Trump is my favourite comedian of the year already (20 Viewers)

[skybluetony176]

The vote looks tight for me. Maybe they should have another one? Not sure everyone knew what they were voting for.

Presumably all those that had no issue with Gina Miller will understand if this goes to court too it is fair.

I don't care who wins, but all those frothing over democracy now were the same people demanding 'a people's vote'. Kind of funny.

Gina Miller went to court to ensure that British sovereignty was up held following the leave vote. At no point did she attempt to overturn the vote, in fact she ensured that the vote was upheld to the latter. Ironically it’s those that voted leave that didn’t want their vote honoured to the latter. Anyone who voted leave and doesn’t understand that then they quite frankly don’t understand what they voted for.

 

---

[SkyBlueDom26]

Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides

 

[Otis]

Yup

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Gina Miller went to court to ensure that British sovereignty was up held following the leave vote. At no point did she attempt to overturn the vote, in fact she ensured that the vote was upheld to the latter. Ironically it’s those that voted leave that didn’t want their vote honoured to the latter. Anyone who voted leave and doesn’t understand that then they quite frankly don’t understand what they voted for.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides

It’s a spectrum isn’t it. If trump had been reasoned and responsible like Biden in his speeches the spectrum would have been limited to law and a few protests. His actions and words mean the spectrum is magnified and you can genuinely see a roadmap that ends up with open civil war in the country. I can in any case and it’s so so sad

 

[clint van damme]

Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides

The difference is one candidate is making conciliatory statements and one is fanning the flames.
That's exactly why he has to go in my opinion. He's not fit to be leader of the free world. Don't get me wrong, I think Biden will be poor but at least he won't stoke a civil war

 

[David O'Day]

The difference is one candidate is making conciliatory statements and one is fanning the flames.
That's exactly why he has to go in my opinion. He's not fit to be leader of the free world. Don't get me wrong, I think Biden will be poor but at least he won't stoke a civil war

It's interesting how the one looking most likely to win is be contillatory.

 

[skybluetony176]

Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides

Naaa. Trump supporters are crystal clear in their message

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

The difference is one candidate is making conciliatory statements and one is fanning the flames.
That's exactly why he has to go in my opinion. He's not fit to be leader of the free world. Don't get me wrong, I think Biden will be poor but at least he won't stoke a civil war

I guess you could quite solidly argue that one side doesn't need to fan the flames, they already like to loot and riot.

Doesn't make what Trump is doing ok though, he needs to go. Peacefully I hope.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Naaa. Trump supporters are crystal clear in their message

Look at those good Christian white woman demonstrating to ensure their fellow Americans votes dont count

 

[chiefdave]

Look at those good Christian white woman demonstrating to ensure their fellow Americans votes dont count

The demographics of those protesting are interesting.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Hence my bit in brackets.

Pretty easy to manipulate in this day and age. It's a shambolic system. As I said earlier, even if there is genuinely is not any election fraud, it looks very fishy. For anyone involved.

I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.

Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.

If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.

You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)

There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.

*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides

Isn’t that because one side is annoyed about the President trying to stop votes being counted because he’s losing, and the other side has dumbasses who believe everything he says?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.

Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.

If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.

You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)

There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.

*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.

Some good points and I agree with most of what you said there.

I think considering the postal votes were started so early, having a cut off so they could announce it all at one time would make a lot more sense. I have seen a lot of reports of people finding bulk ballot papers in bins and stuff but it is difficult to know what to believe. As you say, even if something dodgy hasn't happened, it sure as shit looks a bit suspicious.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I don’t disagree. In a UK context, I’m a Labour voter and not switching anytime soon.

Without getting into the nuts and bolts of this, people just didn’t flip to Trump for no reason. Like many Labour strongholds, areas like Penn, Wisconsin and particularly Michigan have seen these areas lose their manufacturing jobs abroad. If the Democrats were at least perceived to be fighting for their interests, they’d still be beating the Republicans comfortably in these states.

If the Democrats learn from their battles with Trump (which they probably won’t), the changing demographics makes it entirely possible that they could dominate for 3 or 4 elections.

I get the argument but a lot of it is disingenuous. For example in the rust belt many programmes were put in place by the Dem's under Obama for retraining in things like tech and in some small cases renewable energy (not a massive thing over there as yet) to replace those lost jobs and it worked to some extent.

