Gathering for Tommy / Discontent (64 Viewers)

[rob9872]

I'm not outraged or angry - I just think it's typical

But worth raising and not to say the King hasnt spoken but still get the cheap dig in about unelected head of state. Yeah ok.

 

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[torchomatic]

.

Hopefully these reports of people getting sent down for a couple of years will put plenty of people off doing something silly.

If they are capable of reading those reports, that is.

Yeah and no. Think the sentences are a little lenient.

Terror offence definition:

The specific actions included are:

serious violence against a person;
serious damage to property;
endangering a person's life (other than that of the person committing the action);
creating a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public; and
action designed to seriously interfere with or seriously to disrupt an electronic system.

Think a lot of these rioters have crossed the lines above.

I also must stop calling them protesters. They're not, they're rioters.

 

[David O'Day]

From what I've seen the media are reporting on police making preparations for so many gatherings. The police haven't come out and denied it.

I doubt the media have just gone off on one on a notes app.

It's because even if there is not an actual "protest" planned the rumour of one can descend into a shit show as we saw on Monday in Brum.

 

[skybluetony176]

If it's 1 person making up random lists in a notes app. Why are they getting published and taken seriously in the national media?

Slow news day

 

[baldy]

But worth raising and not to say the King hasnt spoken but still get the cheap dig in about unelected head of state. Yeah ok.

Man up

 

[Nick]

Yeah and no. Think the sentences are a little lenient.

Terror offence definition:

The specific actions included are:

serious violence against a person;
serious damage to property;
endangering a person's life (other than that of the person committing the action);
creating a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public; and
action designed to seriously interfere with or seriously to disrupt an electronic system.

Think a lot of these rioters have crossed the lines above.

I also must stop calling them protesters. They're not, they're rioters.

Random how you want them to go down for terror offence but on the thread about the stabbings there were people saying it wasn't terror related.

I agree, punishment is needed but the contrast is madness.

 

[David O'Day]

judging by the amount of pictures of takeaways that have shut for the day and boarded up their windows it could be the lack of fast foot available this evening that kills the last support the far right may have left

 

[Nick]

I don't get it though, if it's one person just bullshitting then why are police even preparing and why is it all over the national media?

I don't know if it is one person or a group of people shit stirring but it doesn't add up.

 

[rob9872]

Random how you want them to go down for terror offence but on the thread about the stabbings there were people saying it wasn't terror related.

I agree, punishment is needed but the contrast is madness.

A lot said the Gillingham one wasn't too.

 

[pusbccfc]

If it's 1 person making up random lists in a notes app. Why are they getting published and taken seriously in the national media?

The media will be loving it. The last thing they want is for this to start to blow over..

Gobshites on telegram plucking out random cities because they have immigration centres.

It could even be bigger forces at play trying to wind up communities to see a continued level of violence on the streets from communities that are scared. Russia? Far right keyboard warriors?

 

[torchomatic]

A lot said the Gillingham one wasn't too.

But not me, so not sure what his dig was about.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

The media will be loving it. The last thing they want is for this to start to blow over..

Gobshites on telegram plucking out random cities because they have immigration centres.

It could even be bigger forces at play trying to wind up communities to see a continued level of violence on the streets from communities that are scared. Russia? Far right keyboard warriors?

the media will love it. Scandal, fear and outrage = readers, viewers, clicks, ££

 

[pusbccfc]

As mentioned. There will be bigger forces at play.

 

[rob9872]

But not me, so not sure what his dig was about.

Yeah absolutely, not at all pointed. I said on the Gillingham one I put them all under the umbrella of terrorism including what is going on right now.

In fairness to Nick, and I'm sure he can speak for himself, I didnt assume he meant you despite being your post he replied to, simply that the post mentioned terrorism. The different narratives under which things are reported does only go to fan the flames on the two tier stuff and isnt helpful.

 

[SBAndy]

Random how you want them to go down for terror offence but on the thread about the stabbings there were people saying it wasn't terror related.

I agree, punishment is needed but the contrast is madness.

