Only problem in your analogy being that afterwards they carried on fighting and killing each other for four years...
Sisu will not drop JR appeal (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter SimonGilbert
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Only problem in your analogy being that afterwards they carried on fighting and killing each other for four years...
Como
Well-Known Member
From ACL's perspective not sure what there is in it for them, a rent for not very much for a couple of years, assuming it is paid. Would be less than they are currently owed.
And then they still need to find a longer term occupant, I am going to guess that is what they are focusing on.
And then they still need to find a longer term occupant, I am going to guess that is what they are focusing on.
Paxman II
Well-Known Member
the £590k has been lodge in escrow so effectively paid.
ACL would gain tremendously from the football club being back at the Ricoh. from sponsorship deals to f&b and footfall using all the available outlets from casino to burger van. They are getting income from all of these one way or another.
ACL can not dictate legal action be dropped or as you say suggest it is utterly pointless. How would anyone know that? If we knew the outcome of the courts beforehand then why do we have them?
Who cares how incredibly weak ACL appear? They are incredibly weak as it stands and getting more so every day.
They can negotiate without losing anything they have not got already without the hard ball attitude of stubbornness.
They are more venerable than SISU whether you like it or not.
The carrot has been dangled by SISU and is already an about turn in thinking so just respond and make an attempt at getting round the table. Drop all your conditions and show the fans how amenable you are and this will reflect badly if SISU having suggested it end up refusing it.
ACL's job is to have a football club using the Ricoh with it's potential capacity usage. There is only ever going to be one football club in the area that can achieve that, so stop with the pre conditions and attempt every time, any time to get that football team back in the Ricoh. Who SISU are, what they are, how they are has no concerns for doing your job.
TheRoyalScam
Well-Known Member
I've read some s##t in my time but your post takes the biscuit.
Astute
Well-Known Member
SISU should get rid of Fisher and sign you up. What you have just stated there is better than anything that Fisher has released on behalf of SISU.
590k effectively paid? Yes, but not paid. And are holding off paying ACL anything so points towards still wanting to distress ACL and not wanting to make a deal.
ACL to gain from our club being back? So SISU want all revenues whilst paying a low rent but for the argument ACL will gain all round?
ACL can't dictate about the legal action being dropped? OMG remember not long ago when some on here were saying that SISU would win. Everything was the fault of ACL/CCC. Nobody knows the final result? Look at the last judgement. Nothing went their way at all. Yet we are supposed to think that they could win an appeal that hasn't been granted. But you and a few others are saying legal action shouldn't be dropped. 'Come on SISU you can batter ACL/CCC in court and weaken them so much then get the arena for your investors' Yeah right. So none of you would want to deal with someone who keeps using litigation against you, especially when it has been proved to be unfounded, but you expect ACL to do so.
Who cares how weak ACL seems? Hardly anyone. But are they as weak as you try to make out. That part of your statement has been tried by Fisher and Labo. But when challenged they both admitted they have no proof.
They can negotiate without losing anything they have not got already without the hard ball attitude of stubbornness? I take it you are talking about SISU here? It certainly describes them and their attitude 100%.
They are more venerable than SISU whether you like it or not. Fact or fiction? ACL seem to be making a profit without our club. Vulnerable? However hard SISU have tried to distress them they are now doing much better than SISU. Our club has been reduced to the size of a small towns football club. Fan base for home games obliterated. Season tickets now in the low hundreds. Income down to nowhere near covering a division 3 club. Legal bills mounting up. Getting battered in court when they promised the opposite. Was Joy showing her face for the first time a sign of desperation? Have her investors had enough of losing money? Why have they started meeting and taking calls off us fans? I could go on. Just like you could if you were being honest about the situation. SISU don't look that strong anymore.
