After training tomorrow... (14 Viewers)

[CovBurty]

Really? Did he mention any of the young players in particular?

None of them have played massive amounts of football. Ben Stevenson for example has started 23 games, I wouldn't say that's an awful lot for a 19 year old touted to be worth Millions.

Jodi Jones has started 10 games. That is 4 less than the old boy Nathan Clarke.

If the young players really are "burning out" I'd say its a lot to do with fitness and management of them. Same with "losing" mentality, any person being played to play a sport should be ashamed to have one of those, you get Sunday league teams who get dicked 10-0 week in week out who show more fight and passion.

Poor 19 year old footballer who has had to play over 20 games, there are 16 year olds who play Saturday's and Sundays who then go to work all week and train in the evenings. There are probably 40 year olds who do it too, they won't have access to physios, nutritionists, sports scientists etc either.

You say this from experience of playing football at this level. Former player?

 

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[CovBurty]

What's that got to do with fitness levels of players?

You do realise if you say something on one topic, then it gets pointed out as nonsense, it isn't a reply to then just pick something else to go on about that's not related. You may as well just say "yes, but today is Monday isn't it".

How have the players burnt out due to the cup run like you keep saying, and not because they are just unfit / training etc?

Sorry had a bit of lunch. Seems the last comment confirms my view. Even Robins says players are tired/ jaded. Not just Mickey Mouse Cup games just the whole season.

 

[Nick]

You say this from experience of playing football at this level. Former player?

No I say it from common sense.

Which players in particular are so tired and why? I guess the fact they aren't fit enough doesn't help.

 

[CovBurty]

If you speak with Robins (which I have) he will tell you that the young players are jaded and have played to much football in the last 18 months. Also, they have adopted a losing mentality which compounds the problem. The young players (both contracted and loaned) have had to play as recent managers (Slade and Venus) have all had to take the short term view.
Fitness and training is nothing to do with tiredness in teenagers. Their bodies are still growing and need lots of rest.
Thee young players should not have been put in this position. All boils down to the recruitment last summer.
Blame TM or blame SISU for not providing funds but that is the real issue.

Thanks for that comment. Nick needs educating

 

[CovBurty]

No I say it from common sense.

Which players in particular are so tired and why? I guess the fact they aren't fit enough doesn't help.

You're going in circles mate. Collectively

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Find me a £70k a year job where you don't work 50 hour weeks minimum as standard.

(MP doesn't count )

The amount of time Grenduffy spends on here during the week supposedly earning 100k.p.a.

 

[Nick]

You're going in circles mate. Collectively

What circle is that then? That it's not an excuse?

I can understand if we are talking players who have done 40 - 50 games are tired, but 19-20 year olds making 20 or so starts? Pro athletes?

Thats up to now as well, it isn't going back the 10 games at least where they have looked "tired".

Using their age and that they are growing and tired etc is a poor excuse.

 

[Otis]

The amount of time Grenduffy spends on here during the week supposedly earning 100k.p.a.

I earn 100k too.

Just takes me 10 years to get there that's all.

 

[CovBurty]

What circle is that then? That it's not an excuse?

I can understand if we are talking players who have done 40 - 50 games are tired, but 19-20 year olds making 20 or so starts? Pro athletes?

Thats up to now as well, it isn't going back the 10 games at least where they have looked "tired".

Find a sports scientist. Loads of studies done. Our current situation is not helped by a dependence of too many young players. Same happened with our last relegation, ask Andy Thorn. You would thought Fisher would've learnt from that mess.

 

[Nick]

Find a sports scientist. Loads of studies done. Our current situation is not helped by a dependence of too many young players. Same happened with our last relegation, ask Andy Thorn. You would thought Fisher would've learnt from that mess.

Studies about what? Young players not being able to play 20 games a season because they are too tired?

You are making out all of our team are toddlers, isn't Jones the youngest player? Age isn't much of an excuse for being tired.

It's the general attitude of players rather than their fitness, if the 20 year olds really wanted to be footballers then they could look at 20 year olds who have played most games league and cup and still want to win games like it would kill them to lose.

