SlowerThanPlatt
Well-Known Member
They wouldn’t as a Championship club. It’s the perfect scenario, they can continue to support and invest just enough to maintain our status and hope for that one good season
The future of the club (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter JonesBob
- Start date
They wouldn’t as a Championship club. It’s the perfect scenario, they can continue to support and invest just enough to maintain our status and hope for that one good season
Old Warwickshire lad
Well-Known Member
Well have they ?
Sky Blue Harry H
Well-Known Member
better days
Well-Known Member
Things are going reasonably well at present so I'll take it
Could be a lot worse
Grendel
Well-Known Member
How have they? What other clubs have owners who’ve deliberately moved the club to attempt a coup at ground ownership and failed, charge Wonga interest rates on loans as they never can actually self sustain, rely on huge transfer credits to stay in business and whose primary objective is to pay investor returns?
Sky Blue Harry H
Well-Known Member
I agree with your points, but your wording mixes up the owners and the club, whereas, as you have pointed out before, the club's financial position is being created by the owners.
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SkyblueDad
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately Grendel people don’t/won’t look at the real picture
Sky Blue Harry H
Well-Known Member
I think most people do know the situation - however, only worry about those things that you can affect, If we could force a change of ownership by doing the conga round the CBS for 24 hours, there'd be thousands happy to do so (me included - although my right knee may protest louder than I do).
Grendel
Well-Known Member
no one can but praising Boddy and his hapless bunch of chancers is something we can avoid and we can remind them they Are temporary custodians who have taken the club to depths most fans never thought possible in 2007 - they certainly deserve zero credit for anything
Greggs
Well-Known Member
if it weren't for them we'd all be supporting Coventry United now
covboy1987
Well-Known Member
I think for the younger generation and those that have not experienced the top flight like some of us then there comments are understandable and maybe staying in the championship mid -table without ambition is where a lot would be happy - However we would doing ourselves a historical injustice particularly to people such as Jimmy hill and all the previous generations of supporter that got us to the top flight previously. We should be demanding that we get to the premier league where we belong - We are Coventry city this is the club that had one of the longest running top flight membership something many have forgotten–
Old Warwickshire lad
Well-Known Member
Just a question.
If supporters genuinely believe SISU have been good for the club that’s fine.
I was just enquiring how ?
If has has been said they are loading management charges on us each season. Not paying the charges but choosing to allow them to accumulate, and then charging interest at rates varying between 11% and 17%.
I am obviously missing something.
Alan Dugdales Moustache
Well-Known Member
When you've been living off scraps out of the bin for years and suddenly presented with beans on toast it's time to lay the table and eat like a king.
That's where we are right now, punching above our weight where we all feel like we've suddenly crawled out of the trenches and been presented with a two week holiday in Morecambe. An absolute luxury.
The reality is we're worse off than we were last time we were in the championship. It just feels better because it's been so bloody bad.
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Sky Blue Harry H
Well-Known Member
I agree with you - the interest charges and the loading of debt is disgraceful (was just having fun with you, as better days seems a harmless sort - I think?)
I was thinking earlier (and - bad I know, but I don't know the figures) that if SISU stayed around for another 10-15 years and we owed a cumulative debt of say £150m (plucking a huge figure at random). how do they extrapolate themselves from our club, when clearly they will never be able to claw it back. I know the club can't escape its owners *unless they get a 'suitable' offer, but how v=can they escape us if we are a figure on their balance sheet that can never be redeemed. I'm straying way out of my depth on the club's financials (I know they take an annual amount out) but assume the debt is accumulating year on year.
SkyblueDad
Well-Known Member
I’ll ask another question what happens if JS kicks the bucket who takes over ?
better days
Well-Known Member
All that is true
I wish it wasn't
The hope is that eventually they sell the club
In the meantime I support the team
SBAndy
Well-Known Member
Putting it bluntly, the main driver for the debt building year on year is the interest accumulated but unpaid. This puts them in a position of not necessarily having to put any additional money in to generate more debt - as the interest adds to the debt, compounded interest (i.e. interest charges on the unpaid interest) takes effect to keep it climbing.
Old Warwickshire lad
Well-Known Member
We all support the team and Robins/Vivash. We just need to be clear on how deep we distrust and detest the owners.
letsallsingtogether
Well-Known Member
Operation Premiership where we sold all our best players, then wondered why we didnt make it!
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
I think the fact that they could choose not to charge interest at all but instead charge rates at between 11% and 20% points to the main driving force behind any business decisions that SISU make...... it is all about the investors. No the interest isnt paid out but in the SISU client investment analysis it is included and allows SISU Capital to take their slice of the "return" of the whole investment pot.