The carrot has been dangled by SISU and is already an about turn in thinking? It is a wonder that they have any carrots left to dangle. That is all we have had from them for ages. All we ever get from them is words not action. So you are saying that if no agreement is made it will be the fault of ACL/CCC. So we are back to where we were before the JR. It is all the fault of ACL/CCC until they prove themselves innocent again. Yet SISU who we know come out with constant bullshit are seen as the innocent party by some yet again :facepalm:
ACL's job is to have a football club using the Ricoh with it's potential capacity usage.d them to the wall. Correct. But as you know SISU have been out to distress them and send them to the wall. ACL have been vindicated in all their actions. So has CCC. SISU have been proved in a court of law to be guilty in all their actions. Yet you try to blame ACL for where we are now. Stop the preconditions? Most of us know that the best way of building bridges would be to stop the futile litigation. The judge didn't make a snap decision. He would have spent the time checking out all points of law. The appeal would be checking out all the same points of law. No new points would be brought up. Yet some think that this should continue.
Who SISU are, what they are, how they are has no concerns for doing your job. It does when you consider how they have tried to do things against them.
What we need is for all things in the past to be left behind. How can this happen when the past is still happening? To me the way forward is stop the futile litigation and talk. Maybe see about getting Higgs out of the equation. You know....like the so called road map. Have a partnership between SISU and CCC. Get revenues going to our club. But this can't be done in a day. All trust is lost in SISU. Nobody in their right mind would trust them. Instead of words we need actions. Not more of the same like we are getting now.
bigfatronssba
Well-Known Member
Strange that some people readily accept and support the unfounded viewpoints of proven liars.
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RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
Who supports the view points of proven liars, that comment hasn't been made once?
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bigfatronssba
Well-Known Member
Paxman in his assertion that acl are weak.
No evidence of that other than in the ramblings of Fisher.
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
I must admit I read this Astute and it's a very distorted opinion..
The money has been placed into an Escrow Account for the Football League to determine the true value of what the Club owe ACL, now what we believe to be correct is something that only the Football League will rule in, one way or the other.
Also the Football League required the Club to meet the requirements in this manner, so why are the Club trying to "hold off on paying ACL" or trying to "distress ACL" you would think ACL would know this information!
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RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
Harsh, I think Paxman has a really strong opinion on the topic personally.
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Astute
Well-Known Member
a lot of us have a strong opinion on the topic. It doesn't make us all correct. But we do know that there is no evidence to say that ACL are weak. So that would suggest that he is wrong.
Astute
Well-Known Member
I tend to agree with the judge. He is impartial in all of the crap that is going on. And he couldn't have been more scathing of SISU if he had tried. So I would say that we all have this information.
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
The Judge did seem to have a strong opinion however your comment regarding the monies owed not being paid, which you referenced as a means of the Club trying to distress ACL is inaccurate, that's the point I was trying to make in my post. An escrow account has had the sum of £590,000 placed into it, now I appreciate at the moment that the money in that escrow account does not belong to ACL, however we now leave that situation to the Football League, the Club have said they are willing to pay ACL what they owe ACL, but need clarification, that doesn't sound unreasonable!
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Ian1779
Well-Known Member
You mean the judge that has had no involvement in the CVA or subsequent deal that came out of it's rejection? He might have given a scathing review of SISU in relation to the JR but it's not relevant in this particular scenario.
I don't understand why you keep going over the same bit repeatedly... so i'll try again.
The FL added the caveat about the 590K. So they are ultimately responsible. The FL have confirmed the full amount is in the ESCROW account from SISU. The FL is going to decide when and how the monies are released to ACL. It's not been paid yet - but that is now down to FL. Going on about how the club is holding off payment is bollocks.
Ultimately - we are not going to be sanctioned by the FL as we have done what we were asked.
Nick
Administrator
Didn't they pay it a while ago to the FL?
It seems SISU are using the situation to their advantage by dubious means yet again . By putting the money in an ESCROW ,not only do ACL not get the disputed cash ,they dont get the undisputed amount either . The FL cannot sanction payment until it is 110 percent sure its right for legal reasons .
And they want to discuss coming back to the Ricoh!
Your havin a laf
And they want to discuss coming back to the Ricoh!
