The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (302 Viewers)

[Captain Dart]

Looking at the Labour Party's rules you'd think they were drawn up by some right numpties who were incapable of seeing all the likely scenario's.

Anyway, Corbyn has been allowed to stand.

 

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[Grendel]

This is exactly why we'll be staying in the common market as the residents of Canary Wharf and the wider London financial community will still have passporting rights into the EU. Of course this also means we'll still have free movement of people with the EU and we'll still be making a financial contribution to the EU also.

Teresa May will take the fall for it and a large section of brexit voters will feel cheated but this was always going to be the case regardless of who the next PM was, well maybe except Gove but maybe this is why he wasn't backed enough in the leadership vote. Well that and he's an untrustworthy back stabber.

It won't be the case at all. Once markets have stabilised an agreement will be reached that will satisfy a fair proportion of the leave requests.

Given you can't even name a prime minister from the 1970's I'm going to take your judgement on Brexit negotiations with a large piece of salt.

 

[Grendel]

It'd be ludicrous in the extreme to stop him anyway.

Not as ludicrous as it would to re-elect him.

 

[martcov]

This is exactly why we'll be staying in the common market as the residents of Canary Wharf and the wider London financial community will still have passporting rights into the EU. Of course this also means we'll still have free movement of people with the EU and we'll still be making a financial contribution to the EU also.

Teresa May will take the fall for it and a large section of brexit voters will feel cheated but this was always going to be the case regardless of who the next PM was, well maybe except Gove but maybe this is why he wasn't backed enough in the leadership vote. Well that and he's an untrustworthy back stabber.

Yes, e.g. as Ashdown postet, Siemens can afford to lose wind power generator sales to Denmark. Other export firms may lose out if tariffs are imposed, but there is no way we can afford to lose the City financial services.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Not as ludicrous as it would to re-elect him.

Maybe, maybe not.

His opponent doesn't really inspire... and that's notwithstanding the fact the Corbyn phenomenon is genuinely interesting.

 

[Grendel]

Maybe, maybe not.

His opponent doesn't really inspire... and that's notwithstanding the fact the Corbyn phenomenon is genuinely interesting.

Unless you want a conservative government for decades to come it's really not interesting at all just a case of history repeating itself.

 

[martcov]

It won't be the case at all. Once markets have stabilised an agreement will be reached that will satisfy a fair proportion of the leave requests.

Given you can't even name a prime minister from the 1970's I'm going to take your judgement on Brexit negotiations with a large piece of salt.

I thought the question was leave or remain. What are the leave requests, besides we want to leave.

 

[mrtrench]

Given you can't even name a prime minister from the 1970's I'm going to take your judgement on Brexit negotiations with a large piece of salt.

Sea or rock?

 

[mrtrench]

Unless you want a conservative government for decades to come it's really not interesting at all just a case of history repeating itself.

I think it's interesting; it may not be good for the country. What it could bring is the Liberals as the second largest party in 2020. I think that's no bad thing - IMO they were very badly treated in 2015 and I have a lot of admiration for Cleggie.

 

[Grendel]

I thought the question was leave or remain. What are the leave requests, besides we want to leave.

The requests are obvious. Control;

Control over all law making
Control over all defence strategy
Control over sovereignty
Control over all home affairs and all foreign policy

Oddly it's what all countries have other than those tied into the Euro project.

 

[chiefdave]

This must be another blow to you Mart :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36771595

Good news, we could do with more companies following suit and making similar announcements. Seeing as those in charge don't have much of a plan to restore confidence this might be the best way forward at the moment.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I think it's interesting; it may not be good for the country. What it could bring is the Liberals as the second largest party in 2020. I think that's no bad thing - IMO they were very badly treated in 2015 and I have a lot of admiration for Cleggie.

Hmm, I'm not convinced about Clegg. He messed his party up big time going into coalition, given at that stage they were positioned, in many respects, left of Labour and had picked up student votes among many. He also gave the Conservatives an easy get-out clause.

If the progressive parties played it wisely, they could be a lot stronger than they are (nothing wrong with having a proper Socialist choice, and a Social Liberal (Social Democrat?) choice too... but they'd need to work together), but where the Conservatives are always better is being pragmatic about healing wounds, and keeping sight of the goal of power.

In many ways, it's game management that the left leaning parties need, rather than policy shifts.

 

[martcov]

The requests are obvious. Control;

Control over all law making
Control over all defence strategy
Control over sovereignty
Control over all home affairs and all foreign policy

Oddly it's what all countries have other than those tied into the Euro project.

Are there that many laws that will be changed now or deleted if we leave?
We seem to run a different military strategy to the EU in many cases. See Iraq and Afghanistan.
Sovereignty. Debatable what we can do with it on our own - even in our wars we rely on US or NATO support. We have to make compromises anyway e.g. comply with international law. we are in the United Nations and have to abide by their decisions.
We are not in Shengen, so there is no discussion there.
We have large amounts of control of Home Affairs anyway - it is usually human rights laws or employees rights ( e.g. working hours ) which upset certain peope. If we do any sort of deal with the EU, we will still have to comply with most things.
Is our foreign policy that good, that we must protect it at all costs?
A strong Europe pulling together - yes, it needs reforming - would be good enough for me. A cohesive foreign policy for the part of the world where we live is desirable, not something to break away from.

