Wasps going into admin & the impact on CCFC (170 Viewers)

[MalcSB]

The bond feels like some sort of pyramid scheme. Use the most bond money to pay the lease. Use rest to cover losses. As doesn't look like wasps put much of their own money in.

None of their own money, even used the bondholders money to pay the first three years interest.

 

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[jordan210]

He’s not. He’s talking about Wasps Holdings, not ACL.


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Its under : What is happening to the training ground and the stadium

Reads as a typical wasps statement with lots of "positive news" with out actual any news.


Wasps would not be able to afford to be a tenant in the area. so all a bit odd

Unless they are trying to get a buyer o the basses that wasps would still be there and that = rent

 

[fernandopartridge]

There is supposedly a forfeiture clause in the case of insolvency in the head lease. However, CCC would have to trigger that clause once the insolvency is known (and for ACL it isn‘t known yet). The bondholders, who hold a legal mortgage over the stadium, would have the right to challenge any forfeiture in court, as indicated in the bonds prospectus. Some of the bondholders point to legal precedent as suggesting they would win such a challenge.

There is also supposedly a clause giving the council the power of veto against prospective purchasers. I would be surprised if that couldn’t also be challenged by bondholders if the application of the veto would reduce the proceeds from the sale.

You'd have thought there was some provision in the head lease for the freeholder to consent to the head lease being used as security. If there was then why on earth did the council consent? Apart from it being a way to get the £14m lump quickly?

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[Nick]

You'd have thought there was some provision in the head lease for the freeholder to consent to the head lease being used as security. If there was then why on earth did the council consent? Apart from it being a way to get the £14m lump quickly?

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Especially as they kept saying that's one of the reasons they wouldn't sell to SISU.

 

[MalcSB]

The most likely solution is that following administration the stadium/long lease is sold* and bondholders get Xp in the pound (as I can’t see it selling for more than £35m and that’s before any professional fees). At that point the stadium will be free from any debts/liabilities…unless new owner has borrowed against it

*there might be a period of trading I guess and that’s what CCC might have to help fund. If so, they’d receive repayment of this before bondholders receive their distribution

Bondholders also have a claim on funds received for the P share - £9m or so.

 

[SHUNT31]

Bondholders also have a claim on funds received for the P share - £9m or so.

So Wasps saying they want to keep P share. Surely with admin they will be forced to sell it to pay the creditors?


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[chiefdave]

Wasps' administrator gives 'confident' update but makes time admission

Wasps Holdings Limited made 167 staff members redundant on Monday

www.coventrytelegraph.net

Little bit concerned by this article, not going to lie.

I don’t want them in Coventry, full stop.

Also says an accelerated merger or acquisition is under way. Does that mean it’s already been agreed to be sold? If they are hopeful of Wasps staying as tenants then they must have had dialogue with the potential new owner over the issue. That for me, rules out Ashley and McEvoy.

May even be sisu who are the party and that they have agreed to have Wasps as tenants. Can’t see it though. My gut says it’s NEC.


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Seems a lot of wishful thinking in there. He also mentions Wasps fulfilling the rest of their fixtures this season and remaining a Premiership team yet they've made all the staff and players redundant.

My understanding is if 2 games are called off you're out which would mean they would need a team ready to go in time for Sundays game at Leicester yet according to the Tigers website "Premiership Rugby Limited have confirmed that Sunday’s scheduled fixture between Leicester Tigers and Wasps has been cancelled."

Think they're just looking to offload the Arena side of the business ASAP, they may well have already spoken to some interested parties but don't think there's a done deal just yet.

 

[Nick]

Fucking hell, these are the pricks running the city? They can barely fucking string 2 words together.

 

[Nick]

Seems a lot of wishful thinking in there. He also mentions Wasps fulfilling the rest of their fixtures this season and remaining a Premiership team yet they've made all the staff and players redundant.

My understanding is if 2 games are called off you're out which would mean they would need a team ready to go in time for Sundays game at Leicester yet according to the Tigers website "Premiership Rugby Limited have confirmed that Sunday’s scheduled fixture between Leicester Tigers and Wasps has been cancelled."

