The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (307 Viewers)

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Astute said:
The same experts that got it totally wrong on what would happen if we voted leave.

I would prefer to have our own currency than be tied to the Euro. And those who wanted the Euro now agree.

Who is Juncker? Are you now trying to downplay his part in everything? Yes he still has 3 years left minimum. 3 more years to push the EU in the direction he wants.

We haven’t left yet. Plenty more to come.

You may well prefer that. The Euro is not fully evolved and is work in progress. Let’s see what happens.

Juncker is the head of the commission. He is not a one man band. The council sets the policy and the commission prepares the laws. The parliament can pass, reject or amend the laws.

Juncker had to lay out his aims to get elected by the parliament and the council.

Only 2 far right countries voted against him in the council. The UK and Hungary.

You must have swallowed the Express.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Grendel said:
Yeah unlike Germany one in six don’t vote for such parties

One in eight. Yes, we do have more choice and fairer representation- even for those I don’t agree with. They still have a right to representation in parliament.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Astute said:
Exactly.

The British public had no say. Those who made money out of us giving over our rights to the EU were the ones who made the decisions.

Brexit/UKIP way of looking at it? I'm so sorry that I am not blind to the faults of the EU. As I have said countless times I would be better off if we stayed in. But it doesn't mean that I should be blindly pro EU like yourself.

The British Public are represented by their MPs. And I am not blind to the faults of the EU. I just don’t make up faults that don’t exist.

And I am convinced that creating more barriers to trade and free movement will have a negative effect on most people in Britain.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Boris Johnson: „fuck business“.

Business: “The actual experience of how supply chains work, the actual experience of employing millions of men and women; of helping them earn a good living - not a theoretical exercise in which you take decisions over the lives of people in imagined worlds,” he said ( Greg Clark )

Astute · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
One in eight. Yes, we do have more choice and fairer representation- even for those I don’t agree with. They still have a right to representation in parliament.

Yet UKIP here shouldn't have a say?

UKIP wanted out of the EU. What do AfD want?

Astute · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
The British Public are represented by their MPs. And I am not blind to the faults of the EU. I just don’t make up faults that don’t exist.

And I am convinced that creating more barriers to trade and free movement will have a negative effect on most people in Britain.

So who is it that is saying they want trade barriers? It certainly isn't the UK.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Astute said:
Yet UKIP here shouldn't have a say?

UKIP wanted out of the EU. What do AfD want?

Who said UKIP shouldn’t be represented? Our FPTP system is flawed.

AfD don’t want out of the EU. They want to reform it to a club of right wingers. Same as Italy. Same as Hungary.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Astute said:
So who is it that is saying they want trade barriers? It certainly isn't the UK.

The UK are the ones leaving the SM and CU which automatically creates trade barriers. So it certainly is the UK even if some politicians try and convince you otherwise. They seem to have succeeded with you.

Astute · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
The UK are the ones leaving the SM and CU which automatically creates trade barriers. So it certainly is the UK even if some politicians try and convince you otherwise. They seem to have succeeded with you.

No it doesn't automatically create trade barriers. A trade agreement would make sure of that. It is the EU that is putting trade barriers in place.

Astute · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
Who said UKIP shouldn’t be represented? Our FPTP system is flawed.

AfD don’t want out of the EU. They want to reform it to a club of right wingers. Same as Italy. Same as Hungary.

So you want UKIP to be represented but you don't want anyone to hear what they have to say.....

AfD are dangerous. There is no other way to put it.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Astute said:
No it doesn't automatically create trade barriers. A trade agreement would make sure of that. It is the EU that is putting trade barriers in place.

How is the EU putting trade barriers in place? They are not changing anything. We are. Trade barriers will be created as we will not get the same deal as we now have without paying in and accepting the 4 freedoms, which we said we definitely will not do. It is our shortsighted action which is the problem, not the EU.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Astute said:
So you want UKIP to be represented but you don't want anyone to hear what they have to say.....

AfD are dangerous. There is no other way to put it.

Who said that? Not me. you must have made things up.... again.

I said they should have the right to their opinion and be represented in parliament- even if I don’t agree with them.

AfD are only dangerous if they get a majority in Parliament, or some other party joins a coalition with them. Both very unlikely scenarios. The last coalition between the far right and Von Pappen ended up costing millions of lives, destroying large parts of Europe and losing Germany lots of territory. Von Storch‘s grandfather was finance minister in Hitler‘s cabinet until the abrupt end in 1945. it is a bit sick that she is now leading a right wing party, supported by Nigel Farage who gives interviews and speeches for her.

