General Election 2019 thread (23 Viewers)

[PVA]

The economic forecasts don’t say that - it’s you who have been brainwashed you arrogant bigoted twat

Oh and a Tory supporting Leaver calling me a bigot LOL

 

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[Walsgrave]

My first post in this thread.

What a disappointment this result is. I do not like Corbyn, but I don't know how people can vote for this lying, deceitful, and genuinely unpleasant Tory government.

I have voted Tory in the past, so it's not like I'm totally anti-Tory. But this particular government are scummy people.

Personally I am probably financially better off under Tory, but I would happily have paid a few hundred quid extra tax in a year to help the NHS and help those worse off than me.

The working class people in working class towns that voted Tory are incredibly stupid and/or brainwashed. The very definition of turkeys voting for Christmas. They are the ones that will suffer the most under this Tory government. I do not wish harm on anyone, but those people who are working in industry and manufacturing in these industrial towns and voted Tory will suffer the consequences of their vote and they deserve it, stuff 'em.

For a sizeable minority, Brexit is the only thing they have left - a legitimate concern of course, but some people take this to be an endorsement that they can be rid of all immigrants and shut down anything perceived as unpatriotic e.g. questions about the Monarchy. They still live with the illusion of grandeur that Britain lost in the 1950s. It kind of reminds me of one of Professor Green's documentaries on working class people last year. For some, including the homeless, their alliance with groups such as 'Britain First' is the only thing keeping them going. Kind of reminds me of those pub guys who are racist until someone like Anthony Joshua turns up and they screech 'Cam on sann do it for ye cantrehh'.

 

[skybluegod]

Social mobility in this country has stagnated according to the Social mobility commission and wealth distribution is 7th worse in the developed nations all on the tories watch so I'm not sure that argument stacks up.

I see your point on Brexit but if Corbyn had came out strongly on favour of it what do you think would have happened?
How would the likes of Jess Phillips reacted, or perhaps more importantly her constituents?

I didn't say the conservatives are delivering it? But the Labour way wasn't going to either as much as Corbyn may say that it will.

We will never know, but it would have been a lot closer possibly.

 

[Grendel]

Oh and a Tory supporting Leaver calling me a bigot LOL

Will you read the report? If you need help I’ll help you understand it as I know you are not the sharpest tool in the box

 

[mark82]

yes, but in reality, can you see Johnson gambling the Union in this way. I can't. He'll have to come up with some sort of solution, I agree, but why would he ever choose that one?

Sturgeon yesterday was saying she would rather do it with cooperation from Westminster but she believes it is a decision for Scottish parliament. At the very least it's going to get extremely messy.

Many in Scotland may have changed their vote based on leaving the EU. I certainly would in their position.

 

[fatso]

Oh and a Tory supporting Leaver calling me a bigot LOL

I know what the Jews call labour members.

 

[PVA]

I suggest you start by looking at the data regarding the claim that we will be £4,300 worse off as claimed by remain in the last referendum and look how that was calculated.

educate yourself first with that and if you are struggling I will help you out

Put your bigotry in your pocket and behave like an adult and we will discuss

ok?

I asked you to post some forecasts that show how much better we will be after Brexit and your response is to say that we won't be quite as worse off as some have said? Right.

 

[fatso]

Get Brexit done, won the day,
It resonated even among leave voters.

People are sick and tired of the situation in Westminster, Boris offered a way forward, Corbyn did not.
End of.

 

[clint van damme]

I know what the Jews call labour members.

all Jews think the same?
Pretty antisemitic comment you've made there.

 

[fatso]

all Jews think the same?
Pretty antisemitic comment you've made there.

Have you not read the Jewish times lately?

 

[PVA]

Will you read the report? If you need help I’ll help you understand it as I know you are not the sharpest tool in the box

I know exactly what report you are referring to and I know that the £4,300 figure does not mean every household will literally be £4,300 worse off, and I never said it does.

But that report does say the country's economy would shrink considerably.

I said all forecasts show that we will be worse off.

You said they don't.

You then, to try and prove your point, directed me to a forecast which shows.... that we will be worse off.

You've tied yourself in knots and made yourself look silly.

 

[tisza]

Ironically the pro brexit policy vote (Tory and Brexit) was only 45.6%


Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

not true. Some remainers couldn't bring themselves to vote elsewhere the same as some Leavers couldn't bring themselves to vote Tory.

 

[clint van damme]

Have you not read the Jewish times lately?

many Jews think Corbyn is antisemitic, there are plenty that don't.
To attribute a people with only one collective train of thought is racist. It's almost as if you're trying to weaponise antisemitism without understanding it.
Same as antisemites on the left who assume all Jewish people support Israel in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.

What you've done is exactly the same only coming at it from a different political perspective.

 

[Ian1779]

It’s simple, Corbyn was being backed by the anarchists of momentum.
Most right minded labour mp’s wanted him out, but we’re being threatened by momentum and the unions.
Last nights result was always on the cards, (I’d called it on this very forum)
But it was also vital for the very future of the Labour Party, The party now has a real chance to purge itself of the “looney left” and the agitators of momentum /militant tendency.
In order to go forward, Labour must now choose the right leader, and re invent itself as the party for a progressive future.

It wasn’t about it being Corbyn, it was about the policies and vision and him being the first to bring them to the table. In the future Labour have to retain the majority (not all) of those ideas if they ever want to be a force in government.

 

[Grendel]

I asked you to post some forecasts that show how much better we will be after Brexit and your response is to say that we won't be quite as worse off as some have said? Right.

No I said have you read any information and showed you where to look. The fact you’ve joined in tub thumping rhetoric is beyond irony

 

[Deleted member 5849]

many Jews think Corbyn is antisemitic, there are plenty that don't.
To attribute a people with only one collective train of thought is racist. It's almost as if you're trying to weaponise antisemitism without understanding it.
Same as antisemites on the left who assume all Jewish people support Israel in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.

What you've done is exactly the same only coming at it from a different political perspective.

Edwin Montagu, Jewish MP and Cabinet member in the Liberal government, thought the foundation of Israel to be an anti-semitic act.

Just thought I'd add some history

 

[Grendel]

I know exactly what report you are referring to and I know that the £4,300 figure does not mean every household will literally be £4,300 worse off, and I never said it does.

But that report does say the country's economy would shrink considerably.

I said all forecasts show that we will be worse off.

You said they don't.

You then, to try and prove your point, directed me to a forecast which shows.... that we will be worse off.

You've tied yourself in knots and made yourself look silly.

no household is worse off

the report assumes we will grow considerably without being in the Eu

so if you have read it your being mind blowingly dumb

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Gutted genuinely deeply upset at the result. Can’t believe mining communities are willing to let Boris shaft them. Today is a new day but I’m genuinely gutted that we have elected Boris and his chums to shaft the poor, marginalised and vulnerable in our communities for a further 5 years

 

[Philosoraptor]

The decision made by the Public in the EU referendum was not made on economical grounds but was largely about statehood.

It's as simple as that.

I think it's going to come down to a simple equation.

It was mentioned earlier on it he thread but I just let it go then.

Tory remainers and Labour leavers.

These are the one that are most likely to switch to another party or not vote at all.

It was pointed out that Tory remainers are the most likely to stay with their own party. I think there is another reason more logical conclusion that all of the groups respect the result of the EU referendum.

I can only see one group moving with enough clout to affect the GE and that is Labour leave voters moving to other camps or not vote at all.

All it takes are votes moving from Labour to the Brexit Party to change the political landscape.

Put the blame on whoever campaigned and voted in favour of a 2nd referendum at the previous Labour conference.

It's not a protest vote anymore. It will bring changes to Parliament if enough move.

Been saying for a while now, seats in Labour Midland and North heartlands are up for grabs and it's not necessarily down to Corbyn.

And with this, I fully put myself forward as SkyBluesTalk's political nerd for the month.

If I ever do get back to Coventry from my current residence I hope the Labour Party in Coventry is ready for the absolute bollocking it's going to get.

I do fancy being a councillor

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

And with this, I fully put myself forward as SkyBluesTalk's political nerd for the month.

If I ever do get back to Coventry from my current residence I hope the Labour Party in Coventry is ready for the absolute bollocking it's going to get.

I do fancy being a councillor

Step up . I feel the same about getting involved more in the local community

 

[PVA]

no household is worse off

the report assumes we will grow considerably without being in the Eu

so if you have read it your being mind blowingly dumb

Does it? Please post a screenshot or text that says this.

Because I am looking at it right now and every form of Brexit leaves the economy worse off.

And ironically, it says we will be even worse off if we implement Brexit and reduce the net immigration of EEA workers to zero, which Brexiteers are so keen to do.

 

[Grendel]

Does it? Please post a screenshot or text that says this.

Because I am looking at it right now and every form of Brexit leaves the economy worse off.

And ironically, it says we will be even worse off if we implement Brexit and reduce the net immigration of EEA workers to zero, which Brexiteers are so keen to do.

Does it? Please post a screenshot or text that says this.

Because I am looking at it right now and every form of Brexit leaves the economy worse off.

And ironically, it says we will be even worse off if we implement Brexit and reduce the net immigration of EEA workers to zero, which Brexiteers are so keen to do.

Well you read the original report so what was the growth rate in that report assumed per annum?

 

[richnrg]

please provide the reference for N/A 12

 

[PVA]

Well you read the original report so what was the growth rate in that report assumed per annum?

