Coventry city centre (3 Viewers)

[Grendel]

House of Fraser closing over 30 stores.

The high street is changing and it is not all about shops anymore.

A retail analyst bloke on the Big Questions on Sunday was predicting that in 10 years time there will be hardly any shops left and the high street needs to evolve and be more about entertainment, eating out and customer service.

Then they will all become wastelands.

There are still many people who enjoy shopping experiences. The stores that have failed have failed for very obvious reasons.

Councils who had foresight developed a flagship store and around it small boutique stores that offer specialist consumer experiences. Many high street chains are growing revenue.

Coventry saddled itself with stores paying huge rents in 1950’s buildings based on Stalinist architecture. Debenhams and M and S will fold as I’m sure at some point will W H Smith.

The nearest example of success to here is touchwood. The indoor complex in Nottingham is similar and footfall in that city centre is huge.

Coventry centre is I suspect at crises point

 

---

[Otis]

Then they will all become wastelands.

There are still many people who enjoy shopping experiences. The stores that have failed have failed for very obvious reasons.

Councils who had foresight developed a flagship store and around it small boutique stores that offer specialist consumer experiences. Many high street chains are growing revenue.

Coventry saddled itself with stores paying huge rents in 1950’s buildings based on Stalinist architecture. Debenhams and M and S will fold as I’m sure at some point will W H Smith.

The nearest example of success to here is touchwood. The indoor complex in Nottingham is similar and footfall in that city centre is huge.

Coventry centre is I suspect at crises point

Totally disagree.

Coventry city centre is beginning to flourish. New places sprouting up everywhere.

Okay, so hardly any shops, but we have had a number of restaurants and cafes and ice cream places. A new trendy cafe is coming and next door to that will be a steak house.

Recently we have had an escape room place open in Broadgate and a climbing wall place in the old Leofric hotel. The is the new water park opening early next year and that will bring 10's of thousands of people into the city centre.

There is an ice-skating and a cinema and another cinema is going to open too in the old Telegraph building.

With all the people coming into the centre there will be shops for sure.

Would say we are on the rise and the complete opposite of being at crisis point.

As I said before, in the city centre south scheme they have some major retail players interested in moving in.

Things are looking a lot rosier than they have for some time.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Then they will all become wastelands.

There are still many people who enjoy shopping experiences. The stores that have failed have failed for very obvious reasons.

Councils who had foresight developed a flagship store and around it small boutique stores that offer specialist consumer experiences. Many high street chains are growing revenue.

Coventry saddled itself with stores paying huge rents in 1950’s buildings based on Stalinist architecture. Debenhams and M and S will fold as I’m sure at some point will W H Smith.

The nearest example of success to here is touchwood. The indoor complex in Nottingham is similar and footfall in that city centre is huge.

Coventry centre is I suspect at crises point

Good point, if you think about the shopping in all of those places compared to Coventry it's a different world.

Touchwood or West Orchards... Not really a hard choice is it!

 

[Otis]

Good point, if you think about the shopping in all of those places compared to Coventry it's a different world.

Touchwood or West Orchards... Not really a hard choice is it!

But like I say, city centres are changing and there is a prediction that the high street could be dead within 10 years.

It needs to evolve into something else.

 

[Grendel]

But like I say, city centres are changing and there is a prediction that the high street could be dead within 10 years.

It needs to evolve into something else.

You are im afraid disillusioned - city centres like coventry will be - how many of the 15 fastest growing centre retail outlets in the uk have a location in Coventry do you think?

 

[Sick Boy]

Totally disagree.

Coventry city centre is beginning to flourish. New places sprouting up everywhere.

Okay, so hardly any shops, but we have had a number of restaurants and cafes and ice cream places. A new trendy cafe is coming and next door to that will be a steak house.

Recently we have had an escape room place open in Broadgate and a climbing wall place in the old Leofric hotel. The is the new water park opening early next year and that will bring 10's of thousands of people into the city centre.

There is an ice-skating and a cinema and another cinema is going to open too in the old Telegraph building.

With all the people coming into the centre there will be shops for sure.

Would say we are on the rise and the complete opposite of being at crisis point.

As I said before, in the city centre south scheme they have some major retail players interested in moving in.

Things are looking a lot rosier than they have for some time.

