They were supposed to take Ukraine in about 10 days and here we are a year later with them nowhere near their objective.
What makes you think they can conquer the whole of eastern Europe?
We have to do whatever we can to help Ukraine to win this war.
If we don't then Ukraine will ultimately lose and in the long run the whole of eastern Europe is in danger of Soviet invasion and ultimately World War 3 after that. Ignoring that fact is simply sweeping it under the carpet and inviting the inevitable.
The consequences of inaction are not worth thinking about.
Not going to do it now. But success in Ukraine would cement the mindset of "might is right," and they can do what they want. Russian mindset is success against Ukraine is success against NATO and the West.They were supposed to take Ukraine in about 10 days and here we are a year later with them nowhere near their objective.
What makes you think they can conquer the whole of eastern Europe?
Other issue is scale. Ukraine is territorially massive and obviously has a large population. Poland aside rest of eastern Europe is small. Russia could theoretically take any of the Baltic States in 48 hours (once Ukraine war is concluded).Ukraine also had 2014 as a warning that gave them a head start on planning and rooting out bad influences. Not sure if that applies to other countries.
I don't think they can quite frankly, but I'm not looking at it in the way Putin does. He won't have to take all of Eastern Europe to trigger a military confrontation with NATO. It'll come before that. The Baltic States won't take long to take and I'm sure that would be a likely flash point. I'm looking at this pessimistically in order not to be too surprised later on. I'm just not sure at what point beyond Ukraine that NATO will act, and whether Europe itself will decide to reinforce it's own borders and individual nations will ramp up their own defences.They were supposed to take Ukraine in about 10 days and here we are a year later with them nowhere near their objective.
What makes you think they can conquer the whole of eastern Europe?
I mean in the broadest sense, probably. He buys a lot of the propaganda wholesale and is a stupid vain rich man which is the type Putin can play like a fiddle.
Come on shmmeee, no sure about Musk being stupid…vain and rich, no doubt. I doubt Putins able to play him either.. he’s hardly Trump. Whatever people’s views on Musk as a person and his beliefs, the guys a genius. Flawed definitely but most are. Also by all accounts Starlink was one of the reasons Ukraine managed to resist Russia in the early months of the invasion
His genius is in PR. Otherwise he’s generally been able to buy in talent and has consistently underperformed. Have a read of some of the stories from people who have worked for him, generally the entire company becomes about handling Elons stupidity but keeping him onside for marketing purposes. Starlink was definitely important, but the policy changes started after he met Putin and suddenly started posting about Russian propaganda so questions have to be asked.
You don't do what he's done without having a big silver spoon to fund all your madcap ideas. A lot of the stuff he's done has created answers to questions nobody but him have asked. Take Paypal. I need to pay someone and I have money in my bank. But instead of just paying from my bank what I really need is some sort of middle account which I can move money from my bank account into and then use that middle account to pay the invoice.I’ve seen various articles on both sides of the argument but you don’t do what he’s done without being very intelligent (hasn’t he got 150+ IQ ?). Also on the spectrum though
Ps I get the impression he wants peace. I disagree with how we he might think it’s best to get there but can’t really knock him if that’s his end goal
It's a Catch 22, isn't it Milo?We could save delivery costs / time and just blow up our little airforce here I guess
And all along we could have carpet bombed Putin's army into pissing off. Yet we haven't, in order to appease someone who sees appeasement as a green flag to do what he wants.I don't think they can quite frankly, but I'm not looking at it in the way Putin does. He won't have to take all of Eastern Europe to trigger a military confrontation with NATO. It'll come before that. The Baltic States won't take long to take and I'm sure that would be a likely flash point. I'm looking at this pessimistically in order not to be too surprised later on. I'm just not sure at what point beyond Ukraine that NATO will act, and whether Europe itself will decide to reinforce it's own borders and individual nations will ramp up their own defences.
Been saying for years how we need to spend the money we've wasted on allowing oil and gas to fleece everyone to set up our own renewable energy infrastructure. We're a really good country for quite a few types of renewables and we wouldn't be at the mercy of outside suppliers. It'd be more secure, as energy generation could be spread out and create numerous jobs, especially in struggling communites like coastal and old mining areas.We also need to consider that if Russia does control Ukraine then it gives them more power economically with regard to global food production. They have already caused massive disruption with energy, tried it with technology and then controlling Ukraine's food production would further enable them to hold the world to ransom.
