What do we need to progress? (8 Viewers)

[shmmeee]

Half way through the season, we look like a bottom 8 side with potential to be mid table IMO (current post loss negativity aside).

Players have talked about pushing at the other end of the table next season, so what would we need to make that happen and become a top ten side?

GK - I like Marosi but I don’t think he commands his area well enough and that affects how the back line play. Also I think his distribution could be better. One of a few top L1/bottom Champ level players. I’d bring in a new GK permanently who is more dominant and more consistent with his distribution. Probably number three priority.

CB - McFafz has been a revelation so far this season, but isn’t getting any younger. I think Rose will come good, less convinced by Hyam especially his bringing the ball out of defence. I think we need a McFadz replacement and a LCB here. Maybe one loan one permanent. I’d have a cheeky go at prising Østigård away if his contract runs down. A solid defence makes the rest of the teams job easier as we saw last season so this would be my number one priority.

LWB - Need two in here anyway unless someone comes through from the U23s. Maybe another loan and a gamble on a younger player. Fourth priority.

RWB - I think we’re OK here.

CM - Kelly like Fadz has proved a lot of people wrong, but also proved he can’t be relied on. I like Sheaf long term and think he’ll keep improving. I expect we’ll sign him based on how often he’s played. Hamer obviously at the level. After that it’s slim pickings. O’Hare had potential but needs the pressure taken off him I think. I’d loan in an AM and bring in another CM (Walsh lol). Fifth priority.

ST - Walker and Godden will both score at this level I think but we need another option who can do the dirty work and get on the end of crosses. I’d spend a little here as well, number two priority. Maybe get a loan and a perm in.

Would leave us with:

GK/Marosi
CB/CB/Rose/Hyam/McFadz
LWB/LWB
Dabo/Dacosta
Hamer/CM
Sheaf/Kelly
AM/O’Hare
ST/ST/Walker/Godden

Then kids/Eccles/Drysdale/Bapaga/Jodi Jones/any of the rest we can’t move on to fill in any gaps. I’d be happy for the likes of Shipley, Allen, to stick around as squad players. Offload: Wilson, Pask, Kastaneer, Hilßner, Jobello

That’s four loans (CB, LWB, AM, ST) which is what we’ve had this season, and five signings, three fairly big (GK, CB, ST - Hamer/Sheaf/Walker style) and a couple of freebies/gambles (LWB, CM - Dacosta/O’Hare style)

Which would seem doable in a window all things being equal. Who knows no corona and we’re back in Cov maybe we get a budget boost?

 

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[Barnsley]

A budget same as the relegated premier league teams.

 

[SlowerThanPlatt]

A budget same as the relegated premier league teams.

You guys would be evidence at the moment that’s not always the case with shrewd management

 

[shmmeee]

A budget same as the relegated premier league teams.

I get your point but I think you need £15-20m to be competitive in this league even if £40m makes the job easier.

 

[KenilworthSkyBlue]

It's great to see optimism within the camp but I think the players discussing a push for a top 10 finish next season is slightly premature when survival this season is far from guaranteed.

 

[NortonSkyBlue]

Half way through the season, we look like a bottom 8 side with potential to be mid table IMO (current post loss negativity aside).

Players have talked about pushing at the other end of the table next season, so what would we need to make that happen and become a top ten side?

GK - I like Marosi but I don’t think he commands his area well enough and that affects how the back line play. Also I think his distribution could be better. One of a few top L1/bottom Champ level players. I’d bring in a new GK permanently who is more dominant and more consistent with his distribution. Probably number three priority.

CB - McFafz has been a revelation so far this season, but isn’t getting any younger. I think Rose will come good, less convinced by Hyam especially his bringing the ball out of defence. I think we need a McFadz replacement and a LCB here. Maybe one loan one permanent. I’d have a cheeky go at prising Østigård away if his contract runs down. A solid defence makes the rest of the teams job easier as we saw last season so this would be my number one priority.

LWB - Need two in here anyway unless someone comes through from the U23s. Maybe another loan and a gamble on a younger player. Fourth priority.

RWB - I think we’re OK here.

CM - Kelly like Fadz has proved a lot of people wrong, but also proved he can’t be relied on. I like Sheaf long term and think he’ll keep improving. I expect we’ll sign him based on how often he’s played. Hamer obviously at the level. After that it’s slim pickings. O’Hare had potential but needs the pressure taken off him I think. I’d loan in an AM and bring in another CM (Walsh lol). Fifth priority.

