Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (220 Viewers)

[Sky Blue Pete]

Church leaders launch legal challenge over lockdown closure

Pastors claim human right to express religious faith infringed by second lockdown

www.independent.co.uk

Such an own goal for me. It’s 4 weeks. Chill out and have patience

How about FO and get in line like the rest of us.

 

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[David O'Day]

Cases in the Coventry area are going in the wrong direction again after seeming to level of and start to drop.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Cases in the Coventry area are going in the wrong direction again after seeming to level of and start to drop.

Yep. R of 1 still means 25000 or so infections doesn’t it

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Cummings leaving mean we'll listen more, or less, to the scientists?

Cummings seemed to argue with them and get his own way sometimes, but more influence for the likes of Duncan Smith would suggest scientists would have less of a role in policy going forward.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Cummings leaving mean we'll listen more, or less, to the scientists?

Cummings seemed to argue with them and get his own way sometimes, but more influence for the likes of Duncan Smith would suggest scientists would have less of a role in policy going forward.

How the hell has ids more influence in this world than me

 

[fernandopartridge]

Cummings leaving mean we'll listen more, or less, to the scientists?

Cummings seemed to argue with them and get his own way sometimes, but more influence for the likes of Duncan Smith would suggest scientists would have less of a role in policy going forward.

Come off it, Cummings was not in charge.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Nearly at 2k hospital admissions a day, the deaths without the arbitrary 28 day cut off are 60k+ already, it'll get pretty close to 100k by Christmas at this rate

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Come off it, Cummings was not in charge.

He has, perversely, been a filter from the likes of IDS though - a man whose utter and total failure as a leader doesn't, for some reason, stop him from getting a seat at the top table.

 

[Grendel]

He has, perversely, been a filter from the likes of IDS though - a man whose utter and total failure as a leader doesn't, for some reason, stop him from getting a seat at the top table.

Won’t stop Ed Milliband either of labour were in power

 

[wingy]

He has, perversely, been a filter from the likes of IDS though - a man whose utter and total failure as a leader doesn't, for some reason, stop him from getting a seat at the top table.

Depending on the path Boris takes (liberal)he knows he'll get the backing of Starmer , unless he swing's to the more hawkish zealots like IDS etc.

 

[wingy]

Won’t stop Ed Milliband either of labour were in power

Was Ed extreme?
Genuine question?

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Was Ed extreme?
Genuine question?

As ever, Grendel's missing what failure is, too, in his attempts to divert from what a horrendous shitshow IDS was and is. William Hague had terrible election results, but wasn't an abject failure as leader - it was entirely sensible he'd end up in cabinet later, if he wanted it.

IDS however, hounded out by his own MPs for sub-Corbyn levels of feebleness. Yet now, apparently, has the ear of the great and the good?!?

 

[wingy]

As ever, Grendel's missing what failure is, too, in his attempts to divert from what a horrendous shitshow IDS was and is. William Hague had terrible election results, but wasn't an abject failure as leader - it was entirely sensible he'd end up in cabinet later, if he wanted it.

IDS however, hounded out by his own MPs for sub-Corbyn levels of feebleness. Yet now, apparently, has the ear of the great and the good?!?

I do find it strange, does he know where the skelingtons are

How the media seem to go to him is befuddling.

 

[chiefdave]

But then isn't private enterprise supposed to be about adapting to change better and those that do thrive and take the place of those that don't?

For example, if you're not supporting smaller city centre businesses (even though many offices etc are now out-of-town business parks and city centres are largely full of chain outlets) you could instead be supporting businesses on your local high st by getting lunch etc from shops near your house. Unneeded commercial property etc could be replaced with housing/apartments which we know are undersupplied. This allows city centre to reimagine themelves as areas people live in again with greater access to things like entertainment on the doorstep. It could rejuvenate them massively and make them quite desirable.

There's huge potential and opportunities in making the change.

Very true. We've got a prime opportunity here to change things for the better yet there seems to be a strong desire to go back to how things were to keep property developers and huge international companies happy.

Interesting article about 15 minute cities which is a similar idea. Basically that instead of having to drive for work, drive to the supermarket, drive coffee shop etc everything you need is within 15 minutes reach of your house by foot, bike or public transport.

