Grab a beer or a cup of tea, it’s CCFC!! (33 Viewers)

[SkyBlueZack]

Why do our fans understand wasps stance? I thought football was partisan. Or is that just other clubs. How can we understand their stance? A team that moves miles away? A team with a management structure who says they are a real estate company with a rugby club attached. They are just a shinier version of Sisu, underneath the shine there wankers just like Sisu. Yet we understand their stance. Fuck sake!

 

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[NortonSkyBlue]

I have said he missed things about regarding the butts situation as one example. I literally went through all the details about it a couple of days ago when Tony strangely missed details too.

Where did I say it was still going to happen?

Why are you trying to play dumb again? Is this the new thing?

If fisher bullshits it's all there in details, if the council do its just "public relations" rather then multiple people being bullshitters.

The people bullshitting should all rightly be called out rather than pretending only one side is at it.

It seems you are trying too hard Nick, it is a good piece based on a perspective, as is your response to it.
There may be errors or omissions but I am with Bawtryneal here, it's faithful to events as we know it and that is as good as we are going to get.

 

[Otis]

Yeah, at least it's a good historical documentation of events and statements from Sisu isn't it and sometimes I think we need that reminder, because it is such tosh, nonsense and full of bullshit and fake promises.

What a joke.

At least of late these statements are rarer and new stadium talk has vanished, so their lips seem to be more buttoned these days.

 

[Captain Dart]

I have said he missed things about regarding the butts situation as one example. I literally went through all the details about it a couple of days ago when Tony strangely missed details too.

Where did I say it was still going to happen?

Why are you trying to play dumb again? Is this the new thing?

Its not worth me pursuing this further. You are not really convincing anyone with your stance. If you have a good reasoned argument to put I am perfectly willing to listen as I am sure most others are too.

 

[bawtryneal]

Why do our fans understand wasps stance? I thought football was partisan. Or is that just other clubs. How can we understand their stance? A team that moves miles away? A team with a management structure who says they are a real estate company with a rugby club attached. They are just a shinier version of Sisu, underneath the shine there wankers just like Sisu. Yet we understand their stance. Fuck sake!

It has nothing to do with being partisan. I am as partisan about CCFC as anybody. I have been to over 1,500 games and sung my heart out. I shout at referees and linesman and sulk when we lose.
This is about facts and that our owners have dragged us into a complete mess through there own actions.

 

[Nick]

Who is bullshitting apart from Fisher.
SISU had an agenda. It has failed. They cannot blame anybody else
As I said yesterday evening. Without the goodwill of Wasps we have no home.
I think it is perfectly reasonable for their stance. They warned SISU of the outcome of their ongoing actions last year.
I cannot see your argument.
Sometimes you argue without logic or reason. One of the major reasons I do not post on here very often.

I argue without logic after you have asked who else has bullshitted apart from fisher?

Ok then. Nobody else has bullshitted through this mess.

Who is it arguing without logic here?

 

[Nick]

Its not worth me pursuing this further. You are not really convincing anyone with your stance. If you have a good reasoned argument to put I am perfectly willing to listen as I am sure most others are too.

No you are just acting dumb as per usual. I posted things that were said around the time of the butts that seem to have been forgotten.

It's as if certain things get erased from history.

Why are people scared of calling the council pricks as well as sisu, as well as the previous owners, as well as people from acl?

 

[Captain Dart]

The council have bullshitted, talking about rebuilding trust while selling to wasps. Saying the future of CCFC and crfc would be secure then saying it was only for four years, that’s bullshit too. The council have had an agenda regarding the club long before Sisu arrived. I don’t find the wasps stance completely reasonable. Do we not remember the bleating about them having no home and it justifying moving miles. Yet here they are not talking to the club about keeping them at the ricoh. The legal action is not against them, they are an interested party. It’s just a convenient excuse that people swallow.

Why do our fans understand wasps stance? I thought football was partisan. Or is that just other clubs. How can we understand their stance? A team that moves miles away? A team with a management structure who says they are a real estate company with a rugby club attached. They are just a shinier version of Sisu, underneath the shine there wankers just like Sisu. Yet we understand their stance. Fuck sake!

Firstly I don't disagree that if SISU were to get hold of the Arena and continued to build the club from there it would be good for Coventry. What I can't stomach is the methods they are using to do it, that is to say litigation to undermine and stress the companies that stand in their way rather than negotiation to come to a mutually beneficial solution. On the other hand I'm aware that off the pitch they are doing a decent job and I really like that even if it would be more in line with my expectations if they were actually challenging for play-offs this season instead of being a little bit too inconsistent to hit that mark.

