Would you get an ST next season if ...... (27 Viewers)

[Great_Expectations]

Out with of interested is there any fans that have Nuneaton as there second team as there local non league side.... a question for them.
Is Nuneaton's ground up to league standard? And could the pitch actually hold up to play 2 teams home games and the rugby team too?
Look at a state of the art pitch at the Ricoh and how with a good full time grounds team working on it, look how that cuts up.
How is a "traditional" pitch realistically gonna hold up to 3 teams playing on it.

I've played on it quite a few times, I personally don't think it can support two football teams (that's circa 50/60 games a season inc cups/friendlies etc), and a rugby team. Plus youth games too.

To be fair, I don't think too many pitches would.

 

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[torchomatic]

What totally fucks me off is Wasps are getting an easy ride.

If SISU stop the legal action and put in a PR savvy negotiating team there's a chance of a decent deal for the club. The last thing Wasps need is bad PR and CCFC's team could exploit this.

Protests with the intensity shown by SOME of our fans at Northampton but now outside the Ricoh when Wasps play, confrontation football types getting in the faces of their posh and fickle Warwickshire fans is Wasps worst night mare.

They always have had an easy ride. They always have been ignored. If anyone has even dared have a go at them they have been shot down and told to write out "I must not blame Wasps for anything" 100 hundred times on the blackboard. There is apparently only one entity that can be blamed for the tragic situation we find ourselves in.

 

[stupot07]

Heard a rumour yesterday, they they are going to start changing the seats in the summer.

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[Esoterica]

Maybe they'll leave the 4000 we will need for next season in sky blue.

 

[Steve.B50]

This was to be our last season in the city of Coventry for many a year?

I know there has been a 'will you get a season ticket next year' thread and many said they definitely wouldn't renew, but just wondered if the goalposts move for you if you understood that this would be our last season here? Kicked out by Wasps, having to groundshare again the year after.

I think it would definitely effect my thinking. I have pretty much said I think I probably will renew again next season, but I most definitely would if I thought this was our last season in the city and faced the prospect of a far away groundshare.

Would it change your thinking?

No, am out next season.
Will go to the odd game at home if a protest is planned but no ST for me.
Away games only and Cov Rugby on other days.

 

[dongonzalos]

Depends if they are worried about the outcome of Jr2 if everything is as it should be then there is no reason to not renew our tenure

There are no guarantees with anything in life. If there was a mistake that's the council's doing not Wasps. All Wasps will be worried about is if SISU surprises us all and win. An unlikely remedy available to the judge is to the reverse the decision made by the Council. If that happened, that would adversely affect Wasps' business.
At the same time you are facing that threat, even if you were 90% certain it wouldn't come to that. In order to manage the risk, when the person who causing that risk needs something from you. You must admit you would be a pretty poor business person if you didn't say 'yep I will do business with you, once you drop that action that is causing a risk to my business.'

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

No I'm done after this season I don't enjoy it and only go to see friends, will try to get to the odd away game. It's not me I'm that bothered about I saw the cup win and hopefully this years event and some exciting football, it's my two boys who are 2 and 5 who are they going to follow and will they just become armchair fans of Chelsea or others?

Thank you Fisher,Sisu and all the other guilty idiots

 

[Warwickhunt]

There are no guarantees with everything in life. If there was a mistake that's the council's doing not Wasps. All Wasps will be worried about is if SISU surprises us all and win. An unlikely remedy available to the judge is to the reverse the decision made by the Council. If that happened, that would adversely affect Wasps' business.
At the same time you are facing that threat, even if you were 90% certain it wouldn't come to that. In order to manage the risk, when the person who causing that risk needs something from you. You must admit you would be a pretty poor business person if you didn't say 'yep I will do business with you, once you drop that action that is causing a risk to my business.'

