Do you want to discuss boring politics? (86 Viewers)

[duffer]

That is why the SNP are in such a huff, their attempt to "trap" Labour has backfired majorly.

That's an odd take. The trap was entirely one of Labour's own making by dithering on the ceasefire issue and whipping their own MPs to vote against their consciences and the wishes of the majority of their constituents.

The SNP, in fairness, has been clear on their opinion on the issue for some time now.

 

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[David O'Day]

That's an odd take. The trap was entirely one of Labour's own making by dithering on the ceasefire issue and whipping their own MPs to vote against their consciences and the wishes of the majority of their constituents.

The SNP, in fairness, has been clear on their opinion on the issue for some time now.

Odd? If the SNP hadn't tabled their motion as a trap for Labour then they wouldn't be having a paddy and would be proceeding with the vote instead of waling out of parliament.

it's an odd take to think that the SNP didn't call this vote to "trap" Labour so they could use in the upcoming election

 

[fernandopartridge]

Anyone who watched the House of Commons in action tonight, would be utterly mystified.

A critical debate on a vital foreign policy issue (calling for a ceasefire in Gaza) and all they really care about is scoring points off each other.

Labour trying to dodge voting on the SNP amendment to avoid showing the splits in their party, and the Tories and SNP doing their best to force them into it for solely that reason (and actually walking out of the HOC in a huff in some cases).

All about political point scoring. In the meantime, Gaza burns.

A pox on the feckin lot of 'em, politics in this country is not fit for purpose.

Agreed, and all the lobby hacks who report on it are just as bad. Fuck the lot of them into the sea.

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[fernandopartridge]

It just shows the SNP only tabled it to embarrass and cause splits in Labour and they give no shits about Gaza. Otherwise they'd have been pissed off but carried on with the amendment. And the labour amendment is actually better as it places conditions, including handover of hostages in it, and the end goal of a two state solution.

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Imagine being so naive

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[SBT]

Can’t imagine why a normal, well-adjusted person would ever look at the state of British politics and want to get involved themselves. It’s truly dire.

 

[duffer]

Odd? If the SNP hadn't tabled their motion as a trap for Labour then they wouldn't be having a paddy and would be proceeding with the vote instead of waling out of parliament.

it's an odd take to think that the SNP didn't call this vote to "trap" Labour so they could use in the upcoming election

Where's the trap? It was the SNP's opposition day and they tabled an amendment calling for a ceasefire. It's something they've been calling for for a while, and the situation in Gaza has become rather critical.

Is it their fault that Labour under Starmer struggled with the issue. Labour trapped themselves because of Starmer's ineptness.

Labour have had since October to use their opposition day to table a ceasefire motion but have chosen not to do so until in effect being forced into it by the SNP.

What happened next was shit, but Labour and particularly Starmer are entirely responsible for their own inaction on this issue.

 

[David O'Day]

Where's the trap? It was the SNP's opposition day and they tabled an amendment calling for a ceasefire. It's something they've been calling for for a while, and the situation in Gaza has become rather critical.

Is it their fault that Labour under Starmer struggled with the issue. Labour trapped themselves because of Starmer's ineptness.

Labour have had since October to use their opposition day to table a ceasefire motion but have chosen not to do so until in effect being forced into it by the SNP.

What happened next was shit, but Labour and particularly Starmer are entirely responsible for their own inaction on this issue.

The whole using your 3 days for a non binding vote on the actions of a foreign government is a trap. The SNP fucked around and got found out.

Fuck them

 

[fernandopartridge]

The whole using your 3 days for a non binding vote on the actions of a foreign government is a trap. The SNP fucked around and got found out.

Fuck them

You showed them grrrr

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[Ian1779]

It just shows the SNP only tabled it to embarrass and cause splits in Labour and they give no shits about Gaza. Otherwise they'd have been pissed off but carried on with the amendment. And the labour amendment is actually better as it places conditions, including handover of hostages in it, and the end goal of a two state solution.

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Not sure that’s true - they have been consistently outspoken on the situation… probably because their leader’s wife has family in Palestine.

Labour embarrassing themselves because it’s full of genocide enablers.

 

[shmmeee]

Anyone who watched the House of Commons in action tonight, would be utterly mystified.

