What the fuck has happened to England (22 Viewers)

[Deleted member 5849]

I'm feeling like I should be guilty in being pleased that for once in my life, an England side has been competing to actually win things.

Clearly, I should be miserable and depressed about that fact, as we didn't do it in enough style!

 

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[Otis]

I'm feeling like I should be guilty in being pleased that for once in my life, an England side has been competing to actually win things.

Clearly, I should be miserable and depressed about that fact, as we didn't do it in enough style!

You are a City supporter. You should be used to it by now.

 

[ajsccfc]

I'm feeling like I should be guilty in being pleased that for once in my life, an England side has been competing to actually win things.

Clearly, I should be miserable and depressed about that fact, as we didn't do it in enough style!

Last two tournaments have been some of the most enjoyable ones I've seen following England. Southgate's got plenty of faults but bless him for giving us something after that previous decade of rank misery in particular

 

[David O'Day]

the world cup was great as it had none of the expectations that people normally place on england

 

[1ccfc]

It's a friendly that the players don't give a fuck about and shouldn't be playing

Surly every time you're representing your country you should care? If you are right in what you say, it's a shame the Hungarian players weren't on the same page as they seemed to care.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

You are a City supporter. You should be used to it by now.

Thing is, I love the way we play at city atm. That style also gives Robins more leeway ref: results I feel, if they dip. Southgate's way doesn't really give much leeway in terms of results, but people appear to want to demand we win, and do it in some kind of superattacking style that doesn't need to cover Maguire & co.

And that's fine if you're Brazil, and are used to winning things with flair and panache. We're used to blundering around in qualifying tournaments and having mediocre campaigns if we get there, so from that base - going far in them is an immense achievement. Sure, say we were shit last night, but to piss on everything that's gone before just because of some naive view that we can bully everyone aside (and let's not forget that Erikssen tried to shoehorn the flair players in, when he'd have probably been better picking for a system - I liked Erikssen's period btw, unlucky in many respects, but we've done better now than then anyway, without a defender of the calibre of Ferdinand and Campbell in sight) is frankly ludicrous.

So, if we do poorly at the world cup, the manager goes, but I'm not going to start blundering around because somehow I get upset that at the end of the season, when players probably don't give a shit and would rather be spit roasting a Love Island contestant or two, that somehow a full list of ah buts can be brought out to run down results in major tournaments that just haven't happened before. That is irrefutable, it's a simple FACT, and there's no but about it.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Was that ex sky blue trust CJ that was on Sky Sports News?

Probably handing over a list of names of all the fans who he thinks misbehaved to the media.

 

[CCFC54321]

So it's everybody else's fault .. wow , this is a man that basically relegated middlesborough

Yes it’s a collective mess with the coaches and manager.

 

[SlowerThanPlatt]

Was that ex sky blue trust CJ that was on Sky Sports News?

 

[SkyBlueSoul]

Feels like an appropriate time to bring this gem back

 

[Otis]

Came across quite well I thought.

Bottom line is, getting rid of Southgate now is not a good move. It should have happened earlier if it was to have happened.

Isn't it now just three games to go before the World Cup? Pointless to bring anyone else in.

Southgate does need a long hard look at himself though.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Yes it’s a collective mess with the coaches and manager.

It’s the coaching staff
It’s the tiredness
It’s a meaningless friendly
It’s ok we made a final and lost
It was because there were too many attacking players in the team

Just excuses really. We have played unattractive and defensive football for years under Southgate. Saying it’s fine because of the results and he’s a nice bloke is all well and good until the unambitious football catches up and the results turn. Cue people saying

What do you want 0-0-10
Kevin Keegan isn’t who we need
We won’t get anyone better than a guy who sank Middlesbrough/is the most woke in our history

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Came across quite well I thought.

Bottom line is, getting rid of Southgate now is not a good move. It should have happened earlier if it was to have happened.

Isn't it now just three games to go before the World Cup? Pointless to bring anyone else in.

Southgate does need a long hard look at himself though.