ST - Walker and Godden will both score at this level I think but we need another option who can do the dirty work and get on the end of crosses. I’d spend a little here as well, number two priority. Maybe get a loan and a perm in.

Would leave us with:

GK/Marosi
CB/CB/Rose/Hyam/McFadz
LWB/LWB
Dabo/Dacosta
Hamer/CM
Sheaf/Kelly
AM/O’Hare
ST/ST/Walker/Godden

Then kids/Eccles/Drysdale/Bapaga/Jodi Jones/any of the rest we can’t move on to fill in any gaps. I’d be happy for the likes of Shipley, Allen, to stick around as squad players. Offload: Wilson, Pask, Kastaneer, Hilßner, Jobello

That’s four loans (CB, LWB, AM, ST) which is what we’ve had this season, and five signings, three fairly big (GK, CB, ST - Hamer/Sheaf/Walker style) and a couple of freebies/gambles (LWB, CM - Dacosta/O’Hare style)

Which would seem doable in a window all things being equal. Who knows no corona and we’re back in Cov maybe we get a budget boost?

At this moment there is an axis of where the pressure is coming from in my opinion. That is Sheaf, Hamer and O’Hare. The inability to pass and receive a pass becomes evident when Kelly plays. When he is absent nothing sticks.
That theory excludes individual errors but is based on breaking down of possession from midfield to attack and exonerates the forward to a degree as the ball is not being put in areas that gives him an opportunity to get a shot off.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It's great to see optimism within the camp but I think the players discussing a push for a top 10 finish next season is slightly premature when survival this season is far from guaranteed.

Yup. Just stay in the league and fantasise about next season afterwards

 

[Magwitch]

Half way through the season, we look like a bottom 8 side with potential to be mid table IMO (current post loss negativity aside).

Players have talked about pushing at the other end of the table next season, so what would we need to make that happen and become a top ten side?

GK - I like Marosi but I don’t think he commands his area well enough and that affects how the back line play. Also I think his distribution could be better. One of a few top L1/bottom Champ level players. I’d bring in a new GK permanently who is more dominant and more consistent with his distribution. Probably number three priority.

CB - McFafz has been a revelation so far this season, but isn’t getting any younger. I think Rose will come good, less convinced by Hyam especially his bringing the ball out of defence. I think we need a McFadz replacement and a LCB here. Maybe one loan one permanent. I’d have a cheeky go at prising Østigård away if his contract runs down. A solid defence makes the rest of the teams job easier as we saw last season so this would be my number one priority.

LWB - Need two in here anyway unless someone comes through from the U23s. Maybe another loan and a gamble on a younger player. Fourth priority.

RWB - I think we’re OK here.

CM - Kelly like Fadz has proved a lot of people wrong, but also proved he can’t be relied on. I like Sheaf long term and think he’ll keep improving. I expect we’ll sign him based on how often he’s played. Hamer obviously at the level. After that it’s slim pickings. O’Hare had potential but needs the pressure taken off him I think. I’d loan in an AM and bring in another CM (Walsh lol). Fifth priority.

ST - Walker and Godden will both score at this level I think but we need another option who can do the dirty work and get on the end of crosses. I’d spend a little here as well, number two priority. Maybe get a loan and a perm in.

Would leave us with:

GK/Marosi
CB/CB/Rose/Hyam/McFadz
LWB/LWB
Dabo/Dacosta
Hamer/CM
Sheaf/Kelly
AM/O’Hare
ST/ST/Walker/Godden

Then kids/Eccles/Drysdale/Bapaga/Jodi Jones/any of the rest we can’t move on to fill in any gaps. I’d be happy for the likes of Shipley, Allen, to stick around as squad players. Offload: Wilson, Pask, Kastaneer, Hilßner, Jobello

That’s four loans (CB, LWB, AM, ST) which is what we’ve had this season, and five signings, three fairly big (GK, CB, ST - Hamer/Sheaf/Walker style) and a couple of freebies/gambles (LWB, CM - Dacosta/O’Hare style)

Which would seem doable in a window all things being equal. Who knows no corona and we’re back in Cov maybe we get a budget boost?

