George Floyd (25 Viewers)
- Thread starter Sky Blue Pete
- Start date
Ring Of Steel
Well-Known Member
yep, my thoughts too.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I didn’t add the framing to the question that you seem to think I did. I don’t see a problem with wanting a more factually accurate account of the past being given in the info, that’s all.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Not sure he’s ever said that
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
he accuses others of saying a lot of things they haven't. I'm not interested in his racist bollocks any more.
I've only got one person blocked, that other racist fuck Gazbola, he can go on ignore with that alt right fucker.
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
Massive overreaction. I dare say it is because I have some half reasonable points. Your only comeback is to call me racist and suggest I would re-introduce the slave trade.
If it wasn't so ridiculous I would be offended!
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
I generally don't have a problem with it at all either, it is just that everything is so one sided at the moment and almost an attempt to try and compensate for stuff that happened in the past whilst causing more tension now.
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
I've consistently maintained any sex offender is scum, regardless of their background. Just because I have an issue particularly with the over-representation of 'British Asian' people in the perpetrator demographics that get covered up does not mean I like white sex offenders. It is just a way for you to try and deflect from the main point whilst calling me racist. It is weak.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I guess that’s happening because of years of it going unnoticed or ignored. So there’s a dash to make wholesale changes which otherwise wouldn’t have been necessary.
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
I also think lockdown has had an impact. My point still stands though, it has got silly and not helpful.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
'Acafemics' seem to be professors of History at Oxford and Cambridge, among others. Yep, they're academics.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Goldsmiths, LSE, Durham...
Yep, academics alright.
Yep, academics alright.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Warwick, Cardiff...
Yep, academics.
Some pretty good courses to take to learn about colonialism and its impact all around those places.
Some people should try it.
Yep, academics.
Some pretty good courses to take to learn about colonialism and its impact all around those places.
Some people should try it.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
I believe we have to be able to discuss problems rationally.. I see many people from the right and left throwing an awful lot of whataboutery around and this is part of the problem.
I should be able to tell you that terrorism kills 21000 people every year on average in the last decade and its a majority Islamic problem. And we should be able to discuss that without being branded racist etc..
I should be able to tell you that young black males commit more crime by % of population and we should be able to discuss that... Without being branded racist etc.
I should be able to tell you that grooming gangs in the UK are a problem mostly within the Pakistani Muslim community... We should be able to discuss that without being branded racist etc..
If I told you that white males are the biggest perpetrator of rape as a whole, you'd already know that and we could have that discussion without the whataboutery...
We won't all agree, but without rational debate, without fear of being branded racist, islamophobic etc... We will never EVER be able to solve Britain's problems.
This is simply common sense..
Leave the whataboutery for the like of Owen Jones and Paul Joseph Watson.
EDIT: I believe I have replied to the wrong reply of yours mate but still.. The overall point stands
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
It's where and why you're going from and to that's the issue. Some try and skew perception...
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
In regards to George Floyd, I Do firmly believe that police in America need to be much better within the community and the way they engage suspects...
But doing something about the police, without doing something about the level of crime within the African American community will lead to zero progress..
We know that things like poverty play a part in crime, but there is still a large disparity in crime levels between black and white youths in America ...
THAT needs rectifying, could take decades
More engagements with police, more police incidents... This isn't talked about anywhere near enough
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
But that's the thing, it needs support and dragging people up, rather than demonising and skewing to fit a warped world view.
There are many posters who drive me mad at times (and probably I them!), but if I step back I can accept that ultimately they have a certain integrity in where they're coming from. A small minority however...
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
The government's, the media, they constantly separate humans through statistics and race... They only get offended when the general population do the same...
Change must start from the very very top... Hopefully that's just around the corner
I might not be great at articulating my points, but you get what I mean
Ring Of Steel
Well-Known Member
Some even put links up to videos which are nothing to do with racism, don’t even claim to be about racism, but then choose to use terms like ‘white guilt’ when describing them, thereby attaching a narrative which wasn’t there in the first place, then laughably say things like “I want equality” and accuse other people of stirring things up. No problem in debating anything but these types of people need to leave their horrible prejudices at the door if they’re going to try and contribute.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
It’s absolutely the case that Covid has highlighted deep inequalities in our society
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
From the BBC today: Ten Top Tips for Diversifying your work place
Top 10 tips for diversifying your workplace
How can firms diversify workplaces? Race equality business champion Karen Blackett has some tips.
www.bbc.co.uk
Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
But you then also have to take factors into account.
For example let's say a second 9/11 happened and thousands of people are killed in the attack, yet it was the only Islamic terror attack that year yet there were hundreds of lone gunman attacks by Christian fundamentalists that only killed a handful of people you can easily take that and say Islamic terrorism is a bigger problem because it killed more people, even though in terms of the number of people involved in terrorism the problem would far more to do with Christian extremists.