The empire has gone and we are far better working with NATO and Europe than trying to punch above our weight.

 

[Captain Dart]

No one has ever proposed leaving NATO, where did you get that bollocks from!
It was the French that were not in NATO from 1966 to 2009 don't you know!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7937666.stm

 

[Nick]

No one has ever proposed leaving NATO, where did you get that bollocks from!
It was the French that were not in NATO from 1966 to 2009 don't you know!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7937666.stm

Leaving the solar system, I think we are better on earth!

 

[martcov]

No one has ever proposed leaving NATO, where did you get that bollocks from!
It was the French that were not in NATO from 1966 to 2009 don't you know!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7937666.stm

I never said anything about leaving NATO. I am pleased we are in it. Don't make things up.

 

[Captain Dart]

Brilliant, Labour decide to keep out poor people.. "party of the people" puts up its supporters fee.

 

[Nick]

What do you actually get for being a "member / supporter" of a political party?

 

[Captain Dart]

The empire has gone and we are far better working with NATO and Europe than trying to punch above our weight.

The implication here was not working with NATO.

 

[chiefdave]

What do you actually get for being a "member / supporter" of a political party?

Not a lot. You get a vote in things like this and selecting your local MP. There's local party meetings you can go to.

You're more likely to be asked to do more than get anything out of it. Its the local party members who go out giving out leaflets and trying to drum up support.

 

[Captain Dart]

What do you actually get for being a "member / supporter" of a political party?

 

[Captain Dart]

 

[martcov]

The implication here was not working with NATO.

Grendel was on about us having complete control of our defence policy. We have to work with NATO and accept their rules, so we don't have complete control anyway. I hope I have cleared that up for you.

 

[Kingokings204]

Brilliant, Labour decide to keep out poor people.. "party of the people" puts up its supporters fee.

Compete joke.

 

[Captain Dart]

Grendel was on about us having complete control of our defence policy. We have to work with NATO and accept their rules, so we don't have complete control anyway. I hope I have cleared that up for you.

Grendel, LOL I don't listen to his old nonsense.

 

[chiefdave]

Brilliant, Labour decide to keep out poor people.. "party of the people" puts up its supporters fee.

I find that disgusting. People who signed up on the basis of being given a vote are now, to all intents and purposes, being told they can't vote this time as they voted for the 'wrong' person last time.

 

[chiefdave]

Quick look on twitter and lots of disgruntled Labour members talking of legal action. Will be interesting to see if that comes to anything. Would think they'd have a pretty strong case.

 

[Grendel]

Grendel, LOL I don't listen to his old nonsense.

Good. Keep siding with the deranged europhile Martcov whose drivel on this subject shows no bounds.

The irony is he accuses posters of believing Brexit propaganda (failing to understand uk media rules at election time) but swallows every piece of euro propaganda lobbed at him from his friends at home,

Bit like you when you swallow all the bullshit CCC ram down your throat.

Gullible, Ill informed and embarrassing.

 

[Grendel]

I find that disgusting. People who signed up on the basis of being given a vote are now, to all intents and purposes, being told they can't vote this time as they voted for the 'wrong' person last time.

Are they the same people who've thrown bricks through Angela Eagles constuancy hq this evening and subjected her to vile abuse in a meeting in Luton?

 

[skybluetony176]

It won't be the case at all. Once markets have stabilised an agreement will be reached that will satisfy a fair proportion of the leave requests.

Given you can't even name a prime minister from the 1970's I'm going to take your judgement on Brexit negotiations with a large piece of salt.

So you think we'll leave the common market then?

 

[Ian1779]

Looks like a daytime chat show on Babestation.

 

[Ian1779]

Are they the same people who've thrown bricks through Angela Eagles constuancy hq this evening and subjected her to vile abuse in a meeting in Luton?

There's knobheads on both sides and you know it.

 

[chiefdave]

Are they the same people who've thrown bricks through Angela Eagles constuancy hq this evening and subjected her to vile abuse in a meeting in Luton?

I have no idea, do you have any evidence to show they were paid up Labour members? You might want to pass the information you have on to the police.

Do you have an opinion on those, who using your logic are Eagle supporters, who have issued death threats against Corbyn this week?

“It is bullying, it has absolutely no place in politics in the UK and it needs to end.”

People in glass houses ...

That aside why have they picked her, she is an appalling candidate.

Her campaign launch was an embarrassing disaster. Then she went on the Sunday Politics and was repeatedly asked to state one policy of hers that was different to Corbyn and couldn't.

She came fourth out of five in the deputy leader election but somehow thinks a few months later she is the person to lead Labour to the promised land.

She'll certainly be hoping nobody looks at her voting record.

 

[chiefdave]

Looks like a daytime chat show on Babestation.

The video is better


and this one


Don't know what they are thinking having her oppose Corbyn, there had to be a better option.

 

[Ian1779]

Campaign launch went down pretty much like a scene from 'The Thick of It'