 

[fernandopartridge]

If you speak with Robins (which I have) he will tell you that the young players are jaded and have played to much football in the last 18 months. Also, they have adopted a losing mentality which compounds the problem. The young players (both contracted and loaned) have had to play as recent managers (Slade and Venus) have all had to take the short term view.
Fitness and training is nothing to do with tiredness in teenagers. Their bodies are still growing and need lots of rest.
Thee young players should not have been put in this position. All boils down to the recruitment last summer.
Blame TM or blame SISU for not providing funds but that is the real issue.

I would suggest they're mentally tired rather than physically tired, bearing the scars now of a team that has been in relegation form for 15 months!

 

[CovBurty]

Studies about what? Young players not being able to play 20 games a season because they are too tired?

You are making out all of our team are toddlers, isn't Jones the youngest player? Age isn't much of an excuse for being tired.

It's the general attitude of players rather than their fitness, if the 20 year olds really wanted to be footballers then they could look at 20 year olds who have played most games league and cup and still want to win games like it would kill them to lose.

You have worn me out. You just can't see through the mist clearly enough. So continue to talk soon. Good chatting, time for work again. Ta

 

[Nick]

You have worn me out. You just can't see through the mist clearly enough. So continue to talk soon. Good chatting, time for work again. Ta

No, I can just see that saying a 19 or 20 year old is still growing isn't an excuse for them being "tired" after 20 or so games. Poor little lambs.

 

[CovBurty]

I would suggest they're mentally tired rather than physically tired, bearing the scars now of a team that has been in relegation form for 15 months!

Yes they are, but a mixture of both. In 'normal' football teams kids would be brought into teams slowly and a few starts. At this club they are in. Jodi Jones is treated in a more balanced way. Even now Mr. Fisher has recognised our heavy reliance on kids. 2 relegations too late. You win nothing with kids. Why say this?

 

[shmmeee]

Can't be arsed to copy and format it, but go look at the Man Utd 95/96 squad and see how many games their kids played in one season. And that was without the last 20 years of sports science behind them.

Tired my arse.

 

[CovBurty]

Can't be arsed to copy and format it, but go look at the Man Utd 95/96 squad and see how many games their kids played in one season. And that was without the last 20 years of sports science behind them.

Tired my arse.

Don't forget to add in quality into the equation. No upset ment by this one. Our lot are not Man Utd standard by a long stretch. Sorry lads.

 

[shmmeee]

Don't forget to add in quality into the equation. No upset ment by this one. Our lot are not Man Utd standard by a long stretch. Sorry lads.

Surely fitness is separate from quality though? A shit player can be the fittest on the pitch.

 

[SkyBlueBlood]

How many times have we heard from a new manager that the team arent fit enough. Puts the blame on the previous manager(s). What he means is dont judge me on the rubbish i have inherited see how we start next season. I dont have a problem with that but just wish people would say what they mean.

Sent from my EVA-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[Nick]

Don't forget to add in quality into the equation. No upset ment by this one. Our lot are not Man Utd standard by a long stretch. Sorry lads.

We are talking fitness / tiredness here and the "growing bodies".

 

[CovBurty]

Surely fitness is separate from quality though? A shit player can be the fittest on the pitch.

That's true. Reminds me of Paul Telfer.

 

[Grendel]

Start with both goalies Burge and Cook. Stevenson, Willis. Haynes. Thomas. All tiring. What do you think? Don't believe players get fatigued from too many games?

Lee Burge is the same age as Westwood when he signed for us and had already played 100 games.

Willis has been a pro for years. Haynes is 22 this year the same age as another player whose agent was bitching and moaning he wasn't playing enough games.

Last years two most successful players fall into the age group as well. Armstrong has played 22 championship games this season and Murphy 34 games. I suggest you get hold of child help line and report Barnsley and Norwich for their child slavery crimes.

 

[CovBurty]

Lee Burge is the same age as Westwood when he signed for us and had already played 100 games.