I’ve got to ask why are you saying get rid of Hilsner yet seem to be okay with Dacosta. Both have pretty well missed half a season and none of us really know what qualities either have. Now they both seem fit I’m treating both equally and from a standing start from now. In Hilsners defence he has had some sort of lung condition possibly asmatic.
Hopefully that’s sorted now so let’s give the bloke a fair chance.

 

[SlowerThanPlatt]

I’ve got to ask why are you saying get rid of Hilsner yet seem to be okay with Dacosta. Both have pretty well missed half a season and none of us really know what qualities either have. Now they both seem fit I’m treating both equally and from a standing start from now. In Hilsners defence he has had some sort of lung condition possibly asmatic.
Hopefully that’s sorted now so let’s give the bloke a fair chance.

Robins said he’s looking at loaning Hillsner out, I don’t know if that’s still the case given he’s creeped onto the bench last few games without being used.

 

[Paxman II]

Hilsner may threaten O'Hare's position once he gets match fit.
Overall it's too early to say much about our squad. Jones could come back and be a huge difference for example.
Don't understand thhe critisim of Wilson who has looked pretty good so far.

The only ones i worry over are those who have had the chance and are yet to show theycan do it at this level i.e:
Shipley, Max, Baka.

The suggestion Walsh is still the answer is silly. Like O'Hare in league 1 he was awesome but far less effective at this level so far. I think Walsh would not have the same impact at this level, hence he was not a part of match day squads at Bristol.
It's a playmaker we need and a leader. Someone in the mould of Dennis Wise, who was the perfect signing back when.

What's equally important is holding onto the likes of Dabo and Hamer.
It's a fun season and we look more than good enough to stay up and build for next season. There are worse teams than us in this league.

 

[shmmeee]

It's great to see optimism within the camp but I think the players discussing a push for a top 10 finish next season is slightly premature when survival this season is far from guaranteed.

Hence the question, is it realistic. I though the same but TBH when you break it down the main question is can we expand the budget to improve the quality. Maybe not playoffs but top half is achievable from what I’ve seen. We aren’t that far off teams around 12/13th already IMO.

 

[shmmeee]

I’ve got to ask why are you saying get rid of Hilsner yet seem to be okay with Dacosta. Both have pretty well missed half a season and none of us really know what qualities either have. Now they both seem fit I’m treating both equally and from a standing start from now. In Hilsners defence he has had some sort of lung condition possibly asmatic.
Hopefully that’s sorted now so let’s give the bloke a fair chance.

Mainly because Dacosta went straight into the bench and has been used in the short time since coming back to training and Hilßner only got on the bench once Jobello and Kastaneer were injured.

 

[Hobo]

We need to keep developing the players we have.

Prune a few from the squad.

Make a few more astute aquasitions Hamer/Sheaf/Ostigaard quality loan or permanent.

Have some luck with injuries - yes luck plays its part.

 

[cc84cov]

Same as I said pre season - experience at the level

 

[SlowerThanPlatt]

Same as I said pre season - experience at the level

Experience at the level doesn’t necessarily translate to success or better results. It’s interesting looking at this, the trends are that the oldest teams are underachieving and at the wrong end of the table and the youngest teams are overachieving in the main.

Top 6 oldest:
Blues (18th)
Wycombe (24th)
Millwall (16th)
Cardiff (15th)
Forest (22nd)
Sheff Weds (20th)

Top 6 youngest:
Barnsley (8th)
Brentford (2nd)
Coventry (17th)
Blackburn (14th)
Reading (6th)
Boro (9th)

Championship - Average age of formation

Average age for each team in the league Championship in the season 20/21.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Experience at the level doesn’t necessarily translate to success or better results. It’s interesting looking at this, the trends are that the oldest teams are underachieving and at the wrong end of the table and the youngest teams are overachieving in the main.

Top 6 oldest:
Blues (18th)
Wycombe (24th)
Millwall (16th)
Cardiff (15th)
Forest (22nd)
Sheff Weds (20th)

Top 6 youngest:
Barnsley (8th)
Brentford (2nd)
Coventry (17th)
Blackburn (14th)
Reading (6th)
Boro (9th)

Championship - Average age of formation

Average age for each team in the league Championship in the season 20/21.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

No, but it can help to have at least some players with experience of the league

 

[Blind-Faith]

Go all out to get Leo on a permanent. Sign Sheaf. Keep hold of Dabo and Hamer.