But there were those who just saw it as "no, we do manufacturing/steel etc, that's what we know so that's what we should do, regardless of the fact it was clear they couldn't be competitive and give the workers a decent living. Like people here who complain saying we need to get back into motor manufacturing. It's nostalgia and wishful thinking, not a path forward.

Instead, Trump came along with "I'm bringing manufacturing/steel jobs back" and it got lapped up by many in the region. So they cut the retraining programmes to focus the funding into those manufacturing etc jobs and very few were created because it wasn't viable. So some of those areas that had been badly hit in those industries but were starting to get back on their feet in new sectors ended up going backwards a bit because the growth sectors were ignored to go for the more traditional but declining ones.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

What are the odds on Trump going again in 2024?

He'll still be in the West Wing, just one in a prison.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.

Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.

If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.

You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)

There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.

*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.

Abolishing the electoral college is nonsense. Firstly, it requires constitutional change - around 66% in favour in Congress and/or the Senate. Secondly, and most importantly, it puts the power firmly into the hands of the largest states, California, Texas, NY and Florida.

In a UK context, we would let the city of London decide the outcome of national elections.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

It's not the first time either, he claimed that the Democrats bussed in millions of 'illegals' to vote in California. Which would make probably even less sense than this shit he's peddling now

That's crazy. Why do it in a state the Dem's are likely to win reasonably comfortably anyway. If you were going to do this you'd do it in swing stats like Penn and Wisconsin.

Be like us saying we're going to cheat for a penalty in a game we're 3-0 up in but not do so in a game that's 1-1.

 

[David O'Day]

Abolishing the electoral college is nonsense. Firstly, it requires constitutional change - around 66% in favour in Congress and/or the Senate. Secondly, and most importantly, it puts the power firmly into the hands of the largest states, California, Texas, NY and Florida.

In a UK context, we would let the city of London decide the outcome of national elections.

London has a lot more say over who wins an election than say Burnley due to the number of MPs it elects.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Really don't think they should release counts as they go on, either. That just stokes the flames. Just say what the final total was!

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

They will say the virus was put here to judge us for our sins

While ignoring the fact that without it Trump could very well have won. So if it's punishment from God it's punishment he's aiming at Trump.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Have to say, thank God we don't drag ours out this long! I know we're nowhere near as big and all that, but this is mentally drawn out. Will it ever end, or will they still be suing in four years?

Remember Bush and the 'hanging chads'? That was ongoing for months.

 

[fernandopartridge]

London has a lot more say over who wins an election than say Burnley due to the number of MPs it elects.

And indirectly through the candidates and media being obsessed with the market

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

lvanka I reckon. Big play about first woman President.

Wouldn't surprise me. Probably against Harris who I reckon will end up being President over the term assuming Biden wins. If not I would really love to see Michelle Obama take a run at it. I wanted her to go against Trump this time round because to see his head explode losing to an Obama, a black person and a woman all in one go would've be a sight to behold.

 

[SBT]

Some good points and I agree with most of what you said there.

I think considering the postal votes were started so early, having a cut off so they could announce it all at one time would make a lot more sense. I have seen a lot of reports of people finding bulk ballot papers in bins and stuff but it is difficult to know what to believe. As you say, even if something dodgy hasn't happened, it sure as shit looks a bit suspicious.

You still haven’t explained why it’s suspicious for votes which are postmarked before Election Day to be counted after Election Day. Nor have you got any evidence of anyone doing it, let alone any evidence of why it would be a good idea for fixing an election in the first place.

The ONLY reason most of the postal ballots haven’t been counted yet is because (mostly Republican) lawmakers in some states insist on waiting to count them. That’s it. Even Florida has its shit together, which is why it was called days ago.

I personally don’t mind if you want to spend another day peddling weirdo Trump talking points from Breitbart or wherever, but there are much more entertaining ones you can try - drugs, human trafficking, alien conspiracy theories, all kinds of stuff. Anything but this postal vote bollocks.

 

[Evo1883]

I really hope the removal of the orange, anti-truth, uber fuckhead will signal a world movement towards fucking common sense and decency. We don't half need it.

Ultimately everybody wants people in power who align with their own beliefs... Which is effectively what you're saying here... And that's fine tbh

 

[SBT]

London has a lot more say over who wins an election than say Burnley due to the number of MPs it elects.

Quite right too.

The US system is beyond farcical at this point. Republicans have won the popular vote just once since 1988, yet they’ve won three presidential elections. Tiny Republican states dominate the Senate because they have the same number of votes as giant Democratic states (and Washington DC doesn’t even get any votes!)