I believe with terror offences there has to be a political aim of the action taken. Fair to say these riots could be classed as that. Virtually impossible to say that about the Southport stabbings as we don’t have a known motive.

The Gillingham thing has genuinely passed me by so won’t be making comment on it.

 

[SkyBlueCharlie9]

People smashing up shops / small businesses and looting are just utter scum.

The irony is that they will go and smash up a kebab shop or something that looks "Muslim" but then order a kebab at the weekend and whinge about "claiming benefits" when it's just a hard working small business owner.

I still think that by promoting it all, all over the news about the hundreds of protests just encourages people who aren't in in Telegram Groups etc to go down and act the c**t.

... and those looting, throwing objects, setting fires, launching fireworks, possessing drugs, punching police/other protestors, kicking, shouting abuse at people, chanting religious hatred, make gesticulations etc.
Anyone convicted of rioting should get a 5 year football banning order too - to help stop the problems we've had in recent years from growing further.
As with anyone in jail these guys must get the mental health support, addiction support, and re-education on tolerance/diversity to help them turn their lives around and given apprenticeships and jobs to help them move on.
Obvious to say a lot of the current problems result from primarily those being disenfranchised poor education, low aspiration, reliance on benefits leading to jealousy and envy and them easily being groomed and radicalised. Applies to far right, ethnic groups and even those on far left that also have a few loons. The government need to see this as an opportunity to make things better for the country and develop a stronger economy and to make the UK safer. It can be turned around.

The people I would target most severely are the likes of MPs Boris, Farage, Patel, Anderson, Redwood, Braverman, Tebbitt, Rees-Mogg, Raab, Bob Stewart, Scully, Swayne, Gullis, Anne Marie Morris and others such as... Yaxley-Lennon, Tate, Musk, Fox, Hopkins, Hester, Hankinson, Doolan, etc.

 

[OffenhamSkyBlue]

I believe with terror offences there has to be a political aim of the action taken. Fair to say these riots could be classed as that. Virtually impossible to say that about the Southport stabbings as we don’t have a known motive.

The Gillingham thing has genuinely passed me by so won’t be making comment on it.

Not just political ...

"... the use or threat is made for the purpose of advancing a political, religious, racial or ideological cause"
(s.1(1)c, Terrorism Act 2000)

 

[Gynnsthetonic]

The people I would target most severely are the likes of MPs Boris, Farage, Patel, Anderson, Redwood, Braverman, Tebbitt, Rees-Mogg, Raab, Bob Stewart, Scully, Swayne, Gullis, Anne Marie Morris and others such as... Yaxley-Lennon, Tate, Musk, Fox, Hopkins, Hester, Hankinson, Doolan, etc.

You missed out this guy

 

[Nick]

I believe with terror offences there has to be a political aim of the action taken. Fair to say these riots could be classed as that. Virtually impossible to say that about the Southport stabbings as we don’t have a known motive.

The Gillingham thing has genuinely passed me by so won’t be making comment on it.

I get that. I was just pointing out the vast contrast.

Skinny Rat, 18, smashes into a greggs to loot it - TERRORIST
Fella kills multiple people on Nottingham, Fella looks for a soldier to stab - MENTAL HEALTH

I do agree though, if people are attacking mosques then it is terror. If people are attacking people based on the colour of their skin then it is racial and they should be charged and punished accordingly.

 

[David O'Day]

You missed out this guy
View attachment 37541

Hi, would you be able to confirm why you think the "protests" are about things like that Newcastle case? I have not seen much in the way of "protestors" calling for more prisons to be built?

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Not just political ...

"... the use or threat is made for the purpose of advancing a political, religious, racial or ideological cause"
(s.1(1)c, Terrorism Act 2000)

So genuine question… in a court of law, not the court of opinion, would the Muslim attacks the other evening count as terrorism? The argument would be that it was retribution/ revenge/ reacting.

and no I’m not “defending” or “condoning” it at all.