As for the Council strategy I think that's been covered in the JHW article, their hard arsed decision that resulted in CCFC losing the chance to own the Ricoh was in response to repeated statements from SISU that they were moving to another stadium in a few years.

The other hard arsed decision by Wasps to cease negotiation and let the existing arrangement lapse also has roots in SISU's decision to continue litigation, if they took another path it could all be resolved.

Your other main point of contention is about Wasps moving base, well that could have been thwarted if SISU had bought the Arena, but they would have had to found £20m and accepted a lease rather than land ownership.

 

[Nick]

It seems you are trying too hard Nick, it is a good piece based on a perspective, as is your response to it.
There may be errors or omissions but I am with Bawtryneal here, it's faithful to events as we know it and that is as good as we are going to get.

Ha me trying too hard? I'm not writing 12000 words for the media and missing certain things out.

I'm not the one going to the media telling them made up reasons that I don't go to games.

 

[NortonSkyBlue]

Ha me trying too hard? I'm not writing 12000 words for the media and missing certain things out.

I'm not the one going to the media telling them made up reasons that I don't go to games.

I understand that and you are correct, however, in my opinion it is a good piece, maybe not balanced but well observed.

 

[Nick]

I understand that and you are correct, however, in my opinion it is a good piece, maybe not balanced but well observed.

What makes it a good piece? Because it makes people get angry at only one side and think the other sides have done nothing wrong

Take a step back, take emotion out of it and have a look at things. What's the reasoning behind it? If it's to just keep people informed then why miss particular steps out.

You will also see why the council leader is so confident about public opinion being on his side, we have people re writing history for him.

Again, im in no way saying people shouldn't be pissed off at sisu. Far from it.

When you add things like this and his wing man who uses multiple social media accounts to mislead fans and jump in if somebody says something against the council it gets a bit more obvious.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Firstly I don't disagree that if SISU were to get hold of the Arena and continued to build the club from there it would be good for Coventry. What I can't stomach is the methods they are using to do it, that is to say litigation to undermine and stress the companies that stand in their way rather than negotiation to come to a mutually beneficial solution. On the other hand I'm aware that off the pitch they are doing a decent job and I really like that even if it would be more in line with my expectations if they were actually challenging for play-offs this season instead of being a little bit too inconsistent to hit that mark.

As for the Council strategy I think that's been covered in the JHW article, their hard arsed decision that resulted in CCFC losing the chance to own the Ricoh was in response to repeated statements from SISU that they were moving to another stadium in a few years.

The other hard arsed decision by Wasps to cease negotiation and let the existing arrangement lapse also has roots in SISU's decision to continue litigation, if they took another path it could all be resolved.

Your other main point of contention is about Wasps moving base, well that could have been thwarted if SISU had bought the Arena, but they would have had to found £20m and accepted a lease rather than land ownership.

Why would they need to find 20m? The purchase price wasn’t that much? They would have to have taken the loan on, yes. The very loan that cripples ACL. The very loan that was the reason we were being charged £1.3 million. The same loan that wasps took out bonds to pay. It would appear Sisu were right to want the debt written off. I imagine with the lease wasps got they would have accepted, they were never offered it though.

Let’s also not forget wasps bought the arena knowing legal action was ongoing. They have also signed new deals with legal action on going. Just a hunch, I’d say it’s nothing to do with legal action, it’s just that people swallow it up.

We do seem to also forget acl was ‘washing it’s face’, more bullshit. The taxpayers everyone gets so worked up about, were lied too. They spoke of reconciliation on our return while negotiating with wasps. More bullshit and two faced.

This isn’t just Sisu who have done wrong. It is multiple parties, past and present. Before the well Sisu own us so it’s nothing to do with anyone else, the club is their responsibility. Is there not an argument the club belongs to the city, traditionally and historically. It brings wide benefits to the city. Now would that not mean the local authority also have a responsibility? To ensure the club stays in the city? A bit like what they alluded to when the wasps deal was announced.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

It has nothing to do with being partisan. I am as partisan about CCFC as anybody. I have been to over 1,500 games and sung my heart out. I shout at referees and linesman and sulk when we lose.
This is about facts and that our owners have dragged us into a complete mess through there own actions.

Reeling out the I’ve supported the club for years and followed them everywhere so I care about my club. Yet we get screwed over by multiple parties and you blame one party. That isn’t partisan.

 

[bawtryneal]

Reeling out the I’ve supported the club for years and followed them everywhere so I care about my club. Yet we get screwed over by multiple parties and you blame one party. That isn’t partisan.