Ahhh...I do miss the provinces

 

[Otis]

You are im afraid disillusioned - city centres like coventry will be - how many of the 15 fastest growing centre retail outlets in the uk have a location in Coventry do you think?

I can never understand why you hate Coventry with such a passion. You only ever seem to say negative things about it whatever is built, whatever arrives into the city.

Coventry is growing. That is not an opinion, it is fact.

More and more outlets are coming to the city centre. If it draws people in I don't see the problem and even if it didn't have any shops at all, but still drew people in, why is that such a problem to you?

Surely if you want to shop in Solihull, shop in Solihull. No-one is stopping you. If Solihull is the best place to shop, but Coventry is the best place for water parks and restaurants, then why on earth is that a problem?

You seem totally obsessed with retail, yet so many experts say shops are dying and there may well be no high street in 10 years. They were not talking about Coventry, but in general, nationwide.

If the high street is indeed dying I am therefore really happy for Coventry to have less shops and more restaurants and escape rooms and cinemas and climbing walls and water parks and cafes etc.

They say the high street needs to evolve. If lots of new places are sprouting up in Coventry, isn't that exactly what it is doing?

Your hatred at times is quite embarrassing.

I don't defend that Coventry has the best shops, it clearly doesn't, but I simply cannot understand why you incessantly focus on shopping. Most people are now shopping from home, online anyway. People are moving a way from shops.

Surely we don't want every city centre to be the same anyway do we?

I am really happy we are getting a water park and another concert venue and another cinema and another hotel.

Hardly points to a place dying does it?

 

[Otis]

Oh and if you do want to focus on shopping, Wilkinson's has nearly 400 stores nationwide.

Guess which store regularly tops the sales out of all their stores? Yep, Coventry. Top sales in the whole country.

And before you say it is only Wilko's, I am not talking about the quality or lack of quality of the store itself, I am talking about in terms of you saying Coventry is dying.

How come they top the sales figures? And sometimes their figures are twice that of other stores.

Sorry, but you are biased and incredibly so. I know Coventry is far from perfect and I will readily admit to what is wrong about the place. I praise what they do right, and criticise what is wrong.

You on the other hand can say nothing positive at all about the place.

The place clearly is not dying. There are 3 restaurants at Cathedral Lanes and they are all doing so well that figure is being increased to 9.

Wasteland my arse.

Facts are there right in front of you. More restaurants to come, more hotels, more cafes, a new waterpark that will draw people in from miles around, a new cinema, a new music venue.

We already have two great museums and a cathedral.

Coventry is evolving.

It has most of the shops I need. If I want to do something more elaborate, with a better quality of shop and more variety, I will simply hop on the train to Birmingham.

I really don't see the problem at all here.

Highs streets are dying. Coventry is doing something about it in focusing on entertainment and places to eat.

 

[Westendlad]

Oh and if you do want to focus on shopping, Wilkinson's has nearly 400 stores nationwide.

Guess which store regularly tops the sales out of all their stores? Yep, Coventry. Top sales in the whole country.

And before you say it is only Wilko's, I am not talking about the quality or lack of quality of the store itself, I am talking about in terms of you saying Coventry is dying.

How come they top the sales figures? And sometimes their figures are twice that of other stores.

Sorry, but you are biased and incredibly so. I know Coventry is far from perfect and I will readily admit to what is wrong about the place. I praise what they do right, and criticise what is wrong.

You on the other hand can say nothing positive at all about the place.

The place clearly is not dying. There are 3 restaurants at Cathedral Lanes and they are all doing so well that figure is being increased to 9.

Wasteland my arse.

Facts are there right in front of you. More restaurants to come, more hotels, more cafes, a new waterpark that will draw people in from miles around, a new cinema, a new music venue.

We already have two great museums and a cathedral.

Coventry is evolving.

It has most of the shops I need. If I want to do something more elaborate, with a better quality of shop and more variety, I will simply hop on the train to Birmingham.

I really don't see the problem at all here.

Highs streets are dying. Coventry is doing something about it in focusing on entertainment and places to eat.

 

[Westendlad]

Yeah you tell him Otis.....P.s We've two cathedrals !!

 

[hill83]

Oh and if you do want to focus on shopping, Wilkinson's has nearly 400 stores nationwide.

Guess which store regularly tops the sales out of all their stores? Yep, Coventry. Top sales in the whole country.