Totally agree with you I would'nt deal with them either I even made sure my pension fund had no dealing with them as well
T

 

[Old Warwickshire lad]

They're taking the right stance, if my tenant was trying to take me to court, then why on Earth would I agree to an extension on the lease when it runs out? I'd kick the cheeky fucker out..

first chance I got

 

[stupot07]

There are no guarantees with everything in life. If there was a mistake that's the council's doing not Wasps. All Wasps will be worried about is if SISU surprises us all and win. An unlikely remedy available to the judge is to the reverse the decision made by the Council. If that happened, that would adversely affect Wasps' business.
At the same time you are facing that threat, even if you were 90% certain it wouldn't come to that. In order to manage the risk, when the person who causing that risk needs something from you. You must admit you would be a pretty poor business person if you didn't say 'yep I will do business with you, once you drop that action that is causing a risk to my business.'

There is 0% chance the courts will reverse the decision made by the council.

The only outcome if sisu win is the council get a slap on the wrist and a fine. Then sisu will sue the council for damages.

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[skybluebeduff]

So if you personally were pulling the strings at wasps you would kick ccfc out?

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It's SISU taking Wasps to court isn't it? The owners of CCFC, do we have a choice ffs?

 

[stupot07]

It's SISU taking Wasps to court isn't it?

No its sisu talking the council to court.

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[skybluebeduff]

No its sisu talking the council to court.

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Which effects Wasps and CCFC, both effectively on opposite sides of the court battle...

 

[oldskyblue58]

There are no guarantees with everything in life. If there was a mistake that's the council's doing not Wasps. All Wasps will be worried about is if SISU surprises us all and win. An unlikely remedy available to the judge is to the reverse the decision made by the Council. If that happened, that would adversely affect Wasps' business.
At the same time you are facing that threat, even if you were 90% certain it wouldn't come to that. In order to manage the risk, when the person who causing that risk needs something from you. You must admit you would be a pretty poor business person if you didn't say 'yep I will do business with you, once you drop that action that is causing a risk to my business.'

But the jr2 only covers the council shares so wasps remain with the 50% they got off the charity and would have a say in who has the other 50%.

The best I think Sisu would get if they would be the judge telling Council to look at the disposal again so it complies with what he decides.

Sisu might well make a claim if they win but what about the one wasps could make not to mention a potential one from the charity.

It could get very very messy and take years to sort out........... and the implications for Ccfc are not great as it means Sisu stay in all probability

Still think the chances of Sisu winning is remote which might explain why jr2 hasn't progressed very far as yet

 

[steve82]

......... only if Russell Slade is reinstated!!!!

 

[rob9872]

When you have a relative dying in a hospice you know you're only going through the motions and a sense of responsibility wanting them to be put out of their misery. You go out of guilt and perhaps not as often as you should but still want to be there to say goodbye.

 

[chiefdave]

It is a negotiating position by Wasps nothing more imo. It puts pressure on Fisher & SISU to make a decision

And perfectly illustrates what an easy ride Wasps get. Imagine if it was SISU acting that way, people would be up in arms.

 

[oldskyblue58]

And perfectly illustrates what an easy ride Wasps get. Imagine if it was SISU acting that way, people would be up in arms.

What has Sisu got that could actually place them in such a position of control? That Ccfc fans could get behind? I can't think of much. The reaction to wasps in large part due to how the fans been ground down and being totally powerless to change it, everyone is tired of the whole saga. Look at how listless the discussions on here are nowadays. At the moment even Sisu are arguably getting an easier time people have given up or focussed on wembley

In 9 years they and their appointed ccfc directors have taken plenty of "negotiating" positions sadly very few (any?) have been with prime purpose of benefiting Ccfc. Not up to wasps to take a position to benefit Ccfc foremost.

Have no problem with any sports team taking a negotiating position so long as it has purpose that benefits the sports team and there is a resolution to it. That's the purpose of a business discussion isn't it...... and I have no problem with Ccfc doing it. Trouble is resolution Sisu style doesn't happen unless entirely on their terms and the driver is not Ccfc but the investors needs

 

[KarmicChris]

No chance would it change my mind. Why should it? Given enough of my time and money there. Ricoh, Sixfields, wherever. I'm not going until the ownership either changes completely, or change their business plan to put money where it needs to go.

