Do you want to discuss boring politics? (186 Viewers)

[SIR ERNIE]

We already know what’s going to follow a Labour government looking at New Zealand and Germany. Starmer definitely tried to model himself on Schloz and maybe even Aldern too.

The German economy is the ‘sick man’ of Europe atm and Aldern’s tenure ended in failure; crime, immigration and housing all getting worse.

Renewables, frankly, has its place to supplement our existing energy demands but it’s not a serious replacement for fossil fuels, yet.

yeah but it's cool to be a 'Progressive'

 

---

[Grendel]

yeah but it's cool to be a 'Progressive'

Many on here were looking to her New Zealand with envy

 

[SIR ERNIE]

Many on here were looking to her New Zealand with envy

and no doubt Canada

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Casts an interesting light on the whole Labour strategy of whoring out to the Daily Mail and renouncing anything vaguely progressive.

The root of it is Starmer’s leadership, in reality he’s a slippery man. Says one thing to get elected by the Labour membership, will say whatever needs to be said to be elected by the country.

In reality, there won’t be a clear mandate to change anything meaningful with the majority he’ll have. Ed Balls pointed out his commitments to not raise ‘working people’s’ taxes and/or increase borrowing really restricts him. So far, the new taxes to raise £7bn is pointless.

He strikes me as a weak leader that won’t make any difficult or potentially unpopular decisions.

 

[clint van damme]

Fucking useless

HMRC has failed to fine a single ‘enabler’ of offshore tax fraud in five years

Landmark powers to impose huge fines to tackle tax evasion and avoidance are ‘pointless’, figures show

www.theguardian.com

 

[fernandopartridge]

Streeting is going to be horrendous

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

The root of it is Starmer’s leadership, in reality he’s a slippery man. Says one thing to get elected by the Labour membership, will say whatever needs to be said to be elected by the country.

In reality, there won’t be a clear mandate to change anything meaningful with the majority he’ll have. Ed Balls pointed out his commitments to not raise ‘working people’s’ taxes and/or increase borrowing really restricts him. So far, the new taxes to raise £7bn is pointless.

He strikes me as a weak leader that won’t make any difficult or potentially unpopular decisions.

Only cause you want to see him in a negative light
Sometimes changing is an act of being open to new ideas and finding a new way

 

[clint van damme]

Streeting is going to be horrendous

Reeves coaching him not to go off message.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Only cause you want to see him in a negative light
Sometimes changing is an act of being open to new ideas and finding a new way

Why would anyone want to see the next PM in a negative light? I want to see positives but beyond competency I see none.

Have Labour actually won anyone over by this lurch to the right? Or at least, any more over than they’ve pissed off? Seems to me this election will be the country’s anger at the Tories rather than anything Labour have done.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Day 3: Candidates​ Click here to listen to an audio recording of this reflection.​ Jeremiah 29.4-7 'But seek the welfare of the city where I have sent you …for in its welfare you will find your welfare … ’ Jeremiah calls us to pray for the welfare – shalom – of our city and land. Shalom means peace, stability, prosperity and rest. That shalom will depend on wise leadership. We pray today for all candidates who are standing in the election. Standing for election takes courage and generosity. Those who stand for public office are open to considerable public scrutiny. They deserve our thanks and respect. Of course, we will agree with the opinions and approaches of some candidates and disagree with others. We may like some candidates and not others. Political engagement and the exercise of our right to vote is to be encouraged. We can be part of a better culture in this general election, and in the exercise of politics generally, by the ways we speak of and to candidates in this election whether in person, in hard copy or online. As we pray for candidates, let’s pray for our good practice in political engagement. ​ Guide all candidates for office and the leaders of the nations into the ways of peace and justice. Hear us, good Lord.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Why would anyone want to see the next PM in a negative light? I want to see positives but beyond competency I see none.

Have Labour actually won anyone over by this lurch to the right? Or at least, any more over than they’ve pissed off? Seems to me this election will be the country’s anger at the Tories rather than anything Labour have done.

Not you or those like you

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Streeting today admits there’s no strategy at all for reforming the care sector and pretty obvious councils will be able to adjust bands and increase above current levels.

No problem with council tax increasing. A drop in the ocean compared to our mortgage payments and at least people locally might benefit.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Streeting is going to be horrendous

Well, at least the conversation around the NHS won’t dumbed down to ‘it’s all the Tories fault’ and that they have ‘systematically and deliberately underfunded’ the NHS.

This prospective Labour government knows it can’t just throw money at the NHS like many people want it to.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not you or those like you

If the Tories hadn’t gone insane since 2019 they’d be comfortably re-elected even with Starmer spitting on the left.

 

[shmmeee]

I agree that renewables are cheaper, but 100% renewables delivered in 4.5 years? Enough supply to support all the electric vehicles and heat pumps being forced on us? And what happens when the wind is too fierce or non existent on gloomy days? It wouldn’t matter what was happening elsewhere in the world then, would it?

It’s five years away and the same date as the new ICE ban, and boilers are only banned from next year on new builds so I don’t think you’re going to see some huge spike by then.

You’ve got Hinckley C coming online and current govt plans had us with 14GW of gas left by 2030, with the current ban on new onshore. If Labour double onshore alone then that’s the gap met basically.

If the wind doesn’t blow I’d expect us to use baseload and storage like we do now.

As I say it’s only moving the current plan forwards by five years.

 

[SBAndy]

Only cause you want to see him in a negative light
Sometimes changing is an act of being open to new ideas and finding a new way

I find it quite interesting on a sociological level. I’ll preface this by saying that, by and large, I can see the point around perceived ‘lack of principles’ but there are so many external factors which have changed, and is it not better to have a pragmatist in charge than an ideologue?

