We will be fine. (1 Viewer)

[shmmeee]

Not really , the people that love him think that .
He looked brilliant in his wolves cameo .. hasn't yet taken it into the season

I think he’s a promising young players with a killer pass in his locker and lots to improve on that I think will come with experience. I gave him a 6 yesterday mostly because he struggled with the press at times. He’s not played a full season at this level yet and I think the faster pace will come. But his vision and range is light years ahead of Kelly’s and that’s what I want in his position.

 

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[Evo1883]

I think he’s a promising young players with a killer pass in his locker and lots to improve on that I think will come with experience. I gave him a 6 yesterday mostly because he struggled with the press at times. He’s not played a full season at this level yet and I think the faster pace will come. But his vision and range is light years ahead of Kelly’s and that’s what I want in his position.

It depends what you want in your team .

2 midfielders infront of your back 3 I'd want 1 who is less pretty and more gritty in that 2 .

That's just me

 

[shmmeee]

It depends what you want in your team .

2 midfielders infront of your back 3 I'd want 1 who is less pretty and more gritty in that 2 .

That's just me

He’s not a “terrier” mostly because he’s tall TBH. But his tackling is generally really good. And his height is important.

These days I’m not sure a “terrier” would even work in this division with the amount of diving. Yesterday Kelly would’ve given away tons of free kicks around the area.

 

[Gint11]

Why is the standard response nowadays “do you think you know better than Robins”?

I don’t think Kelly is up to Championship standard, and I don’t see the huge issue with this. I’ve done a quick stats comparison between him and Ryan Woods (random average Championship midfielder) and whilst his interceptions are better per 90 mins, his passing is appalling.

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I haven’t got an issue with you not rating Kelly and of course you entitled to an opinion just like I am entitled to see it differently and challenge it.

Football isn’t just about passing is it?
Kelly’s pass completion last season was 66% which isn’t great but what about other attributes he brings? Leadership, heart, organisation, communication, leading by example, the odd goal (the 2 he scored against Wycombe)

In my opinion, when Kelly plays the team is better.

 

[Evo1883]

He’s not a “terrier” mostly because he’s tall TBH. But his tackling is generally really good. And his height is important.

These days I’m not sure a “terrier” would even work in this division with the amount of diving. Yesterday Kelly would’ve given away tons of free kicks around the area.

His height is a plus il give you .. we do look more competitive.

I said to my dad yesterday if sheaf could just lose that fear and add some oomph into his game he'd be brilliant .
How do you get that into people's game ?

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Hes a decent lower league player. He’s not Championship quality and quality is what we need. If we’re relying on Kelly we’re in trouble. Need to get out of the “L1 club just happy to be here” mentality TBH.

We’re in trouble based on what? We survived with him comfortably last year. In fact, our PPG was relegation form without him. He’s our most influential player and is fine for the level we’re at and the notion that ‘we’re in trouble’ because he’s a start is just nonsense.

However, I agree Kelly is not a long term option, and like the Doyle situation in L1, we will need someone to replace him eventually. Kelly is 32 going on 33 not in his late 30s as Doyle was.

As things stand, Sheaf has been playing quite well so far and looks improved from last year.

 

[shmmeee]

We’re in trouble based on what? We survived with him comfortably last year. In fact, our PPG was relegation form without him. He’s our most influential player and is fine for the level we’re at and the notion that ‘we’re in trouble’ because he’s a start is just nonsense.

However, I agree Kelly is not a long term option, and like the Doyle situation in L1, we will need someone to replace him eventually. Kelly is 32 going on 33 not in his late 30s as Doyle was.

As things stand, Sheaf has been playing quite well so far and looks improved from last year.

This is just the Kelly equivalent of Max’s “he tries his best and scores important goals”.

You’re basically doing @Philosorapter’s model of player rating and we all saw the results that came out with.

He came in at the end of the season when the side had half a season of experience and by all accounts a bit of a bollocking to pull themselves away from danger.

Relying on “heart” and “leadership” is the stuff of minnows punching above their weight not serious Championship sides. I expect better from us this season and so far I’m seeing it. We were the better team yesterday for all Barnsley’s heart and passion. And with a touch more luck would’ve hammered them.

 

[COV]

We’re in trouble based on what? We survived with him comfortably last year. In fact, our PPG was relegation form without him. He’s our most influential player and is fine for the level we’re at and the notion that ‘we’re in trouble’ because he’s a start is just nonsense.

However, I agree Kelly is not a long term option, and like the Doyle situation in L1, we will need someone to replace him eventually. Kelly is 32 going on 33 not in his late 30s as Doyle was.

As things stand, Sheaf has been playing quite well so far and looks improved from last year.

I know, people forget Kelly was part of a team that survived relatively comfortably in the end, and I don’t see how we’re “relying” on him. Same as we had people saying McFazdean was coming to the end and we were in trouble if we were relying on him- he’s been great.

so many extreme reactions- Kelly isn’t going to singlehandledly win matches but with the club in the position it’s in with us unable to spend money on replacements, he’s a good player to have around.

it’s not always a binary case of “he’s amazing” or “he’s shite”

 

[Evo1883]

We’re in trouble based on what? We survived with him comfortably last year. In fact, our PPG was relegation form without him. He’s our most influential player and is fine for the level we’re at and the notion that ‘we’re in trouble’ because he’s a start is just nonsense.

