The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (52 Viewers)

[Astute]

what are you talking about lower myself to Marts level?
Of course Farage is still on TV, he's hasn't got his own show but he appears frequently. Just Google it and see the high profile programmes hes appeared on this year.
Can you name another MEP who appears as much as him? Can you name another MEP because I'm struggling to!
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make about him to be honest.

So do you see Farage on TV all the time like Mart says?

I can't remember the last time I saw him on TV yet I am supposed to believe he is on all the time.

 

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[Astute]

He was on the BBC news, ITV news and CH4 news over the weekend and again on the BBC yesterday. He's tweets regularly, he has a regular slot on FOX news and has a radio show on LBC 5 days a week. Oh and his appearances on YouTube are almost daily as his LBC show is uploaded there.
Apart from that, he's invisible.

On the news? So what was that about?

On Twatter? So are most twats.

Fox news? So how many on here watch Fox news?

 

[clint van damme]

So do you see Farage on TV all the time like Mart says?

I can't remember the last time I saw him on TV yet I am supposed to believe he is on all the time.

all the time is just a figure of speech isn't it? No one is on the TV all the time are they? It's just semantics and it's a silly game you're trying to play in my opinion.

I'll ask you a question, do you agree his media profile is far higher than it should be given his political standing? Or do you think that I am underestimating his political standing and he deserves a high profile.

 

[Astute]

all the time is just a figure of speech isn't it? No one is on the TV all the time are they? It's just semantics and it's a silly game you're trying to play in my opinion.

I'll ask you a question, do you agree his media profile is far higher than it should be given his political standing? Or do you think that I am underestimating his political standing and he deserves a high profile.

Why is it a silly game?

Mart says he is on TV all the time in the UK. I can't remember the last time I saw him on TV. Yet now his comment is being defended.

And I suppose we are leaving the EU because of Farage and no other reason.

He is a twat. He should have no stage. UKIP is finished. Farage is finished. That is as long as Brexit goes ahead. The one very good thing about Brexit.

 

[Grappa]

Is that right?

Yeah OK. Have it your way. You only know what you see on Twatter.

"Ad hominem - How it works is that rather than refuting an opponent’s argument the person attacks the individual instead. This can be directed towards their character, morals, intelligence, reputation or credentials. In fact, it really doesn’t matter, the main thing to remember is that they are not addressing the actual argument being presented but relying purely on feelings and prejudices to win their case."

 

[Astute]

Hilarious. Are they going to tell me that the don’t see or hear of Farage in the media? You are the twister in chief.

I don't. Not sure if others go looking for him like you do.

 

[clint van damme]

Why is it a silly game?

Mart says he is on TV all the time in the UK. I can't remember the last time I saw him on TV. Yet now his comment is being defended.

And I suppose we are leaving the EU because of Farage and no other reason.

it's a silly game because "on TV all the time" is just an expression. I'n sure you've uttered it about some minor celebrity who seems to be everywhere, I know I have, and you clearly know it's not meant literally.
Back to Farage, like I said, he has a very high media profile for an MEP, don't you agree?
If you don't can you name another MEP who get's the exposure he does?

 

[Astute]

"Ad hominem - How it works is that rather than refuting an opponent’s argument the person attacks the individual instead. This can be directed towards their character, morals, intelligence, reputation or credentials. In fact, it really doesn’t matter, the main thing to remember is that they are not addressing the actual argument being presented but relying purely on feelings and prejudices to win their case."

Sounds like you are describing certain pro EU whatever posters on here.

 

[Astute]

it's a silly game because "on TV all the time" is just an expression. I'n sure you've uttered it about some minor celebrity who seems to be everywhere, I know I have, and you clearly know it's not meant literally.
Back to Farage, like I said, he has a very high media profile for an MEP, don't you agree?
If you don't can you name another MEP who get's the exposure he does?

He gets exposure he doesn't deserve. Like even on here.

