I know the usual protaganitsts (26 Viewers)

[Sky Blue Kid]

People realised we were losing silly amounts of money?

Not thought why people call you SISU apologist yet?... It wouldn't have taken much more financial investment IMHO to have gained promotion in that first year of them taking charge. Pity they didn't use the £20m promised at the "Get go" by Ranson eh Nick

 

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[Nick]

Not thought why people call you SISU apologist yet?... It wouldn't have taken much more financial investment IMHO to have gained promotion in that first year of them taking charge. Pity they didn't use the £20m promised at the "Get go" by Ranson eh Nick

Apologist? It's fact isn't it?

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Apologist? It's fact isn't it?

What's up Nick? no real reply to my post?

 

[clint van damme]

Oh, and didn't they just not only get promotion,(Burnley) but won the league again?

That doesn't really disprove my point.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

That doesn't really disprove my point.

Why doesn't it? Knowing Burnley as I do, I know it's proof... Suck it up buttercup and read this....
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...osts-admits-Sean-Dyche-spending-3-6m-far.html

 

[fernandopartridge]

Sky Blues Kid, isn't it time for another one of your shite used car analogies?

 

[JimmyHillsbeard]

Not thought why people call you SISU apologist yet?... It wouldn't have taken much more financial investment IMHO to have gained promotion in that first year of them taking charge. Pity they didn't use the £20m promised at the "Get go" by Ranson eh Nick

Are you seriously saying that the reason we didn't get promotion is that Coleman and Kean weren't given enough money by SiSU?

 

[clint van damme]

Most teams who get out of the championship either have the guts of a premiership squad backed by parachute money after relegation or spend heavily, (i.e Bournemouth). Burnley are the exception that prove the rule.

I'd love us to have owners who could throw that money at the team, but failing that, I want us to be well run and not load the club with debt gambling on promotion.

You didn't answer if you'd be happy with a fan owned model for the club run if it meant living within our means.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Under the SCMP rules, the definition of 'Turnover' is particularly important as Turnover is used to determine the maximum wage-spend. Within a traditional accounting perspective, there are usually only three elements of turnover:

• Match-day Income
• Commercial Income (such as sponsorship)
• TV revenue (and any 'merit payments' based on league position)

However the Football League use a is broader definition of Turnover. Crucially, the FL Turnover figure includes donations from the owners to the club and injections of equity. Loans from club owners are understandably not included in the Turnover figure as these would result in growing club debts. up club debts. In League 1 and League 2, a wealthy owner can therefore fund the club spending in a way that is not permitted in other divisions. Manchester City and Leicester for example seem set for punishment for their excessive losses (from UEFA and the Championship respectively) despite the fact that the owners have injected hard cash into the club to finance the spending.
http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/scmp.php


They could put money in, but they won't, stop sticking up for BULLSHIT. It's above you in black and white.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Sky Blues Kid, isn't it time for another one of your shite used car analogies?

fernandopartridge... Isn't it time for you to make a worthwhile post?

 

[Esoterica]

Yawnnnnn. Burnley won promotion after spending £500k on Charlie Adam and £4k on a left back... Serious cash that eh Clit?

Where do you get this bullshit from? Charlie Adam has never played for Burnley. Last year they won the league having spent 9 million alone on 1 striker - Andre Gray, and had huge earners like Joey Barton in their team. This was on the back of having come straight back down from the Prem with a 30 million profit for the season, even before the massive parachute payments kicked in.

Their previous promotion they did not win the league - Leicester did. Leicester who smashed the FFP rules to do it. And Burnley managed it largely due to the brilliance of Danny Ings - another 7 figure signing from Bournemouth.

And they will come straight back down again, as their owners are refusing to buy anyone because of the crazy prices. Which, if you were a Burnley fan, you would be screaming about as a lack of ambition and calling them shit owners for 2 relegations in 3 years.

 

[stupot07]

Read my link, then ask if I'm sniffing glue!

Read it yet? or has it got stuck in your throat yet?

Yes I read it. £100.5m for finishing bottom plus £81.6m parachute payments so a min of £182.1m inc parachute payments.

Whilst its a lot of money, that's not the guarenteed £200m plus £100m parachute payments as you suggested:

£200m guaranteed for promotion to the Prem and £100m parachute payment on relegation. :

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[Sky Blue Kid]

Are you seriously saying that the reason we didn't get promotion is that Coleman and Kean weren't given enough money by SiSU?

I'm seriously saying if we'd not brought those two useless muppets in who were on serious money at that time, and kept hold of Dowie and used that money we'd have saved, we could have had a realistic chance of promotion... Oh! and actually had that promised £20m for players, I think we could very well have been in the Premier League by now.