They havent put net capital back in over 3 years up to and including 31/05/2020. In that time it would be hard to argue we havent been successful. 2021 figures may show something different when published in February but that would be because of the pandemic not an investment choice. What they cant do is let CCFC crash and burn so have to do just enough
Also not entirely true that debt will grow just because of the compounded interest that is accrued not paid. This is from the 2020 financials
this of course puts pressure on cash flow to the tune of £1m pa repayments........ for the next three years. Perhaps a reason why MR doesnt have the money to spend.
SBAndy
Well-Known Member
Agree with all of this, I was just explaining to Harry how they could still be generating debt to themselves and earning from the club without having to actually dip further into their pocket.
Also worth pointing out that at the time of the last accounts, £1.1m of that EFL loan has been held in reserve. Just because it’s been taken, doesn’t necessarily mean it’s been used and if it hasn’t been used to the fullest extent then the cash flow pressures you speak of are of reduced impact.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Sorry wasn't meant as any sort of criticism just adding to what you put.
That 1m in reserve was at 31/05/2020 and the club had obligations to pay at least that in transfer fees although they were also due some too. The efl loan wasn't received until May 2021. Not sure if there would have been much held back still available by then we will see in next accounts. The efl loan could easily have been used in full to meet wages,paye,expenses during the summer of 2021 when income is essentially season ticket sales which would have been unknown when loan taken
That 1m in reserve was at 31/05/2020 and the club had obligations to pay at least that in transfer fees although they were also due some too. The efl loan wasn't received until May 2021. Not sure if there would have been much held back still available by then we will see in next accounts. The efl loan could easily have been used in full to meet wages,paye,expenses during the summer of 2021 when income is essentially season ticket sales which would have been unknown when loan taken
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Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
I'm not as militant as some on here. I think the Boddy/Fisher/Robins axis has done well to turn us from looking at oblivion and possible non-league to being a reasonable semblance of a football club.
I just think if we ever want to move forward from this point though we need some more vision than just getting the basics right and hoping a once in a generation manager can pull a rabbit out of a hat every season.
This season we've struggled with ticketing, crowd control, merchandising off the field and now we're told we can't upgrade the squad on the field because we're skint yet we have the highest season ticket sales in many of our lifetimes and an apparently hugely favourable rental deal but just can't compete with some pretty bang average size clubs. This in a season we've been top 6 for so long.
All in all we have a decent lower league set up but we need more to have ambitions of being a force at even this level over a sustained period let alone the next.
I just think if we ever want to move forward from this point though we need some more vision than just getting the basics right and hoping a once in a generation manager can pull a rabbit out of a hat every season.
This season we've struggled with ticketing, crowd control, merchandising off the field and now we're told we can't upgrade the squad on the field because we're skint yet we have the highest season ticket sales in many of our lifetimes and an apparently hugely favourable rental deal but just can't compete with some pretty bang average size clubs. This in a season we've been top 6 for so long.
All in all we have a decent lower league set up but we need more to have ambitions of being a force at even this level over a sustained period let alone the next.
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
I agree with that but I'd remove Fisher from the axis.
A stain on our clubs history and no coincidence that relations between the fans and the club have improved since he's slinked into the background.
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
Don't get me wrong I think he's a prick but he is the chairman here an part of the setup that allows Boddy and Robins to do what they do. If Boddy is credited for his part then Fisher should be for his no matter how unpalatable that is.
If Fisher isn't credited when Boddy is then it's obviously an emotional thing not an objective analysis which I feel is probably where our fanbase is with our ownership/structure right now.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Wasn't he key in getting Robins back to the club?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Yes he was
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
The best thing he did second best, disappearing from the public eye!(though I understand the point LG is making above, I just can't stick the man).
higgs
Well-Known Member
Danceswithhorses
Well-Known Member
Please correct me if my memory is wrong, but didn't he once (vaguely) say that he (personally) is not paid by the club (ie by payroll), but that doesn't rule out that sisu or ccfc aren't paying for his services through his own company (professional services/contractor) ...he would then technically be paid by his own company.
Hobo
Well-Known Member
The most important thing is to have a club to support.
The second thing is to prepare the club for the future within our financial needs.
The Third thing is to avoid relegation and try to play entertaining football.
Most of those boxes have been ticked and we are now establishing ourselves as a Championship side and not long ago we were League Two.
We are a long way off being a Premiership side - so just enjoy it. We beat Derby in FA Cup today and people are moaning?? Just enjoy it. Stop looking for perfection every game.