However, I agree Kelly is not a long term option, and like the Doyle situation in L1, we will need someone to replace him eventually. Kelly is 32 going on 33 not in his late 30s as Doyle was.

As things stand, Sheaf has been playing quite well so far and looks improved from last year.

Well after 2 games so far his pass completion and defensive stats are short of his 20/21 average ..so he's started generally worse , it's fine though as its early season and players are expected to grow into seasons

He does have an assist which was a nice assist tbh

 

[Marty]

I'm not Sheaf's biggest fan by any stretch of the imagination, technically he's very good but I feel like hes a tad ponderous. anyway, think he's been pritty ok this season actually, he couldn't do anything for the Forest goal, pointless playing 55 mins+ plus with one less player and he's no where quick enough to keep up with Brennan Johnson. Not really sure he could have done much yesterday either, maybe a tad slow to lung in but there's far more obvious errors that need to be addressed first.

 

[Evo1883]

The reality is we take the chances we had , nobody cares about their goal

 

[Evo1883]

And if we win Tuesday night we'd have made a great start to the season

A point and it's been a solid start

 

[Sick Boy]

I know, people forget Kelly was part of a team that survived relatively comfortably in the end, and I don’t see how we’re “relying” on him. Same as we had people saying McFazdean was coming to the end and we were in trouble if we were relying on him- he’s been great.

so many extreme reactions- Kelly isn’t going to singlehandledly win matches but with the club in the position it’s in with us unable to spend money on replacements, he’s a good player to have around.

it’s not always a binary case of “he’s amazing” or “he’s shite”

No one has said he's shite but we end up with over the top assessments of players; he's a decent player for us at the moment in time but he's hardly likely to attract interest from any clubs at this level. It sometimes feels like some of our fans have adopted a small-time mentality around the club.

 

[Evo1883]

I still think and you can quote me on this , we will get more points than last season and finish slightly higher ..what I saw yesterday was very encouraging

 

[Sky Blue Harry H]

Yesterday Kelly would’ve given away tons of free kicks around the area.

Whether you like Kelly or not, that's a bit of a creative assumption!

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

it was a bit like that with him last week as well, needs to impose himself much more, he's clearly very capable at this level.

It’s a shame James wasn’t replaced else we could use Hamer more offensively

 

[shmmeee]

Whether you like Kelly or not, that's a bit of a creative assumption!

I mean I don’t have a what if machine, but the “gritty” style that works at lower leagues is all about getting tight and letting people know you’re there and yesterday as soon as a Barnsley player was less than 40 yards from goal and someone was near they fell over.

 

[Evo1883]

What pleased me is I remember watching many of these players in person at Ipswich away in league 1 in our last game , and they've all managed to make a step up from what I've seen.. shows that with many of our players their ceiling was higher than the level of league 1 and they've been coached well to take the next step up , it also shows solid recruitment overall in the last 4 years

You only really see the difference in person I think , the game looks so much different and faster than on TV

 

[clint van damme]

I still think and you can quote me on this , we will get more points than last season and finish slightly higher ..what I saw yesterday was very encouraging

I agree and it's what I expect, will be disappointed if it doesn't happen.
The goal yesterday was reminiscent of so many we conceded last season down our left, I don't think we'll be conceding many more like that with the two lads from Chelsea playing on that side, and as you say, you can quote me on that!

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

Kelly looked poor when he played in the second half of last season - his lack of pace and poor distribution was getting worse.

he’s going to be a fringe player this season

Disagree. I think he was our most influential performer in the games in which he played. You mention his performance second half of the season but I think he was instrumental in the vital, late season win at Rotherham for example.

 

[shmmeee]

One thing that really impressed me yesterday was we didn’t give up in the face of Barnsley’s press. We for the most part carried on playing out from the back and for the most part did it well. Last season we’d have been lumping it up to Max or giving the ball away.

 

[shmmeee]

Disagree. I think he was our most influential performer in the games in which he played. You mention his performance second half of the season but I think he was instrumental in the vital, late season win at Rotherham for example.

He is very good against L1 teams that’s fair.

 

[COV]

He is very good against L1 teams that’s fair.

Tbf he was pretty good against Brentford too

 

[Grendel]

Tbf he was pretty good against Brentford too

he was taken off after an hour

 

[COV]

he was taken off after an hour

Yes, and he played well.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

This is just the Kelly equivalent of Max’s “he tries his best and scores important goals”.

You’re basically doing @Philosorapter’s model of player rating and we all saw the results that came out with.

He came in at the end of the season when the side had half a season of experience and by all accounts a bit of a bollocking to pull themselves away from danger.

Relying on “heart” and “leadership” is the stuff of minnows punching above their weight not serious Championship sides. I expect better from us this season and so far I’m seeing it. We were the better team yesterday for all Barnsley’s heart and passion. And with a touch more luck would’ve hammered them.

