Do you want to discuss boring politics? (130 Viewers)

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CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
Deleted member 5849 said:
Indeed. My point still stands!
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My concern with Sunak is I’ve not seen any ideas to help
Brighton Sky Blue said:
My concern is that this like other problems facing society at large requires expertise, nuance and long term thinking. We don’t have a political system or dare I say an electorate that encourages that but instead encourages short term promises and flashy slogans.

I would very much like to see VAT scrapped or substantially lowered and the minimum wage to go up but beyond that one has to look at the root cause of the inflation. Lowering trade barriers with the EU would likely help but be unpopular with people who conflate that with wanting to rejoin. The energy price crisis could be eased by switching to nuclear, but instead the government is focused on coal mines instead because it wins votes.

It’s a time for technocrats to be in office but our system makes it very hard for such people to get elected.
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Spot on about short term planning. I’ve always throught stuff like energy there should be attempts to find some cross party consensus around at least some of the long term plans/strategy so it’s maintained whoever’s in government and doesn’t become a political football
 
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
clint van damme said:
We have totally mismanaged our energy, (and water) for years with privatisation playing a big part of it.
Its time to go back to the drawing board. Martin Lewis claims these latest price rises will push 10 million people into poverty. I don't know if that's true but even if it's a tenth of that its scandalous.
(Cue some tory fan boy waffling on about how badly Germany are doing as if that makes our situation OK).
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The French have used nuclear power for years and really so should we. A very low carbon energy source, abundant energy from tiny amounts of fuel and research is constantly improving our ability to ‘recycle’ the spent fuel.

In the long term I’d want to see serious thought put into a solar power grid to install in the Sahara which could meet the energy demands of Africa and Europe combined. It would also go some way to repaying the debt Europe especially owes that continent.
 
clint van damme

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
My concern with Sunak is I’ve not seen any ideas to help


Spot on about short term planning. I’ve always throught stuff like energy there should be attempts to find some cross party consensus around at least some of the long term plans/strategy so it’s maintained whoever’s in government and doesn’t become a political football
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I think there has been consensus, maximise profits and dividends for executives andshare holders!
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
clint van damme said:
We have totally mismanaged our energy, (and water) for years with privatisation playing a big part of it.
Its time to go back to the drawing board. Martin Lewis claims these latest price rises will push 10 million people into poverty. I don't know if that's true but even if it's a tenth of that its scandalous.
(Cue some tory fan boy waffling on about how badly Germany are doing as if that makes our situation OK).
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It is scandalous and I’d be shocked if the government didn’t do more to help people when the cap rises. My point was just that this isn’t just a U.K. problem is relevant though and also that the government might need to think about more innovative solutions to solve the wider inflation problem

Or we can just hope the war ends soon and a reduction on global growth will force at least oil prices down
 
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
My concern with Sunak is I’ve not seen any ideas to help


Spot on about short term planning. I’ve always throught stuff like energy there should be attempts to find some cross party consensus around at least some of the long term plans/strategy so it’s maintained whoever’s in government and doesn’t become a political football
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Also applies to education and the health system. These aren’t things that politicians should be dabbling in but have all suffered from short termist thinking.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
The French have used nuclear power for years and really so should we. A very low carbon energy source, abundant energy from tiny amounts of fuel and research is constantly improving our ability to ‘recycle’ the spent fuel.

In the long term I’d want to see serious thought put into a solar power grid to install in the Sahara which could meet the energy demands of Africa and Europe combined. It would also go some way to repaying the debt Europe especially owes that continent.
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The neglect of nuclear has been a disgrace but we all know there’s been a big anti nuclear movement in this country, same with fracking (I know there are issues)… at least probably partially funded by big oil/gas, Putin and using some useful eco idiots

France are ok at the moment but half of their nuclear plants aren’t working properly and need replacing. Im guessing that would be 10s or 100s bns of government investment

We need to hope renewable tech keeps improving at a rapid rate…not really the best policy I appreciate 😊
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
My concern with Sunak is I’ve not seen any ideas to help


Spot on about short term planning. I’ve always throught stuff like energy there should be attempts to find some cross party consensus around at least some of the long term plans/strategy so it’s maintained whoever’s in government and doesn’t become a political football
Click to expand...

This always makes me laugh when people say an issue is too important for politics and people should just agree. I know what you mean but if people could do that we wouldn’t need politics.

This BTW is why benevolent dictator is by far the best form of government. Just need to find the right dictator.
 
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
The neglect of nuclear has been a disgrace but we all know there’s been a big anti nuclear movement in this country, same with fracking (I know there are issues)… at least probably partially funded by big oil/gas, Putin and using some useful eco idiots

France are ok at the moment but half of their nuclear plants aren’t working properly and need replacing. Im guessing that would be 10s or 100s bns of government investment

We need to hope renewable tech keeps improving at a rapid rate…not really the best policy I appreciate 😊
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As a scientifically minded person I don’t think the anti nuclear arguments stand up to scrutiny when weighed up against what we can see happening due to burning tonnes of carbon instead. Nuclear is also not meant to be a long term answer-the fuel itself is finite-but it buys humanity the time to get a long term solution in place. Solar is the solution but as I said, only if first world nations are willing to invest heavily in and work with African nations to pull it off.