And before you say it is only Wilko's, I am not talking about the quality or lack of quality of the store itself, I am talking about in terms of you saying Coventry is dying.

How come they top the sales figures? And sometimes their figures are twice that of other stores.

Sorry, but you are biased and incredibly so. I know Coventry is far from perfect and I will readily admit to what is wrong about the place. I praise what they do right, and criticise what is wrong.

You on the other hand can say nothing positive at all about the place.

The place clearly is not dying. There are 3 restaurants at Cathedral Lanes and they are all doing so well that figure is being increased to 9.

Wasteland my arse.

Facts are there right in front of you. More restaurants to come, more hotels, more cafes, a new waterpark that will draw people in from miles around, a new cinema, a new music venue.

We already have two great museums and a cathedral.

Coventry is evolving.

It has most of the shops I need. If I want to do something more elaborate, with a better quality of shop and more variety, I will simply hop on the train to Birmingham.

I really don't see the problem at all here.

Highs streets are dying. Coventry is doing something about it in focusing on entertainment and places to eat.

 

[clint van damme]

I can never understand why you hate Coventry with such a passion. You only ever seem to say negative things about it whatever is built, whatever arrives into the city.

Coventry is growing. That is not an opinion, it is fact.

More and more outlets are coming to the city centre. If it draws people in I don't see the problem and even if it didn't have any shops at all, but still drew people in, why is that such a problem to you?

Surely if you want to shop in Solihull, shop in Solihull. No-one is stopping you. If Solihull is the best place to shop, but Coventry is the best place for water parks and restaurants, then why on earth is that a problem?

You seem totally obsessed with retail, yet so many experts say shops are dying and there may well be no high street in 10 years. They were not talking about Coventry, but in general, nationwide.

If the high street is indeed dying I am therefore really happy for Coventry to have less shops and more restaurants and escape rooms and cinemas and climbing walls and water parks and cafes etc.

They say the high street needs to evolve. If lots of new places are sprouting up in Coventry, isn't that exactly what it is doing?

Your hatred at times is quite embarrassing.

I don't defend that Coventry has the best shops, it clearly doesn't, but I simply cannot understand why you incessantly focus on shopping. Most people are now shopping from home, online anyway. People are moving a way from shops.

Surely we don't want every city centre to be the same anyway do we?

I am really happy we are getting a water park and another concert venue and another cinema and another hotel.

Hardly points to a place dying does it?

I think the city centre is at a cross roads. Things are definitely improving but have a long way to go. There is going to be massive investment in the next few years leading up to the city of culture and there is no doubt that as the city expands it will become more affluent.
Get it right in the next couple of years and we could have a city centre to be proud of, get it wrong and I don't think we'll get another chance to put it right.

Problem is to get it right we need the council to make all the right calls which I don't have a lot of confidence in happening.

The other problem is, even if they get it right, city centres need on going investment to keep them fresh and vibrant. As I mentioned In another post, Brum has had shitloads of money thrown at it but as far as retail is concerned is starting to look stale and be dominated by 2 superstores. It used to have loads of great little independent shops and boutiques but they've all gone.
Even the nightlife isn't what it was and Moseley and Digbeth seem more happening and vibrant.

 

[Otis]

I think the city centre is at a cross roads. Things are definitely improving but have a long way to go. There is going to be massive investment in the next few years leading up to the city of culture and there is no doubt that as the city expands it will become more affluent.
Get it right in the next couple of years and we could have a city centre to be proud of, get it wrong and I don't think we'll get another chance to put it right.

Problem is to get it right we need the council to make all the right calls which I don't have a lot of confidence in happening.

The other problem is, even if they get it right, city centres need on going investment to keep them fresh and vibrant. As I mentioned In another post, Brum has had shitloads of money thrown at it but as far as retail is concerned is starting to look stale and be dominated by 2 superstores. It used to have loads of great little independent shops and boutiques but they've all gone.
Even the nightlife isn't what it was and Moseley and Digbeth seem more happening and vibrant.

Yeah, agree.

I really like the idea of Coventry becoming an entertainment hub though and I really think that's the way to go.

Bottom line is people are now going online to shop and it's going to hit everywhere.

People need a reason to go to town. If it's not for shopping it needs to be to be entertained and fed.