Agreed. Though it’s always prudent to have a few options in mind

 

[Otis]

It’s the coaching staff
It’s the tiredness
It’s a meaningless friendly
It’s ok we made a final and lost
It was because there were too many attacking players in the team

Just excuses really. We have played unattractive and defensive football for years under Southgate. Saying it’s fine because of the results and he’s a nice bloke is all well and good until the unambitious football catches up and the results turn. Cue people saying

What do you want 0-0-10
Kevin Keegan isn’t who we need
We won’t get anyone better than a guy who sank Middlesbrough/is the most woke in our history

I would say it was a mixture of tiredness and the wrong team selection.

I thought Gallagher and Bowen both struggled, as did Philips, who just got swamped in midfield and doesn't possess the nous or skill to counter that. Bellingham clearly showed he does have through his trickery.

Forget about the meaningless friendly. We still should have turned up.

I was not at all in favour of employing Southgate, but he's here and we are stuck with him.

He has got us to a semi-final and final though of major competitions. That is an undeniable fact.

I think we are capable of more, but it is what it is and we have to cross our fingers and hope Southgate turns this current bad run around asap.

I would take defeats against Germany and Italy in the next two games as long as we put in a decent performance and show some promise.

 

[procdoc]

Why would he? The England job is nothing compared to a big club job.

Once again you prove yourself to be a crayon eater

Crayon eater, that’s a bit rich coming from an alcoholic IRA sympathiser

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I would say it was a mixture of tiredness and the wrong team selection.

I thought Gallagher and Bowen both struggled, as did Philips, who just got swamped in midfield and doesn't possess the nous or skill to counter that. Bellingham clearly showed he does have through his trickery.

Forget about the meaningless friendly. We still should have turned up.

I was not at all in favour of employing Southgate, but he's here and we are stuck with him.

He has got us to a semi-final and final though of major competitions. That is an undeniable fact.

I think we are capable of more, but it is what it is and we have to cross our fingers and hope Southgate turns this current bad run around asap.

I would take defeats against Germany and Italy in the next two games as long as we put in a decent performance and show some promise.

It was just that bottom of the table Championship midfielder that was too much to handle. As Southgate said the problem was too many attacking players on the pitch. We could have used another centre back, another holding midfielder and probably another keeper

 

[David O'Day]

Crayon eater, that’s a bit rich coming from an alcoholic IRA sympathiser

get your own shite jokes and stop playing up to a 5ft tramp who pretends he worked for jlr

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

get your own shite jokes and stop playing up to a 5ft tramp who pretends he worked for jlr

Speaking of which what’s your trade?

 

[Evo1883]

Yea CJ spoke sense tbh

 

[procdoc]

get your own shite jokes and stop playing up to a 5ft tramp who pretends he worked for jlr

What do you do for a living? And fighting over the dry seat in impulse doesn’t count as a job

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

Good players with an average manager. He should have left all of the big guns out of these games were they have looked disinterested at least he would have had an excuse and they would have had a good rest.

I would sack him but I wouldn’t have let him run the team at the euros either.

 

[CJ_covblaze]

Unbelievably poor and pathetic. Can only think of two occasions where I’ve seen us play poorer than that. Ramsdale will want two of those goals back. August Kyle Walker and June Kyle Walker are like polar opposites. Phillips looked like he was running in treacle from kick off. Gallagher tried a few things but very little seemed to work for him. Saka probably put in his worst performance in an England shirt. The only player that came out of it with any amount of credit was Bellingham who’s 18 years old ffs.

The only positives were it proved how much we need Maguire and Pickford to start and it was nice to have a game away from Wembley.

 

[FulltimeWum]

If a Mourinho side went one nil up at home in a final, the shit housery on show would be on a par with the Porto Celtic final.

Lack of leaders and desire throughout the team.

 

[CCFC54321]

Unbelievably poor and pathetic. Can only think of two occasions where I’ve seen us play poorer than that. Ramsdale will want two of those goals back. August Kyle Walker and June Kyle Walker are like polar opposites. Phillips looked like he was running in treacle from kick off. Gallagher tried a few things but very little seemed to work for him. Saka probably put in his worst performance in an England shirt. The only player that came out of it with any amount of credit was Bellingham who’s 18 years old ffs.

The only positives were it proved how much we need Maguire and Pickford to start and it was nice to have a game away from Wembley.