The Farage who, allegedly sung ‚gas ‚em al‘ as a drunken teenager. ‚Gas ‚em all‘ being a reference to the gassing of Jews by Von Storch‘s grandfather‘s regime friends.

That some leavers openly brag about the perceived success of such a party is sickening. Just because they are hoping that some other EU country will do a Brexit and they will not be alone with their stupid decision. All polls point to the EU gaining support since Brexit has been exposed as a Farce and AfD, Front National, and the Italians have all said they don’t envisage leaving the EU, which leaves the U.K. as Billy no Friends.

dutchman · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
All polls point to the EU gaining support since Brexit has been exposed as a Farce and AfD, Front National, and the Italians have all said they don’t envisage leaving the EU, which leaves the U.K. as Billy no Friends.

Uh?

Marine Le Pen promises liberation from the EU with France-first policies

Marine Le Pen has formally launched her presidential campaign, promising to put France first by freeing it it from the “tyrannies” of globalisation, Islamic fundamentalism and the European Union.

Rehearsing themes familiar from the successful Donald Trump and Brexit campaigns, Le Pen said the momentum was clearly now on her side. From the US to Italy and Austria to the UK, she said: “The people are waking – the tide of history has turned.”

She was speaking at the end of a two-day event with party militants during which the anti-immigration, anti-EU Front National unveiled its election campaign platform consisting of 144 “commitments” to the French people.

Published on Saturday, the document, notably short on macro-economic and practical detail, pledges to take France out of the eurozone and – unless the EU agrees to revert to a loose coalition of nations with neither a single currency nor a border-free area – to hold a referendum on France’s EU membership

Grendel · Jun 27, 2018

Not too much Eu sentiment today. The whole office erupted when Korea scored - everyone was joining in - as one woman said - I hate football but I hate the Germans even more.

SkyblueBazza · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
How is the EU putting trade barriers in place? They are not changing anything. We are. Trade barriers will be created as we will not get the same deal as we now have without paying in and accepting the 4 freedoms, which we said we definitely will not do. It is our shortsighted action which is the problem, not the EU.

How? By imposing them where there are currently none.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

SkyblueBazza said:
How? By imposing them where there are currently none.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

Trade barriers are obligatory under world trade rules which will apply if leave without a deal. We have been told that third party countries cannot have a better deal than members even if we get a deal.. So whatever happens we will be worse off. At least until we trade with someone else. This is what you were told.

This is what leavers voted for. Not the EU citizens.

Even Farage admits that we may lose some of our manufacturing resulting in a 10% drop in GDP, but insists that we should care more about the 90% and future deals. Brexit wasn’t about economics ( according to Farage ) it was about becoming a self governing independent country ( which we are anyway ). So, feck the people who lose their jobs... it is not so important.. if you follow the Farage line.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Grendel said:
Not too much Eu sentiment today. The whole office erupted when Korea scored - everyone was joining in - as one woman said - I hate football but I hate the Germans even more.

Racist cow. Fits easily with your right wing mindset. Thought you might like that sort of bigotry.

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

dutchman said:
Uh?

Marine Le Pen promises liberation from the EU with France-first policies

Marine Le Pen has formally launched her presidential campaign, promising to put France first by freeing it it from the “tyrannies” of globalisation, Islamic fundamentalism and the European Union.

Rehearsing themes familiar from the successful Donald Trump and Brexit campaigns, Le Pen said the momentum was clearly now on her side. From the US to Italy and Austria to the UK, she said: “The people are waking – the tide of history has turned.”

She was speaking at the end of a two-day event with party militants during which the anti-immigration, anti-EU Front National unveiled its election campaign platform consisting of 144 “commitments” to the French people.

Published on Saturday, the document, notably short on macro-economic and practical detail, pledges to take France out of the eurozone and – unless the EU agrees to revert to a loose coalition of nations with neither a single currency nor a border-free area – to hold a referendum on France’s EU membership

When was this published? She dropped all this crap.

Westendlad · Jun 27, 2018

.

martcov said:
Racist cow. Fits easily with your right wing mindset. Thought you might like that sort of bigotry.

Seriously ?

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Westendlad said:
.

Seriously ?

Yes of course. Hating people because of their race ( in this case nationality ) is called racism. It is in in Brexit Britain. I am surprised at you for not knowing that.

Westendlad · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
Yes of course. Hating people because of their race ( in this case nationality ) is called racism. It is in in Brexit Britain. I am surprised at you for not knowing that.

So you are calling me a racist ?

martcov · Jun 27, 2018

Westendlad said:
So you are calling me a racist ?

? How do you come to that conclusion?

Westendlad · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
? How do you come to that conclusion?

That's obviously a yes then.

dutchman · Jun 27, 2018

martcov said:
When was this published?