 

[Macca]

I can never understand why you hate Coventry with such a passion. You only ever seem to say negative things about it whatever is built, whatever arrives into the city.

Coventry is growing. That is not an opinion, it is fact.

More and more outlets are coming to the city centre. If it draws people in I don't see the problem and even if it didn't have any shops at all, but still drew people in, why is that such a problem to you?

Surely if you want to shop in Solihull, shop in Solihull. No-one is stopping you. If Solihull is the best place to shop, but Coventry is the best place for water parks and restaurants, then why on earth is that a problem?

You seem totally obsessed with retail, yet so many experts say shops are dying and there may well be no high street in 10 years. They were not talking about Coventry, but in general, nationwide.

If the high street is indeed dying I am therefore really happy for Coventry to have less shops and more restaurants and escape rooms and cinemas and climbing walls and water parks and cafes etc.

They say the high street needs to evolve. If lots of new places are sprouting up in Coventry, isn't that exactly what it is doing?

Your hatred at times is quite embarrassing.

I don't defend that Coventry has the best shops, it clearly doesn't, but I simply cannot understand why you incessantly focus on shopping. Most people are now shopping from home, online anyway. People are moving a way from shops.

Surely we don't want every city centre to be the same anyway do we?

I am really happy we are getting a water park and another concert venue and another cinema and another hotel.

Hardly points to a place dying does it?

I think you bit

 

[Otis]

I think you bit

Oh. Thought I was the biter.

 

[Grendel]

Oh and if you do want to focus on shopping, Wilkinson's has nearly 400 stores nationwide.

Guess which store regularly tops the sales out of all their stores? Yep, Coventry. Top sales in the whole country.

And before you say it is only Wilko's, I am not talking about the quality or lack of quality of the store itself, I am talking about in terms of you saying Coventry is dying.

How come they top the sales figures? And sometimes their figures are twice that of other stores.

Sorry, but you are biased and incredibly so. I know Coventry is far from perfect and I will readily admit to what is wrong about the place. I praise what they do right, and criticise what is wrong.

You on the other hand can say nothing positive at all about the place.

The place clearly is not dying. There are 3 restaurants at Cathedral Lanes and they are all doing so well that figure is being increased to 9.

Wasteland my arse.

Facts are there right in front of you. More restaurants to come, more hotels, more cafes, a new waterpark that will draw people in from miles around, a new cinema, a new music venue.

We already have two great museums and a cathedral.

Coventry is evolving.

It has most of the shops I need. If I want to do something more elaborate, with a better quality of shop and more variety, I will simply hop on the train to Birmingham.

I really don't see the problem at all here.

Highs streets are dying. Coventry is doing something about it in focusing on entertainment and places to eat.

When emotion overides rational thought processes debate is pointless.

 

[Otis]

When emotion overides rational thought processes debate is pointless.

You best stop now then.

 

[Grendel]

You best stop now then.

You keep quoting a tiresome strap line of a dying high street. What that comment actually means is not the interpretation you are applying to it.

Even the most optimistic of online forecasts suggests retain purchasing will be done physically vs online until 2030 - at the moment it’s 70% in favour of physical.

The shopping chains that have gone bankrupt have done so for many reasons. The main one is the physical environment that they operate in both for size and appearance. The House of Fraser issue was multiplied by buying another dinasaur chain which was ego over business sense.

Numerous centres show significant increase in retail footfall.

It’s impossible for a city to exist as you describe without retail offers. The principal issue is the collapse of rental revenue which means the council investment becomes threatened. Coventry will likely lose Debenhams and M and S at some point which means huge spaces of empty buildings. A few humdrum food chains isn’t going to repair that damage in terms of employment business rates or rentals.

The water park business projections are interesting - I suggest you look at that. It’s profit figures assume some rather ambitious figures around guests spending money in retail outlets. You may like some Gin palace for its appearance but a loss making folly is the last thing we need.

It also justifies its green belt destruction by offering high end retail stores to the high demographic it is targeting in those areas - particularly the massive development in Pickford green. I see zero evidence of this

Coventry has 1 of the highest growing 15 retailers 1. I see no sign of the city addressing that but plenty of evidence of other cities doing the same.

 

[Otis]

You keep quoting a tiresome strap line of a dying high street. What that comment actually means is not the interpretation you are applying to it.

