The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (63 Viewers)
- Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Not a good situation. Although maybe it is just shifting a relatively little cost & staff resource from another waste of time rejigging the NHS instead. That fact is - some like to panic...this is giving them their reason to. Others like to remain calm...this is giving them their reason to as well.
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
ALL sensasionalist shit really Tony. I have little doubt that with some in-depth research some other 'experts' would paint quite the opposite picture.
They are media outlets, they create news if it gets the outlet/reporter exposure. Or if it suits the prevailing old boy network best.
It's interesting that you use the Express especially, given the argument about many leavers voting leave due to such sensationalist stories printed in the same!
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shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Out of interest, what sources of information do you trust when forming your opinions?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Sensationalised? Probably. Shit? Definitely not. The most sensationalised is probably the article about red lines regarding immigration. The other two stories though are based on real concerns from the bodies that are on the front line of their respected industry and organisation. Why would you be so eager to dismiss their warranted concerns in the scenario of a no deal brexit? What makes you qualified to make that judgment?
Ironically though the people who seem to be championing a no brexit deal were traveling around on a big red bus with a spurious claim that Brexit will benefit the NHS no longer seem concerned about the damage that the NHS is in the firing line to receive because of Brexit. Then you have Ferage the Fisherman’s champion who again is backing a hard brexit regardless of the damage it could cause to the fishing industry.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
I agree they are based on real concerns...but sensationalised to get attention. For the most they will undoubtedly negatively impact some self interest groups. Most of us will not notice much difference...especially shorter term.
And that is pretty much the same result as various things the EU have/do/might bring in.
Businesses & individuals evolve to cope.
The major changes I think we see - whoever has the overriding power - take place over a much longer period of time. That happens naturally anyone...which is why I am generally calm about the whole damned thing.
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shmmeee
Well-Known Member
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Self interest group? Strange description for the NHS. Do you not know anyone who takes medicine on a regular basis for an ongoing condition? Do you not think you should be at least the slightest bit concerned if not for yourself for them?
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I thought you meant sources of information...the media as-in.
I take virtually everything with a pinch of salt, because everything everybody does is to predominantly benefit themselves in some way.
Obviously I trust my own senses as far as possible...but even they can let you down. I mean - I thought it actually WAS butter.
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
As you well know - I was talking about those with an agenda for sensationalising the actual story, like the media...to scare people - a bit like you have either been or are trying to do to others.
Ethically, the Pharma industry generally would not be inclined to allow such shortages. If the medicines are produced but directed away from the UK (because that seems to be the only reason such a shortage would occur)...euther the companies themselves or the EU would find themselves up before their own EU courts or maybe even the Court of Human Rights.
So me not being in any way able to impact the supply chain...means no...I am not concerned looking forward any more than I am by current Governmental influenced supply restrictions.
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Astute
Well-Known Member
Yet we must stay in the EU because of their hardball tactics?
The way it is run is bent. The puppet master has now become the master in a way not allowed. Yet the sheep say we must stay in. And all because those who keep getting forecasts for the UK wrong say it will go wrong for us if we leave.
But yes. Leave voters are thick. It will only be democratic if the democratic vote result is ignored. Not having any ability to choose how many people come here to live doesn't cause homelessness. And it is more important to have cheap labour to pick fruit than leave the infrastructure in chaos.
Yes I think I would be better off if we stayed in the EU. But me being better off doesn't mean that we should stay in.
You want to be worse off?
The hard ball tactics are us saying bend your rules for us, or we will leave without a deal. The EU has stuck to its rules from day 1. We‘re the ones leaving, it’s up to us to say how we intend doing that - respecting EU rules. What has cheap fruit got to do with neglecting infrastructure? What has selling off Council houses and not building cheap housing got to do with immigration? Blame the people responsible, not some guy looking for work. The areas hurt most by „austerity“ cuts are the highest leave voting areas. Why do you think that is? Why aren’t the billionaire owned newspapers on to the connections with austerity and government policies? If an immigrant, especially a Muslim one, farts they are all over it.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Finally. A no deal brexit positive.
No-deal Brexit 'may hit Grand National'
Should be banned anyway.
No-deal Brexit 'may hit Grand National'
Should be banned anyway.
Astute
Well-Known Member
The EU frequently breaks its own rules.
It makes the rules to suit and breaks the rules to suit. We didn't sign up to the rules. We didn't sign up to the EU. We have kept to the rules.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Interesting that, with it's booming economy, Germany's public debt is falling while the EU as a whole it is increasing.
Makes you wonder who actually does well out of the EU? All in it together of course. Or is Germany just engineering things to safeguard itself somewhat against impending doom of the euro or EU itself maybe?
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Makes you wonder who actually does well out of the EU? All in it together of course. Or is Germany just engineering things to safeguard itself somewhat against impending doom of the euro or EU itself maybe?
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dutchman
Well-Known Member
Another 'glowing endorsement' of EU membership from a pro-EU newspaper!
Greece was never bailed out – it remains a debtor’s prison and the EU still holds the keys | Yanis Varoufakis
"Over the past week, the world’s media have been proclaiming the successful completion of the Greek financial rescue programme mounted in 2010 by the European Union and the International Monetary Fund. Headlines celebrated the end of Greece’s bailout, even the termination of austerity.
Buoyant reports from ground zero of the eurozone crisis portrayed Europe’s eight-year long Greek intervention as a paradigm of judicious European solidarity with its black sheep; a case of “tough love” that, reportedly, worked.
A more careful reading of the facts points to a different reality. In the very week that a devastated Greece entered another 42 years of harsh austerity and deeper debt bondage (2018-2060), how can the end of austerity and Greece’s regained financial independence be presented as fact? Instead, last week should be cited in our universities’ media schools and economics departments as an example of how consent can be built internationally around a preposterous lie."