New GK
Young replacement for Mcfadz
2 lwb
Keep Kelly fit for a whole season
2 AM unless Bapaga can step up
1 decent striker

Bin off Baka Biamou Shipley Allen. ( although he’s looked handy last two games )

Easy right???

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Go all out to get Leo on a permanent. Sign Sheaf. Keep hold of Dabo and Hamer.

New GK
Young replacement for Mcfadz
2 lwb
Keep Kelly fit for a whole season
2 AM unless Bapaga can step up
1 decent striker

Bin off Baka Biamou Shipley Allen. ( although he’s looked handy last two games )

Easy right???

On our budget it’s going to take multiple windows. The difficult decision is where to start

 

[shmmeee]

On our budget it’s going to take multiple windows. The difficult decision is where to start

Maybe, but we brought in arguably seven or eight players of the right level last summer. I do think the limiting factor will be our wage budget though as each L1 player we upgrade will add to it.

For me you always start at the back. I think we’d score more of the WBs and CMs could play further up the pitch because the back three and GK was solid.

If only we could replicate Sisus first transfer window. A Westwood, Dann, Fox triple swoop would be perfect for us right now.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Maybe, but we brought in arguably seven or eight players of the right level last summer. I do think the limiting factor will be our wage budget though as each L1 player we upgrade will add to it.

For me you always start at the back. I think we’d score more of the WBs and CMs could play further up the pitch because the back three and GK was solid.

If only we could replicate Sisus first transfer window. A Westwood, Dann, Fox triple swoop would be perfect for us right now.

I I suppose the question I’m really asking is if we’re going to spend a 7 figure sum or two on a position, where do you go? I have real concerns up front more than anywhere else in that department and nobody any good there comes cheap. Though when Osti goes back we need to replace him and probably upgrade on one or two of the other CBs. Which is why I think it’ll take several windows to get it right.

 

[covcity4life]

For me priority is amc. Get top quality alongside o hare instead of Shipley or Allen and I think we are a big difference.

Would like go see hillsner given a chance

 

[Philosoraptor]

I've had a thought.

I don't want to step on anyone's toes here but I reckon I can make an individual ranking system based on the number of games an individual player has played at a football club based on the matches they win, lose or draw over the course of a season at a club.

The results could be bizarrely interesting.

 

[hill83]

I've had a thought.

I don't want to step on anyone's toes here but I reckon I can make an individual ranking system based on the number of games an individual player has played at a football club based on the matches they win, lose or draw over the course of their career at the club.

The results could be bizarrely interesting.

I always take the piss out of your confusing maths bollocks but I'd like to see that.

 

[Philosoraptor]

I always take the piss out of your confusing maths bollocks but I'd like to see that.

I'm having a good think. It is definitely possible. I think this may be a case of thinking more of if I could do it, rather than if I should do it.

 

[Barnsley]

No, but it can help to have at least some players with experience of the league

You can have a youthful team that’s also experienced, it’s not necessarily one or the other. Look at these 6 we’ve got in our squad
Luke Thomas 21 years old, played 126 first team games
Conor Chaplin 23 years of age, played 223 games
Callum Styles 20 years old, played 93 games
Callum Brittain 22 years old, played 137 games
Patrick Schmidt 22 years old, played 142 games
Bradley Collins (GK) 23 played 108 games.

That’s 6 players with the average age of 22 and they’ve played 829 games between them, at first team level. I’d say they’re pretty experienced. Most of our players have both youth and experience.

 

[stevefloyd]

We first of all need to improve the quality we have on the bench, I would imagine Robins thinks we need to change something in games and then looks at the bench with the likes of Pask, Kasta, Baka, Shipley and Max looking at him then he must think...fuck it we'll stay the same for a while! Obviously if we got upgrades to the actual playing squad then the bench would become stronger by default. I like Shmmeees idea of a new goalie and whilst I like Marosi he absolutely doesn't command his area in fact I think Wilson controls or attempts to control it a little better than Marco, Hyam of late seems to be caught out by pace but still worthy of a place atm but for me we need some better quality in the engine room to drive us forward as a unit instead of little cameos at present...a striker would definitely be nice because our back ups are not cutting it, Baka especially

 

[Winny the Bish]

I think the big decider will be how ruthless Robins is in the summer. We need as much wage budget as possible, which means being brutal and not only clearing out the players who aren't at this level, but some of the others that are borderline as well.

 

[lord_garrincha]

Well, apparently...