So all the time means what? I would expect to remember the last time I saw him if the phrase is to be believed at all.

 

[Monners]

"Ad hominem - How it works is that rather than refuting an opponent’s argument the person attacks the individual instead. This can be directed towards their character, morals, intelligence, reputation or credentials. In fact, it really doesn’t matter, the main thing to remember is that they are not addressing the actual argument being presented but relying purely on feelings and prejudices to win their case."

Oddly enough that is exactly how Farage behaved when questioned on 5Live and Sky News last week - personal attacks on May "liar" being the main one he repeated ad nauseum, rather than put forward a more appropriate way forward.

 

[clint van damme]

He gets exposure he doesn't deserve. Like even on here.

So all the time means what? I would expect to remember the last time I saw him if the phrase is to be believed at all.

Just because you haven't seen him doesn't mean he hasn't appeared. I work with a Villa fan who hates Harry Redknapp and goes on about how he's always on TV. I don't see him that much but that doesn't mean he's not on, just means I don't often watch Sky sports.
All the time can mean regularly, I bet at least 80% of people on this forum use the expression all the time. I bet most have used it to their kids, or missus - you do that all the time.

It's not meant to be taken literally and if some one was trying to play that silly game with you you'd be calling them out for it.

Your fixating with the phrase all the time which tells me you know you're wrong because you're trying to derail the argument and avoid my questions regarding his profile.

 

[bezzer]

On the news? So what was that about?

Go on, have a guess. But if it's too difficult a question for you to answer, he was interviewed about the 'Deal' may had agreed on with the EU. Plus earlier in the week he was on CH4 news when UKIP appointed Yaxley-Lennon as an advisor.

 

[Grappa]

Sounds like you are describing certain pro EU whatever posters on here.

That's called a 'Tu Quoque'. Literally translating as 'you too' this fallacy is also known as the appeal to hypocrisy. It is commonly employed as an effective red herring because it takes the heat off someone having to defend their argument, and instead shifts the focus back on to the person making the criticism.

 

[bezzer]

I don't. Not sure if others go looking for him like you do.

I don't think anyone in their right mind goes 'looking' for Farage, but if you watch MSM news, unfortunately the odious twat pops up regularly.

 

[skybluetony176]

SB and UKIP voting Tony. Those who try to twist the truth constantly like yourself.

Ha ha was waiting for that one. Lost the argument again hey Chubby Checker.

 

[skybluetony176]

He works for Fox TV in the USA, has a regular talk show in the UK, he is interviewed every time Brexit comes up by some Programm somewhere on TV or radio, and the Brexit Press is constantly quoting him. The he has a massive library posted on YouTube by his fans, or people and RT. People are complaining about how much time he gets on TV as a non MP. And you still are at „Farage who?“

He’s all over Facebook and Twitter also. I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s one of the most shared on Facebook and retweeted on Twitter by U.K. users.

 

[skybluetony176]

I don't think anyone in their right mind goes 'looking' for Farage, but if you watch MSM news, unfortunately the odious twat pops up regularly.

I watch channel 4 news daily, the bbc 10 o’clock news daily and question time most weeks and he crops up on one or another at least once a week, sometimes more. I can only assume that astute doesn’t watch such current affairs type programs which actually would explain a lot.

 

[Astute]

That's called a 'Tu Quoque'. Literally translating as 'you too' this fallacy is also known as the appeal to hypocrisy. It is commonly employed as an effective red herring because it takes the heat off someone having to defend their argument, and instead shifts the focus back on to the person making the criticism.

You mean as in those looking for a straw to grasp at when they didn't get the result they wanted? And then they can't get into a sensible conversation because all they want to do is blame others for their woes. But strangely enough not blame those who they have supported before. They defend those like the EU whatever they do. At the same time they jump on every bit of negativity they can find about us leaving even if they don't understand any part of it.

Yeah seen all that before. Just can't think of where though.......

 

[Sick Boy]

SB and UKIP voting Tony. Those who try to twist the truth constantly like yourself.

Back in reality, I've said that the UK should go into the EEA as a compromise. In fact I've said it multiple times.

Another one of your attempts to put words in someone's mouth.

 

[Grappa]

You mean as in those looking for a straw to grasp at when they didn't get the result they wanted? And then they can't get into a sensible conversation because all they want to do is blame others for their woes. But strangely enough not blame those who they have supported before. They defend those like the EU whatever they do. At the same time they jump on every bit of negativity they can find about us leaving even if they don't understand any part of it.

Yeah seen all that before. Just can't think of where though.......

And another Tu Quoque. Textbook stuff.

 

[Grendel]

Studies by the CBI, WTO, LSE and our own government all available on line if people can be bothered to look and all paint a pretty bleak picture In event of a no deal. The government one probably painted the bleakest picture of the lot but luckily they get everything wrong so it's more than likely inaccurate.
The WTO are predicting UK GDP to shrink by 4% and the EU by 1.7%.
unemployment to rise by 1.6 million in the UK and 2.7 million in the EU but what some people seem to fail to grasp is the hit the EU will be taking is shared between 27 countries and 500 million people so it will be painful, but not as painful as the hit we'll take as one country of 60 odd million.

Didn't the CBI study give a range of scenarios

"Our new review of the evidence incorporates a thorough analysis of twelve studies including more recent estimates of the overall net benefit to the UK economy of EU membership than were available at the time of the 2013 analysis. This amounts to twelve studies which include fourteen different estimates of the overall economic net benefit of Britain’s EU membership. These are listed in the table at the end of this summary. There is a very large degree of uncertainty over the size of the costs and benefits, and the estimates covered in the papers range from a cost of 13% of GDP to a gain of 31%."

 

[clint van damme]

Didn't the CBI study give a range of scenarios

"Our new review of the evidence incorporates a thorough analysis of twelve studies including more recent estimates of the overall net benefit to the UK economy of EU membership than were available at the time of the 2013 analysis. This amounts to twelve studies which include fourteen different estimates of the overall economic net benefit of Britain’s EU membership. These are listed in the table at the end of this summary. There is a very large degree of uncertainty over the size of the costs and benefits, and the estimates covered in the papers range from a cost of 13% of GDP to a gain of 31%."

They did. The WTO used 3 models, all based on no deal, I used the one that painted the best picture, I don't know how many the models the government one used and I haven't seen it just the headlines.

 

[Astute]

Back in reality, I've said that the UK should go into the EEA as a compromise. In fact I've said it multiple times.

Another one of your attempts to put words in someone's mouth.

Would you like a list of other things you have said? Especially when backing up Tony and Mart.

 

[Astute]

They did. The WTO used 3 models, all based on no deal, I used the one that painted the best picture, I don't know how many the models the government one used and I haven't seen it just the headlines.

And that is the problem with predictions. It could be worse than the worse one or better than the best prediction. All it dies is causes more diversion when we could do without it.

 

[Grendel]

Would you like a list of other things you have said? Especially when backing up Tony and Mart.

Gone are the days when Sb accused Tony of vile racist behaviour with the monkey boy taunt. Funny how principals are abandoned in chasing a common cause

 

[skybluetony176]

Gone are the days when Sb accused Tony of vile racist behaviour with the monkey boy taunt. Funny how principals are abandoned in chasing a common cause

Sick boy never accused me of vile racist behaviour. You try and make out what I called sick boy was racist. He’s never seen it that way as far as I know and we have discussed it. It’s just you being a moron because you can’t argue your opinion. Ad hominem.

 

[Astute]

Gone are the days when Sb accused Tony of vile racist behaviour with the monkey boy taunt. Funny how principals are abandoned in chasing a common cause

Or the accusations that UKIP voters were racist. When you uncovered Tony as a UKIP voter the accusations stopped. Then when I said Tony is racist for voting UKIP those who made the original accusation of UKIP voters being racist then backed up Tony and said I was acting like an idiot......And that was for copying them. But it was a different matter when I was saying that voting UKIP didn't make you a racist.

 

[martcov]

Why is it a silly game?

Mart says he is on TV all the time in the UK. I can't remember the last time I saw him on TV. Yet now his comment is being defended.

And I suppose we are leaving the EU because of Farage and no other reason.

He is a twat. He should have no stage. UKIP is finished. Farage is finished. That is as long as Brexit goes ahead. The one very good thing about Brexit.

It is a stupid game that you are playing. In colloquial speech being “on all the time” doesn’t literally mean 24 hours a day, but he is on some form of media nearly every single day. You may watch different programs, not read certain papers, not use Twitter, not view current affairs on YouTube, not listen to certain radio programs, but millions do. The comment is being defended because it is a fact and you are trying to twist the facts again.

Why do you keep posting crap?

Then you come out with the usual, putting words into other people’s mouths, “we are leaving because of Farage and no other reason”. No one, not even Farage, has ever claimed that.

Why do you post such crap?

 

[martcov]

I don't. Not sure if others go looking for him like you do.

Don’t you read what the others have posted? They put the Tele on and he is being interviewed. People cannot avoid him if they watch current affairs.

 

[martcov]

And that is the problem with predictions. It could be worse than the worse one or better than the best prediction. All it dies is causes more diversion when we could do without it.

Are you so stubborn that you think we should not use predictions? How do you think the government plans budgets, or roads, or how anyone plans anything in advance? Of course we are going to base our views on predictions.

 

[martcov]

Or the accusations that UKIP voters were racist. When you uncovered Tony as a UKIP voter the accusations stopped. Then when I said Tony is racist for voting UKIP those who made the original accusation of UKIP voters being racist then backed up Tony and said I was acting like an idiot......And that was for copying them. But it was a different matter when I was saying that voting UKIP didn't make you a racist.

You were and are acting like an idiot. Tony has explained why he, IMO stupidly, voted UKIP. As a protest vote, not as a racist. He explained it to you and the guy who keeps getting things wrong, for example saying that anyone who thought the Midterms were a success was a moron. 39 Congress seats flipped, nearly 400 legislative state seats flipped, 8,1 point victory, 8,9 million popular vote win. You are now ganging up with him against Tony. That’s how low you have to go as you keep getting things wrong and trying to twist them.

 

[dutchman]

He explained it to you and the guy who keeps getting things wrong, for example saying that anyone who thought the Midterms were a success was a moron.

They are, and it's the reason Trump will win a second term in office and the Republicans probably a third and fourth.

 

[Astute]

It is a stupid game that you are playing. In colloquial speech being “on all the time” doesn’t literally mean 24 hours a day, but he is on some form of media nearly every single day. You may watch different programs, not read certain papers, not use Twitter, not view current affairs on YouTube, not listen to certain radio programs, but millions do. The comment is being defended because it is a fact and you are trying to twist the facts again.

Why do you keep posting crap?

Then you come out with the usual, putting words into other people’s mouths, “we are leaving because of Farage and no other reason”. No one, not even Farage, has ever claimed that.

Why do you post such crap?

Me posting crap? Oh the irony.

 

[Grendel]

Sick boy never accused me of vile racist behaviour. You try and make out what I called sick boy was racist. He’s never seen it that way as far as I know and we have discussed it. It’s just you being a moron because you can’t argue your opinion. Ad hominem.

You clown Tony and why is that dribbling lunatic liking a post that’s factually innacurate?

Back to being the biggest club in Coventry?

 

[Astute]

Sick boy never accused me of vile racist behaviour. You try and make out what I called sick boy was racist. He’s never seen it that way as far as I know and we have discussed it. It’s just you being a moron because you can’t argue your opinion. Ad hominem.

So you lie and Mart backs you up. How unusual.