COV
Well-Known Member
I agree with this, at least be honest about it
Do you want to discuss boring politics? (18 Viewers)
- Thread starter mrtrench
- Start date
I agree with this, at least be honest about it
COV
Well-Known Member
I'm not cheering either, but it beats pretending that they're actually a good government, and discredits any attempt to say they are.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
You know thats horse shit don’t you? Many do, we need to take more responsibility but many can’t and don’t have the opportunities you have and had
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
An honest Tory. What is the world coming to.
D
Deleted member 9744
Guest
Labour should have made the positive case for staying in the EU from the start. Corbyn was abysmal and he let people down on that. And he should have supported a second reforendum. We were promised that a vote to leave didn't mean leaving the single market. This is so damaging to the country.
But the real problem is the incompetent Government. But hey join the Tory media in criticising the Labour leadership. They did the same to Milliband, Corbyn and now Starmer.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Don’t think this is going to go away anytime soon. Might even be the beginning of the end of world king Boris.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
There are a wealth of stats out there to say that Corbyn did more appearances to support the Remain campaign than anyone else, including the self-appointed leaders of that campaign.
However in reality it’s failure to win came down to the sheer arrogance of its campaign, thinking it merely had to turn up and it would win. It’s failed to explain effectively that the Leave arguments rhetoric of immigration being the root cause was in fact utter bollocks used to stir up fear and division.
Furthermore when you look at the demographics of where the Leave vote was concentrated it’s no coincidence that it manifested itself in post-industrial areas that had effectively been left to fester by successive governments. No one had the desire or nous to anticipate that and offer a compelling argument as to why remaining in the EU would actually be better for those people and their lives.
Chuck in some grifters with lies on the side of a bus and here we are.
Your ‘blaming’ of Corbyn is laughable because he actually gave the remain side multiple chances to secure something of a softer Brexit. Opportunities squandered by the Lib Dem’s and the bellends that were TIG/CUK/WTF (who are hugely culpable for where we are today) for Custom Union 2.0, Norway style deals etc at the indicative vote stage because they delusionally thought that Swinson was going to be the next Prime Minister.
You are right one on thing - the Tories are the real villains here. But they exploited a group of people hell bent on fighting each other.
Starmer has had a really easy ride press wise in comparison to Miliband and Corbyn, and still barely makes an impact. What happens when they really go after him? We all know they will pull dirt from his days as DPP (things he did and didn’t do) - so then what happens?
oakey
Well-Known Member
IIRC during the referendum campaign Corbyn refused to do televised debates or share a platform with any Tories, preferring to tour Miners galas, Friends of Palestine and such-like fringe left wing events.
He may have persuaded a few on the far left whilst ignoring the rest of the population. Which rather neatly sums up his tenure as leader.
He may have persuaded a few on the far left whilst ignoring the rest of the population. Which rather neatly sums up his tenure as leader.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
He probably refused to share the stage with Tories that much is true, but I saw him on TV on at least a couple of occasions. I remember one such appearance on the Last Leg where he rated his love for the EU (or something like that) as 7/10, but then quantified his answer by daring to explain why it was not higher.
In fact his media appearances for Remain were only outdone by the incumbent PM and Chancellor.
But obviously he should have shown up on TV banging out some meaningless slogans rather than taking the time to articulate reasons as to why staying in the EU may have been beneficial.
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
I think it was correct not to share a platform with Tories given how well that tactic worked for them in Scotland.
It's funny how Corbyn has been morphed into some catch all baddy by both sides. Hard remainers think he was a secret leaver and and hard leavers think he was trying to get us to remain by stealth. The failure in his leadership was his insistence on compromise. He tried to understand both sides of the argument during a culture war where everybody else just took sides and he tried to get the PLP on board when their only objective was to get rid of him.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
He was useless regardless of the Sinn Fein suckupery - he was there by default - it was like having Andy thorn as manager - always going one way - down
oakey
Well-Known Member
I dont blame Corbyn at all for Remain being useless. I just point out that his personal contribution was small.
The Tories are 100% responsible for Brexit.
Labour should have had nothing to do with it. I think Corbyn was very conflicted and did his best. Which was very limited in its scope and appeal.
Trying to get nuance or compromise in a referendum?
The Tories are 100% responsible for Brexit.
Labour should have had nothing to do with it. I think Corbyn was very conflicted and did his best. Which was very limited in its scope and appeal.
Trying to get nuance or compromise in a referendum?