Your havin a laf
Sisu didn't want to pay ACL before and don't want to pay in anyway shape or form in the future, its not in the plan, maybe the FL forced them to set the money aside due to the deadline being passed..As for when that was made available that's anyone's guess and will never be found out if we are honest, my opinion is Sisu didn't have that money until Wilson was sold...
skyblueinBaku
Well-Known Member
NO! They are the custodians of the club.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
The JR showed that CCC/ACL acted lawfully. So you are happy for this 'legal process' to occur and produce that result. But now you want 'legal process' to be ignored just so ACL get some money.
Absurd.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
What legal process? It's a private agreement between two parties. Nothing to do with the law.
Are you not a little but pissed off at Sisu for playing silly buggers with our club instead of just paying what was agreed?
You'd have to be some kind of simple sycophant to actually keep believing Sisu are acting reasonably and not taking the piss at each step.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
Quite frankly - the FL put the agreement in place... it is theirs to manage. As long as SISU have done what the FL expect and the club is free of sanctions I couldn't care less.
It is up to ACL to arrange the transfer of the monies from FL. If everything was crystal clear then surely they would have had it by now?
davebart
Active Member
The problem with ACL doing any deal with SISU is that they cannot trust that SISU will stick by their side of the bargain. Say they come to a deal to transfer the Ricoh over a period of time. They could not expect it to be a smooth process. It would be painful with SISU / Otium constantly trying to get more advantage.
Everything was crystal clear. ML said the amount owed would be paid, although he was not sure about the banking mechanics. He should have asked Tim. Tim worked for the Commerz Bank - albeit in their darkest hour. Vielen Dank Herr Fisher.
SISU muddied the waters with a spurious claim, that, because ACL got monies from another source, the amount that they owe is reduced.
There is nothing to stop them authorizing the FL to release the undisputed part of the total i.e. 590K - 300K = 290K.
But, that wouldn't be SISU. That would be helping ACL and they don't want that, they are trying to distress ACL and give them a hard time ( see court judgement ). A far cry from what SISU are publicly saying through Tim regarding "healing and reconciliation".
The Fl will review the situation at their füll meeting in August - so how do you expect ACL to arrange the transfer of monies before then? and why should they arrange anything? It is the debtor ( SISU ) who has to make the transfer - even if the hapless Labovitch doesn't understand the banking mechanics.
J
Jack Griffin
Guest
Unfortunately
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Your faith in the FL is worrying. They're admitted they've not even looked at the issue yet.
As with everything Sisu get involved in it was crystal clear until they muddied the waters.
They could've just paid what they owe. Instead they took stalling tactics at just about the only time in the year the FL can do anything about our situation.
It was designed to keep us at Sixfields for longer and you support it. That's all you really need to know.
The agreement SISU have with the FL wil not be verbal and open to the FL's discretion . It will be written and binding . If SISU can find cause to withhold payment in the wording of the agreement ,they will . That is their game . Look at their "previous". The've had talks with ,and sucked in, that many organisations and well meaning people . Only to turn on them later on!
The money was supposed to be paid to ACL, by the end of May,so no it has not been effectively paid at all, just yet another attempt from them to wriggle out of a commitment that they (in case you forget) freely gave to the FL.
No one has said ACL can dictate legal action can be dropped,you just made that up.
In case you hadn't noticed they've already lost the court case,seemingly on every single point. As the judge made crystal clear there legal actions are based on simply trying to distress ACL.
Your assertion that ACL are incredibly weak is just deliberate hyperbole. Where is your evidence? You provide none to back up your smear, maybe it is just wishful thinking on your part. The idea that SISU will give a damn on fans reaction, if they reject a olive branch is risible.
Who SISU are, what they are, how they are has no concerns for doing your job.
Yes it does concern you if you are doing your job properly. ACL are obliged to act prudently. Dealing with SISU is not exactly "prudent" as we have seen. Any future dealings can only be with adequate securities. SISU's credit-rating with ACL is "red - do not touch with a bärge pole".
Every announcement from SISU should, and no doubt will be, treated with extreme caution.
Yes it does concern you if you are doing your job properly. ACL are obliged to act prudently. Dealing with SISU is not exactly "prudent" as we have seen. Any future dealings can only be with adequate securities. SISU's credit-rating with ACL is "red - do not touch with a bärge pole".
Every announcement from SISU should, and no doubt will be, treated with extreme caution.