Greece was never bailed out – it remains a debtor’s prison and the EU still holds the keys | Yanis Varoufakis
"Over the past week, the world’s media have been proclaiming the successful completion of the Greek financial rescue programme mounted in 2010 by the European Union and the International Monetary Fund. Headlines celebrated the end of Greece’s bailout, even the termination of austerity.
Buoyant reports from ground zero of the eurozone crisis portrayed Europe’s eight-year long Greek intervention as a paradigm of judicious European solidarity with its black sheep; a case of “tough love” that, reportedly, worked.
A more careful reading of the facts points to a different reality. In the very week that a devastated Greece entered another 42 years of harsh austerity and deeper debt bondage (2018-2060), how can the end of austerity and Greece’s regained financial independence be presented as fact? Instead, last week should be cited in our universities’ media schools and economics departments as an example of how consent can be built internationally around a preposterous lie."
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dutchman
Well-Known Member
Great idea!
Germany mulls year of national service for young people and migrants
Angela Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union (CDU) party is floating the idea of a new form of compulsory national service in Germany for all young people and migrants.
For over 50 years, all German men were obliged to spend a year in the army after leaving school. Those who could not, or would not, volunteered their time in community service instead.
The scheme was abolished in 2011, but the belief that young people should dedicate a year to national service persists in many conservative circles. Now, the CDU leadership, keen to reunite the party around traditional core values, is revisiting the concept.
Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer,the CDU general secretary, suggested earlier this month that all young men and women should complete a compulsory “service year”. The plan, if implemented, would also apply to all adult asylum seekers and refugees, she added.
Germany mulls year of national service for young people and migrants
Angela Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union (CDU) party is floating the idea of a new form of compulsory national service in Germany for all young people and migrants.
For over 50 years, all German men were obliged to spend a year in the army after leaving school. Those who could not, or would not, volunteered their time in community service instead.
The scheme was abolished in 2011, but the belief that young people should dedicate a year to national service persists in many conservative circles. Now, the CDU leadership, keen to reunite the party around traditional core values, is revisiting the concept.
Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer,the CDU general secretary, suggested earlier this month that all young men and women should complete a compulsory “service year”. The plan, if implemented, would also apply to all adult asylum seekers and refugees, she added.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Yes...that probably overall small minority of asylum seekers who have terrorist leanings will either be empowered by being given a gun, or maybe build stronger allegiance to the country iteslf.
Tough choices...I'm sure they've thought about it in depth.
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Germany was the richest country in Europe, along with Switzerland, long before the Euro. Their biggest challenge was the reunification which put it on wobble for a while. Germany has absorbed the GDR and is once again successful. It is an exporting country and exports, as an example, 3 times as much to China as the UK.
Where is the impending doom of the Euro? Some countries, including Iran, are threatening to trade their oil in Euros as opposed to the dollar. Or the doom of the EU for that matter? Do you know something no-one else does?
Germany isn’t suffering under the uncertainty of Brexit to the same extent as the UK.
Wasn’t that totally rejected, by the CDU?
Astute
Well-Known Member
Luxembourg is now the richest country in Europe per resident. How did that happen I wonder......
Germany does well out of the EU and Euro. So they will never suffer whilst the majority will.
The proposed service year was not necessarily military service.
You surprise me. I thought you knew these things.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Some may say that it has everything to do with the tax dodges/tax fraud that Juncker started off. Luxembourg took billions just charging a small amount of tax instead of trillions going to the countries it should have been paid to. But the EU wouldn't allow anything that dodgy to happen though.......
At least they don't hold dodgy elections where there isn't even an election......
But yes they did the best for the people of Greece.......
We helped write the rules. Especially the single market and customs union. The EU doesn’t make rules to suit or break rules to suit - generally. Seems to be the mistaken belief of Brexiters that they do. May explain why we are getting nowhere in negotiations.
? What elections are you on about?
Greece has a lot to do with it’s own demise and is an ongoing situation.
dutchman
Well-Known Member
Since the article is dated 26th August 2018, apparently not.
The articles says the opposition Social Democrats rejected it.
AfD supports it so there's a good chance of it becoming law.
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The idea came at the beginning of August... so the article was a bit late..
The answer from the guy who would be responsible was:
Auch der Wehrbeauftragte des Deutschen Bundestages, Hans-Peter Bartels sieht die Einführung einer allgemeinen Dienstpflicht für Männer und Frauen skeptisch. "Eine allgemeine Dienstpflicht für Männer und Frauen ist verfassungsrechtlich im Moment nicht möglich. Das fällt unter das Verbot der Zwangsarbeit", sagte der SPD-Politiker der "Bild am Sonntag".
dutchman
Well-Known Member
They would almost certainly leave the country rather than serve in the army. Win-Win.
Astute
Well-Known Member
I'm not a brexiteer as you call them. But this debacle has made people look closer at the EU. If Brexit hadn't come about then someone getting the top job in the EU that shouldn't have even been in the running when nobody knew there was going to be a vacancy and nobody even had the chance of going for the position wouldn't have even been noticed.
Are you telling me that something as massive as this happens and nothing else? If so you are deluded.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Is that your way of saying that a pro EU paper is wrong when saying things that could be seen as against the EU?
Astute
Well-Known Member
But Mart says the AfD is nothing in Germany
I have not said anything else, but I wouldn’t be so deluded to say that this proves that the EU always bends rules to the limit.
Brexit is actually attracting more attention to the failings and lies of the Brexiteers than the EU in relation to the size of the U.K. against that of the EU.