Sun 5 Feb 2017 19.25 GMT Last modified on Tue 28 Nov 2017 06.03 GMT

The biggest anti-EU party in Holland also increased its share of the vote in the recent Dutch election to finish in second place whilst the new anti-EU/anti-austerity Socialist Party totally obliterated the pro-EU Labour Party.

martcov said:
She dropped all this crap.

Do you have a link to support that statement because I certainly couldn't find any?

The only thing that's changed is the name of the party:

National Rally (France) - Wikipedia

Its major policies include opposition to the French membership of the European Union, the Schengen Area and the Eurozone, economic protectionism, a zero tolerance approach to law and order issues, and opposition to free migration.[14] As an anti-European Union party, the FN has opposed the European Union since its creation.

Ashdown · Jun 27, 2018

Mart.......do you actually do anything else other than spout politics all day and keep looking in the wardrobes for Nazis ?! FFS get a life man !

chiefdave · Jun 28, 2018

martcov said:
Racist cow. Fits easily with your right wing mindset. Thought you might like that sort of bigotry.

I think you'd struggle to find any non-German in Europe who wasn't happy they lost and got knocked out. Doesn't make it racist.

They are a rival and the vast majority of football supporters want their rivals to fail, especially when its someone who has historically done well. And it means an underdog won which most neutral supporters would applaud.

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

chiefdave said:
I think you'd struggle to find any non-German in Europe who wasn't happy they lost and got knocked out. Doesn't make it racist.

They are a rival and the vast majority of football supporters want their rivals to fail, especially when its someone who has historically done well. And it means an underdog won which most neutral supporters would applaud.

Yes, but you can take the Mick without hating Germans. I am doing that here. It’s one thing hating the German football team or it’s style or it’s arrogance and another thing hating Germans, basically for being German.

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

dutchman said:
Sun 5 Feb 2017 19.25 GMT Last modified on Tue 28 Nov 2017 06.03 GMT

The biggest anti-EU party in Holland also increased its share of the vote in the recent Dutch election to finish in second place whilst the new anti-EU/anti-austerity Socialist Party totally obliterated the pro-EU Labour Party.

Do you have a link to support that statement because I certainly couldn't find any?

The only thing that's changed is the name of the party:

National Rally (France) - Wikipedia

Its major policies include opposition to the French membership of the European Union, the Schengen Area and the Eurozone, economic protectionism, a zero tolerance approach to law and order issues, and opposition to free migration.[14] As an anti-European Union party, the FN has opposed the European Union since its creation.

Yes:
Marine Le Pen abandons 'Frexit' campaign after crushing election defeat

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

Ashdown said:
Mart.......do you actually do anything else other than spout politics all day and keep looking in the wardrobes for Nazis ?! FFS get a life man !

No.

Joking.

But, there is certainly a shift in views to the right and public debate has changed for the worse.

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

chiefdave said:
I think you'd struggle to find any non-German in Europe who wasn't happy they lost and got knocked out. Doesn't make it racist.

They are a rival and the vast majority of football supporters want their rivals to fail, especially when its someone who has historically done well. And it means an underdog won which most neutral supporters would applaud.

Also, Grendel tried to associate Germany losing with anti EU sentiment. Nothing to do with the underdog winning.

Probably him just being on a wind up, but nothing to do with rival football teams. Just him getting a nasty dig in.

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

Westendlad said:
That's obviously a yes then.

No. It’s a question. Which you obviously can’t answer.

Grendel · Jun 28, 2018

martcov said:
Racist cow. Fits easily with your right wing mindset. Thought you might like that sort of bigotry.

Can you explain then why everyone was ecstatic with germany losing - and I mean everyone. The pundits on the TV and the radio were pissing themselves laughing.

Everyone on here on the World Cup thread was on cloud 9.

Why Mart?

Grendel · Jun 28, 2018

martcov said:
Also, Grendel tried to associate Germany losing with anti EU sentiment. Nothing to do with the underdog winning.

No it’s to do with the Germans losing

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

Grendel said:
No it’s to do with the Germans losing

Hating Germans has nothing to do with football. Hating „Germany“ the football team is totally different.

martcov · Jun 28, 2018

Grendel said:
Can you explain then why everyone was ecstatic with germany losing - and I mean everyone. The pundits on the TV and the radio were pissing themselves laughing.

Everyone on here on the World Cup thread was on cloud 9.

Why Mart?

I was too. He he. That’s football related.

But I don’t hate Germans or post things about hating Germans and equate this hate to anti EU sentiment.

The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (307 Viewers)

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

Remain

Leave

Undecided

Not registered or not intention to vote

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Users who are viewing this thread

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency