The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (170 Viewers)

Ian1779 · Jun 12, 2016

The EU will always struggle because it in essence is trying to meet the needs of 25+ countries at the same time.

Being a united force together is more productive force going forward. That first mean it can't improve and get better

I'm pretty sure that's the message we should want to send out as CCFC fans about our club.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jun 12, 2016

What fucks me off the most about this whole thing is that for every one article on the BBC that favours Leave, there is another 9 for Remain. For every big article for Leave, there is a smaller one for Remain that appears above it on the news page. Every single post I see on Facebook encouraging people to vote is also trying to ram the Remain campaign down people's throats.

The Remain campaign just seems to be built on trying to scare people into voting in favour, also arguing that the 'uncertainty' will be too hard to predict and deal with, whilst also trying to make anyone that even suggests a point in favour of Leave look like a dick at every opportunity rather than have a rational debate.

Personally I'm on the fence, and I can see the benifits of both despite the shite deal we currently have, however for the reasons stated above I'll almost certainly be voting out.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

I'm out, I just think the whole project has got far to bureaucratic, undemocratic and become far more idealistic than realistic. I think the whole thing needs to be scrapped and a more watered down version tried again in the future. If we do vote for leave it is the beginning of the end for EU in it's current form.

I also agree with the bias that is being shown by the BBC towards the leave campaign, but I would say that about 8 out of 10 people I talk to, from all walks of life, and all ages are voting leave.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

dancers lance said:
I'm out, I just think the whole project has got far to bureaucratic, undemocratic and become far more idealistic than realistic. I think the whole thing needs to be scrapped and a more watered down version tried again in the future. If we do vote for leave it is the beginning of the end for EU in it's current form.

I also agree with the bias that is being shown by the BBC towards the leave campaign, but I would say that about 8 out of 10 people I talk to, from all walks of life, and all ages are voting leave.

10 out of 10 people I speak to are voting remain, perhaps it's the company we keep? I think that the EU will carry on without Britain, which will doubt surprise a lot of people.

Terry Gibson's perm · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
10 out of 10 people I speak to are voting remain, perhaps it's the company we keep? I think that the EU will carry on without Britain, which will doubt surprise a lot of people.

I will sit right in the middle as some I speak to are in and some out, I am out, I think the Eu will carry on for a while but I think others will watch to see how we do and then break away.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
10 out of 10 people I speak to are voting remain, perhaps it's the company we keep? I think that the EU will carry on without Britain, which will doubt surprise a lot of people.

It has nothing to do with the 'company I keep' in fact, I would say that the majority of my friends and family are voting remain, however, in my job I meet lot's of people from virtually every demographic and I find that the vast majority are for leave. And lot's of people think that Britain would be just fine if we leave and we will not just shrivel up and die like we are being told, which will surprise some people.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

dancers lance said:
It has nothing to do with the 'company I keep' in fact, I would say that the majority of my friends and family are voting remain, however, in my job I meet lot's of people from virtually every demographic and I find that the vast majority are for leave. And lot's of people think that Britain would be just fine if we leave and we will not just shrivel up and die like we are being told, which will surprise some people.

It's the same for me and overwhelmingly they are all voting remain.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

dancers lance said:
And lot's of people think that Britain would be just fine if we leave and we will not just shrivel up and die like we are being told, which will surprise some people.

I'd be interested to hear how they think Britain will get along outside the single market; they must be well-informed if they are going against the world renowned economists.

Terry Gibson's perm · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
It's the same for me and overwhelmingly they are all voting remain.

Soon be done and we can go back to talking about court cases

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

Terry Gibson's perm said:
Soon be done and we can go back to talking about court cases

Personally I wish we could get the bloody thing over with, am sick to death of it!!

Terry Gibson's perm · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
Personally I wish we could get the bloody thing over with, am sick to death of it!!

They could get rid of half of the tv channels as its all they talk about.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

Terry Gibson's perm said:
They could get rid of half of the tv channels as its all they talk about.

I'm not sure there has been the need for the endless TV debates. Also the campaigns from both sides have shown British politics at its very worst.

Terry Gibson's perm · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
I'm not sure there has been the need for the endless TV debates. Also the campaigns from both sides have shown British politics at its very worst.

Have to agree

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
I'd be interested to hear how they think Britain will get along outside the single market; they must be well-informed if they are going against the world renowned economists.