There is only one party to blame !!
Maybe the other parties have not acted in the best interests of CCFC. That is not the point
They have acted in their own best interests. That's life !
SISU are the aggressor and despite my love for all things CCFC they deserve what is coming there way.

 

[bawtryneal]

What makes it a good piece? Because it makes people get angry at only one side and think the other sides have done nothing wrong

Take a step back, take emotion out of it and have a look at things. What's the reasoning behind it? If it's to just keep people informed then why miss particular steps out.

You will also see why the council leader is so confident about public opinion being on his side, we have people re writing history for him.

Again, im in no way saying people shouldn't be pissed off at sisu. Far from it.

When you add things like this and his wing man who uses multiple social media accounts to mislead fans and jump in if somebody says something against the council it gets a bit more obvious.

It's a good peice because it is factual ( not sure why you always put a , so thought I would as well)

 

[Otis]

There is only one party to blame !!
Maybe the other parties have not acted in the best interests of CCFC. That is not the point
They have acted in their own best interests. That's life !
SISU are the aggressor and despite my love for all things CCFC they deserve what is coming there way.

I wouldn't say they were the only one to blame, bawtry, but number one culprit for sure.

 

[Nick]

It's a good peice because it is factual ( not sure why you always put a , so thought I would as well)

And again, its selective with the facts isn't it?

You go on about being logical but can't seem to understand that.

 

[Nick]

I wouldn't say they were the only one to blame, bawtry, but number one culprit for sure.

The article had its desired effect on him.

Nobody else to blame at all. Certain things wiped from history and forgotten about.

It's exactly what it was intended to do. Wipe away anything from other parties.

Just proves my point.

 

[Otis]

It's absolutely fine to be annoyed with all of them, even if it is to varying degrees.

 

[Nick]

It's absolutely fine to be annoyed with all of them, even if it is to varying degrees.

Which is the point I'm making.

Now it's "nobody else did anything wrong". It probably has something to do with the article they had just read completely ignoring certain things.

Like I said, its no different to Brexit propaganda.

Logic would point out the strange meeting with the council a few days ago just before this comes out absolving them of blame. Did it need to be signed off?

 

[SkyBlueZack]

There is only one party to blame !!
Maybe the other parties have not acted in the best interests of CCFC. That is not the point
They have acted in their own best interests. That's life !
SISU are the aggressor and despite my love for all things CCFC they deserve what is coming there way.

It is the point! Why is it ok for other parties to screw us over? Just because Sisu do? Why is it ok what the council have done? Sisu won’t get anything coming there way, the club will. Wasps stance that you understand may leave the club without somewhere to play and cease to exist. So you’ll have no club, we’ll all have no club. Seems that’s acceptable if it screws Sisu over.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

We don’t have partisan fans or love for CCFC. We have a hatred of Sisu and a love for the local council, stadium management company and wasps. It shines through.

 

[Otis]

We don’t have partisan fans or love for CCFC. We have a hatred of Sisu and a love for the local council, stadium management company and wasps. It shines through.

Now there you have the other side of the daft reasoning.

Who on here loves the council and Wasps?

There may be misunderstanding of the entire picture and there may be a degree of sympathy for the council and our insect overlords, but love them both?

Has anyone said everything the council have done is correct and every stance of Wasps ?

Balance has to come from all sides.

 

[Nick]

Now there you have the other side of the daft reasoning.

Who on here loves the council and Wasps?

There may be misunderstanding of the entire picture and there may be a degree of sympathy for the council and our insect overlords, but love them both?

Has anyone said everything the council have done is correct and every stance of Wasps ?

Balance has to come from all sides.

Yes, people say the council and wasps have done nothing wrong and aren't too blame for anything. You have people involved with jhw setting up multiple social media accounts telling people the council aren't too blame for anything.

Find somebody who says sisu aren't too blame for anything. You might get RFC and that's it....

Why could there possibly be a misunderstanding about the entire picture? Articles like this, people involved creating so many aliases to push particular things who happen to be heavily involved with the council.

This is exactly my point, it's done on purpose. They go on about fisher misleading but do the same thing.

 

[MatthewWallis]

Do people wake up on a Sunday morning gagging for an argument? People need to chill out and enjoy their weekend instead of coming on here for yet another disagreement

 

[Nick]

Do people wake up on a Sunday morning gagging for an argument? People need to chill out and enjoy their weekend instead of coming on here for yet another disagreement

I'm waiting for swimming to open before enjoying the day

 

[Deleted member 2477]

The council have bullshitted, talking about rebuilding trust while selling to wasps. Saying the future of CCFC and crfc would be secure then saying it was only for four years, that’s bullshit too. The council have had an agenda regarding the club long before Sisu arrived. I don’t find the wasps stance completely reasonable. Do we not remember the bleating about them having no home and it justifying moving miles. Yet here they are not talking to the club about keeping them at the ricoh. The legal action is not against them, they are an interested party. It’s just a convenient excuse that people swallow.