Same with crime. Blacks more likely to be involved in crime. So you have to ask why, and then what are the potential solutions? Poor people are more likely to be involved in criminal activity too. Black people are more likely to be poor. So is it because they're black or because their poor? Do poor people actually commit more crime per capita than the rich, given there's a lot more of them? Is the severity of the crime (esp in terms of economic crime) as bad - is a few thousand people claiming small amounts in benefit fraud anywhere near as bad a s a small handful of individuals commiting hundreds of millions in laundering that's nigh on impossible to trace? Look at the recent govt contracts - £100m + contracts given out without tender to companies with no experience in the field who just happen to be linked in some way to people in govt. You're going to have a hell of a time proving crime has been committed in doing so but it stinks of corruption.
So yes we can have the discussion but don't be surprised when that debate points out the nuances, possible causal links and potential bias of the statistics. It's nowhere near as simple as 'stats show this - case closed'.
Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
But it has also been shown that the treatment of white and black youths in similar situations are often very different. White kids are more likely to be let off with a slap on the wrist for things like minor drug offences etc. Black kids aren't and are far more likely to face prosecution and be convicted.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Whilst I don't disagree, incidents involving black individuals and the police are far more publicised often leading to massive sway in opinion... When you actually look at the levels of crime and interactions with the police, the levels of 'brutality' suddenly become less glaring based solely on race...
The problem is we are told over and over again what to believe but the statistics show (whilst still showing racial bias) that the problem is not just a police problem
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Just to make absolutely clear, it's not a black problem, either.
Nick
Administrator
I think all of it again comes down to taking responsibility for actions and people facing up to the reality of things. (regardless of colour).
If somebody is white, black or asian and is a c**t. People really shouldn't be going out of the way to excuse it "Oh but they are poor" type shite if the person is a wrongun. As we have seen a few times with people like D'OD, if somebody is black then they can't possibly be a wrongun and everything is just the colour of their skin.
As we saw with the lads in broadgate, couldn't possibly have a knife as they victims of a racial attack and the knife was planted.
What it needs is for all "communities" to start calling this shit out rather than trying to defend it. That isn't just black communities, this is everybody. Again, look at the racist c**t in broadgate who was unanimously called out by everybody on here.
If somebody is white, black or asian and is a c**t. People really shouldn't be going out of the way to excuse it "Oh but they are poor" type shite if the person is a wrongun. As we have seen a few times with people like D'OD, if somebody is black then they can't possibly be a wrongun and everything is just the colour of their skin.
As we saw with the lads in broadgate, couldn't possibly have a knife as they victims of a racial attack and the knife was planted.
What it needs is for all "communities" to start calling this shit out rather than trying to defend it. That isn't just black communities, this is everybody. Again, look at the racist c**t in broadgate who was unanimously called out by everybody on here.
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
nor should they dismiss the possibility that an officer has profiled someone on their appearance or where they're from and reacted according to his own preconceived view. Whether that is of the persons colour, appearance or where they're from.
Nick
Administrator
Exactly, there needs to be proof to show that though. It isn't everything is racist until proven otherwise.
Of course, there will be absolute wronguns within the police force and they should be called out as well. However when people start giving it the "every white copper is stopping that black man because they are racist" it's doing exactly what they seemingly have an issue with.
People need to start calling out the wronguns, of course that goes for all races, colours, communities, groups etc. Imagine if when that racist prick was in broadgate that fans groups started trying to defend him and make out he was a nice bloke but had just had a beer.
Then look at it the other way, organisations and communities were going out of their way to say that it was never ever possible that those 2 lads would have had a knife and that it was planted there. They were being racially targetted, chased because of their skin colour etc.
If somebody is walking around carrying a knife, they are a c**t regardless of skin colour. People shouldn't be going out of their way to defend it, condemn it. Regardless of who they are. None of the stuff like in this thread "the police only stopped him because of his skin colour" type bollocks.
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
I agree, but when I saw that video of the Leeds fan I couldn't see the lad was black because his face was distorted but I still thought that is horrendous and the police shouldn't be doing that regardless of his colour or what he's done which let's face it, as he was out celebrating his teams promotion was probably something pretty minor.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Nick
Administrator
It wasn't really that horrendous, they had their knee on his head and another officer had been attacked. The lad in Leeds was white I think but resisting arrest. Again, don't resist arrest and be a c**t and you don't get a knee on your head.
It's the same with bouncers in a way, of course there are some bouncers who are absolute pricks but when you go out now you see people in their faces giving it loads because the bouncers cant do anything about it. When I first started going out at about 15-16 if that happened you would get your head taken off.
Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
I've no doubt that there are individuals within groups that are seen as oppressed in someway, such as black, women, gay, trans etc, that take that view and use it as an excuse for anything they do when in fact the fault is theirs. Unfortunately that takes away from the prejudice against the group as a whole, which is often actually happening, and people use it as a reflection onto the entire group.
Alan Dugdales Moustache
Well-Known Member
Were either of them black or should I say none white ?
Alan Dugdales Moustache
Well-Known Member
I dare say because the lad was white, and a football supporter, it won't get much air time on the nationals. However, if the copper had his knee on his neck, it should , in keeping with the London incident, where a violent scumbag also resisted arrest but which also promoted hysterics because of his colour.