Shooting reported outside Houses of Parliament (23 Viewers)

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

I have to say actually, the response on here has been quite commendable.

No nonsense, not a lot of denial, and no hate. Just straight forward healthy debate.

I know people have some different opinions (me included) but they've been put across very well.

Hats off SBT, and R.I.P once again to the victims of yesterday.

 

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[Moff]

I doubt there has ever been a poll of anything on that scale for anything. Can't just dismiss the results because you disagree

...onwards & upwards PUSB

So first you say the most recent poll of Police Officers said they didn't want to be routinely armed, I point out there hasn't been one, and now you say there hasn't been a poll on anything of that scale for anything. Well apart from the poll of all officers on industrial action a few years ago. If you did some research you might have discovered it is possible.

What results exactly are being dismissed? as I see it you cant dismiss a poll result if there's never been a poll.

 

[Grendel]

colour unfortuntley does matter to lowlifes. the guy who did the attack yesterday was a brit. the person who killed jo cox was a brit. the reaction to both hugely different though.

The outrage against the killing of an Mp will always cause outrage as would the killing and beheading of a soldier. Not really sure the point you are making.

 

[martcov]

The outrage against the killing of an Mp will always cause outrage as would the killing and beheading of a soldier. Not really sure the point you are making.

Tommy Robinson wasn't outraged by the killing of an MP - an attack on our democratic system built over hundreds of years by mainly Christian people believing in a just society.

 

[Grendel]

Tommy Robinson wasn't outraged by the killing of an MP - an attack on our democratic system built over hundreds of years by mainly Christian people believing in a just society.

While Abu Hansa actively cheered the beheading so again I struggle with the point being made.

 

[rob9872]

Tommy Robinson and Abu Hamza.

Even Adam Johnson fits into the spectrum of being a good egg if we are we are only using those morons as a moral compass.

 

[martcov]

While Abu Hansa actively cheered the beheading so again I struggle with the point being made.

Two attacks against our democratic values. 1. murder of MP 2. attack on parliament and area of parliament. Lots of outrage from the extreme right where a Muslim is involved. Not so much from the extreme right when a remainer MP was murdered. Although our values that were attacked need defending by all of us - whoever the attacker is.

 

[Johnnythespider]

To be fair yesterday was a lot worse than the Jo Cox attack.

Not to her family it wasn't

 

[SkyblueSpecial]

Not to her family it wasn't

1 family as opposed to 4.

 

[Grendel]

Two attacks against our democratic values. 1. murder of MP 2. attack on parliament and area of parliament. Lots of outrage from the extreme right where a Muslim is involved. Not so much from the extreme right when a remainer MP was murdered. Although our values that were attacked need defending by all of us - whoever the attacker is.

You seem to have an obsession with the far right. Extremists are by definition off the scale and their views are extreme.

I'd never even heard of Tommy Robinson until SBT Twitter gate and wasn't aware such views are still in existence. As wouldn't most people as they are a tiny minority.

The soldier was killed by drug addled lunatics and the politician was killed by a delusional dangerous man. I genuinely find it offensive to suggest (as some have) that Brexit somehow encouraged him to kill (which I think is where this is going) he was clearly a highly disturbed man

 

[SkyblueSpecial]

they are misguided or downright evil. doesnt change the fact that muslim people die everyday at hands of west. their hate comes from this.

Most muslims in the Middle East are killed by other Muslims. The amount killed by western forces pales into insignificance in comparison.

We are not responsible for the overwhelming majority of Middle East killings.

 

[SkyblueSpecial]

You seem to have an obsession with the far right. Extremists are by definition off the scale and their views are extreme.

I'd never even heard of Tommy Robinson until SBT Twitter gate and wasn't aware such views are still in existence. As wouldn't most people as they are a tiny minority.

The soldier was killed by drug addled lunatics and the politician was killed by a delusional dangerous man. I genuinely find it offensive to suggest (as some have) that Brexit somehow encouraged him to kill (which I think is where this is going) he was clearly a highly disturbed man

The far right try to exploit events such as yesterday.

Some in the remain campaign (Jack Straws son for instance) tried to exploit Jo Cox's death.

 

[martcov]

You seem to have an obsession with the far right. Extremists are by definition off the scale and their views are extreme.

I'd never even heard of Tommy Robinson until SBT Twitter gate and wasn't aware such views are still in existence. As wouldn't most people as they are a tiny minority.