Even the most optimistic of online forecasts suggests retain purchasing will be done physically vs online until 2030 - at the moment it’s 70% in favour of physical.

The shopping chains that have gone bankrupt have done so for many reasons. The main one is the physical environment that they operate in both for size and appearance. The House of Fraser issue was multiplied by buying another dinasaur chain which was ego over business sense.

Numerous centres show significant increase in retail footfall.

It’s impossible for a city to exist as you describe without retail offers. The principal issue is the collapse of rental revenue which means the council investment becomes threatened. Coventry will likely lose Debenhams and M and S at some point which means huge spaces of empty buildings. A few humdrum food chains isn’t going to repair that damage in terms of employment business rates or rentals.

The water park business projections are interesting - I suggest you look at that. It’s profit figures assume some rather ambitious figures around guests spending money in retail outlets. You may like some Gin palace for its appearance but a loss making folly is the last thing we need.

It also justifies its green belt destruction by offering high end retail stores to the high demographic it is targeting in those areas - particularly the massive development in Pickford green. I see zero evidence of this

Coventry has 1 of the highest growing 15 retailers 1. I see no sign of the city addressing that but plenty of evidence of other cities doing the same.

Quite a few retail experts are predicting the high street could be dead within 10 years.

 

[clint van damme]

Quite a few retail experts are predicting the high street could be dead within 10 years.

isn't this either Moff or Hobos field of expertise? They might be able to shed some light on it.

 

[Grendel]

Quite a few retail experts are predicting the high street could be dead within 10 years.

They mean traditional high street - the great big old stores not retail shopping in specialised smaller outlets.

Can you provide some links and I’ll see what they say and what qualifies them as experts.

 

[Otis]

They mean traditional high street - the great big old stores not retail shopping in specialised smaller outlets.

Can you provide some links and I’ll see what they say and what qualifies them as experts.

No, I agree. Shopping centres such as Meadowhall and Touchwood etc. are doing okay.

It IS the high street they are talking about and that's what I am talking about.

Most cities obviously have main shopping high streets.

Malls will do okay they believe. Not talking about them.

I am not driven simply by emotion, I deal with honest and open facts and you will never ever hear me defend West Orchards. It is not fit for purpose and was very badly designed. Needs ripping down and starting again.

I just don't see Coventry going down a route of entertainment to draw people in as in any way being a bad thing.

People like Nick will always shop online anyway.

 

[theferret]

Coventry is on the cusp of a major revival in my option. That applies to leisure, culture, the restaurant scene, and yes, retail also. This may seem somewhat counter-intuitive given the national picture, but Coventry is starting from a low base having suffered decades of retail stagnation. I'm not talking about major expansion, but certainly there is scope to dramatically improve what is already there. This is not fantasy stuff, because many of the schemes are underway or at an advanced stage of planning and already fully funded. It is the reason why many retail outlets are currently on short-term lets in places like Hertford St and Shelton Square - no high-end retailers are going to set-up shop in areas earmarked for demolition in the near future.

Coventry is on the bounce. There is development everywhere. So what if a lot of it is student accommodation. Good. It brings footfall and disposable income, and if this means that long abandoned, derelict sites are being brought back into use and developed, then great.

As far as student accommodation goes, supply will shortly meet demand. There are private residential schemes now coming to the table. One 15 storey block is now being built at Belgrade Plaza. Another in for planning on the Elliots site. When the first phase of luxury apartments at the Co-op development (an excellent, high-quality scheme with another new tenant announced this week) came on the market, they all sold off-plan on the first day.

The Burges heritage scheme is about the start. Work to turn the old CET building into a boutique hotel starts later this summer. The old Nationwide building in Broadgate will be demolished next month re-opening the link with Hertford Street. The Upper Precinct scheme is to be resubmitted for planning soon following the listing. Major public realm schemes along Smithford Way and Market Way will happen next year (along with a long list of other public realm proposals). Expansion at Catherdral Lanes is underway. The Water Park is heading for completion. Drapers Hall is about to be converted. The planning application for a major expansion at Coventry Station is now in. There is an announcement expected next month regarding a second office block at Friargate, along with a new hotel development. Coventry Point will be demolished next year ahead of City Centre South.