My own view is there are just too many selfish entities getting in the way when really this century is our last chance saloon.
 
W

wingy

Well-Known Member
It's been 40-50 years in the making.
Consequence of the shrinking state , utterly implausible to me the lack of long-term strategy.
I don't know which regime sold which portion off but I do know who started it.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
This always makes me laugh when people say an issue is too important for politics and people should just agree. I know what you mean but if people could do that we wouldn’t need politics.

This BTW is why benevolent dictator is by far the best form of government. Just need to find the right dictator.
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You know what I mean though, at least some consensus to say, long term energy security
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
The French have used nuclear power for years and really so should we. A very low carbon energy source, abundant energy from tiny amounts of fuel and research is constantly improving our ability to ‘recycle’ the spent fuel.

In the long term I’d want to see serious thought put into a solar power grid to install in the Sahara which could meet the energy demands of Africa and Europe combined. It would also go some way to repaying the debt Europe especially owes that continent.
Click to expand...

The answer is so obviously nuclear baseline with renewables and energy storage, the constant silly games played around restricting onshore wind or whatever are so frustrating. The left doesn’t want nuclear and the right doesn’t want renewables.
 
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
The answer is so obviously nuclear baseline with renewables and energy storage, the constant silly games played around restricting onshore wind or whatever are so frustrating. The left doesn’t want nuclear and the right doesn’t want renewables.
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Yes I do get some funny looks in left wing circles for arguing in favour of nuclear plants across the country
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
You know what I mean though, at least some consensus to say, long term energy security
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Thing is there’s not much left for the politicians. I always felt the issue with education was it was a twenty year long system run by people with five year timeframes. So a kid can have four or more different ideologies and initiatives in their school career.

As you say energy and climate is another. Infrastructure generally arguably.

I’d rather we just started electing sensible politicians who can take advice and think past their own reelection. But that’s probably just as wild a pipe dream.
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
This always makes me laugh when people say an issue is too important for politics and people should just agree. I know what you mean but if people could do that we wouldn’t need politics.

This BTW is why benevolent dictator is by far the best form of government. Just need to find the right dictator.
Click to expand...
According to many people on my coventry live Facebook feed the media have just forced him out lol
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Yes I do get some funny looks in left wing circles for arguing in favour of nuclear plants across the country
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That and GMO stuff is what put me off the Greens for life. Like your whole thing is the environment yet you are vehemently against the main thing that could make a difference. Absolutely nuts.
 
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
That and GMO stuff is what put me off the Greens for life. Like your whole thing is the environment yet you are vehemently against the main thing that could make a difference. Absolutely nuts.
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I guess a good number of these people haven’t really reflected deep down on where their beliefs come from. GM crops are how we get more from less, likewise nuclear. It should be right up their street if it’s about maximising resources.
 
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PVA

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
Spot on about short term planning. I’ve always throught stuff like energy there should be attempts to find some cross party consensus around at least some of the long term plans/strategy so it’s maintained whoever’s in government and doesn’t become a political football
Click to expand...

Yes absolutely.

Prime example the other day, obviously not energy, but when they announced Zawahi and Johnson were going to be announcing a new economic plan... The day after Zawahi became chancellor.

Now it may be the plan had already been formulated between Sunak and Johnson and they were just going to put Zawahi's name on it. But I think in reality he he was going to spend the night coming up with something on the back of a fag packet with less than 24 hours in the job to present something half arsed purely for political gain
 
skybluetony176

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
What gets me with solar is the lack of promotion from the government. Every business on every industrial estate in the UK should have solar on their roof. All that free space going to waste and in the working day they’ll use what they produce being a benefit to grid pressure, the businesses energy costs and also a chance to generate income over the weekend while closed. It needs the government to work with the private landlords to force the allowance for installation and work with the businesses to help with the investment costs through grants or lead in tariffs or a combination of both.

The government controls building standards, they could have been insisting that all new build’s residential and commercial have an element of solar in the construction for years now meaning all new properties are more energy efficient from the off.

Short term thinking again.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I guess a good number of these people haven’t really reflected deep down on where their beliefs come from. GM crops are how we get more from less, likewise nuclear. It should be right up their street if it’s about maximising resources.
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It’s not perfect though so they don’t want it. That’s the crazy world we live in. In the meantime let’s power up the coal mines and let half the world starve
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
So....who is the least damaging option for new leader?

Javid? Wallace? Hunt?

We certainly don't want Truss do we.

This is what Dominic Cummings said about her....

Screenshot_2022-07-09-11-05-20-05_40deb401b9ffe8e1df2f1cc5ba480b12.jpg

Screenshot_2022-07-09-11-06-57-73_40deb401b9ffe8e1df2f1cc5ba480b12.jpg
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
Ben Wallace withdraws from the running.

Big surprise as he was seemingly front runner.

Seemed to be one of the less mental options so that's good news for Labour.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Ben Wallace withdraws from the running.

Big surprise as he was seemingly front runner.

Seemed to be one of the less mental options so that's good news for Labour.
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I’d heard yesterday he might not fancy it. Has one eye on NATO leader. Shame as a credible contender even if I don’t really know what he’d stand for
 
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