What do you expect from a labour council. They can’t lie straight in bed

 

[Otis]

Do people wake up on a Sunday morning gagging for an argument? People need to chill out and enjoy their weekend instead of coming on here for yet another disagreement

I agree.

I always want to come on here with an intention for a chill and to exchange views, but some clearly come on looking for a fight and an argument (that's not a dig at you, Nick)

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Now there you have the other side of the daft reasoning.

Who on here loves the council and Wasps?

There may be misunderstanding of the entire picture and there may be a degree of sympathy for the council and our insect overlords, but love them both?

Has anyone said everything the council have done is correct and every stance of Wasps ?

Balance has to come from all sides.

It’s not daft. Look how much are fans absolve other parties of blame. You’re on here a lot, you have seen it. To say otherwise is well, daft!

 

[Otis]

It’s not daft. Look how much are fans absolve other parties of blame. You’re on here a lot, you have seen it. To say otherwise is well, daft!

There is hardly anyone I would say.

What doesn't help is with stuff like this thread.

Why can't people see there is a lot of decent and reasoned comment within the article, rather than go straight on the attack?

Surely sensible is 'Yeah, a lot of that is accurate and reasoned, but there's some stuff that's been omitted', rather than just decry the whole piece and dismiss it.

There's lot to commend in that piece. Sure, I would like a bit more balance though.

 

[Nick]

There is hardly anyone I would say.

What doesn't help is with stuff like this thread.

Why can't people see there is a lot of decent and reasoned comment within the article, rather than go straight on the attack?

Surely sensible is 'Yeah, a lot of that is accurate and reasoned, but there's some stuff that's been omitted', rather than just decry the whole piece and dismiss it.

There's lot to commend in that piece. Sure, I would like a bit more balance though.

Really? There are plenty.

Do a simple test, write something like "sisu,ACL,higgs, the council and wasps are all bullshitters and have to take parts of blame for our mess"

See how many say sisu aren't too blame compared to the others.

I'm decrying the reasoning and the agenda behind the article. We all know sisu are twats, why does it need rewriting history to leave parts out that make other parties look like twats?

 

[Captain Dart]

The biggest problem Nick and Zak have is that they pay no heed to the aims and objectives of parties other than CCFC. Their attitude where there is a conflict is to blame the other party. Generally I've found that where there is conflict with CCFC it is as a consequence of actions from SISU.

 

[Nick]

The biggest problem Nick and Zak have is that they pay no heed to the aims and objectives of parties other than CCFC. Their attitude where there is a conflict is to blame the other party. Generally I've found that where there is conflict with CCFC it is as a consequence of actions from SISU.

It's funny, I'm saying blame everybody for their part in it and that's the point I'm making.

Are you acting dumb again? Funny that, it's becoming a habit.

You just prove my point time and time again, if you dare to blame anybody else for something it means you aren't blaming sisu for anything

 

[Ashdown]

I've not read the article just yet but will. Thing is 90% of the City fans see SISU as the chief protagonists of our shitty predicament and given their stubborn stance still in 2019 that is hardly going to change is it. We all know others have played a sorry part in our demise but the club has been caught in the crossfire between SISU and just about everyone else that they have dealt with in the locality.
Despite all of us fans hoping that Wasps see sense, the council/MP's apply some pressure or the EFL grow a pair of bollocks and step in and mediate, ultimately only a SISU climb down will guarantee us a home next season.

 

[Otis]

Really? There are plenty.

Do a simple test, write something like "sisu,ACL,higgs, the council and wasps are all bullshitters and have to take parts of blame for our mess"

See how many say sisu aren't too blame compared to the others.

I'm decrying the reasoning and the agenda behind the article. We all know sisu are twats, why does it need rewriting history to leave parts out that make other parties look like twats?

I would re-word that and say 'not as much to blame as Sisu'.

I know some side with the council, but I think there are very few who think the y have done NOTHING wrong.

It's all about degrees, but it's all become a bit polarised.

Think maybe the only thing that would open up everyones eyes would be if Sisu DID drop the legals and still there was no deal or goodwill.

They SHOULD drop them legals though. It's caused nothing but harm and consternation.n