Didn’t think Bellingham was anything special and I’m not sold on the hype surrounding Bellingham in an England shirt to date…

 

[CJ_covblaze]

Didn’t think Bellingham was anything special and I’m not sold on the hype surrounding Bellingham in an England shirt to date…

When he’s been on the pitch we’ve looked so much better. He drives us forward and causes the opposition problems. As I said too, 18 years old.

 

[stupot07]

It was just that bottom of the table Championship midfielder that was too much to handle. As Southgate said the problem was too many attacking players on the pitch. We could have used another centre back, another holding midfielder and probably another keeper

Too many attacking players, but failed to even look like scoring

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

He should have gone after the Euros. At least Poch is tactically more astute than Fraudgate and the football would be better. Anyone who thinks Southgate is doing a good job need to follow a different sport as they clearly know nothing about football

Not sure how you can justify sacking a manager getting you to a final of a major tournament.

You’re assuming Poch would even want the job. I highly doubt he would. There’s a reason we ended up with Southgate in the first place!

Frankly, his major tournament record speaks for itself. ‘Better’ managers messed up easier paths (Capello 2010).

 

[Nick]

Not sure how you can justify sacking a manager getting you to a final of a major tournament.

Got to a final and pretty much fucked it up. Does that mean he has a job for life?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not sure how you can justify sacking a manager getting you to a final of a major tournament.

You’re assuming Poch would even want the job. I highly doubt he would. There’s a reason we ended up with Southgate in the first place!

Frankly, his major tournament record speaks for itself. ‘Better’ managers messed up easier paths (Capello 2010).

The man himself did question whether he had taken the side as far as he could.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Got to a final and pretty much fucked it up. Does that mean he has a job for life?

Not at all. Ultimately, he’s judged on major tournaments and we’ll see what happens this year.

We didn’t ‘fuck up’ the final. We played the in-form team, best then in the first half and momentum switched and lost on penalties. Hardly a ‘fuck up’.

The man himself did question whether he had taken the side as far as he could.

That might be the case, and these last four games is an opportunity for Southgate to take stock of everything and change the preparation for the tournament.

I’m sorry, but regardless if anyone’s opinion on Southgate, from the highest praise to the most critical… Any reasonable person would think sacking a manager 2 games before the World Cup is a ridiculous idea.

If we under perform in 2022, it’s hardly the case it’s anything unique about Southgate. We had some brilliant teams and players between 2002 and 2010 and did absolutely nothing in 5 tournaments (we didn’t even make one).

By contrast, 2018 was probably one of the worst squads (on paper) in my time, and we got to a semi final.

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

Not at all. Ultimately, he’s judged on major tournaments and we’ll see what happens this year.

We didn’t ‘fuck up’ the final. We played the in-form team, best then in the first half and momentum switched and lost on penalties. Hardly a ‘fuck up’.



That might be the case, and these last four games is an opportunity for Southgate to take stock of everything and change the preparation for the tournament.

I’m sorry, but regardless if anyone’s opinion on Southgate, from the highest praise to the most critical… Any reasonable person would think sacking a manager 2 games before the World Cup is a ridiculous idea.

If we under perform in 2022, it’s hardly the case it’s anything unique about Southgate. We had some brilliant teams and players between 2002 and 2010 and did absolutely nothing in 5 tournaments (we didn’t even make one).

By contrast, 2018 was probably one of the worst squads (on paper) in my time, and we got to a semi final.

Southgate definitely fucked up the final. As he did agaisnt Croatia in 2018, and Holland in the nations league. He took the league and went Cautious trying to hold a slender lead

Southgate has dragged us back to relevancy but it’s clear he doesn’t know how to win. He talks about scoring goals, but plays 2DMs and Mason Mount as his most attacking midfielder. He has some of the most talented attacking players we’ve seen in years but doesn’t want to play them

I’m not too worried at the moment, I like the nations league but currently it’s just glorified friendlies, and even worse they’ve tacked on 4 games to the end of the season. Half the team looked like they couldn’t be arsed. Come November they’ll be all fit and good to go.

 

[Otis]

This made me chuckle. Football365 and their ratings of the England team from Tuesday.