Would these be the same 'world renowned economists' like the IMF, who, even 48 hours before the biggest financial collapse in the worlds history were advising people to invest in the American sub prime mortgage market? I'm a small business owner, and I have already been through the worst financial crisis the world has ever seen (including a 70% drop in turnover) and made it out the other side. The economic scare tactics using projected growth figures, for an ideal world, years in advance doesn't bother me one bit.

LastGarrison · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
It's the same for me and overwhelmingly they are all voting remain.

The vast majority of people I work with are voting remain (or at least saying they are).

Whereas the vast majority of people I drink with are voting out. And that is definitely due to the company I keep.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

LastGarrison said:
The vast majority of people I work with are voting remain (or at least saying they are).

Whereas the vast majority of people I drink with are voting out. And that is definitely due to the company I keep.

It's a shame I very rarely go to pubs, I could have said 9 out of 10 instead of 8.

Houchens Head · Jun 12, 2016

I reckon the majority of SBT members on here weren't even born or were too young to actually remember the country as it was before we joined the Common Market (as it was then known). I remember it well, and we did okay without bloody Brussels poking its nose in at every bleedin' turn! I'm voting OUT because I'd like to see things back to the way they were!

chiefdave · Jun 12, 2016

Houchens Head said:
I reckon the majority of SBT members on here weren't even born or were too young to actually remember the country as it was before we joined the Common Market (as it was then known). I remember it well, and we did okay without bloody Brussels poking its nose in at every bleedin' turn! I'm voting OUT because I'd like to see things back to the way they were!

I certainly don't. I guess the difference would be at that point everyone was going it alone. Now we'd be going it alone with everyone else in a group. Again its the unknowns isn't it. We pretty much know where we are staying in. Out is very much unknown.

Before the campaign I wasn't particularly on either side and I've not heard a convincing argument from either yet. The biggest thing putting me off a no vote is the people they have out campaigning!

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

Houchens Head said:
I reckon the majority of SBT members on here weren't even born or were too young to actually remember the country as it was before we joined the Common Market (as it was then known). I remember it well, and we did okay without bloody Brussels poking its nose in at every bleedin' turn! I'm voting OUT because I'd like to see things back to the way they were!

First you wanted Cromwell back alive and now this, bit bizarre coming from a self proclaimed Irishman considering how the EU has helped transform the country.

The world has also majorly changed since the time you are talking about. More and more the vote is becoming about the younger v older generations.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

chiefdave said:
I certainly don't. I guess the difference would be at that point everyone was going it alone. Now we'd be going it alone with everyone else in a group. Again its the unknowns isn't it. We pretty much know where we are staying in. Out is very much unknown.

Before the campaign I wasn't particularly on either side and I've not heard a convincing argument from either yet. The biggest thing putting me off a no vote is the people they have out campaigning!

I know, because Cameron, Osbourne, Major and Tony Blair are truly men to be trusted and follow, not one of these people has ever lied to the British people who gifted them a career.

chiefdave · Jun 12, 2016

dancers lance said:
I know, because Cameron, Osbourne, Major and Tony Blair are truly men to be trusted and follow, not one of these people has ever lied to the British people who gifted the a career.

I wouldn't trust any of them either but the alternative is Farage, Boris and Gove!

Sumo the Micky Quinn · Jun 12, 2016

Houchens Head said:
I reckon the majority of SBT members on here weren't even born or were too young to actually remember the country as it was before we joined the Common Market (as it was then known). I remember it well, and we did okay without bloody Brussels poking its nose in at every bleedin' turn! I'm voting OUT because I'd like to see things back to the way they were!

Prior to early 70's we had a different country and Industry to today. Most large UK companies only dealt with UK customers. Hence why we joined the EU, to get into that market.
For example you wouldn't have found many British Cars outside the UK, most French cars would only be found in France etc. How many car manufacturers have we lost in Coventry alone. He in the Canaries the car Park is not much different to a Coventry Car Park - BMW mini's, Fiat 500's, Peugeots, VW's for example, compared that to a typical street in the 70's with BL's, Vauxhalls' & Fords'.

How many Cadbury chocolates were sold outside the UK (Except Ireland), Now you can buy Cadbury's pretty much everywhere in the World.