 

[Esoterica]

I'm seriously saying if we'd not brought those two useless muppets in who were on serious money at that time, and kept hold of Dowie and used that money we'd have saved, we could have had a realistic chance of promotion... Oh! and actually had that promised £20m for players, I think we could very well have been in the Premier League by now.

IF we'd not brought them in, IF we'd kept hold of Dowie, IF we'd used that money we saved, IF we had the 20 mill we COULD have been in the premier league. 4 massive IFs for a COULD, before we've even looked at what else was going on in the league that year.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Most teams who get out of the championship either have the guts of a premiership squad backed by parachute money after relegation or spend heavily, (i.e Bournemouth). Burnley are the exception that prove the rule.

I'd love us to have owners who could throw that money at the team, but failing that, I want us to be well run and not load the club with debt gambling on promotion.

You didn't answer if you'd be happy with a fan owned model for the club run if it meant living within our means.

I believe if we were "Fan owned" we would have full houses every other week, because I know the gate money would be reinvested into the Club, Merchandise would be top of the list "Must haves". I personally would be back watching and buying season tickets for myself and my family(Possibly even a box.) You can take that as a FACT.

 

[Captain Dart]

Its a pity there are a dozen teams in the Championship prepared to spend to try & get to the Premiership. It is quite possible to spend big and still fail to get promoted.

 

[JimmyHillsbeard]

I'm seriously saying if we'd not brought those two useless muppets in who were on serious money at that time, and kept hold of Dowie and used that money we'd have saved, we could have had a realistic chance of promotion... Oh! and actually had that promised £20m for players, I think we could very well have been in the Premier League by now.

Right - and I largely agree. But to reiterate, you're problem isn't with a lack of investment but in what (or who) the money was invested in?

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

IF we'd not brought them in, IF we'd kept hold of Dowie, IF we'd used that money we saved, IF we had the 20 mill we COULD have been in the premier league. 4 massive IFs for a COULD, before we've even looked at what else was going on in the league that year.

Put it this way mate. SISU did themselves along with 22k+ fans no favours by Lying through their teeth about the £20m. Dowie brought both Dann and Fox to CCFC. was then promptly "Kicked in the bollocks" by being sacked in favour of that useless muppet Coleman. 9 months later Dann and Fox sold, and so began the slippery slide down the league until relegation and finally in the shit where we are now!

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Its a pity there are a dozen teams in the Championship prepared to spend to try & get to the Premiership. It is quite possible to spend big and still fail to get promoted.

IMHO it is the old adage of "Nothing ventured, nothing gained"

 

[Ian1779]

I believe if we were "Fan owned" we would have full houses every other week, because I know the gate money would be reinvested into the Club, Merchandise would be top of the list "Must haves". I personally would be back watching and buying season tickets for myself and my family(Possibly even a box.) You can take that as a FACT.

I don't actually dispute that attendances may rise - but how do we create a situation where cash flow allows for transfer fees & wages, rent, setting up merchandise systems for fans to buy, plus numerous other things. What happens in the close season etc...

It's like any small business in the fact that the set up costs to get going are the killer.

That would be the biggest hurdle to overcome.. that and not having a stadium.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

IF we'd not brought them in, IF we'd kept hold of Dowie, IF we'd used that money we saved, IF we had the 20 mill we COULD have been in the premier league. 4 massive IFs for a COULD, before we've even looked at what else was going on in the league that year.

Please read my last post

 

[Esoterica]

Put it this way mate. SISU did themselves along with 22k+ fans no favours by Lying through their teeth about the £20m. Dowie brought both Dann and Fox to CCFC. was then promptly "Kicked in the bollocks" by being sacked in favour of that useless muppet Coleman. 9 months later Dann and Fox sold, and so began the slippery slide down the league until relegation and finally in the shit where we are now!

Why are we putting it this way? You're arguing about something else entirely now. It has nothing to with your statement that we could have won promotion with all your ifs and buts. Newcastle and WBA got the automatic spots that year, both immediately returning to the premier league at the first time of asking, with Newcastle breaking the 100 point mark.

 

[JimmyHillsbeard]

Dann and Fox played a total of 3 games each for Dowie as he was sacked before the February FA Cup game vs West Brom
Coleman signed Aron Gunnarsson, Keiren Westwood, Clinton Morrison, Freddy Eastwood, Stephen Wright, David Bell, Guillame Buezelin and James McPake before Fox and Dann left. He then signed Sammy Clingan, Michael McIndoe, Martin Cranie, Richard Wood, Gary Deegan, Chris Hussey and Carl Baker.

 

[JimmyHillsbeard]

Why are we putting it this way? You're arguing about something else entirely now. It has nothing to with your statement that we could have won promotion with all your ifs and buts. Newcastle and WBA got the automatic spots that year, both immediately returning to the premier league at the first time of asking, with Newcastle breaking the 100 point mark.

