The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (123 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Let them go - leave is then a foregon conclusion

Nope I voted to keep them in in 2014

 

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[djr8369]

When has several over a sustained time equalled two in a couple of weeks?

You seemed to have lost your appetite to demand people show their sources?


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[Grendel]

As far as I’m aware no other party has had a member in the audience, picked for a question each time, then had their question shared each time on social media.

Presumably every party has had representatives in the audience at some point.


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You said several councillors - do you now retract the allegation?

 

[Grendel]

You seemed to have lost your appetite to demand people show their sources?


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No it’s the fact you made an allegation you can’t substantiate

 

[djr8369]

You said several councillors - do you now retract the allegation?

Yes it seems it was two several times.


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[djr8369]

No it’s the fact you made an allegation you can’t substantiate

Deflection from the core point.


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[Brighton Sky Blue]

No I don’t think so - If Nigel Farage in an interview said he’d now work to reform the EU from within I assume Tony would believe that

Explain then why people want progressive policies but vote to damage their own public services

 

[Grendel]

Hello what this?

It’s official: Question Time is a Remainer stronghold - spiked

 

[Grendel]

Deflection from the core point.


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No it’s not you made an allegation that’s not anything like factually accurate is it? How can I deflect when in challenging you to prove a statement you made?

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

No one has ever shown me an unbiased report on the true economic effects of mass migration. Most I've read suggest that the tax receipt benefit is outweighed by the strain on services and infrastructure, NHS, Schools, roads, environment, crime and security. Again I don't blame individuals but our successive governments have allowed systematic abuse.

Have a read through that.

 

[djr8369]

Hello what this?

It’s official: Question Time is a Remainer stronghold - spiked

Spiked, a Koch brothers propaganda site quoting The IEA, a right wing think tank who regularly get one of their paid shills on the panel.

Do better.

To be fair it’s possible the numbers are correct. I’ll have a look elsewhere.


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[djr8369]

No it’s not you made an allegation that’s not anything like factually accurate is it? How can I deflect when in challenging you to prove a statement you made?

How can you say it’s not anything like factually accurate when a UKIP councillor has been featured several times? The fact it is several people or one person several times doesn’t take anything from my point.


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[Grendel]

Have a read through that.

I assume as this is unbiased this is not the Daniel Harari whose slavishly pro Eu and works in Paris?

 

[Ashdown]

There will no doubt now be another sustained campaign by all the mainstream media, Remain politicians past and present, leading establishment figures in and around London, the legal profession, Foreign born people living in the UK or people with foreign born spouses, the governor of the Bank of England, Vince Cable car, Martcov and a myriad of other deniers ............still pretending that, people don't know what they have voted for { twice }, they're all xenophobic, racist, Tommy Robinson loving lunatics and that why should they complain or rebel against a corrupt and impotent political system that is totally London centric , allows systematic destruction of our green belts and landscape for useless vanity projects like HS2 and constant house building for incoming persons and others in a burgeoning population, ensures that most of the wealth of the country is either generated in the South East or is funnelled back to London anyway and disenfranchises those regions where most of the UK's historical wealth was forged over centuries.

 

[Grendel]

Spiked, a Koch brothers propaganda site quoting The IEA, a right wing think tank who regularly get one of their paid shills on the panel.

Do better.

To be fair it’s possible the numbers are correct. I’ll have a look elsewhere.


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Ah of course it’s spiked

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

So what I'm gauging from last night is that if you add up lib dem, green, snp, plaid cymru, sausage, egg, beans, lions, Netflix subscribers and sales of gazebos this month......... Remain won last night lol

Well if you take the swing away from UKIP (-24.2%) as totally going to Brexit (who are essentially New UKIP) then that leaves 7.4% of Brexit's vote unaccounted for.

Tories (probably the next most ardent leave party) had a swing of -14.8%. So that means only half of the lost Tory vote went to Brexit.

Labour (who I'm going to consider as slightly in favour of remain but policy wise are getting splinters in their arse) had a swing of -11.3%.

Lib Dem swing was +13.4% and Green swing was +4.2%, totalling +17.6%.Then there is also the 3.4% Change UK picked up taking it to 21% and I'll leave the SNP's 1.1% increase out even though Scotland largely voted to remain.

So from that it appears there was much more of a swing from the established parties towards remain parties than Brexit parties.

 

[djr8369]

Hello what this?

It’s official: Question Time is a Remainer stronghold - spiked

Grendel, this is a wonderful demonstration of how Brexit is funded by shady arch capitalists who don’t want the best for the British people and will only make the issues we face worse.

Thank you.


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[Grendel]

Grendel, this is a wonderful demonstration of how Brexit is funded by shady arch capitalists who don’t want the best for the British people and will only make the issues we face worse.

Thank you.


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As opposed to the dribbling liberal elite who want to retain their greedy snouts in the Brussels trough?

Aren’t you doing a bit of a straw man here?

 

[SIR ERNIE]

As far as I’m aware no other party has had a member in the audience, picked for a question each time, then had their question shared each time on social media.

Presumably every party has had representatives in the audience at some point.


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Can’t whine about a sign on a bus anymore so instead the new one is whinge about the QT audience.