The soldier was killed by drug addled lunatics and the politician was killed by a delusional dangerous man. I genuinely find it offensive to suggest (as some have) that Brexit somehow encouraged him to kill (which I think is where this is going) he was clearly a highly disturbed man

I would say that I am not obsessed, but certainly worried by the way the world seems to be going. The fascist Erdogan calling the Germans Nazis. Trump employing a literate version of Tommy Robinson as chief strategist and leting him sit on the national security council. Those are just 2 examples without mentioning AfD here in Germany.

 

[Gazolba]

ISIS is not targeting Western Europe because of anything we or our allies have done or are doing in the MIddle East. If you read the Koran, it clearly says it is a Muslim's duty to kill all infidels. Radical Islamists hate us and our way of life and want to kill us all. They want to kill you and kill me. They'd like to behead us all, men, women and children and wouldn't think twice about it. They want to install fundamentalist Islam as the World's only religion and eliminate anyone who refuses to submit. Once we realize this and take it seriously, we can begin to combat it.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

To be fair yesterday was a lot worse than the Jo Cox attack.

Not to Jo Cox's family

...onwards & upwards PUSB

 

[SkyblueSpecial]

Not to Jo Cox's family

...onwards & upwards PUSB

As I said before, 1 family as opposed to 4.

 

[ccfc92]

ISIS is not targeting Western Europe because of anything we or our allies have done or are doing in the MIddle East. If you read the Koran, it clearly says it is a Muslim's duty to kill all infidels. Radical Islamists hate us and our way of life and want to kill us all. They want to kill you and kill me. They'd like to behead us all, men, women and children and wouldn't think twice about it. They want to install fundamentalist Islam as the World's only religion and eliminate anyone who refuses to submit. Once we realize this and take it seriously, we can begin to combat it.

I'd say that's pretty much spot on.

Normal, reasonable Muslims worship their faith, and attempt to convert others, like any other religion. They don't start killing people if they refuse though.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

So first you say the most recent poll of Police Officers said they didn't want to be routinely armed, I point out there hasn't been one, and now you say there hasn't been a poll on anything of that scale for anything. Well apart from the poll of all officers on industrial action a few years ago. If you did some research you might have discovered it is possible.

What results exactly are being dismissed? as I see it you cant dismiss a poll result if there's never been a poll.

1. I said "thought the most recent poll suggested"
2. You said "There has never been a poll of all officers"...now you're saying there has - all be it on industrial action
3. Although the poll you refer to was "all officers" I bet not ALL voted
4. The poll I am referring to was after some other 'event' that left an officer dead or maimed

I think neither you nor I know for sure. But I do personally know quite well several (9 now I counted them) ex & current officers that are against all Police being armed & I know 2 armed response officers who logically are in favour of being armed (though not necessarily for ALL of them to be).

So I am not sure that if all officers were given the option to be armed that even 1/3 would take it up. They all have the option to apply for armed duties - don't hear anything about it being generally more desirable than a motorway traffic cop.

...onwards & upwards PUSB

 

[SkyblueBazza]

As I said before, 1 family as opposed to 4.

Yeah I never read that far before posting.

If that is how you measure worse that's fine.

...onwards & upwards PUSB

 

[martcov]

ISIS is not targeting Western Europe because of anything we or our allies have done or are doing in the MIddle East. If you read the Koran, it clearly says it is a Muslim's duty to kill all infidels. Radical Islamists hate us and our way of life and want to kill us all. They want to kill you and kill me. They'd like to behead us all, men, women and children and wouldn't think twice about it. They want to install fundamentalist Islam as the World's only religion and eliminate anyone who refuses to submit. Once we realize this and take it seriously, we can begin to combat it.

ISIS are bastards. No doubt about it. But the only way to heaven is through Jesus Christ and it is the duty of Christians to spread the gospel. So, if you look at some modern Christian missionaries that turn up in places like Afghanistan and christian aid connected with saving more souls, you will see that Islam is not alone in wanting to convert everyone to the one true religion.

Maybe the Christians are not employing such violence at this time, but they are quite capable of using it as we see from the past.

 

[Moff]

1. I said "thought the most recent poll suggested"
2. You said "There has never been a poll of all officers"...now you're saying there has - all be it on industrial action
3. Although the poll you refer to was "all officers" I bet not ALL voted
4. The poll I am referring to was after some other 'event' that left an officer dead or maimed

I think neither you nor I know for sure. But I do personally know quite well several (9 now I counted them) ex & current officers that are against all Police being armed & I know 2 armed response officers who logically are in favour of being armed (though not necessarily for ALL of them to be).

So I am not sure that if all officers were given the option to be armed that even 1/3 would take it up. They all have the option to apply for armed duties - don't hear anything about it being generally more desirable than a motorway traffic cop.

...onwards & upwards PUSB

You should be in politics with your twisting of the facts.

1) There has never been a poll of officers re routine arming.
2) You suggested there had been a poll of officers re the above. I said there hadn't, there hasn't been. I pointed out there has on another matter after you suggested such a poll would be difficult.
3) Most officers voted in the poll re industrial action. Should we not accept any result of any vote in this country unless 100% vote, or are you just being pedantic to prove your point
4) The poll you are referring to didn't happen, but you keep using it if you wish.

You are right neither you nor I know, but I also know quite a lot of officers in the job and who have left who are all for routine arming. Officers do have an option to apply for armed roles but only if the job comes up, there is only a finite number, which doesn't help if you aren't one and come face to face with someone willing to use deadly force against you.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

ISIS is not targeting Western Europe because of anything we or our allies have done or are doing in the MIddle East. If you read the Koran, it clearly says it is a Muslim's duty to kill all infidels. Radical Islamists hate us and our way of life and want to kill us all. They want to kill you and kill me. They'd like to behead us all, men, women and children and wouldn't think twice about it. They want to install fundamentalist Islam as the World's only religion and eliminate anyone who refuses to submit. Once we realize this and take it seriously, we can begin to combat it.

Once we take this seriously??

 

[SkyblueBazza]

You should be in politics with your twisting of the facts.

1) There has never been a poll of officers re routine arming.
2) You suggested there had been a poll of officers re the above. I said there hadn't, there hasn't been. I pointed out there has on another matter after you suggested such a poll would be difficult.
3) Most officers voted in the poll re industrial action. Should we not accept any result of any vote in this country unless 100% vote, or are you just being pedantic to prove your point
4) The poll you are referring to didn't happen, but you keep using it if you wish.

You are right neither you nor I know, but I also know quite a lot of officers in the job and who have left who are all for routine arming. Officers do have an option to apply for armed roles but only if the job comes up, there is only a finite number, which doesn't help if you aren't one and come face to face with someone willing to use deadly force against you.

If you refer back to my first point the word 'thought' came into it. And lookimg it up & openimg the top story on it (Survey to ask Met police officers if they want to carry firearms) & although a poll has been suggested - it refers to a survey which to save you the trouble showed "A national survey of police officers across England and Wales last year showed that 20% wanted to be routinely issued with a firearm and six out of 10 wanted a Taser"

My guess is that you will use the 6:10, whereas I will argue that most would consider a firearm to mean 'armed'...but let's just beg to differ on that if I'm right or this could become an even more dull exchange

...onwards & upwards PUSB

 

[Moff]

If you refer back to my first point the word 'thought' came into it. And lookimg it up & openimg the top story on it (Survey to ask Met police officers if they want to carry firearms) & although a poll has been suggested - it refers to a survey which to save you the trouble showed "A national survey of police officers across England and Wales last year showed that 20% wanted to be routinely issued with a firearm and six out of 10 wanted a Taser"

My guess is that you will use the 6:10, whereas I will argue that most would consider a firearm to mean 'armed'...but let's just beg to differ on that if I'm right or this could become an even more dull exchange

...onwards & upwards PUSB

Yes let's agree to disagree, its very dull, especially responding to someone who continually changes the parameters of the discussion to suit their argument.

I also full well know that a firearm means armed but thanks for the lame attempt at one upmandhip.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Yes let's agree to disagree, its very dull, especially responding to someone who continually changes the parameters of the discussion to suit their argument.

I also full well know that a firearm means armed but thanks for the lame attempt at one upmandhip.

If you say so

...onwards & upwards PUSB

 

[covcity4life]

just got off the m6 after 2 hours. the crash was horrific, pray the driver survived.

60s earlier and i would have been at the point where accident happened, makes you think. along with westminister attack where people just going about their day it shows just how fragile life is.

 

[Nick]

Panic over, Phillip Schofield has walked over the bridge in tribute. FFS.

 

[shmmeee]

Not a big fan of Simon Jenkins usually, but thought this piece sums up my thoughts on it all pretty well: The overhyped coverage of the Westminster attack will only encourage others | Simon Jenkins

 

[Moff]

If you say so

...onwards & upwards PUSB

I do thanks.

 

[SkyblueSpecial]

Panic over, Phillip Schofield has walked over the bridge in tribute. FFS.

He is so brave.

 

[Macca]

What a grade A cock

At least we have largely avoided the Facebook profile picture "tributes"

 

[dutchman]