their investment portfolio.

Looking at the economics of the CCFC deal I cannot see what they're trying to achieve, but I take this as I don't know all the facts.

I do know NOPM is the best protest we have, they are a financial beast don't feed them.
Click to expand...

Yes, I agree with this. So why did you say a few days ago that you believe SISU is using CCFC as a debt pit and hence NOPM will not work?
 

ESB

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #19
I said i feared it won't work, hence knowing all the facts.

But I'm still not giving them cash, as that's my only form of protest I have that can achieve anything.

Should also say I deplore the fact these leaches are trying to distress ACL in to a fire sale. So I refuse to feed them.
 
Last edited: Aug 30, 2013
T

thaiskyblue

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #20
Nick said:
How do we know the money isn't coming to build a stadium or if it is even coming to ccfc?
Click to expand...
You can not be that green , how long have shitsu been here , when have they ever done anything positive for the club, wake up please !
 
J

jesus-wept

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #21
singers_pore;536578 You'll never get that information unless someone from within SISU chooses to leak.[/QUOTE said:
[That's what is needed, an insider. Think I read they employ about 15 at their London HQ so we need a well heeled ally to make one an offer that can't be refused.
Click to expand...
 

mattylad

Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #22
Just because they have Morgan Stanley looking for possible suiters does not mean that they are selling at any price. This is just a case of sending out feelers to see if any one bites. As for propping up CCFC my understanding was that they have already had to show proof of funding for the next three years to the football league.
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #23
Nick said:
How do we know the money isn't coming to build a stadium or if it is even coming to ccfc?
Click to expand...

ointlaugh:
 

James Smith

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #24
Nick said:
How do we know the money isn't coming to build a stadium or if it is even coming to ccfc?
Click to expand...

I'll believe it when I see the stadium being built - Where are the plans for the White Elephant Stadium Tim?
 

James Smith

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #25
Nick said:
Was hoping somebody would be able to look a bit deeper, I thought they didn't sell when it was at the bottom of the sequence or whatever it was that was said???
Click to expand...

Wasn't it you don't sell at the bottom of the business cycle"*? And if so sounds like someone somewhere isn't peddling fast enough.

*especially if it's your fault that you've got there in the first place.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #26
James Smith said:
I'll believe it when I see the stadium being built - Where are the plans for the White Elephant Stadium Tim?
Click to expand...

The thing is, all we know from that is that SISU may sell one of their investments. Nothing more or less so may not even be related to CCFC?
 
T

Taga

New Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #27
skybluetony176 said:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323324904579043023358294120.html

Shitsu are looking to off load revenue tied up in an eastern Europe telecoms company.

Just business or do they need to raise capital? fingers crossed the later.
Click to expand...

Are SISU giving away money? or are they they off loading assets to generate revenue?
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #28
Nick said:
The thing is, all we know from that is that SISU may sell one of their investments. Nothing more or less so may not even be related to CCFC?
Click to expand...

tbf we know a little more than that. Even Joy has said time and time again they have made mistakes. Funny thing is, they keep making them !
 

RegTheDonk

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #29
James Smith said:
Wasn't it you don't sell at the bottom of the business cycle"*? And if so sounds like someone somewhere isn't peddling fast enough.

*especially if it's your fault that you've got there in the first place.
Click to expand...

While I understand Fishers point, it relies on the business being able to climb back up that cycle. This did't happen with Woolworths, Comet, and god knows how many other big chains who have gone bump, and the jury is out on Jessops.

Sometimes your business model is wrong or your competitors have the market sewn up.

For Fisher to unilaterally say that, effectively, you don't sell unless you are making a profit, is blind ignorance. Just because its a football club, a unique product in a particular catchment area, doesn't mean it will see a return .... SISU have apparently writton off millions "selling" to Otium. Robinson apparently lost millions selling to SISU.

The only way the will ever get their money back, as lots of people have pointed out so apologies for a repetative post, is getting the stadium on the cheap and flogging CCFC with it as a package. Alternatively, get us into the prem and pocket the TV money, which won't happen as they are a company that strips, not invests.

So sell up now Joy, the cycle's chain has come off - you'll get a few million back for CCFC - the council won't sell below the going price, if to SISU at all.
 

lordsummerisle

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #30
RegTheDonk said:
While I understand Fishers point, it relies on the business being able to climb back up that cycle. This did't happen with Woolworths, Comet, and god knows how many other big chains who have gone bump, and the jury is out on Jessops.
Click to expand...

I think that lots of those couldn't afford the rent on their shops, after selling the freeholds for a bit of money and then leasing them at excessive rates.

Lot of that about!
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #31
Nick said:
No but things are being read into, it also says another company is looking to sell not just sisu.
Click to expand...

the other company has board members on shitsu's board as well. they are linked in a big way.
 
Last edited: Aug 30, 2013

rondog1973

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #32
Nick said:
Was hoping somebody would be able to look a bit deeper, I thought they didn't sell when it was at the bottom of the sequence or whatever it was that was said???
Click to expand...
It could be that all of SISU's eggs are in the one basket (Obtaining the Ricoh). This ain't gonna happen. Could be wrong, but I think I hear the sound of creaking noises coming from the organisation given some of their recent activities (This post's subject, advertising for fans due to Timmy's woefully optimistic forecast on attendance figures. Keep the pressure on, NOPM.
 
W

wince

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #33
It could be that all of SISU's eggs are in the one basket (Obtaining the Ricoh). This ain't gonna happen. Could be wrong, but I think I hear the sound of creaking noises coming from the organisation given some of their recent activities (This post's subject, advertising for fans due to Timmy's woefully optimistic forecast on attendance figures. Keep the pressure on, NOPM
Click to expand...
Have said all along no company can run without money, soon that £70 mill debt wont just be on paper but real, no one can keep loosing other peoples money , remember we have already had 5 plus years of losses , it will be ten twelve years before the club can think of selling how much will they have spent by then ?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 30, 2013
  • #34
football.co.uk have picked up the story also

http://www.football.co.uk/coventry_city/sisu_to_off-load_its_polish_telcom_interest_rss4386922.shtml

(edit) just noticed they got the scoop from Coventry-city mad, remember you heard it here 1st
 
Last edited: Aug 30, 2013
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