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.

Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.

If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.

You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)

There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.

*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.

It may to us but states have different rules and it’s perfectly legitimate to count every vote received by Election Day. If other states are going to take a few days counting then the decision is fine. If sometime arbitrarily decides that only votes that can be counted on the day then probably someone should tell the states and maybe change the legislation before accusing people of fraud

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.

Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.

If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.

You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)

There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.

*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.

You know there’s a pandemic on don’t you. I think most people thought a postal vote made sense this year. It really is no surprise there are so many

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Really don't think they should release counts as they go on, either. That just stokes the flames. Just say what the final total was!

That’s a really sensible idea

 

[Skybluefaz]

Ultimately everybody wants people in power who align with their own beliefs... Which is effectively what you're saying here... And that's fine tbh

I hear what you are saying. With Trump though I think it is pretty indisputable that he's not a decent person. Which is the point with him before you even begin to look at policies.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Some good points and I agree with most of what you said there.

I think considering the postal votes were started so early, having a cut off so they could announce it all at one time would make a lot more sense. I have seen a lot of reports of people finding bulk ballot papers in bins and stuff but it is difficult to know what to believe. As you say, even if something dodgy hasn't happened, it sure as shit looks a bit suspicious.

The other dodgy thing is why was it made so that voting of the mail in ballots couldn't begin in certain areas until after the on the day votes had been counted?

Only rational I could come up with was it was in areas where it was likely the mail in vote would favour Biden and would give Trump an excuse to claim victory, say postal votes were fraudulent and shouldn't be counted. That's exactly what happened.

Makes very little sense to me although there is a potential issue about postal voters also voting on the day and it enabling a check to ensure no-one voted twice fraudulently. You could say anyone with a postal vote is automatically removed from the list to be able to vote on the day. Some would argue you could then get people registering as other people for a postal vote so when they turn up on the day they're refused a vote because they're registered postal but the checks in place in terms of proving identity should minimise it and make it a very small problem.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

You still haven’t explained why it’s suspicious for votes which are postmarked before Election Day to be counted after Election Day. Nor have you got any evidence of anyone doing it, let alone any evidence of why it would be a good idea for fixing an election in the first place.

The ONLY reason most of the postal ballots haven’t been counted yet is because (mostly Republican) lawmakers in some states insist on waiting to count them. That’s it. Even Florida has its shit together, which is why it was called days ago.

I personally don’t mind if you want to spend another day peddling weirdo Trump talking points from Breitbart or wherever, but there are much more entertaining ones you can try - drugs, human trafficking, alien conspiracy theories, all kinds of stuff. Anything but this postal vote bollocks.

Can we have some common sense, please? You clearly haven't read my posts properly at all. The way you are talking clearly shows that.

I have repeatedly said I do not care who wins, it really doesn't bother me. If someone held a gun to my head I would probably say Biden, but I wouldn't be rushing to get my cock out for either one of them. I am not pushing any agenda, nor do I care about the result.

You are so one sided it is quite remarkable, especially compared to some posters on here. How on earth can you try and say the postal ballots are totally fool proof? If it was the other way round and Biden was behind, with Trump looking likely to win, you would probably be on here saying some shit about how Trump had fiddled it in his favour. As the interaction with Dreamer shows, even if there hasn't been any interference and it is clean (which I am sure is very likely), the whole process is fucked and there are definitely reasons to be suspicious. That goes for BOTH the Democrats and Republicans.

As I said, if Trump does lose, he should step aside. This stuff about 'no more votes' is a joke. Think you are getting worked up about not a lot and directing it in the completely wrong direction.

 

[skybluetony176]

This about sums it up. He knows the game is up but his ego can’t take Biden beating his 2016 total of 304 electoral votes, I think if the counting trends keep going the way they do and Biden swings states back to him he’ll end up with 306 electoral votes. Trumps only claim for a “win” is that he won more electoral votes in his first try than Biden did. I really think it’s that silly.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

It may to us but states have different rules and it’s perfectly legitimate to count every vote received by Election Day. If other states are going to take a few days counting then the decision is fine. If sometime arbitrarily decides that only votes that can be counted on the day then probably someone should tell the states and maybe change the legislation before accusing people of fraud

Totally. I suspect Trump probably thought he was going to walk it. If he had stepped down from his ego for a moment he might have covered that base.

Reminds me of the referendum. 'This is going to be easy'.... SHIT! Panic. Deluded arrogance never gets you that far sadly. Trump has a lot of that.