I've just posted the evidence that the economy is predicted to shrink.

I'm still waiting for your evidence that the economy is expected to grow.

 

[PVA]

please provide the reference for N/A 12

I don't know if you are being genuine or just messing, but it says:

"Modelled EEA-type scenario is not shown because the illustrative zero net inflows of EEA workers migration scenario does not apply to the modelled EEA-type scenario"

 

[CCFCSteve]

Does it? Please post a screenshot or text that says this.

Because I am looking at it right now and every form of Brexit leaves the economy worse off.

And ironically, it says we will be even worse off if we implement Brexit and reduce the net immigration of EEA workers to zero, which Brexiteers are so keen to do.

I would never try to argue that Brexit won’t have any negative impacts on the UK (at some point it has/will but hopefully businesses will adapt etc etc), however, from memory since the referendum vote the wage increases for the lower paid//‘working class’ have increased significantly (as a percentage a lot more than higher earners) due to a reduction of lower paid workers from the EU.

If they have seen this then why wouldn’t they continue to think brexit is a good idea ?!

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Yep, those thick working class northerners will get what’s coming to them ! (Can’t find a rolleyes emoji)

That PVA, has been the attitude of labour hierarchy and southern, more liberal, base, which is exactly why those traditional labour supporters have voted against the party they love/loved in their droves, many for the first time in their lives !

Too many people only living in their own echo chambers !

I actually feel a bit sorry for Corbyn today, not a fan at all and he’s got what was coming (In actual fact I think he’s as, if not more, deceitful than Johnson with a far more iffy/almost dangerous past) but nearly every labour commentator/MP is pointing the finger solely at him ! Well, if he was that much of a liability 1) why would you not do something about it before now ? 2) how could you vote/campaign for a man who is that much of a liability to run our country ?!

Tell me what the Tories have done to or for the mining communities of the north over the past 50 years. In fact tell me what good they have done for anyone outside the Home Counties.

God I wish I could emigrate

 

[richnrg]

I don't know if you are being genuine or just messing, but it says:

"Modelled EEA-type scenario is not shown because the illustrative zero net inflows of EEA workers migration scenario does not apply to the modelled EEA-type scenario"

ah. as I suspected.
thanks.

 

[fatso]

Tell me what the Tories have done to or for the mining communities of the north over the past 50 years. In fact tell me what good they have done for anyone outside the Home Counties.

God I wish I could emigrate

Why can’t you?

 

[Grendel]

I've just posted the evidence that the economy is predicted to shrink.

I'm still waiting for your evidence that the economy is expected to grow.

It’s not the growth rate assumptions in the £4,300 report are to grow but over the 10 year period at a rate of 0.6% a year less than in the Eu - the reduction is best on an assumption of less inward investment mainly from India and Japan

The IFS have said this analysis is based of flawed assumptions and factors no benefit from additional trading elsewhere

So it’s on assumptions that are non existent on alternate trade deals and any economic additions this will bring.

The figures assume LESS growth against a static EU modelling not DECLINING and shrinking of the economy

It also makes assumptions on contribution into the EU as a cost against the growth which again we do not know

It also makes zero assumption on benefit of trade externally through currency changes and a stagnating fiscal policy

it makes no assumptions on the impact of increased fiscal convergence - eg corporation tax tightening of bands

It’s assumptions on migration have been questioned

So it’s not assuming a shrinking but reduced growth from a flawed base which the IFS said should never have even been produced

Stick to lee burge adulation

 

[PVA]

Grendel, if you want to take the IFS as gospel then I assume you fully agree with them when they say...

"Revoking Brexit would lead to the best economic outcome."

?

You can argue about other aspects of Brexit all you like, but there is absolutely no way you can say that Brexit leaves us better off economically. It's simply not true, as every report and forecast says, like I said originally.

 

[PVA]

Just been chatting to a South African guy at work.

Voted Tory and is delighted they got their majority. He really wants a points based immigration system...

...under which he definitely wouldn't have qualified to come to the UK.

Unbelievable.

 

[Monners]

No excuses now for the Govt. Nobody to blame but themselves if Brexit goes badly wrong.

Also, we will see if the manifesto spending pledges are delivered.Like any Govt., they need to be held to account.

 

[fernandopartridge]

A clever (but very smug) one

Whats he said now Fernando ? (I can imagine...people like being lied to etc etc)

ps yet I still have some weird addiction to listening to him !

He's staged a phone in this morning asking lifelong Labour voters why they felt they had to vote Tory.

 

[fatso]

No excuses now for the Govt. Nobody to blame but themselves if Brexit goes badly wrong.

Also, we will see if the manifesto spending pledges are delivered.Like any Govt., they need to be held to account.

Why would it go wrong?