The 15-Minute City—No Cars Required—Is Urban Planning’s New Utopia

From Paris to Portland, cities are attempting to give residents everything they need within a few minutes of their front doors. Can it work—without leaving anyone out?

www.bloomberg.com

 

[Grendel]

Was Ed extreme?
Genuine question?

I was referencing him as an utter failure as a leader

 

[SBAndy]

I was referencing him as an utter failure as a leader

As ever, Grendel's missing what failure is, too, in his attempts to divert from what a horrendous shitshow IDS was and is.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Nearly at 2k hospital admissions a day, the deaths without the arbitrary 28 day cut off are 60k+ already, it'll get pretty close to 100k by Christmas at this rate

I check the total hospitalised covid patients on PHE reports Fernando (appreciate it’s England only) to keep an eye on the net increase in patients each day. The average net increase is a lot less than the 1.5-2k daily admissions as many patients admitted to hospital are now coming out again a few days later which is obviously great news (unfortunately some will also be passing away)

There’s been a couple of big jumps over the last few days but hope/think it’s settling a little.

Ps IDS was a poor leader. He certainly shouldnt be a big influence (gets way too much media attention)

 

[clint van damme]

Now I think anti vaxxers are absolute roasters.
But scanning today's news I've seen articles about Labour wanting social media platforms to censor anti Vax content and in Denmark they want to introduce enforced vaccination for certain groups.

A bit draconian surely?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Now I think anti vaxxers are absolute roasters.
But scanning today's news I've seen articles about Labour wanting social media platforms to censor anti Vax content and in Denmark they want to introduce enforced vaccination for certain groups.

A bit draconian surely?

Yes, new Labour is back most definitely

 

[Ian1779]

Now I think anti vaxxers are absolute roasters.
But scanning today's news I've seen articles about Labour wanting social media platforms to censor anti Vax content and in Denmark they want to introduce enforced vaccination for certain groups.

A bit draconian surely?

The focus groups don’t want their Twitter feeds full of this nonsense as it makes it more difficult to show off their Algarve photos and look for their next ski trip location.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Now I think anti vaxxers are absolute roasters.
But scanning today's news I've seen articles about Labour wanting social media platforms to censor anti Vax content and in Denmark they want to introduce enforced vaccination for certain groups.

A bit draconian surely?

Depends what. An I don't want the vaccine because it's unproven yet - fine. A Bill Gates eats your babies, less fine

 

[ajsccfc]

If it was part of a wider call for social media to do more about dangerous lies and the impressionable audience they reach I'm all for it

 

[SBT]

If instant bans for sharing unlicensed football highlights is fine, but censoring people trying to undermine public health is draconian, then sign me up as draconian.

 

[clint van damme]

If instant bans for sharing unlicensed football highlights is fine, but censoring people trying to undermine public health is draconian, then sign me up as draconian.

You think it will end there?
It's a slippery slope if you ask me, and If people don't want to get the vaccine fuck 'em, the more for the rest of us.

 

[SBT]

You think it will end there?
It's a slippery slope if you ask me, and If people don't want to get the vaccine fuck 'em, the more for the rest of us.

You’re focused on the wrong slippery slope. If people don’t want to get the vaccine, the vaccine is worthless.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Depends what. An I don't want the vaccine because it's unproven yet - fine. A Bill Gates eats your babies, less fine

Yeah, agreed. I don’t like lumping everyone in together, there’s various different ‘antivax’ groups from the absolute nutjobs to the ‘unproven’ concerned people you mention, to people like me and a couple of a my mates. We’re wondering if the risk of Covid to us (we reckon we’ve all possibly had it anyway) is less than a rushed vaccine and also whether we, as a country or world, will get away with just vaccinating those most at risk like with annual flu anyway

I think we’d all have it if that was the only we’d get herd immunity/protect others but otherwise I’d be in no rush to take for myself - that might well change when we know more about Covid and/or vaccines though

 

[Deleted member 5849]

You think it will end there?
It's a slippery slope if you ask me, and If people don't want to get the vaccine fuck 'em, the more for the rest of us.