Confidence in Coventry is as high as it has been for decades. Some people hate this city so much though that you almost get the sense they are disappointed.

 

[Otis]

Coventry is on the cusp of a major revival in my option. That applies to leisure, culture, the restaurant scene, and yes, retail also. This may seem somewhat counter-intuitive given the national picture, but Coventry is starting from a low base having suffered decades of retail stagnation. I'm not talking about major expansion, but certainly there is scope to dramatically improve what is already there. This is not fantasy stuff, because many of the schemes are underway or at an advanced stage of planning and already fully funded. It is the reason why many retail outlets are currently on short-term lets in places like Hertford St and Shelton Square - no high-end retailers are going to set-up shop in areas earmarked for demolition in the near future.

Coventry is on the bounce. There is development everywhere. So what if a lot of it is student accommodation. Good. It brings footfall and disposable income, and if this means that long abandoned, derelict sites are being brought back into use and developed, then great.

As far as student accommodation goes, supply will shortly meet demand. There are private residential schemes now coming to the table. One 15 storey block is now being built at Belgrade Plaza. Another in for planning on the Elliots site. When the first phase of luxury apartments at the Co-op development (an excellent, high-quality scheme with another new tenant announced this week) came on the market, they all sold off-plan on the first day.

The Burges heritage scheme is about the start. Work to turn the old CET building into a boutique hotel starts later this summer. The old Nationwide building in Broadgate will be demolished next month re-opening the link with Hertford Street. The Upper Precinct scheme is to be resubmitted for planning soon following the listing. Major public realm schemes along Smithford Way and Market Way will happen next year (along with a long list of other public realm proposals). Expansion at Catherdral Lanes is underway. The Water Park is heading for completion. Drapers Hall is about to be converted. The planning application for a major expansion at Coventry Station is now in. There is an announcement expected next month regarding a second office block at Friargate, along with a new hotel development. Coventry Point will be demolished next year ahead of City Centre South.

Confidence in Coventry is as high as it has been for decades. Some people hate this city so much though that you almost get the sense they are disappointed.

Well said ferret. Was going to say the same thing on the student situation.

There are thousands and thousands of student appartments going up in the city centre.

These students all need to eat and all need to shop.

The more people there are milling about in the centre, the more retailers and food outlets will want to come in to the city.

There is definitely a sea change. The City of Culture thing will clearly help generate footfall too.

We all know about the city's demise, but things are definitely changing.

Was right next to the new water park today and it does look impressive.

And on that last point, I couldn't agree more.

 

[ajsccfc]

I rarely go into town and don't even have cause to use the ring road these days so when I do it's remarkable how quickly the landscape changes. That building going up opposite Cov baths for example, it was just that car park last I knew and now there's a behemoth going up.

 

[I_Saw_Shaw_Score]

I sit in the cathedral ruins on my lunch break and the amount of tourists is staggering.

I think Cov’s definitely having a revival!

 

[clint van damme]

I sit in the cathedral ruins on my lunch break and the amount of tourists is staggering.

I think Cov’s definitely having a revival!

they're there to watch you!

 

[LastGarrison]

I took just under 20 people from all over Europe around the city on Wednesday.

All of them had never been to Cov before but all of them had 'heard' things about Cov and they came with many preconceptions, however, they were all very very surprised and it was not at all how they thought it would be.

I echo a lot of the comments above in that it is clear to see that the city is changing and is changing for the better. I can't be arsed to get into the whole student debate but the fact is, is that they have driven a lot of money into the city and I think by the time 2021 comes around it will be vastly different to how it is now!

 

[Otis]

Latest pic of the water park.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Latest pic of the water park.

Typical SISU.

Trying to save on costs by not putting any water in!

 

[Nick]

Latest pic of the water park.

Is there another part to it? It doesn't look very big

 

[clint van damme]

Is there another part to it? It doesn't look very big

Waterworld, (I think that's what it's called), in Stoke on Trent isn't very big but there's a fair few slides in there. They all criss cross each other.

 

[Otis]

Is there another part to it? It doesn't look very big

Looks pretty big to me.

There is another part to it too.

There's the water park, dance studios, a gym, a spa, a 25m pool and squash courts.

 

[chiefdave]

I'm not a building expert but are they building it out of wood? That can't be the best option for longevity.

 

[Otis]

It seems about the same size as WaterWorld.