Grendel
Well-Known Member
No it's an investment portfolio fund that ultimately owns wasps which no one knows the shareholders composition of.
Great try though.
Wasps owner Derek Richardson explains Coventry move and rejects "franchise" tag (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter SimonGilbert
- Start date
No it's an investment portfolio fund that ultimately owns wasps which no one knows the shareholders composition of.
Great try though.
it really really isn't.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Show me a link then to the shareholder composition of MGI Fiduciary or whatever they are called. Also show me a the composition of Moonstone Ltd the subsidiary.
While you are at it why not explain why Camango Ltd that was bought out by Wasps (holdings) and had one share in Richardsons name was a UK domicile company when in the interview you are referring to he just said the ownership structure is based in Malta for no real reason. Why is Moonstone there at all then? Is that not Moonstone Ltd -- a Florida based hedge fund.
You are in the know -- I am not -- I am sure you will provide a detailed explanation as to why this ownership structure exists if indeed one person owns it.
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
What you talking about, all we need to do is open up a used car lot and shift a few dodgy motors and we'll be playing Barcelona in no time
...... or something similar. Certainly a lot more required than they are doing at the moment.
SkyBlue_Bear83
Well-Known Member
Clearly the club shop and merchandise stand is running far below the standards that would be considered adequate.
But even if it was, it isn't enough, its like opening up a lemonade stand to allow you to put down a deposit on a house.
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
Depends how much lemonade you sell.
Perhaps we could bottle it and sell it 365 days a year ?
Time to think outside the box
If Canmango was acquired by Wasps Holdings, and if Wasps Holdings is owned by a Maltese company then....it is a Maltese ownership structure. Not too hard to understand.
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
This is from memory but didn't it go something like Wasps owned by Canmango, Canmango owned by Moonstone, Moonstone owned by MGI Fiduciary with Richardson being a shareholder in MGI. Think both Moonstone an MGI were Malta based.
Sure everything is above board there. We all base our companies in Malta, where less details are available for scrutiny, don't we
Sure everything is above board there. We all base our companies in Malta, where less details are available for scrutiny, don't we
Nick
Administrator
You should take it up with the telegraph, apparently sisu aren't a hedge fund as joy seppala owns ccfc
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/coventry-city-fc-owner-joy-6096912
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Even they wouldn't be that stupid -- wasps don't own ACL you know
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Ah you missed Moonstone out -- is it the Florida Hedge Fund or not? Serious question -- Wasps Holdings is a subsidiary of Moonstone Not MGI -- who are they?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
But in the meantime assume it's a hedge fund
You really are a moron
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
From you I'll take that as a double negative. Thanks
You might need to spend some time understanding corporate structures before spouting rubbish.
Google suggests that MGI is a fiduciary company. The word fiduciary speaks volumes.
And where on earth did the Florida link come from.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
tbf the answers are so vague and wishy washy from him, they could be anything.
'Trust me, it's all OK - honest'.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
That's enough about Grendull. What do you think about "intheknow"? I still think he's RFC's alter ego
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Google suggests? That's not very in the know? I am constantly asking you who moonstone holdings are. Why will you not answer? There's a Florida based company and a Jersey one I can find - why so defensive? What's to hide. You are in the know so tell us who they are and why they are in the middle of Mgi and wasps holdings.
Also out of interest another major creditor of wasps holdings are Close Leasing Limited. Who are they and why do wasps holdings owe over £2 million to them? They also seem to owe half a million to their former owner.
Looking forward to an answer this time in the know.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
It really is odd that you're not interested in asking these sort of questions of our owners and their intricate web of companies. Are you sure you're not a Wasps fan?
Taken from Rob Smiths blog (ex wasps coach).
"With regard to the financial set up of Wasps we simply do not know any or hardly any of the details. What we do know is Wasps RFC are the trading company, have bought the leasehold, most likely pay rent to CCC on the freehold, own 50% or 100% of ACL the operating company. Wasps are 100% owned by Canmango Ltd a holding Company registered in London, largest shareholder David Thorne. Canmango Ltd are 100% owned by Moonstone Ltd who shares are 100% owned by MGI Fiduciary Services in which Derek Richardson is the primary shareholder. Both Moonstone Ltd and MGI are Malta registered companies, so quite difficult to establish details.The funding for the purchase will have come down from these Companies and will be presented as loans in the Wasps accounts."
"With regard to the financial set up of Wasps we simply do not know any or hardly any of the details. What we do know is Wasps RFC are the trading company, have bought the leasehold, most likely pay rent to CCC on the freehold, own 50% or 100% of ACL the operating company. Wasps are 100% owned by Canmango Ltd a holding Company registered in London, largest shareholder David Thorne. Canmango Ltd are 100% owned by Moonstone Ltd who shares are 100% owned by MGI Fiduciary Services in which Derek Richardson is the primary shareholder. Both Moonstone Ltd and MGI are Malta registered companies, so quite difficult to establish details.The funding for the purchase will have come down from these Companies and will be presented as loans in the Wasps accounts."
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
Interesting. I said all along that Wasps are paying rent on the Freehold. Still don't know but makes more sense.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Who says they are paying rent on the freehold? ACL didn'
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
.... but in the meantime continue your argument on the assumption it's a franchise :facepalm:
I know it's irritating for all of us that we don't know all the facts but why keep wasting hours of your life fighting everybody who explains alternative reasons ?
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
Grendel
Well-Known Member
No we know the deal was heavily put in favour of wasps and we know that it was reported at the time £1 million was taken off the loan. It's a fairly good assumption that's the freehold. It will be a peppercorn freehold no doubt.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
No one presents any alternate reasons do they?
Moonstone in Valletta exist but no record exists of any trading details or directors. You seem in love with them yet they hide in a veil of secrecy.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
It's OK, intheknow will be along to explain.
Nick
Administrator
Think it's quite obvious isn't it about intheknow?That's enough about Grendull. What do you think about "intheknow"? I still think he's RFC's alter ego
italiahorse
Well-Known Member
But they did. So how can you assume it changed?
- ACL took a 50 year sublease of the Arena from CNR, with the option ofpaying a £1.9m per annum rent or a premium of £21m. In addition, “superrent” was payable, based on ACL’s net profit before tax, of 10% on profitsover £3.75m rising to 50% of profits over £7.75m.
Nick
Administrator
To start with the length had changed?
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
How many times have they paid the superrent?
stupot07
Well-Known Member
They never made profits of more than £1m, so never paid any super rent. Wasps will just move money around so they don't have to pay any super rent.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors