Grendel
Well-Known Member
It’s based on the fact that you said voters not members. Interesting Martcov liked your post.
The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (310 Viewers)
- Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
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It’s based on the fact that you said voters not members. Interesting Martcov liked your post.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
...again, based on what? A hunch?
Awaiting your answer to Sick Boy's question...
Grendel
Well-Known Member
With respect it was sick boy who actually stated more labour voters voted to remain and then provided a link with an article on members.
Perhaps first he’d like to withdraw his statement and apologise and you can explain why you blindly liked something that was wrong
Also it took him several hours to respond - with a very lame side swerve - and then you claim I am refusing to answer a question within minutes of it being posted.
Astute
Well-Known Member
YouGov get most elections wrong. Now you expect us to believe this? It all depends on where they ask their questions. And then it depends on thise being truthful.
I don’t know where Sick Boy is or what he is doing, but you are „on air“ now. I think it is both members and voters that voted remain. I also think that the division in the Tory cabinet is helping labour and exit Brexit. The more the leavers like BoJo, Gove and Davis make txts of themselves, and that coupled with the right wing antics of the worm Farage, the more this is looking like the working class has been conned. They thought they were sticking two fingers up at the elite. The elite is making a power grab whilst Brexit is going nowhere near like many leavers thought.
Labour, LibDems and Exit Brexit MPs may yet come together to put their foot on the brake.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Wishful thinking eh?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
I have been at work. Again, what's the basis of your claim?
YouGov | Why people voted Labour or Conservative at the 2017 general election
I'm not sure what I have to apologise for. Still waiting for your opinion of the Snoopers Charter as well, BTW.
Are you also against the Internet and social media? Both are much more intrusive than ID cards.
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Every day some clown says something stupid. One day it is Davis, then BoJo, then Gove and then Farage weighs in praising the Austrian extreme right Party grounded by ( amongst others ) the Nazi Agriculture minister, if he‘s not too busy backing a paedophile together with the likes of Bannon and Palin in the USA, or speaking for a party led by the granddaughter of Hitler‘s finance minister ... you cannot make this up... then there are the Panama papers, the paradise papers....
Brexit associated with far right ambitions...
Now May won’t guarantee the 48 maximum working week... how long before guaranteed paid holidays get questioned ? What about the so called gig economy doing away with these things with fake self employment?
Sooner or later the penny will drop...
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Haha I think you'll be waiting a while for that.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Yeah, it's far better to believe a poster on a football forum. Ffs.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
You’ve done it again. You made a statement that most labour voters voted remain and again provide a link to something that dies t support the comment you made.
It’s your claim not mine. Again Martcov likes a claim with no basis in fact.
Let’s start at the beginning.
What do you class as a labour voter?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
No I haven't. I've posted a link to motivations for voting for either party and it was mostly Cons voters that cited Brexit as a reason for voting.
Not sure what point you're trying to make.
Nice to see you dodge another question that's been asked several times of you as well.
With some it will never drop, but how can anyone not see what is going on? The same in the USA where they will pass a tax bill which increases the national debt in order to help businesses and the rich..
I still think that if things start going bandy here there will be a backlash..
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Sadly we are more likely to see scapegoats blamed instead.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
What has motivation to do with anything? Primary motivation is subjective and has no actual relevance to the choice on referendum.
My point is you said 65% if labour voters voted remain. It’s wrong and Martcov liked it.
You were wrong weren’t you?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
YouGov | How Britain Voted
I'd rather rely on YouGov that your hunches, thanks.
The vote on Britain's membership of the European Union cut across party lines, with significant division within Britain's main political parties. Conservatives voted to Leave, 61% to 39%. Labour voters (65%) and Liberal Democrats (68%) largely voted for Remain but significant minorities went for Leave. Only UKIP, where 95% voted for Leave, and the Greens, where 80% voted for Remain, avoided significant internal divisions on the vote.
Still waiting for your reply about the Snoopers Charter and the Internet. Do you think ID cards are more invasive than these?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Genuinely don’t you understand the difference between members and voters?
Scapegoats are Obama and the EU. Now it’s Trump and here, the Tories. Let’s watch this panning out.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
The other curious thing Sick Boy is that it’s you who claims to be the fair minded liberal. So my views on CCTV cameras are hardly relevant. What is relevant is your claimed no opinion on ID cards. These are considered by Liberty to be an abomination and a move to nazism and state control over an individuals rights,
Your indifference shows actually you are far far right of centre than you claim
Your indifference shows actually you are far far right of centre than you claim
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Hahaha yeah, whatever. I asked you about the Snoopers Charter and the internet, which you bizarrely chose to ignore, both of which intrude on the privacy of the individual a lot more than ID cards
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
The YouGov article is discussing voters (65%).
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Sigh. It’s an article that was lauded in the Gaurdian. It’s members as no poll was taken regarding views of actual voters when leaving the ballot box of any significance.
Over 70% of voters in labour constituencies (I.e labour elected MP’s) voted to leave which makes your correlation impossible.
In all Labour held constituencies 70% of Labour voters voted leave? On average? All constituencies that are labour voted 70% leave? The UK average was 52% of voters of all parties. How was this calculated then?
How many EU countries have ID cards? How many have Nazi tendencies which also have ID cards? Is anyone anywhere in the EU on the streets protesting about identifying people? The biggest complaint here, is that we cannot identify everyone. We’re moving that way with the refugees with public consent after seeing what happens when you can’t identify people. Amri has 17 identities. No one is against ID cards that I know of. People can’t understand how you can have a country without them. What rights do I lose by carrying an ID card? The only people who ask me for mine are banks, hire car companies etc.. Excluding flights of course and the UK border controls,
Theresa May sends Christmas Brexit message to millions of anxious UK citizens living in Europe
Interesting that May claims she is fighting for UK citizens rights in the EU. The EU wanted a guarantee of citizens rights from the start.
I am waiting for my last certificates and then getting German citizenship. I am not relying on strong and stable May. I won’t get a German state pension because I am self employed. I won’t get other benefits either. I have private health and pension. All I want is free movement should I ever move, an EU ID for Schengen countries, and peace of mind, that if Brexit goes really bandy, I still have a right to live and earn my keep here.
Plus my ID fits in my pocket unlike my British Passport. Life is easier when you have identity. It is also harder for people to pass themselves off as me - identify theft.
It is arrogant to criticise people like Merkel for not knowing who is in her country and then claiming ID cards are against your liberty. For Muslims, Roma etc. a good thing, but for some on here an infringement of liberty.
Interesting that May claims she is fighting for UK citizens rights in the EU. The EU wanted a guarantee of citizens rights from the start.
I am waiting for my last certificates and then getting German citizenship. I am not relying on strong and stable May. I won’t get a German state pension because I am self employed. I won’t get other benefits either. I have private health and pension. All I want is free movement should I ever move, an EU ID for Schengen countries, and peace of mind, that if Brexit goes really bandy, I still have a right to live and earn my keep here.
Plus my ID fits in my pocket unlike my British Passport. Life is easier when you have identity. It is also harder for people to pass themselves off as me - identify theft.
It is arrogant to criticise people like Merkel for not knowing who is in her country and then claiming ID cards are against your liberty. For Muslims, Roma etc. a good thing, but for some on here an infringement of liberty.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Dodging questions?
You know that YouGov have been constantly wrong on voting. They even thought that we would vote remain and the Tories would get the majority. There are major problems with the systems they use. But you still think it is a fact when they come out with something.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Hahaha it's priceless, isn't it. Astute seems to think it has legs though so it must be right.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
You clearly underestimate just how much personal data the likes of Facebook collect on you.
Astute
Well-Known Member
How about coming out with something worthwhile for once. Like showing the last time YouGov got an election right. Yet you call their latest numbers as proof.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Which is why you won't find me on Farcebook.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
It's going to be far more accurate than Grendel's claims, which you appear to be believe are more reliable.
Do you really believe that 70% of Labour voters in Labour held constituencies voted leave?