Your correct. But why do people look for another job?
Gyokeres to Everton- Two in exchange? (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter CCFC54321
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fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Name me a team that doesn't. We've signed more good than bad and raised the standard of the team a number of levels
Given the budget we have here our recruitment team have to be spot on and better than 95% of the league. If not then we will fail and they have to move on. Badlan did a good job with some but I question how many were his calls. Hamer, Sheaf yes. Vik for example looked like a last min panic loan that worked out brilliantly. You then have the 10's of shocking signings in the last few seasons.
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Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
'Name me a team that hasn't signed bad players' isn't an argument.
our squad is probably weaker than last season and we have a large amount of players that aren't good enough. The margin for error could and needs to be a lot better. That doesn't mean we haven't signed some good players, and that doesn't mean it wouldn't be nicer if the budget was a bit better.
SHUNT31
Well-Known Member
Agree with most of your judgements.
Doyle not good enough? Think he’s been very good personally.
Palmer adds something different. Still getting up to speed, which considering we are 24 games in seems mad but he has barely played last 2/3 years.
Matty James was a massive success and arguably the reason we are still in the championship. His leadership during the second half 2020/21 kept us up. Was a shame he didn’t sign permanently.
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ccfc1234
Well-Known Member
This post is a bit off. While there have been some scouting successes your list does Robins and AVs coaching a slight disservice.
Gyokeres - The Brighton scouting team (who I rate as the best in the Country. Look at their net spend and the likes of Bissoma, Caicado, McAllister to name a few.) Did their homework on Vik he went to Swwansa was poor and we took a punt and Robins and AV played to his strengths and got the best out of him. Well done to recruitment for finding out he was available but I think the management team take most the credit.
Hamer - big win for the recruitment department especially Hamer who was plucked from the Dutch league.
Sheaf - An arsenal academy lad who was on loan in our division at the time and playing well was not hard to spot and was far from plucked from obscurity.
OHare - was on loan at a lower level and to the passing fan was obviously a level above. A recruitment win.
On the flip side there have been long contracts given to Hilstner, DaCosta, Waghorn (who had his least mobile and pooest scoring return the season before we signed him). Moore was a number 2 and has a horrible saves to shots ratio. Will not go back as far as Kasta and Jobello and all the dross Badlan saddled us with in the U23s of who none look like they will be long term 1st team players.
All in all they were not terrible but I feel our success is more down to the coaching staff than the recruitment team. But Hamer no question was a great spot and had there been 2 or 3 more of that ilk I would be concerned that Blackpool had taken a key part of the club's operating model.
SkyBlueScottie
Well-Known Member
The main problem we have had is that we have not sold players at the right time. If we were to follow the method of buying low, selling high, then O Hare and Gus probably should have gone. 2 players that we got for a million quid that could have gone out the door for 15 million. Problem is, there was clearly some disconnect between Boddy / Robins throughout the summer regarding our situation. It also seems we have not been actively looking for replacements for any of our better players, mainly due to the fact that the club will not risk paying out 2 or 3 million for a player before getting a sizeable fee for the player they are replacing. This is where the club needs to be ran better, we dont need to be looking for a Gus Hamer million quid player we can actually look at getting a 3 million quid player in, due to the fact Gus is going for 5 million... * Im not suggesting that the figures are accurate or that Gus should be sold, just highlighting how the club should be going about the business.
Speedie's Head
Well-Known Member
The higher up you are the more difficult it is to get players moving between u23 and 1st team. Even harder now that it's u-21 level. Remember those lads won their division. That's not a feasible model for building a Championship squad on it's own.
I think Badlan had maybe run his course and it was time for a refresh
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
How do you calculate those risks well though when you don't have the budget to sign ready made players?
Plus some of those guys are just signed as filler. It’s impossible to sign 10 or so young talents who are expected to make it into the first team - imagine how much that would cost. If we want to put a 23s (or 21s as it is now) team out we need enough numbers and that means signing players who are there literally to make up the numbers, without ever progressing to the first team. Obviously they still need to be of a certain level.
And that’s true for all teams, not just us.
Nick
Administrator
To be fair, most of the ones we have seemingly bombed off should have been ready-made and cost accordingly.
Moore, Waghorn, Kane, Walker for starters.
Offhegoes
Well-Known Member
I think O'Hare was all but sold at the end of July to Burnley (before his injury), and I am sure Robins had 3-4 players lined up to go based on that transfer going through. It didn't, and then the pitch debacle led to the quick fire sale of Hyam, and nobody brought in. Hence the small squad. Also Todd Kane was apparently lined up to leave before getting injured.
Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
I think the decision to make the U21/23 rather than a reserve league has actually been detrimental to development.
It's basically mollycoddling the players and they don't have experience of competitive first team football and so making that jump up is much harder. What do most clubs do with a decent U21 prospect they want to develop? They send them out on loan to get the experience because playing U21 isn't going to be that much different from playing U18 so what chance is there of real progression?