A critical debate on a vital foreign policy issue (calling for a ceasefire in Gaza) and all they really care about is scoring points off each other.

Labour trying to dodge voting on the SNP amendment to avoid showing the splits in their party, and the Tories and SNP doing their best to force them into it for solely that reason (and actually walking out of the HOC in a huff in some cases).

All about political point scoring. In the meantime, Gaza burns.

A pox on the feckin lot of 'em, politics in this country is not fit for purpose.

Nothing that happens today will have any real world impact on Gaza, this is entirely political from all sides.

 

[Ian1779]

Nothing that happens today will have any real world impact on Gaza, this is entirely political from all sides.

It’s kind of depressing that you are completely right.

We could do something meaningful by ending arms sales to Israel, but we know will never happen

 

[duffer]

Nothing that happens today will have any real world impact on Gaza, this is entirely political from all sides.

With apologies mate, that makes no sense to me. Either politics and where parties stand on things matters, or it doesn't.

If it doesn't, then what the hell are you doing on this thread?

One question. If Sunak came out tomorrow and said, the UK government's position on Gaza is that we couldn't give a shit because we can't do anything about it, would you agree?

 

[shmmeee]

With apologies mate, that makes no sense to me. Either politics and where parties stand on things matters, or it doesn't.

If it doesn't, then what the hell are you doing on this thread?

One question. If Sunak came out tomorrow and said, the UK government's position on Gaza is that we couldn't give a shit because we can't do anything about it, would you agree?

Where the UK political parties stand matters for things they may have influence over in power. Neither side in this war will give a shiny shite what the result of todays vote is. What’s happening in Gaza will not be affected by the actions of SNP or Labour politicians.

To be honest if Sunak did that I’d actually gain an ounce of respect for him. Everything today from both sides is political theatre aimed at their supporters, just like the way certain activists focus on Starmer over the actual PM shows it’s political theatre there as well.

It’s people using Gaza as a stick in existing political divides all the way down. Same as branding protests hate marches or whatever.

I don’t vote to have my views endorsed, I vote to elect someone who will make changes in the real world.

 

[fernandopartridge]

I don’t vote to have my views endorsed, I vote to elect someone who will make changes in the real world.

You're voting Labour at the next election aren't you

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[shmmeee]

You're voting Labour at the next election aren't you

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Yes in the hope they enact policy. If they just passed motions saying they’re against bad stuff I’d be quite disappointed.

 

[duffer]

The whole using your 3 days for a non binding vote on the actions of a foreign government is a trap. The SNP fucked around and got found out.

Fuck them

Opposition days are always non binding votes, I believe. If you can't see it's an issue that Labour created entirely for themselves then I suspect it's because you're looking at it with one eye closed.

The SNP haven't suddenly shifted their principles on this to catch Labour out; that they've found themselves in this position is primarily a function of Starmer's mishandling and vacillation.

 

[Liquid Gold]

Absolute shambles and they're intending to spend billions on doing up the place to continue this mess of a system.

Tear the lot down, move to parliament to Milton Keynes or somehwere, make it a semi circular chamber and make every vote count.

This country is a fucking joke.

 

[David O'Day]

Opposition days are always non binding votes, I believe. If you can't see it's an issue that Labour created entirely for themselves then I suspect it's because you're looking at it with one eye closed.

The SNP haven't suddenly shifted their principles on this to catch Labour out; that they've found themselves in this position is primarily a function of Starmer's mishandling and vacillation.

The very fact they use one of the few opposition day debates they get to choose itself was trying to set a trap for Labour.

If you can't see that then I would suggest that you are the one with "one eyed closed".

 

[fernandopartridge]

The very fact they use one of the few opposition day debates they get to choose itself was trying to set a trap for Labour.

If you can't see that then I would suggest that you are the one with "one eyed closed".

"A trap" how embarrassing that the opposition doesn't want to be shown to be shown as the "broad church" it claims it is

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[JAM See]

The very fact they use one of the few opposition day debates they get to choose itself was trying to set a trap for Labour.

If you can't see that then I would suggest that you are the one with "one eyed closed".

I don't really follow Scottish politics, so I can't comment on what they might have chosen as a motion.