I'm basically on Facebook for groups to share my hobbies. Turns out the people who like my posts are reactionary swivel eyed loons. Some of the posts on their profile pages are all about how government want to control, and track (if they thought rationally, they'd realise that even if they wanted to, our government would be unable to track our movements, even if they implanted all of us) and how the flu vaccine is really Mercury and kills everyone who takes it.

That kind of nutter behaviour is bad enough on a profile page. Extend it to adverts and absolutely, it should be banned.

Also, if any vaccine is 90% effective, it needs as many as possible to have it, to damp the risk. I'm not for forcing people to have it, but am for the censoring of crazed bullshit.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I think we’d all have it if that was the only we’d get herd immunity/protect others but otherwise I’d be in no rush to take for myself - that might well change when we know more about Covid and/or vaccines though

As said below, if a vaccine is only 90% effective, to damp rates it needs more to have it.

 

[fatso]

Surely it’s very simple, when the vaccine becomes readily available, all restrictions can end. Those that want the vaccine can have it, those who don’t won’t.
If you choose not to have it, and then you get it, you can self isolate for 10 days while you watch box sets on Netflix, and then your ok to go out again.
(That is the recommended treatment).
If you get it bad and end up in hospital, That’s your risk, get on with it.
It’s much the same for influenza, (Which is also a covid virus)

 

[chiefdave]

As said below, if a vaccine is only 90% effective, to damp rates it needs more to have it.

A quick google suggests exactly that. In the UK the aim for existing vaccines is 95% uptake. At that point the infamous herd immunity kicks in as circulation drops, below that you have things like the measles outbreak in Wales a few years back.

If the vaccine is 90% effective think what happens if only half the country agrees to have it, still huge potential for outbreaks and the NHS being overrun. Hopefully the anti-vexers are a loud but very small group and most people will have it so we can get back to something approaching normal by next summer.

 

[shmmeee]

Cases in the Coventry area are going in the wrong direction again after seeming to level of and start to drop.

Haven’t seen the data, but does it correlate with half term at all?

Now I think anti vaxxers are absolute roasters.
But scanning today's news I've seen articles about Labour wanting social media platforms to censor anti Vax content and in Denmark they want to introduce enforced vaccination for certain groups.

A bit draconian surely?

For background, I left Labour in the early 2000s because of their authoritarian tendencies. However in this case I think it’s spot on. Anti vaccine bollocks has the potential to kill considerably more than terrorism and do significantly more economic damage. A lot of it is pushed by hostile state actors.

It’s a criminal, health and security issue and we’ve set precedent with anti terror laws that we should crack down on it. Even then telling SM sites they have a broadcasting responsibility isn’t new here and no one AFAIK is taking about prosecuting individual nutters.

 

[shmmeee]

A quick google suggests exactly that. In the UK the aim for existing vaccines is 95% uptake. At that point the infamous herd immunity kicks in as circulation drops, below that you have things like the measles outbreak in Wales a few years back.

If the vaccine is 90% effective think what happens if only half the country agrees to have it, still huge potential for outbreaks and the NHS being overrun. Hopefully the anti-vexers are a loud but very small group and most people will have it so we can get back to something approaching normal by next summer.

One of the many things I’m proud of the U.K. for is that we have among the lowest levels of anti vaccine sentiment in the world:



And the few who say they wouldn’t take it are young and not at risk so aren’t 100% definite nuts.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

One of the many things I’m proud of the U.K. for is that we have among the lowest levels of anti vaccine sentiment in the world:

View attachment 17529

And the few who say they wouldn’t take it are young and not at risk so aren’t 100% definite nuts.

Surprised Brazil is so high, given their leader.

Not surprised China is low. When their government will do whatever they feel like to you, it's hard to be confident!

 

[David O'Day]

Haven’t seen the data, but does it correlate with half term at all?


For background, I left Labour in the early 2000s because of their authoritarian tendencies. However in this case I think it’s spot on. Anti vaccine bollocks has the potential to kill considerably more than terrorism and do significantly more economic damage. A lot of it is pushed by hostile state actors.

It’s a criminal, health and security issue and we’ve set precedent with anti terror laws that we should crack down on it. Even then telling SM sites they have a broadcasting responsibility isn’t new here and no one AFAIK is taking about prosecuting individual nutters.

With the 4 to 5 day incubation period the dip looks a bit too early for half term

 

[Ian1779]

Boris self isolating.....