U21 has led to us taking on a number of youngsters who very much look like they won't make the grade pretty much just to make up numbers in the U21's. If we had a reserve team you could just take on a select few, playing alongside experienced pros who are out of favour/coming back from injury and they'd learn a lot more from that.
With a reserve team, squad players get some form of competitive game to keep them a bit sharper, youngsters get a more testing experience for their development and the overall quality improves because you're not just taking youngsters on just to make up the numbers.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
The first 3 were though. Moore played a decent first season, Waghorn did ok at the very start then got Covid and injuries which the recruitment team can’t be blamed for. Kane did ok to start with and we don’t really know why he got bombed out do we? Walker was a long term target for Robins.
Players like Hilsner and DaCosta were awful but cost a quarter of a decent Championship level player and if we felt we could develop whatever raw attributes they had, then I'd say that was a calculated risk.
Skyblueweeman
Well-Known Member
Back on topic....if Vik does go now or in the summer, a cash plus player/s deal is ideal really. If we got £18m and someone like Simms and the other fella in for at least the rest of the season, that's good business in my eyes.
I know MR wouldn't get £18m...Brighton would get about £1.3m from it and the club would use some for running costs. I'd be flabbergasted (even by Coventry City FC standards...) if MR didn't get anything from £18m.
I'd love to keep Vik...the fact is that he'll leave at some point. End of the season would be better (especially if he continues scoring) but if £18m plus two fairly decent players turns out to be correct - from Everton or anyone else - I'd accept that.
I know MR wouldn't get £18m...Brighton would get about £1.3m from it and the club would use some for running costs. I'd be flabbergasted (even by Coventry City FC standards...) if MR didn't get anything from £18m.
I'd love to keep Vik...the fact is that he'll leave at some point. End of the season would be better (especially if he continues scoring) but if £18m plus two fairly decent players turns out to be correct - from Everton or anyone else - I'd accept that.
Frostie
Well-Known Member
I don't think MR would see signing a player who can't play for us as good business.
Skyblueweeman
Well-Known Member
* someone like Simms....
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Please name the 20 shocking signings we’ve made since Robins came in.
Particularly with our injury luck. End up like Callum situation. Can’t play for us and lost a financial asset for some time
AFCCOVENTRY
Well-Known Member
As long as it isn’t anything like the Wilson deal when we sold him to Bournemouth. We got some of the most gash players in return!
ProfessorbyGrace
Well-Known Member
I think Vik will have to think seriously about any move to a Premiership that’s in the bottom 3 or above. He won’t just strut into the first team and start banging goals in, especially at Everton. A negative move like that would stunt his skill growth, and affect his confidence.
He’s better off staying, putting some hard graft in, develop those skills and take stock in the summer. At least, that’s the more logical thing to do.
Oh and Everton can shove their £18 million right up their toffee makers.
He’s better off staying, putting some hard graft in, develop those skills and take stock in the summer. At least, that’s the more logical thing to do.
Oh and Everton can shove their £18 million right up their toffee makers.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I don’t think Callum O hare will advise him that
AFCCOVENTRY
Well-Known Member
One of the players offered, Broadhead is off to Ipswich.
we would probably go down
lord_garrincha
Well-Known Member
Ignoring the dev players & ones who got injured when in the 1st team, there's probably half of that bought in on a perm.
Vicenti, Ogogo & Brown, Kastaneer, Hillsner, Dacosta, Josh Reid, Bright... and you would have to now include Waghorn & Moore.
There are other lesser lights (Pask etc.) but not truly shocking.
We stayed up with Biamou leading the line for half a season tbf
MAFF
Well-Known Member
Peter Vincenti
Tony Andreu
Carl Baker
Josh Barrett
Jordan Maguire-Drew
Reise Allassani
Junior Brown
Abu Ogogo
Charlie Wakefield
David Meyler
Wesley Jobello
Gervane Kastaneer
Josh Pask
Julien Dacosta
Marcel Hilßner
Tyler Walker
Josh Reid
Martyn Waghorn
Simon Moore
Bright Enobakhare
Todd Kane
Northeast sky blue
Well-Known Member
The way our season is going, he'll probably get injured and be out for weeks
Thanks, because i really couldnt be bothered
Skybluefaz
Well-Known Member
Was thinking similar myself yesterday. Its a risk but he's going to go eventually, so probably cash in on desperate premier league clubs now.
I think it’s harsh to call a lot of those shocking. Bad yes, but shocking no.
Eg Andreu was fine, then did his ACL
Jobello – as above
Kane and Moore have been poor, not shocking
Walker has been OK
Pask was fine in L1
Don’t get me wrong some of them are shocking, but not all of them.
Also this is not unique to us, every club makes plenty of bad and shocking signings.