What would suggest they should have tabled, to ensure maximum exposure for their party and their cause?

 

[David O'Day]

I don't really follow Scottish politics, so I can't comment on what they might have chosen as a motion.

What would suggest they should have tabled, to ensure maximum exposure for their party and their cause?

Something that effects the people of Scotland? Instead they keep using up their very few opposition days to try and trap Labour on the middle east.

 

[JAM See]

Something that effects the people of Scotland? Instead they keep using up their very few opposition days to try and trap Labour on the middle east.

That's my point. Something that affects Scotland only will not be heavily attended in the commons and would probably sail through.

The SNP are terrified of a Labour revival in Scotland.

They need to distance themselves from Starmer.

I don't agree with what they did, but that's politics in a FPTP system.

PR now.

 

[David O'Day]

That's my point. Something that affects Scotland only will not be heavily attended in the commons and would probably sail through.

The SNP are terrified of a Labour revival in Scotland.

They need to distance themselves from Starmer.

I don't agree with what they did, but that's politics in a FPTP system.

PR now.

Opposition day debates are non binding so all they are normally good for is getting to say "The government are bastards look what they don't support".

The SNP gets something like 3 opposition days and that's 2 they have used to try and trap labour.

 

[Grendel]

This is surely the point when everyone agrees politicians no longer serve the country but are just there to build money making careers.

Can anyone with belief in genuine integrity in politics vote for labour or Tory now?

I can’t and I won’t

 

[JAM See]

This is surely the point when everyone agrees politicians no longer serve the country but are just there to build money making careers.

Can anyone with belief in genuine integrity in politics vote for labour or Tory now?

I can’t and I won’t

Yes.

Next question.

 

[skybluetony176]

Can anyone with belief in genuine integrity in politics vote for labour or Tory now?

Didn’t you vote for Boris?

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

This is surely the point when everyone agrees politicians no longer serve the country but are just there to build money making careers.

Can anyone with belief in genuine integrity in politics vote for labour or Tory now?

I can’t and I won’t

Governing isn’t easy
Deciding who governs isn’t easy
It’s a responsibility we can’t abstain from
We want better we have to demand it
We get the leaders we deserve

 

[Grendel]

Didn’t you vote for Boris?

You voted for Nigel Farage Tony and Austerity Cameron (twice)

 

[PVA]

Anyone who says this is the tipping point for deciding that politicians are in it for themselves has obviously been living under a rock for the last 5 years at the absolute bare minimum.

 

[skybluetony176]

You voted for Nigel Farage Tony and Austerity Cameron (twice)

(Once)

You can’t complain about integrity in politics having willingly voted for Boris (twice). What are you saying exactly. You forgot who Boris is? Because the one quality no one can honestly claim Boris has is integrity, in any area of his life at any point in his life. Unless you’re Dorries of course but she’s a fruit loop.

 

[Sick Boy]

(Once)

You can’t complain about integrity in politics having willingly voted for Boris (twice). What are you saying exactly. You forgot who Boris is? Because the one quality no one can honestly claim Boris has is integrity, in any area of his life at any point in his life. Unless you’re Dorries of course but she’s a fruit loop.

…and Farage does?

 

[skybluetony176]

…and Farage does?

I’m not complaining about integrity in politics though am I. And for the record Grendull also voted for Farage and as he’s the one complaining about integrity in politics perhaps you should point your question in his direction.

 

[Sick Boy]

I’m not complaining about integrity in politics though am I. And for the record Grendull also voted for Farage and as he’s the one complaining about integrity in politics perhaps you should point your question in his direction.

It was obvious what both Johnson and Farage were like, no idea how anyone could vote for either of them, personally.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Anyone who says this is the tipping point for deciding that politicians are in it for themselves has obviously been living under a rock for the last 5 years at the absolute bare minimum.

Did your dad tell you that?

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[shmmeee]

This is surely the point when everyone agrees politicians no longer serve the country but are just there to build money making careers.

Can anyone with belief in genuine integrity in politics vote for labour or Tory now?

I can’t and I won’t

Not the billions to mates, not the tax breaks, not the revolving door with think tanks and consultancies. This is what pushed you over the edge?