 

[Sick Boy]

"Voters are turning away from the two major parties in a huge break with the trend seen in the 2019 general election campain"

Good to see that lessons have been well and truly learnt from what happened with Brexit.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Well, at least the conversation around the NHS won’t dumbed down to ‘it’s all the Tories fault’ and that they have ‘systematically and deliberately underfunded’ the NHS.

This prospective Labour government knows it can’t just throw money at the NHS like many people want it to.

Their message is that it is all the Tories fault, the follow up bit is that they will do nothing different.

You are the embodiment of dumbed down with your Telegraph messaging.

 

[Sick Boy]

The root of it is Starmer’s leadership, in reality he’s a slippery man. Says one thing to get elected by the Labour membership, will say whatever needs to be said to be elected by the country.

In reality, there won’t be a clear mandate to change anything meaningful with the majority he’ll have. Ed Balls pointed out his commitments to not raise ‘working people’s’ taxes and/or increase borrowing really restricts him. So far, the new taxes to raise £7bn is pointless.

He strikes me as a weak leader that won’t make any difficult or potentially unpopular decisions.

I agree to an extent but you could say the same about the likes of Johnson who was only pro-Brexit to further his own career.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Only cause you want to see him in a negative light
Sometimes changing is an act of being open to new ideas and finding a new way

You’d think that, but I actually supported Starmer’s bid to become Labour leader.

All due respect Pete, well meaning platitudes isn’t enough to get this country (or the West as a whole) out of this rut.

 

[PVA]

Good to see that lessons have been well and truly learnt from what happened with Brexit.

What does Brexit have to do with it?

The article says that the main two parties will have a low vote share and tries to frame it as much a Labour problem as a Tory problem.

It seems to totally fail to mention that a) Labour's vote share is going to increase and b) the reason for the low vote share is because the Tories are going to be decimated.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I find it quite interesting on a sociological level. I’ll preface this by saying that, by and large, I can see the point around perceived ‘lack of principles’ but there are so many external factors which have changed, and is it not better to have a pragmatist in charge than an ideologue?

Just look at Johnson
Brexit change of heart madness to think people have to think the same thing the whole of their lives

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

You’d think that, but I actually supported Starmer’s bid to become Labour leader.

All due respect Pete, well meaning platitudes isn’t enough to get this country (or the West as a whole) out of this rut.

Wasn’t really aimed at you

 

[MalcSB]

Fucking useless

HMRC has failed to fine a single ‘enabler’ of offshore tax fraud in five years

Landmark powers to impose huge fines to tackle tax evasion and avoidance are ‘pointless’, figures show

www.theguardian.com

As you say, useless. And part of Labour’s master plan.

 

[shmmeee]

Man the copium levels are high in here.

This place is going to be in bits come July 5th.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I agree to an extent but you could say the same about the likes of Johnson who was only pro-Brexit to further his own career.

Yes, but his bid to win Tory leadership and 2019 GE was to ‘get Brexit done’ and break a constitutional deadlock that was plaguing this country. That was delivered for better or worse.

 

[MalcSB]

Only cause you want to see him in a negative light
Sometimes changing is an act of being open to new ideas and finding a new way

And often not.

 

[PVA]

Man the copium levels are high in here.

This place is going to be in bits come July 5th.

Especially as I think the majority is going to be bigger than a lot of people are expecting.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Man the copium levels are high in here.

This place is going to be in bits come July 5th.

It isn’t. It’ll be indifference at a long overdue Tory exit having at last happened

 

[MalcSB]

No problem with council tax increasing. A drop in the ocean compared to our mortgage payments and at least people locally might benefit.

They don’t provide services at the horrendous level they are at now. Plus refusing to take on new developments leaving homeowners paying twice.

 

[Grendel]

Only cause you want to see him in a negative light
Sometimes changing is an act of being open to new ideas and finding a new way

And you just want to see him in a positive light. The deficit in the manifesto is £20 billion and that’s based on a growth rate much higher than forecast. It’s on independent projections of growth £38 billion.

His response to the Jeremy Corbyn question was laughable.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Their message is that it is all the Tories fault, the follow up bit is that they will do nothing different.

You are the embodiment of dumbed down with your Telegraph messaging.

Which is actually worse when you think about it…

 

[Grendel]

What does Brexit have to do with it?

The article says that the main two parties will have a low vote share and tries to frame it as much a Labour problem as a Tory problem.

It seems to totally fail to mention that a) Labour's vote share is going to increase and b) the reason for the low vote share is because the Tories are going to be decimated.

It’s no different to 1983 other than the fact the Tory vote under Thatcher is likely to be marginally higher than Starmer will achieve. It’s actually likely to be less than both Corbyn and May achieved in 2017

 

[PVA]

It’s no different to 1983 other than the fact the Tory vote under Thatcher is likely to be marginally higher than Starmer will achieve. It’s actually likely to be less than both Corbyn and May achieved in 2017

The article says:

"Voters are turning away from the two major parties in a huge break with the trend seen in the 2019 general election campaign"

They are turning away from one of the major parties, not both of them.

It's a joke of an article.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Their message is that it is all the Tories fault, the follow up bit is that they will do nothing different.

You are the embodiment of dumbed down with your Telegraph messaging.

He’s got a point though Fernando. Its not as if SNP or Welsh Labour are delivering a top quality health service either.

Every country has demographic and health challenges especially post pandemic. I’ve said it before and after I’ll continue to say it, there are cultural issues in and around the NHS and that are resistant to challenge and change. Also, just as important, we as a nation continue to abuse it. We don’t look after ourselves well enough and then complain when it’s overrun

Both the above need addressing as well as finding ways to increase investment, as much for social care as the NHS, as this would free up a huge amount of beds/capacity