Think they're just looking to offload the Arena side of the business ASAP, they may well have already spoken to some interested parties but don't think there's a done deal just yet.

Haven't they already had 2 games off?

 

[Balli001]

Haven't they already had 2 games off?

One was their version of the papa johns trophy I think

 

[chiefdave]

Fucking hell, these are the pricks running the city? They can barely fucking string 2 words together.

Can't speak for the rest of the city but one of my councillors who was standing in a recent election knocked on my door and, irrespective of party politics, was one of the most politically clueless people I've ever spoken to and I've read the politics thread on here!

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Seems a lot of wishful thinking in there. He also mentions Wasps fulfilling the rest of their fixtures this season and remaining a Premiership team yet they've made all the staff and players redundant.

My understanding is if 2 games are called off you're out which would mean they would need a team ready to go in time for Sundays game at Leicester yet according to the Tigers website "Premiership Rugby Limited have confirmed that Sunday’s scheduled fixture between Leicester Tigers and Wasps has been cancelled."

Think they're just looking to offload the Arena side of the business ASAP, they may well have already spoken to some interested parties but don't think there's a done deal just yet.

Didn't they yesterday say that all the fixtures were cancelled and no refunds?

 

[SHUNT31]

Seems a lot of wishful thinking in there. He also mentions Wasps fulfilling the rest of their fixtures this season and remaining a Premiership team yet they've made all the staff and players redundant.

My understanding is if 2 games are called off you're out which would mean they would need a team ready to go in time for Sundays game at Leicester yet according to the Tigers website "Premiership Rugby Limited have confirmed that Sunday’s scheduled fixture between Leicester Tigers and Wasps has been cancelled."

Think they're just looking to offload the Arena side of the business ASAP, they may well have already spoken to some interested parties but don't think there's a done deal just yet.

Yes, this whole thing is just a mess and beyond most of our legal knowledge.

I cannot imagine why SISU wouldn’t be one of the parties that at least have been in dialogue about taking over the lease from Wasps. It’s not as if this has all come out of nowhere.

Keeping everything crossed for a good outcome at the moment.


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[CCFCSteve]

Bondholders also have a claim on funds received for the P share - £9m or so.

I didn’t realise that. Doubt they’ll be getting 9m for it though !

 

[Nick]

Reeves involved as well, c**t.

 

[shepardo01]

Bump this - @oldskyblue58 - any ideas?

The Arena is going through an "accelerated mergers process" - being overseen by the administrator!?...
What is this??

Quote from CovTel article.

""""As for the Arena, the Arena is part of a much larger complex of businesses and are different legal entities. It hosts Wasps in rugby, it hosts Coventry City in football, it hosts concerts, that will still be in use for those activities and I am sure if in the fullness of time, there is a new owner for that business because that's going through an AMA (accelerated mergers and acquisitions) process as well, which we're running, that they would want to have Wasps as a tenant. Because obviously it's important to have the tenant for the income and I am sure that is where they would look to play.""

 

[Nick]

When does the arguing start with councillors? This is boring.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Bump this - @oldskyblue58 - any ideas?

The Arena is going through an "accelerated mergers process" - being overseen by the administrator!?...
What is this??

Quote from CovTel article.

""""As for the Arena, the Arena is part of a much larger complex of businesses and are different legal entities. It hosts Wasps in rugby, it hosts Coventry City in football, it hosts concerts, that will still be in use for those activities and I am sure if in the fullness of time, there is a new owner for that business because that's going through an AMA (accelerated mergers and acquisitions) process as well, which we're running, that they would want to have Wasps as a tenant. Because obviously it's important to have the tenant for the income and I am sure that is where they would look to play.""

It’s just a way of saying an accelerated sale process. Trying to get a sale done in weeks (or even days) rather than months

Depends on potential buyers though I guess

 

[MalcSB]

Can someone explain why bond holders should get their money back? wasnt it a risk that failed, so bad luck for them?

