torchomatic
Well-Known Member
Nope, not me.
Investment on the Horizon? (25 Viewers)
- Thread starter Malaka
- Start date
Nope, not me.
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
Sorry Torch I was responding to Grendels post, I pressed reply to the wrong post,this
Was the one.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
He's overblown shite anyway according to Super Scoop Gilbert
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
And when is he ever wrong?
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
Well then, that's gonna be a bit awkward for you in a few months time, what with
You being in the same camp as Gilbert.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
There are many ways to take money out of a business without it showing up in the published accounts. I don't have proof that SISU have done this. Likewise there is no proof that they haven't done it. I am just providing a bit of balance to the discussion given that Nick, Torch et al always say "have you checked the accounts - ask OSB" every time someone suggests the possibility that SISU are taking money out of the club. Fact is nobody knows, and nobody will know without access to the detailed transactional data. However, you do have to ask yourselves why our players are so shit given that our staff costs in the accounts are relatively high compared to many other L1 clubs. Either we are spending too much on shit players or the staff costs number reflects expenses other than what is being spent on player wages.
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Nick
Administrator
Staff costs isn't just players is it?
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
No it's not. But players should make up the vast majority of those costs.
Well I'm not the only one to point out the differences to other clubs.
So I wonder If some of the it is to do with paying off previous management?
Nick
Administrator
I think somebody did say paying off Pressley and his staff was a nice chunk so could have been that.
mrtrench
Well-Known Member
Nope. I knocked a spreadsheet when I first saw the numbers. Even with the most outrageous assumptions I couldn't get close to the costs in the accounts.
Cannot prove a thing; have no evidence; but I smell a rat.
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
But it's not like we own a stadium and/or acadamy is it, so therefore we don't incur any Of the
associated staff costs that we would if we did.
Ticketing is outsourced, F&B enough said, car parking outsourced, merchandise outsourced,
A club shop the size of a broom cupboard, and a dwindling amount of stewards to watch over
A dwindling number of supporters.
So I wouldn't think we could be considered over laden with staff.
Also I'd have to say I find it puzzling, that anyone would find the thought of SISU being less
Than honest, hard to believe.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I think this is outrageous of course you can't hide anything in accounts, mind you did hear of an administrator who couldn't find something he actually knew was there somewhere. However can't remember what company this was. Wonder if anybody else remembers ?
Irish Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
What would be best for my football club is for the owners to leave and someone who actually cares about them to take over. Someone like Russell Slade could actually come in and stand some chance of succeeding. Wouldn't you agree? At the moment I would think his primary aim would be to keep us in this division. In the light of Fishers comments about probable sales, I think it will be hard for him.Like I said, papering over the cracks.
letsallsingtogether
Well-Known Member
Fuck me not another CT turning thread?
letsallsingtogether
Well-Known Member
Well at least you'll have something to agree on.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I haven't read the whole thread but from what I have read you're the only one that's mentioned fraud.
Nick
Administrator
Surely it is if they are taking money out and claiming it's staff wages like suggested?
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Depends if the people any money is going to are"staff" but then again I'm not saying it is
mark82
Super Moderator
Genuine question... Are you that dumb that you believe the shit you are spouting here or are you on the wind up?
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
I'm sure we've been through this before but what is now being claimed to be taken out.
Looking at the latest accounts (year ending 31 May 2015) there's £5.2m in staff costs (including directors). £4.3m of that was wages. That covers 414 employees of which 105 are players, coaches etc.
Directors pay, Fisher, Waggott, Anderson and Labovich for the period these accounts covered, was £144K.
Sure someone can dig out a quote from someone about what the player budget was for 14/15 (although the season doesn't run exactly in line with the accounts so it will include some 13/14).
The question would be why, when the accounts show they are entitled to take millions out but haven't, would they be instead be sneaking money out and quite possibly committing fraud.
Looking at the latest accounts (year ending 31 May 2015) there's £5.2m in staff costs (including directors). £4.3m of that was wages. That covers 414 employees of which 105 are players, coaches etc.
Directors pay, Fisher, Waggott, Anderson and Labovich for the period these accounts covered, was £144K.
Sure someone can dig out a quote from someone about what the player budget was for 14/15 (although the season doesn't run exactly in line with the accounts so it will include some 13/14).
The question would be why, when the accounts show they are entitled to take millions out but haven't, would they be instead be sneaking money out and quite possibly committing fraud.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Was fisher getting paid for that period or is fisher not being paid a more recent event? Pretty sure not being a paid director was something Labovich always claimed as well.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
It's possible that Fisher is getting "deferred compensation" in the form of a pension and this is being accounted for as staff costs. That would also explain why he is still hanging around unless he's doing it purely out of love for the super sky blues. If the compensation is deferred it would also explain why Fisher says he hasn't taken a penny out of the club since 2015. Technically that statement would be true but ethically it would be extremely misleading.
Next time the accounts come out it will be interesting to compare the net income with net operating cash flows. If the theory is correct we will see positive operating cash flows and negative net income. BTW - this doesn't necessarily imply fraud, although I wouldn't rule that out either.
Next time the accounts come out it will be interesting to compare the net income with net operating cash flows. If the theory is correct we will see positive operating cash flows and negative net income. BTW - this doesn't necessarily imply fraud, although I wouldn't rule that out either.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
Ok, genius. How do you suggest the CT do that? Rock up to Ryton and demand to see the books?
Your relentless obsession with the CT is embarrassing.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Well I noticed that an item entitled 'other pension costs' jumped from £19.5K in 2014 to £337.5K in the 2015 accounts, why?
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
Yes, I noticed that as well, which is the reason for my skepticism.
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
So in 14/15 we had 309 employees, other than players and coaches, that seems a lot
what do they all do, most of them would be part time I guess Stewards etc.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Attachments
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
Cheers. Anyone know what a steward earns per match.
I would have guessed about £60 - £90 but don't know.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
4 or 5 hours at minimum wage I suspect
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
£8/hr for about 4-5 hrs, so something like £40. (£8/hr from a Wasps advert)
But how many per match, I guess it ain't 289 every match, more like 150 max.
So that adds up to £40x150stewartsx30matches = £180K, shall we call it £250K absolute tops.
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
So at £50 each per game over 30 games, that's roughly £400.000 per season.