No. West Brom and Stoke! Hull went up in the play-offs

 

[Esoterica]

No. West Brom and Stoke! Hull went up in the play-offs

You're right that was his first full season, I was referring to the year Coleman got sacked.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Why are we putting it this way? You're arguing about something else entirely now. It has nothing to with your statement that we could have won promotion with all your ifs and buts. Newcastle and WBA got the automatic spots that year, both immediately returning to the premier league at the first time of asking, with Newcastle breaking the 100 point mark.

Im not arguing anything entirely different at all.

Yes I read it. £100.5m for finishing bottom plus £81.6m parachute payments so a min of £182.1m inc parachute payments.

Whilst its a lot of money, that's not the guarenteed £200m plus £100m parachute payments as you suggested:






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WTF you talking about??? £200m Guaranteed for promotion... Minimum £100m guaranteed parachute payment. Now when I went to school £200m + £100m = £300m Which is what SISU would make if they took CCFC up... and then brought them down.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Dann and Fox played a total of 3 games each for Dowie as he was sacked before the February FA Cup game vs West Brom
Coleman signed Aron Gunnarsson, Keiren Westwood, Clinton Morrison, Freddy Eastwood, Stephen Wright, David Bell, Guillame Buezelin and James McPake before Fox and Dann left. He then signed Sammy Clingan, Michael McIndoe, Martin Cranie, Richard Wood, Gary Deegan, Chris Hussey and Carl Baker.

How many of those 15 players Coleman signed would you say were half decent? I'll give you my list now...
Gunnarsson, Westwood, Crainie, and possibly Baker.... 4 out of 15 the rest were total Gash. This is my argument against Coleman.. The Welsh squad that did well in the Euro's having the spine of the team(Gary Speed) already there made Colemans job a "Walk in the park"

 

[Esoterica]

Im not arguing anything entirely different at all.


WTF you talking about??? £200m Guaranteed for promotion... Minimum £100m guaranteed parachute payment. Now when I went to school £200m + £100m = £300m Which is what SISU would make if they took CCFC up... and then brought them down.

There's a big difference between saying if we'd speculated that year we could have got promoted vs highlighting the decisions that the lying SISU made which kicked off the slippery slide to League 1.

 

[stupot07]

Im not arguing anything entirely different at all.


WTF you talking about??? £200m Guaranteed for promotion... Minimum £100m guaranteed parachute payment. Now when I went to school £200m + £100m = £300m Which is what SISU would make if they took CCFC up... and then brought them down.

Think you should re-read the article, because you are wrong. You're making yourself look silly.

After costs and before increase wages, bonuses, transfers an estimated profit of £108m.

No need to apologise.

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[Sky Blue Kid]

Think you should re-read the article, because you are wrong. You're making yourself look silly.

After costs and before increase wages, bonuses, transfers an estimated profit of £108m.

No need to apologise.

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The club that win the Championship play-offs this weekend stands to make almost £200million from promotion to the Premier League.

An analysis of past Premier League payments, sponsorship and matchday earnings has revealed how much a team can profit from its victory - however fleeting.

Weird my link differs from yours eh stupot07... My basic figures were £200m for total gain to the Prem. and £100m for relegation. I never went into how much it cost to go for a pie at the away end

 

[Captain Dart]

The club that win the Championship play-offs this weekend stands to make almost £200million from promotion to the Premier League.

You don't seem to understand that they have to spend most if not all or even more than this to stay up. It guarantees a better quality of player & opposition but it isn't profit it is turnover.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

You don't seem to understand that they have to spend all of this to stay up.

So according to stupot07.. They have to spend all of the parachute payment as well?

 

[fernandopartridge]

You don't seem to understand that they have to spend all of this to stay up.

....and increase their spending on wages massively including offering multi year contracts which will eat into the parachute payment pretty quickly. As well as that, the double whammy of an average 25% drop in attendances coupled with a likely decrease in ticket prices. Not to mention reductions in commercial income and sponsorship.

 

[Captain Dart]

So according to stupot07.. They have to spend all of the parachute payment as well?

Didn't help Wigan overmuch & you only get that dosh after relegation when salaries of contracted (shit) players (that got you relegated) you can't shift will eat most of it up. That is what happened to us after relegation from the premiership, the losses and persisting salaries couldn't remotely be covered by sales even though McGinnity had a damn good try at balancing the books.

 

[Hobo]

Really!... I'd say at least 8+ years. This Football Club had a team capable of promotion to the Premier league around the time SISU took control. What has happened since, Oh wait a minute.......

Lots has happened since then, a lot of bad things.

But lets live in the real world, the current side is about 12 to 18 months old.....if you can't see the positives compared to the eight years previous that is up to you.