Captain Dart · Jun 12, 2016

Houchens Head said:
I reckon the majority of SBT members on here weren't even born or were too young to actually remember the country as it was before we joined the Common Market (as it was then known). I remember it well, and we did okay without bloody Brussels poking its nose in at every bleedin' turn! I'm voting OUT because I'd like to see things back to the way they were!

That referendum was the first time I could vote, I'm not sure I was wrong then to vote Yes, but this time I've (postal) voted Leave.

The EU isn't remotely like what I voted for at the time & I want it changed radically if we are to remain in.

Note this deal Cameron negotiated is so unimportant and inconsequential that the Remain campaign have failed to mention it in recent weeks, preferring instead to claim we might be pitched into a European War or Pensions and the NHS will suffer or the Economic outlook will be dreadful.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

chiefdave said:
I wouldn't trust any of them either but the alternative is Farage, Boris and Gove!

Exactly! I don't trust any of those either, these people have nothing in common with a vast majority people in this country, hence I have never fought the argument in an ad hominem way. It is funny though, how people on the remain side are quick to do this? If we are going down this road then surely the remain side should be ashamed by the endorsement of Tony Blair as he was a massive player in an illegal war that has been a major factor in the refugee crisis that is now threatening to destroy the EU?

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

Captain Dart said:
Note this deal Cameron negotiated is so unimportant and inconsequential that the Remain campaign have failed to mention it in recent weeks, preferring instead to claim we might be pitched into a European War or Pensions and the NHS will suffer or the Economic outlook will be dreadful.

Cameron is full of hot hair and bullshit. I wold have voted remain regardless but he would have been much better to focus upon the many positives of EU membership rather than predicting ww3.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
Cameron is full of hot hair and bullshit. I wold have voted remain regardless but he would have been much better to focus upon the many positives of EU membership rather than predicting ww3.

Cameron fought the election campaign by saying 'we are the only party that will give you a referendum vote on the EU' he used this argument all the time, mocking other parties and MP's at PMQ's for not wanting it. He made it very clear he would be impartial if he did not get his demands passed by the EU (and would most likely promote out) he was made to look the bumbling, top hat wearing upper class school boy he is by the EU, who gave him nothing. If you are happy to have this man and his chosen protege (Osbourne) rule this country for the next 20+ years then vote remain. Or vote out, and maybe change the entire face of politics in this country and let real people, the disenfranchised, take back some power and have something to believe in.

Sumo the Micky Quinn · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
Cameron is full of hot hair and bullshit. I wold have voted remain regardless but he would have been much better to focus upon the many positives of EU membership rather than predicting ww3.

Some of the positives a lot of people are not aware of which benefits the working man not the company owners:

Paid Holiday (& Bank Holiday) Leave - prior to 1997 this was voluntary.
Maximum hours expected to work - 48 Hrs (France opted for 35 Hrs) - although our government at the time tried to exempt us from this rule.
Compulsory Maternity Pay - Paid by some before but only voluntary
Compulsory Redundancy Pay - Paid by some before but only voluntary.

Most people I have spoken to here on holiday are voting out, mainly blaming the Eastern Europeans - However Boris answered in Stratford-upon-Avon last week that they will be allowed to stay.

The other view I have been given to vote 'OUT' is they hate Cameron and everything he has to say, without realising that Boris is a tory, then I remind them that its the tories who are split and the Labour party and the Liberals are supposed to be fully behind Remain.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

dancers lance said:
Cameron fought the election campaign by saying 'we are the only party that will give you a referendum vote on the EU' he used this argument all the time, mocking other parties and MP's at PMQ's for not wanting it. He made it very clear he would be impartial if he did not get his demands passed by the EU (and would most likely promote out) he was made to look the bumbling, top hat wearing upper class school boy he is by the EU, who gave him nothing. If you are happy to have this man and his chosen protege (Osbourne) rule this country for the next 20+ years then vote remain. Or vote out, and maybe change the entire face of politics in this country and let real people, the disenfranchised, take back some power and have something to believe in.

Had to agree with you until the end there. Cameron never expected to win a majority (?!) and could look to appease the Eurosceptics in the party.

In no way would I trust a right leaning Conservative government led by Johnson and the likes of IDS and Patel in charge of Britain.

Johnson has shown himself to switch sides at the drop of the hat and all that matters is getting Cameron's job. It wasn't all that long ago he was suggesting an amnesty for ILLEGAL immigrants and was celebrating his Turkish heritage.