Willis has been a pro for years. Haynes is 22 this year the same age as another player whose agent was bitching and moaning he wasn't playing enough games.

Last years two most successful players fall into the age group as well. Armstrong has played 22 championship games this season and Murphy 34 games. I suggest you get hold of child help line and report Barnsley and Norwich for their child slavery crimes.

Strange then after Xmas both Murphy and Armstrong seemed tired, lacked fight or pace. Many fans wondered why. Burn out?

 

[CovBurty]

Strange then after Xmas both Murphy and Armstrong seemed tired, lacked fight or pace. Many fans wondered why. Burn out?

Additionally I added a further question of quality levels. If you are in a team that can pass, rather than give the ball away. You work less in a game. Let the ball do the work, kinda thing. We are constantly chasing the game using more energy. Better teams with kid less burn out. Less quality more running. You get me.

 

[CovBurty]

Surely fitness is separate from quality though? A shit player can be the fittest on the pitch.

Much like Telfer are current team give away ball to oppo constantly. Like Telf we are always chasing balls. More possession of the ball less work trying to retrieve. At least Telfer used to get most of his way word passes back. This lot it ends up in our goal. Constant work chasing.

 

[lifeskyblue]

I'm afraid I don't believe in the resting of youngsters but I do believe our lot have a losing mentality. I think it is 20 years since Hanson made his 'you won't win anything with kids' speech. Of course giggs, beckham, the nevilles, scholes, butt et al (all as young or younger than our current crop) went on to claim the league title and represent their countries. Not jaded...just successful.


PUSB

 

[Grendel]

Additionally I added a further question of quality levels. If you are in a team that can pass, rather than give the ball away. You work less in a game. Let the ball do the work, kinda thing. We are constantly chasing the game using more energy. Better teams with kid less burn out. Less quality more running. You get me.

Not really no. I'd expect the likes of Haynes, Willis to be considered as first team contenders every game or they are surplus to requirements.

Mentioning Burge at 24?

Stevenson has hardly featured since the turn of the year and Jones even less so.

 

[stevefloyd]

Yes they will have a few more Pukka pies and a tub of lard.

Hey where are they getting the pies from?

 

[stevefloyd]

I earn 100k too.

Just takes me 10 years to get there that's all.

Show off it takes me twenty...mind you I do go on a lot of holidays

 

[bawtryneal]

No, I can just see that saying a 19 or 20 year old is still growing isn't an excuse for them being "tired" after 20 or so games. Poor little lambs.

Have you considered all the U23/U21 games they have also played.
Have you also considered that training with the first team of hardened players (whether they are crap players or not is not the point) who have been through many pre seasons takes its toll.
Have you ever played a game of football at a decent level.
How much they earn is irrelevant to their body physics.

 

[bawtryneal]

Lee Burge is the same age as Westwood when he signed for us and had already played 100 games.

Willis has been a pro for years. Haynes is 22 this year the same age as another player whose agent was bitching and moaning he wasn't playing enough games.

Last years two most successful players fall into the age group as well. Armstrong has played 22 championship games this season and Murphy 34 games. I suggest you get hold of child help line and report Barnsley and Norwich for their child slavery crimes.

Armstrong form has dipped alarmingly at Barnsley over last few weeks. Also, as you say, he has played 22 games. Rested/injured for 14/15 games due to worn out.

 

[bawtryneal]

The amount of time Grenduffy spends on here during the week supposedly earning 100k.p.a.

Only 100k, not worth getting out of bed for.

 

[CovBurty]

I'm afraid I don't believe in the resting of youngsters but I do believe our lot have a losing mentality. I think it is 20 years since Hanson made his 'you won't win anything with kids' speech. Of course giggs, beckham, the nevilles, scholes, butt et al (all as young or younger than our current crop) went on to claim the league title and represent their countries. Not jaded...just successful.


PUSB

Playing with quality players and a quality manager can work with kids. Not in the lower league it doesn't. As we can see here. Less quality with lesser managers. Anyways there will always be an exception to the rule