You mean like in Vietnam/Laos/Cambodia? That worked out well didn't it?And all along we could have carpet bombed Putin's army into pissing off.
You mean like in Vietnam/Laos/Cambodia? That worked out well didn't it?
It would have inevitably escalated pretty quickly and led to WW3.Nowhere near comparable.
It would have inevitably escalated pretty quickly and led to WW3.
The Russian mindset is also non comparable to that of the west.
He’s hardly been left to ‘crack on with it’. It would also have made it more likely China would get involved, not to mention the real risk of nuclear war.So I keep hearing. If Ukraine falls, and we end up with Putin gaining enormous territory plus a big chunk of the grain supply, we might still be patting ourselves on the back for ‘not escalating’ against a man who sees that as a weakness.
We then also give the green light to China to take Taiwan so long as they make a nuclear threat upon invasion. Meanwhile Putin would similarly move on to invasions of Georgia and Moldova. Can’t escalate though-let him crack on with it.
He’s hardly been left to ‘crack on with it’. It would also have made it more likely China would get involved, not to mention the real risk of nuclear war.
Apart from nuclear war that is and risking the likes of China getting involved - tensions with them and the USA are already bad enough.All we have at the moment is a meat grinder that could go on for years when it would not take much to tip the balance. I question how much we are saving by choosing not to do so.
You cannot escalate more than he already has by invading another country with everything he’s got. He is already spinning our ‘intervention’ to date to his people as de facto war. If Ukraine falls, that is a far bigger long term gamble
You’re confusing intelligence with stupidity. He’s clearly an intelligent person but being vain, rich, self indulgent and self entitled leaves him vulnerable to stupidity. Just look at what he’s achieved with taking over twitter or some of the many many ridiculous things he’s said over the years.Come on shmmeee, no sure about Musk being stupid…vain and rich, no doubt. I doubt Putins able to play him either.. he’s hardly Trump. Whatever people’s views on Musk as a person and his beliefs, the guys a genius. Flawed definitely but most are. Also by all accounts Starlink was one of the reasons Ukraine managed to resist Russia in the early months of the invasion
They weren’t the invading forces though. Where were they going to run away too? Not saying for one minute we should carpet bomb Russias forces in Ukraine but if you’re going to compare this to the Vietnam war you’ve put the cart before the horse.You mean like in Vietnam/Laos/Cambodia? That worked out well didn't it?
Apart from nuclear war that is and risking the likes of China getting involved - tensions with them and the USA are already bad enough.
Apart from in reality the west is very much involved, otherwise it would have been over a long time ago.I would argue that China will be more likely to aggress against its neighbours if there is a blueprint for how to prevent Western intervention.
He’s hardly been left to ‘crack on with it’. It would also have made it more likely China would get involved, not to mention the real risk of nuclear war.
Yeah, he’s definitely wanted this to go on for a year. It’s naive to think that if the west started carpeting bombing Russian troops and the country and its civilians that it wouldn’t lead to nuclear war.Nonsense. This has isolated Russia and strained their relationship with China and nuclear weapon use would do so further. Putins whole game is keep threatening to escalate because the other side are pussies and will back down and he gets what he wants. And he’s mostly been right.
Yeah, he’s definitely wanted this to go on for a year. It’s naive to think that if the west started carpeting bombing Russian troops and the country and its civilians that it wouldn’t lead to nuclear war.
Nobody has suggested attacking Russian territory, just the invasion force. Like that many mile long column of equipment that made a beeline for Kyiv and was just sitting there exposed.
that would be an act of war on Russia and it’s allies would respond and ww3 starts
It’s also telling that none of them have gone down your preferred route either.It’s an act of defence against an invader. Had strategists listened to your way of thinking all of Ukraine would be under Russian control by now.
It’s an act of defence against an invader. Had strategists listened to your way of thinking all of Ukraine would be under Russian control by now.
It’s also telling that none of them have gone down your preferred route either.
no it’s an act of war we have no alliance in the west with Ukraine
it’s an act of war
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?