On a side note, even if there is a vote to leave I do not believe we will leave the single market.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

Sumo the Micky Quinn said:
Some of the positives a lot of people are not aware of which benefits the working man not the company owners:

Paid Holiday (& Bank Holiday) Leave - prior to 1997 this was voluntary.
Maximum hours expected to work - 48 Hrs (France opted for 35 Hrs) - although our government at the time tried to exempt us from this rule.
Compulsory Maternity Pay - Paid by some before but only voluntary
Compulsory Redundancy Pay - Paid by some before but only voluntary.

Most people I have spoken to here on holiday are voting out, mainly blaming the Eastern Europeans - However Boris answered in Stratford-upon-Avon last week that they will be allowed to stay.

The other view I have been given to vote 'OUT' is they hate Cameron and everything he has to say, without realising that Boris is a tory, then I remind them that its the tories who are split and the Labour party and the Liberals are supposed to be fully behind Remain.

I have often thought that if the EU consisted of western and central European nations, there wouldn't be so many objecting to it.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

Sumo the Micky Quinn said:
Some of the positives a lot of people are not aware of which benefits the working man not the company owners:

Paid Holiday (& Bank Holiday) Leave - prior to 1997 this was voluntary.
Maximum hours expected to work - 48 Hrs (France opted for 35 Hrs) - although our government at the time tried to exempt us from this rule.
Compulsory Maternity Pay - Paid by some before but only voluntary
Compulsory Redundancy Pay - Paid by some before but only voluntary.

Most people I have spoken to here on holiday are voting out, mainly blaming the Eastern Europeans - However Boris answered in Stratford-upon-Avon last week that they will be allowed to stay.

The other view I have been given to vote 'OUT' is they hate Cameron and everything he has to say, without realising that Boris is a tory, then I remind them that its the tories who are split and the Labour party and the Liberals are supposed to be fully behind Remain.

Every single one of those positives, for the average working man, has been bypassed by the Zero Hour Contract and by big companies employing staff through agencies they own.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

dancers lance said:
Every single one of those positives, for the average working man, has been bypassed by the Zero Hour Contract and by big companies employing staff through agencies they own.

Does that have anything to do with the EU? My fear is that outside of the EU they would become even more commonplace.

I'd love to see them made illegal- I'm sure the other of weatherspoons will be rubbing his hand's with glee should there be a vote to leave.

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 12, 2016

The biggest problem we will have if we remain is that we have weakened even further any bargaining power that we had with the EU. How many more times in the future will we see a British leader waving a pointless bit of paper like Chamberlain did in the 30's whilst the EU push through their objectives? Camerons already done it once and will be in a worse position next time.

Sick Boy · Jun 12, 2016

eastwoodsdustman said:
The biggest problem we will have if we remain is that we have weakened even further any bargaining power that we had with the EU. How many more times in the future will we see a British leader waving a pointless bit of paper like Chamberlain did in the 30's whilst the EU push through their objectives? Camerons already done it once and will be in a worse position next time.

...believe it or not but the EU isn't a massive conspiracy to weaken Britain.

Although a lot of fellow Europeans actually couldn't care less if Britain left and probably welcome it.

dancers lance · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
Had to agree with you until the end there. Cameron never expected to win a majority (?!) and could look to appease the Eurosceptics in the party.

In no way would I trust a right leaning Conservative government led by Johnson and the likes of IDS and Patel in charge of Britain.

Johnson has shown himself to switch sides at the drop of the hat and all that matters is getting Cameron's job. It wasn't all that long ago he was suggesting an amnesty for ILLEGAL immigrants and was celebrating his Turkish heritage.

On a side note, even if there is a vote to leave I do not believe we will leave the single market.

I agree about the single market, as much as this is used as a threat the implications for the the major traders with the UK are massive. I don't want any of these people leading our country, whether they be in or out. Trey Parker and Matt Stone couldn't even predict PM Boris Johnson and President Trump .

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 12, 2016

Sick Boy said:
...believe it or not but the EU isn't a massive conspiracy to weaken Britain.

Thanks. I keep that in mind when I put my X in the box. Camerons had his arse smacked by the EU once and it will happen again and again from now on. His position and therefore our position is weaker in the future if we vote to remain.

The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (170 Viewers)

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