Mason Mount.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Southgate definitely fucked up the final. As he did agaisnt Croatia in 2018, and Holland in the nations league. He took the league and went Cautious trying to hold a slender lead

Southgate has dragged us back to relevancy but it’s clear he doesn’t know how to win. He talks about scoring goals, but plays 2DMs and Mason Mount as his most attacking midfielder. He has some of the most talented attacking players we’ve seen in years but doesn’t want to play them

I’m not too worried at the moment, I like the nations league but currently it’s just glorified friendlies, and even worse they’ve tacked on 4 games to the end of the season. Half the team looked like they couldn’t be arsed. Come November they’ll be all fit and good to go.

He clearly does know how to win because he has the highest win % of any England manager with the exception of Sir Alf Ramsey.

There’s a reason for our caution. Our defence really isn’t that good. Maguire and Stones as centre backs? Both good defenders, but not in the same plane as Campbell, Ferdinand and Terry.

Italy were the favourites going into the final, yet England fans believe we’re entitled to have won it. We went 1-0 and we’re on top for most of the first half and the game slipped away from us. Croatia’s 2018 team was probably better than our team and likewise with the Netherlands in 2019.

Likewise, the England fans would probably start all; Mount, Grealish and Foden which would be way too unbalanced.

Ironically, we tried playing just the one DM v Hungary and really tried to attack at 2-0 down and we were too open. Which shows that Southgate isn’t completely clueless to be cautious.

Personally, I think the team will kick on and do well in Qatar. Either way, most England fans will get what they want because Southgate will probably leave. The mood towards him is completely toxic.

Joachim Low and Santos, who won international trophies with Germany and Portugal have terrible club CVs. Which shows that international management is not dependent on club success and that Southgate’s club CV is irrelevant. He earned his stripes managing the age-groups and as a technical director.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not at all. Ultimately, he’s judged on major tournaments and we’ll see what happens this year.

We didn’t ‘fuck up’ the final. We played the in-form team, best then in the first half and momentum switched and lost on penalties. Hardly a ‘fuck up’.



That might be the case, and these last four games is an opportunity for Southgate to take stock of everything and change the preparation for the tournament.

I’m sorry, but regardless if anyone’s opinion on Southgate, from the highest praise to the most critical… Any reasonable person would think sacking a manager 2 games before the World Cup is a ridiculous idea.

If we under perform in 2022, it’s hardly the case it’s anything unique about Southgate. We had some brilliant teams and players between 2002 and 2010 and did absolutely nothing in 5 tournaments (we didn’t even make one).

By contrast, 2018 was probably one of the worst squads (on paper) in my time, and we got to a semi final.

Well I personally haven’t said sack him. In 2002 we narrowly lost to the eventual winners Brazil because of Seaman’s blunder. 2004 we had a legit winning goal chalked off against the hosts. 2006 a penalty shootout. Eriksson did also very quickly turn around the pretty bleak situation Keegan had left him with.

This is the problem with only focusing on the results or final outcome. The game against Scotland summed Southgate up. Still insisting on trying to nick a goal against crap like that at home with our best players walking through treacle. If you’re going to play sleep inducing football then the margin of patience is very thin.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Well I personally haven’t said sack him. In 2002 we narrowly lost to the eventual winners Brazil because of Seaman’s blunder. 2004 we had a legit winning goal chalked off against the hosts. 2006 a penalty shootout. Eriksson did also very quickly turn around the pretty bleak situation Keegan had left him with.

This is the problem with only focusing on the results or final outcome. The game against Scotland summed Southgate up. Still insisting on trying to nick a goal against crap like that at home with our best players walking through treacle. If you’re going to play sleep inducing football then the margin of patience is very thin.

Did Southgate not inherit a bleak situation? Iceland and Costa Rica knocked us out of our last two major tournaments in 2014 and 2016.

Why are you or anyone bothered by the Scotland result? It was a boring 0-0, but having beaten Croatia, a draw against Scotland guaranteed qualification. That was their cup final whereas we were trying to peak for the knockout stages i.e. exactly what happened.

We also scored the most goals in the KO stages in the Euros and only we scored 2 less goals than Italy and Spain in the whole tournament.

Our group was objectively more difficult than their Groups too.