Leadership is one of, if not the most important things in a team setting in any team sport. Teams without good leadership tend to underperform. So to see you call it ‘the stuff of minnows’ is just a careless comment.

Realistically, with where we’re at now, Kelly is a good player to have and objectively, we perform better with Kelly in the team than without. In all the leagues he’s played for us in. The results don’t lie. The club is trying to grow incrementally and I’m sure at some point Kelly’s time as skipper and starter will end - probably after this season.

Side note: Why do you think PSG have brought in Messi, Ramos and Wjinaldum in a team that is already stacked with quality? All just happen to be captains and great leaders for their country, previous clubs or both. PSG also happens to be a club we associate with mental fragility or ‘bottle jobs’, if you prefer.

 

[cc84cov]

Once Kelly is fit sheaf will be back on the bench,we are a different side with Kelly in it unless Hamer is pushed into an attacking midfield position

 

[COV]

Once Kelly is fit sheaf will be back on the bench,we are a different side with Kelly in it unless Hamer is pushed into an attacking midfield position

not sure about that

 

[shmmeee]

Leadership is one of, if not the most important things in a team setting in any team sport. Teams without good leadership tend to underperform. So to see you call it ‘the stuff of minnows’ is just a careless comment.

Realistically, with where we’re at now, Kelly is a good player to have and objectively, we perform better with Kelly in the team than without. In all the leagues he’s played for us in. The results don’t lie. The club is trying to grow incrementally and I’m sure at some point Kelly’s time as skipper and starter will end - probably after this season.

Side note: Why do you think PSG have brought in Messi, Ramos and Wjinaldum in a team that is already stacked with quality? All just happen to be captains and great leaders for their country, previous clubs or both. PSG also happens to be a club we associate with mental fragility or ‘bottle jobs’, if you prefer.

They should’ve saved some cash and brought in Max and Kelly.

Obviously leadership counts, but you don’t put in substandard players for it. Leaders need to be respected and lead by example, if you’re the worst player on the pitch you can’t lead because you won’t be respected.

 

[fatso]

Kelly is head and shoulders above Sheaf and Hamer and is the missing link IMO. Both players need a player like Kelly to make sense their movement.

I think the problem is that when MR opts to play Kelly, it's going to be at the expense of one of the strikers, and now that we have better options up front, I'd be suprised if Kelly gets a regular start if Hamer and Sheaf are both fit.
I think Kelly will be used more as cover from now on.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Leadership is one of, if not the most important things in a team setting in any team sport. Teams without good leadership tend to underperform. So to see you call it ‘the stuff of minnows’ is just a careless comment.

Realistically, with where we’re at now, Kelly is a good player to have and objectively, we perform better with Kelly in the team than without. In all the leagues he’s played for us in. The results don’t lie. The club is trying to grow incrementally and I’m sure at some point Kelly’s time as skipper and starter will end - probably after this season.

Side note: Why do you think PSG have brought in Messi, Ramos and Wjinaldum in a team that is already stacked with quality? All just happen to be captains and great leaders for their country, previous clubs or both. PSG also happens to be a club we associate with mental fragility or ‘bottle jobs’, if you prefer.

Dare I say we don't need a figure like Kelly on the pitch as much as we need someone who can simply finish. Sadly that chap busted his shoulder after 15 minutes and his substitute spent most of the game getting caught offside

 

[Sick Boy]

I think the problem is that when MR opts to play Kelly, it's going to be at the expense of one of the strikers, and now that we have better options up front, I'd be suprised if Kelly gets a regular start if Hamer and Sheaf are both fit.
I think Kelly will be used more as cover from now on.

But…but…he’s a really nice guy.

 

[SBAndy]

I haven’t got an issue with you not rating Kelly and of course you entitled to an opinion just like I am entitled to see it differently and challenge it.

Football isn’t just about passing is it?
Kelly’s pass completion last season was 66% which isn’t great but what about other attributes he brings? Leadership, heart, organisation, communication, leading by example, the odd goal (the 2 he scored against Wycombe)

In my opinion, when Kelly plays the team is better.

You’re right in that it isn’t just about passing, but we are a team that wants to play progressive football and build patterns of play. To do this you need to be competent on the ball, which Kelly isn’t. 28% long passing success is abysmal. I take your point on his other ‘intangible’ qualities but this is why I’ve been quite passionate in that I’d have moved Kelly on and got someone in the mould of James who has both sides to his game. Obviously the budget hasn’t stretched to that so we are where we are.

If your passing success rate is only 66% in the Championship in a position where you’ll tend to have a fair few options on, it tells me the game is moving too quickly for you. That’s why I don’t think he’s Championship quality.

 

[clint van damme]

Dare I say we don't need a figure like Kelly on the pitch as much as we need someone who can simply finish. Sadly that chap busted his shoulder after 15 minutes and his substitute spent most of the game getting caught offside

wonder how bad his injury is? Robins says 2 to 3 weeks but he was clapping supporters when he went off. Can you do that when you've got a bad shoulder injury? I've never experienced one.

 

[Evo1883]

But…but…he’s a really nice guy.

I'm not entirely sure the max and Kelly comparisons are remotely fair

Kelly has been fantastic for the club whereas max was largely ineffective.