 

[djr8369]

There will no doubt now be another sustained campaign by all the mainstream media, Remain politicians past and present, leading establishment figures in and around London, the legal profession, Foreign born people living in the UK or people with foreign born spouses, the governor of the Bank of England, Vince Cable car, Martcov and a myriad of other deniers ............still pretending that, people don't know what they have voted for { twice }, they're all xenophobic, racist, Tommy Robinson loving lunatics and that why should they complain or rebel against a corrupt and impotent political system that is totally London centric , allows systematic destruction of our green belts and landscape for useless vanity projects like HS2 and constant house building for incoming persons and others in a burgeoning population, ensures that most of the wealth of the country is either generated in the South East or is funnelled back to London anyway and disenfranchises those regions where most of the UK's historical wealth was forged over centuries.

Firstly you stereotype loads of people then you mention a load of issues that have nothing to do with the EU.


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[djr8369]

As opposed to the dribbling liberal elite who want to retain their greedy snouts in the Brussels trough?

Aren’t you doing a bit of a straw man here?

No it’s not a straw man I’m responding to the link you shared.


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[Grendel]

Let’s have a look at some of the advocates of the Eu - lets go one by one

I’ll start

The blood stained Blair creature

Whose next?

 

[SIR ERNIE]

Well if you take the swing away from UKIP (-24.2%) as totally going to Brexit (who are essentially New UKIP) then that leaves 7.4% of Brexit's vote unaccounted for.

Tories (probably the next most ardent leave party) had a swing of -14.8%. So that means only half of the lost Tory vote went to Brexit.

Labour (who I'm going to consider as slightly in favour of remain but policy wise are getting splinters in their arse) had a swing of -11.3%.

Lib Dem swing was +13.4% and Green swing was +4.2%, totalling +17.6%.Then there is also the 3.4% Change UK picked up taking it to 21% and I'll leave the SNP's 1.1% increase out even though Scotland largely voted to remain.

So from that it appears there was much more of a swing from the established parties towards remain parties than Brexit parties.

Lol. Adding the individual % swings to get a total % swing.

 

[Grendel]

No it’s not a straw man I’m responding to the link you shared.


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You immediately create a diversionary statement by naming the person who did it and discredited him

I’m still waiting for the several UKIP councillors infiltrating question time, can we have the names?

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

In seat numbers, UKIP lost 24 seats which we'll take as all going to Brexit. So that's 5 'new' Brexit seats to get to their total of 29.

Remain parties had increases of 19 seats (Lib Dem +15, Green +4) or 20 if you add in SNP.

The established parties (who campaigned at the GE for leaving the EU in some form or other) lost 25 seats in total (Con 15, Lab 10)

So again that suggests that the make-up has shifted far more towards remain than Brexit.

 

[djr8369]

You immediately create a diversionary statement by naming the person who did it and discredited him

I’m still waiting for the several UKIP councillors infiltrating question time, can we have the names?

Who have I named and discredited?

I shared the links with you and admitted it was two people several times rather than several people. What more do you want?


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[Mucca Mad Boys]

I assume as this is unbiased this is not the Daniel Harari whose slavishly pro Eu and works in Paris?

Why is living in France a problem? If it was, how would you feel about the Brexit Party MEP who lives in France?

 

[Grendel]

Who have I named and discredited?

I shared the links with you and admitted it was two people several times rather than several people. What more do you want?


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You didn’t admit at all - you’ve scampered round the edges

 

[Grendel]

Why is living in France a problem? If it was, how would you feel about the Brexit Party MEP who lives in France?

You said this is an impartial assessment - what does he do for a living?

 

[djr8369]

You didn’t admit at all - you’ve scampered round the edges

I admitted it was two several times. You’re floundering because my core point stands and I’ve shown you the evidence.


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[Grendel]

I admitted it was two several times. You’re floundering because my core point stands and I’ve shown you the evidence.


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There is no core point. You claim bias when actually it’s one bloke whose asked an audience question 3 times in the programmes history.

The panel should be marginally in favour of leaving the EU over a period of time - it isn’t

The notion this programme has since 2016 tried to adopt a UKIP agenda is hilarious

Why did you make a false claim you had to dribble and backtrack on out of interest?

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

You said this is an impartial assessment - what does he do for a living?

How would living in France affect his impartiality?

Equally, how would living in France Male said Brexit Party MEP less capable in his role?

It’s irrelevant.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Lol. Adding the individual % swings to get a total % swing.

Yep. If this is pro-Brexit vs Pro-Remain that's what you do. UKIP and Brexit saw an overall swing of +7.4%. All the staunchly pro-Remain parties had a swing of +21%.

You can go on about how Brexit did so well, but you can't then ignore how badly UKIP did. Most of the Brexit vote came from UKIP imploding. The pro-remain parties got theirs from the established two.

 

[Grendel]

How would living in France affect his impartiality?

Equally, how would living in France Male said Brexit Party MEP less capable in his role?

It’s irrelevant.

What does he do?

You must know as you say there they are impartial - that’s a big claim

If it was me I’d do a hell of of a lot of research as of know their background would be scrutinised

It took me 2 seconds on LinkedIn so can you share the research?

 

[Ashdown]

Firstly you stereotype loads of people then you mention a load of issues that have nothing to do with the EU.


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You have to be a little bit generalistic as it's what the voting maps show at the end of these elections anyway. Of course there are exceptions to all of those ideas.