Because they have a legal mortgage over the arena, they will get back the residue of whatever that is sold for minus tye administration costs,

 

[MalcSB]

I didn’t realise that. Doubt they’ll be getting 9m for it though !

I think that is what PRL would have to pay to get the back, They were magically updated in value to about £13m in a recent set of accounts.

 

[CCFCSteve]

When does the arguing start with councillors? This is boring.

They streaming it on ifollow ?

 

[MalcSB]

So Wasps saying they want to keep P share. Surely with admin they will be forced to sell it to pay the creditors?


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Not sure about that as the only possible purchaser is the PRL.

 

[MalcSB]

I didn’t realise that. Doubt they’ll be getting 9m for it though !

I think that is the value the only potential buyer, the PRL, has to pay.

 

[chiefdave]

Not sure about that as the only possible purchaser is the PRL.

Read one article about Wasps yesterday that said both the lease and the P share were greatly over valued in their accounts which surely is a bit dodgy.

 

[MalcSB]

Yes, this whole thing is just a mess and beyond most of our legal knowledge.

I cannot imagine why SISU wouldn’t be one of the parties that at least have been in dialogue about taking over the lease from Wasps. It’s not as if this has all come out of nowhere.

Keeping everything crossed for a good outcome at the moment.


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Where would the money come from? Unless they can persuade existing investors to stump up more cash.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not sure about that as the only possible purchaser is the PRL.

Actually not quite

Exeter Chiefs pay about £5m for Leeds Premiership share - BBC Sport

 

[Nick]

They streaming it on ifollow ?

Agenda for Council on Tuesday, 18th October, 2022, 2.00 pm - Coventry City Council

Committees and meetings at Coventry City Council

edemocracy.coventry.gov.uk

 

[MalcSB]

Read one article about Wasps yesterday that said both the lease and the P share were greatly over valued in their accounts which surely is a bit dodgy.

Upgraded in value by £4m, plus CVC money helped their accounting position no end. Breakeven for 6 months?

 

[SHUNT31]

Where would the money come from? Unless they can persuade existing investors to stump up more cash.

It’s a myth that SISU do not have any money.

If they don’t at least attempt to buy the ground then what is the point? All the court action etc is for nothing. They have to be making some kind of move, if not for the arena then putting the club up for sale.


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[MalcSB]

Actually not quite

Exeter Chiefs pay about £5m for Leeds Premiership share - BBC Sport

That was 10 years ago. The regulations allow a promoted team to buy the P share. At the moment there is no promoted team, so PRL would take it back. Also, the PRL are talking about a reduction to a 10 team league and the remaining teams will take the benefit of increased central allocations as there would be less P shares in circulation.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

That was 10 years ago.

The same principle can apply

 

[Nick]

Read one article about Wasps yesterday that said both the lease and the P share were greatly over valued in their accounts which surely is a bit dodgy.

Didn't people say at the time it wasn't worth £35m or whatever? Then they struggled to refinance which kind of shows it wasn't worth what they thought.

 

[jordan210]

Agenda for Council on Tuesday, 18th October, 2022, 2.00 pm - Coventry City Council

Committees and meetings at Coventry City Council

edemocracy.coventry.gov.uk

Surprised Mutton isn't in a mourning suit

 

[shmmeee]

Seen Wasps fans saying they're closing their HSBC accounts because they didn't loan them the money

Not the money laundering then,

This line is odd

The real thrust now, must be to find a preferred party. We've been talking to somebody today, and are reasonably hopeful, confident, I would say that tomorrow we will be pushing them forward and pushing them in front of the RFU to get that process going.


Why would you talk to the RFU about the arena sale ?

its almost as if who ever gave that interview is confused about what's going on

I think he’s taking about Wasps there. It sort of wraps up the article. But it’s not very clear.

 

[MalcSB]

It’s a myth that SISU do not have any money.

If they don’t at least attempt to buy the ground then what is the point? All the court action etc is for nothing. They have to be making some kind of move, if not for the arena then putting the club up for sale.


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Don’t get me wrong, I can’t see how they could not make a bid for the arena at around £35 million and then talk about spending a similar amount on a new build unicorn.