 

[procdoc]

It’s difficult when you haven’t got the finances. Finding hidden gems for peanuts is a lot harder in real life than it is on football manager. Hopefully we can develop the likes of Bapaga, Eccles, Ngandu, Burroughs, Newton etc into good first team options

 

[Magwitch]

Mainly because Dacosta went straight into the bench and has been used in the short time since coming back to training and Hilßner only got on the bench once Jobello and Kastaneer were injured.

Hilsner has had a serious lung condition ffs! and DaCosta a serious ankle injury. Was getting match fit a race, winner takes all ? I don’t know how good, bad or indifferent either are, nor do you but the very least both should be given time to show what they offer. Just saying let’s bin off Hilsner is codswallop to be honest. Like I have said proper supporters would give both reasonable time to see what they offer.

 

[lordy_87]

We can do better than Sheaf. If it was up to me I wouldn't sign.

 

[covhead1]

In terms of having players that have the talant/skill to compete in the championship we are very thin on the ground. Dabbo, Hamer and maybe a couple of other potentials tick the boxes, the rest need to up there game if we are to survive in this league.
MR also needs to step up as a championship manager and work on his tactics or we will be relegated.

 

[KenilworthSkyBlue]

Hence the question, is it realistic. I though the same but TBH when you break it down the main question is can we expand the budget to improve the quality. Maybe not playoffs but top half is achievable from what I’ve seen. We aren’t that far off teams around 12/13th already IMO.

I think you've opened a proverbial can of worms with that question. In a word, no. It isn't realistic.

If we remain in Birmingham for the foreseeable future there's no eventuality whereby I can see our budget increasing much. Not unless Joy takes the decision to either bring in a co-investor (which she's never previously had an interest in doing) or SISU themselves invests significantly (which is just as unlikely). I think even if we returned to the Ricoh the same logic would apply. In this event the budget would of course increase somewhat, but the gulf between ourselves and the top 10 would still remain significant - still putting us at a disadvantage against the competition. Regardless, in both scenarios the only way we'd be able to supplement the squad with better players is through our model. Sell, buy relatively cheap relative to their potential/ability, develop, and sell new player for times X.

The caveat to that is, if you consistently sell your best players season after season to finance transfer spend you're putting yourself at a distinct disadvantage as there's a probable risk that the players the club brings in won't be as good as what they've just sold. In my opinion, it'd be difficult to progress next season (assuming we stay up) if we can't build a squad around players such as Ostigard, Dabo, Hamer. But back to budgets. Budgets don't necessarily dictate league position but they certainly help paint a rough picture of how the season is likely to pan out. Of course, you'll always get a couple of clubs that break the mould and surpass expectations (E.g. Barnsley) but even if you take Barnsley as an example, their wage bill last season was quoted in the press at around the £10m mark the summer before last (more than happy for anyone to correct me on this if it's incorrect) - which is quite obviously greater than ours. Equally, if you look back at the past 2/3 seasons the 'smaller' clubs in the top 10 have had wage budgets starting just below the £15m mark at a brief look. What's our budget likely to be this season? At a guess 2-3 times smaller than the above mentioned figures.

The point is, when asking for a top half of the table push you're asking Robins to over perform at one of the toughest and most competitive leagues probably in the world with lesser players and a significantly lesser budget. So, I'll ask you, do you consider that as realistic?

 

[AFCCOVENTRY]

The biggest issue creativity in the final third. We need a couple of attacking/creative midfielders and another striker, as well as a Kelly type experienced CDM player.

 

[Grendel]

Hilsner may threaten O'Hare's position once he gets match fit.
Overall it's too early to say much about our squad. Jones could come back and be a huge difference for example.
Don't understand thhe critisim of Wilson who has looked pretty good so far.

The only ones i worry over are those who have had the chance and are yet to show theycan do it at this level i.e:
Shipley, Max, Baka.

The suggestion Walsh is still the answer is silly. Like O'Hare in league 1 he was awesome but far less effective at this level so far. I think Walsh would not have the same impact at this level, hence he was not a part of match day squads at Bristol.
It's a playmaker we need and a leader. Someone in the mould of Dennis Wise, who was the perfect signing back when.

What's equally important is holding onto the likes of Dabo and Hamer.
It's a fun season and we look more than good enough to stay up and build for next season. There are worse teams than us in this league.

Im speechless