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
There were lots of underlying reasons as to why Brexit occurred. Even now very few have been even acknowledged never mind resolved. The Leave campaign exploited the immigration argument and went to town on EU corruption… yet the corruption at national level was just as bad and being done largely by those talking about the EU. Perfect deflection but Remain never produced a counter attack to it.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Id imagine must have had as much opportunity as me actually.
That’s not the real point though. People can and will decide the government if the day through an electoral process that’s been here for a century - it clearly works
Let’s also not fool ourselves here. The so called Tory bias in the press has always existed and actually I’d say Alexander Boris De Plefeill Johnson is the most disliked Tory leader in power by large sections of the press I can recall. Johnson is not a Tory - he’s socially and now clearly economically liberal and that’s not a desired leader by many Tory establishment figures in the media
Skybluefaz
Well-Known Member
Dorries is making her self look an absolute muppet at the moment, there is this, the Tommy Robinson stuff and the James O'Brien tweets. She should walk.
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
Fucking hell.
I'm sure the tory contingent will be as quick to condemn her inciting violence as they were to condemn Angela Rayners comments about the tories.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I think rayner made her comments this year not 10 years ago pretty desperate really
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
Is not resurrecting things from the past now a thing? Noted.
That’s a bizarre tweet and a ridiculous thing to say about anyone but there is no context (only an assumption that she’s not happy that her daughters speaking to RDH because he is black which Id imagine isn’t the case but who knows)
The tweet is from 2012 which is a reflection on where we are in society...basically dredging up anything from people’s social media past without context or providing a chance to reply. I’m glad I’m not on Twitter, I’d probably be inside by now
Ps that no justification for a stupid and potentially racist tweet...or one that could certainly be perceived to be
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
But even if there's no racist undertone, she's talking about getting a shotgun, I thought this sort of think wassupposed to be out of bounds?
Admittedly this was before Jo Cox and David Amess.
I agree mate. As I said, it’s a stupid thing to even joke about
Edit - my point was that I’d imagine most people would have posted/joked about something inappropriate in the past 10 years. Having said that if it was proven to be racist, she’d rightly have to go even considering time elapsed
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Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
Amazing coming from Mr 'But What About The Thing This Labour MP Did In The Past'!
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Well when I resurrect Labour MPs who called the death of a sitting Tory M.P. “a start” and that his comrade was arrested for protesting the murderers human rights that’s what I’m told
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Only in this government could someone with her ability find a place in the cabinet. #notacomplement
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Serious question. What do you think about the work of Jo Berry? A friend of Magees. Or the words of Harvey Thomas? Also a friend of Magees. Both also victims of the Brighton Bombing.
Im not entirely sure it was totally about corruption or what corruption there was .
Played on an old trope of unelected officials ruling us,but what that club did and quite well from my perspective was maintain a planned and provided for method of delivery of all our wants and needs ,yes there were butter mountains in the early days .
We can now possibly say that what we paid for all of that was too cheap?
Yet must have been in part behind the property price booms
Folk may now find out paying for those inflated monthly mortgage.fees not so easy as food and energy takes a larger share of income, Indeed either way the other way was good or now is more the real levels.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
She is what she is
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
2012 wasn't exactly the dark ages
Rose Paterson told of article linking her to corruption allegations
In a reply to an email from her friend, the Tory peer Anne Jenkin, Rose Paterson is understood have written: 'Sometimes I just feel like I should go into the garden and never come back.'
Skybluefaz
Well-Known Member
I agree that dredging up old tweets gets a bit tiresome but at the same time cricketers and footballers have been punished for it and we shouldn't have higher standards for them than politicians. It isn't just the Reg Hunter thing anyway, just the brass neck of her with her more than dodgy posting history in relation to this online hate bill.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
She’s attacked a certain James O’Brien repeatedly using expletives and even having a go at him for the school he went to, which apparently in a very ironic twist is also the same school her own children went to. She’s not ministerial quality. Well, except in this government.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
From @COV neck of the woods
Cork: Man charged with sending 'menacing message'
Daniel Weavers, 41, is instructed not to make unwarranted contact with UK Police Authorities.
www.bbc.co.uk
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Rose Paterson told of article linking her to corruption allegations
In a reply to an email from her friend, the Tory peer Anne Jenkin, Rose Paterson is understood have written: 'Sometimes I just feel like I should go into the garden and never come back.'www.dailymail.co.uk
Thos is pretty gross and completely against Samaritans guidelines on suicide reporting.