 

[Harrison Cov]

Out with of interested is there any fans that have Nuneaton as there second team as there local non league side.... a question for them.
Is Nuneaton's ground up to league standard? And could the pitch actually hold up to play 2 teams home games and the rugby team too?
Look at a state of the art pitch at the Ricoh and how with a good full time grounds team working on it, look how that cuts up.
How is a "traditional" pitch realistically gonna hold up to 3 teams playing on it.

Nuneaton would be a difficult one, the ground is nowhere near good enough for league two standard. Coventry explored that idea before and sighted the problems of A) The ground isn't up to scratch and would cost the club a fortune to upgrade. B) It's difficult area to expand due to the surrounding areas. C) Unhappy residents near by. Also now there's another problem that's with the local rugby club, as everyone as heard the rugby club are being awkward on the parts of land they own and are blocking certain exits with skips, which is currently reducing the capacity there. There also is the issue of some Boro fans not taking kindly to Cov fans coming on their patch. If Boro were still at the old Manor Park then I don't think there would have been so many issues.

Isn't Rugby Town being considered? a slightly bigger capacity?

 

[dongonzalos]

But the jr2 only covers the council shares so wasps remain with the 50% they got off the charity and would have a say in who has the other 50%.

The best I think Sisu would get if they would be the judge telling Council to look at the disposal again so it complies with what he decides.

Sisu might well make a claim if they win but what about the one wasps could make not to mention a potential one from the charity.

It could get very very messy and take years to sort out........... and the implications for Ccfc are not great as it means Sisu stay in all probability

Still think the chances of Sisu winning is remote which might explain why jr2 hasn't progressed very far as yet

Does JR2 not have an issue with the the decision to extend the lease to 250 years?
If the judge finds the lease extension should not have happened at that price.
Is it not in the judges power as a remedy option to have that decision reversed and the lease reverted to the original time frame at point of sale.
With SISU also separately taking legal action for compensation?

 

[chiefdave]

Does JR2 not have an issue with the the decision to extend the lease to 250 years?
If the judge finds the lease extension should not have happened at that price.
Is it not in the judges power as a remedy option to have that decision reversed and the lease reverted to the original time frame at point of sale.
With SISU also separately taking legal action for compensation?

Interesting thought. The council will have to argue the lease extension was a separate deal to the ACL sale. While the ACL is far too complicated to undo the lease extension could be reversed very easily. CCC give Wasps their £1m back and the lease reverts to the remaining 40 years of the original lease.

That would put Wasps in a very tricky situation with their bonds as they are secured against the lease. The value of that would surely drop massively

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Wasps stance is to insist on a long term deal which is clearly in their interests looking at their own financial position.

What is long term?
Come on G you know we have no other option we will not build our own, moving away will close us down so why not if the price is right.

 

[dongonzalos]

Interesting thought. The council will have to argue the lease extension was a separate deal to the ACL sale. While the ACL is far too complicated to undo the lease extension could be reversed very easily. CCC give Wasps their £1m back and the lease reverts to the remaining 40 years of the original lease.

That would put Wasps in a very tricky situation with their bonds as they are secured against the lease. The value of that would surely drop massively

That's the threat I assumed Wasps perceived hence the 'unofficial' ultimatum and why I don't think Wasps will back down over negotiations until the legal action is over.
Personally I can't see it happening for a multitude of reasons. Number one that I can't see SISU winning. However in terms of risk management that's why I perceive Wasps are taking the stance they are taking as oppose to it just been a negotiating tactic.

 

[AndreasB]

No. It's fucking not like that at all . What a fucking awful metaphor.

When you have a relative dying in a hospice you know you're only going through the motions and a sense of responsibility wanting them to be put out of their misery. You go out of guilt and perhaps not as often as you should but still want to be there to say goodbye.

 

[dongonzalos]

And perfectly illustrates what an easy ride Wasps get. Imagine if it was SISU acting that way, people would be up in arms.

SISU have done on numerous occasions some were up in arms as we knew it wasn't going to work and the club was going to end up getting hurt in the end. SISU's priority isn't the club so they were prepared to take those risks.
Others wholeheartedly supported their stance on withholding rent, moving the club away, not agreeing rent deals and were in fact encouraging them to do more. Those people wrongly believed it would benefit the club in the end and we would get ACL for nothing it did us insurmountable damage instead.

 

[rob9872]

No. It's fucking not like that at all . What a fucking awful metaphor.

Well I didn't ask your opinion so fuck you too!

 

[Otis]

Will Robins taking over the managerial reins make any difference to renewing for anyone?

 

[scottccfc]

Not for me perversely I'm looking forward to next season that little bit more.

 

[dongonzalos]

There is 0% chance the courts will reverse the decision made by the council.

The only outcome if sisu win is the council get a slap on the wrist and a fine. Then sisu will sue the council for damages.

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I believe similar as well. I think it is very unlikely.
However hedge funds employ risk mangers, Tim Fisher used to be one. It isn't 0%, it would be 0% if it was not an option to the judge to reverse the lease extension.
So whilst it's a 1-10% chance, it's a real risk that exists. With catastrophic implications for Wasps.
The risk managers for Moonstone (whatever they are called). Will have been made aware of this and other possible outcomes of JR2 by the commercial lawyers.
They will be trying to mitigate the risk and plan for what action to take if it happens.
As it happens the cause of the problem also needs something from Wasps.
So now they have an angle to play to completely mitigate the risk.
You stick with this legal action you can go and play in front of 500 fans in Northampton or wherever.
You really think they wouldn't play that card?

 

[dongonzalos]

Will Robins taking over the managerial reins make any difference to renewing for anyone?

Yes anyone who bleeds blue automatically gets my backing

 

[stupot07]

Interesting thought. The council will have to argue the lease extension was a separate deal to the ACL sale. While the ACL is far too complicated to undo the lease extension could be reversed very easily. CCC give Wasps their £1m back and the lease reverts to the remaining 40 years of the original lease.

That would put Wasps in a very tricky situation with their bonds as they are secured against the lease. The value of that would surely drop massively

I don't believe thats an option either. Too much time has moved on since that decision, and it wouldn't be in the public interest, given the bonds are intrinsically linked to the lease.

I maintain, the worst that will happen is the council gets a fine.

I suspect wasps already know this, they would gone through it all with a fine tooth comb when doing due diligence, but its a handy excuse to use, given everyone hates sisu.

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[dongonzalos]

I don't believe thats an option either. Too much time has moved on since that decision, and it wouldn't be in the public interest, given the bonds are intrinsically linked to the lease.

I maintain, the worst that will happen is the council gets a fine.

I suspect wasps already know this, but its a handy excuse to use, given everyone hates sisu.

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Well I am sure Wasps will sleep easy at night and won't perceive any risk to their £35 million. As long as you maintain that the option the judge has as a remedy of reverting the lease length to 40 years , won't be utilised by the judge.
Why on earth would Wasps not try and stop this risk as source if they have the option to use our future at the Ricoh as an angle. They would be very very poor business people if they didn't. If I had money invested in the hedge fund who owns Wasps. I would be totally peeved off if they didn't use their position as Landlord to protect my investment against any such risk.

 

[stupot07]

Well I am sure Wasps will sleep easy at night and won't perceive any risk to their £35 million. As long as you maintain that the option the judge has as a remedy of reverting the lease length to 40 years , won't be utilised by the judge.
Why on earth would Wasps not try and stop this risk as source if they have the option to use our future at the Ricoh as an angle. They would be very very poor business people if they didn't. If I had money invested in the hedge fund who owns Wasps. I would be totally peeved off if they didn't use their position as Landlord to protect my investment against any such risk.

I'm sure they are sleeping safe and sound.

Keep on fighting wasps battles for them if you wish.

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[letsallsingtogether]

Why is he legal point bullshit?
Do you think Wasps would prefer that the legal action stopped?
They have something to hold against us to try and achieve that, you think very lowly of them do you not think they are capable of subtly blackmailing us?
Why do you think they will agree a short term deal?

Your right but it is all of our own doing they obviously run a better fund then our owners.
They put their money in into the right places.
Ours put nothing in and expect everything when they don't get it we go crying to the court's.
Who would do buisiness with a untrustworthy company like that.
And it is not just our football club they do this to look it up it's all out there, one case after another.
But some will still deny it.