 

[David O'Day]

So genuine question… in a court of law, not the court of opinion, would the Muslim attacks the other evening count as terrorism? The argument would be that it was retribution/ revenge/ reacting.

and no I’m not “defending” or “condoning” it at all.

probably not, or you'd see people doing similar things on far right protests being charged with terror offences

the talk of terror offences is likely aimed at as Clint says the likes of the people who tried to burn down the hotels

 

[Ring Of Steel]

You missed out this guy
View attachment 37541

Are you able to explain how he caused race riots?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

The Gillingham thing has genuinely passed me by so won’t be making comment on it.

This is the thing though Andy, it's been allowed to pass people by. With this, the Manchester pair being out and about, the Leeds riot being dealt with differently (along with the arrest of Nicola Wilcox and other factors) - it begs a lot of reasonable questions.

There might be good reasons for each one of those things being handled differently, I am not saying there isn't, but it is a lot of things all at once and all it is doing at the moment is pouring petrol on a very volitle fire. The media, government, and police could calm this all down pretty quickly if they were a bit more proactive, but all they're doing at the moment is making it worse.

 

[Gynnsthetonic]

Hi, would you be able to confirm why you think the "protests" are about things like that Newcastle case? I have not seen much in the way of "protestors" calling for more prisons to be built?

Its about lawless people blowing children's pop concerts, innocent little girls being stabbed to death at a summer play scheme, teenagers being raped in the sea, soldiers being stabbed and killed on the streets, innocent married couples being stabbed to death on the beach in Bournemouth, University students being stabbed to death after a night out, protestors outside a police station getting violent disgusting thugs released, the Leeds riots with the police running off. I think this has caused the riots, call me what you want these are just some of the problems that some people think, the over stretched NHS, over stretched housing market, over stretched schools, over stretched police. Its not a racist its what a lot of people are thinking but are not listened too

 

[rob9872]

... and those looting, throwing objects, setting fires, launching fireworks, possessing drugs, punching police/other protestors, kicking, shouting abuse at people, chanting religious hatred, make gesticulations etc.
Anyone convicted of rioting should get a 5 year football banning order too - to help stop the problems we've had in recent years from growing further.
As with anyone in jail these guys must get the mental health support, addiction support, and re-education on tolerance/diversity to help them turn their lives around and given apprenticeships and jobs to help them move on.
Obvious to say a lot of the current problems result from primarily those being disenfranchised poor education, low aspiration, reliance on benefits leading to jealousy and envy and them easily being groomed and radicalised. Applies to far right, ethnic groups and even those on far left that also have a few loons. The government need to see this as an opportunity to make things better for the country and develop a stronger economy and to make the UK safer. It can be turned around.

The people I would target most severely are the likes of MPs Boris, Farage, Patel, Anderson, Redwood, Braverman, Tebbitt, Rees-Mogg, Raab, Bob Stewart, Scully, Swayne, Gullis, Anne Marie Morris and others such as... Yaxley-Lennon, Tate, Musk, Fox, Hopkins, Hester, Hankinson, Doolan, etc.

Galloway? Not a very balanced list you have. Also listed lots of ex MP's who have nothing to do with this and you want them hung still. Get over it.

Why should rioting be related to football? We're already linked too much and bad enough that they always find the guys with the St George flag to associate with hooligan behaviour from lazy reporting.

Also "Obvious to say a lot of the current problems result from primarily those being disenfranchised poor education, low aspiration, reliance on benefits leading to jealousy and envy and them easily being groomed and radicalised" Really? I see it as a result of idiots being whipped up by other idiots on social media and opportunists jumping on the bandwaggon following events in Gillingham, Leeds, Manchester & Southport, in the pretence of support but wanting to cause nothing but disruption, mayhem and violence.

 

[Nuskyblue]

So I can find breaking Coventry transfer goss?

But I get what you’re saying…

I get that. You have to wade through a lot of manure tho!

 

[David O'Day]

Its about lawless people blowing children's pop concerts, innocent little girls being stabbed to death at a summer play scheme, teenagers being raped in the sea, soldiers being stabbed and killed on the streets, innocent married couples being stabbed to death on the beach in Bournemouth, University students being stabbed to death after a night out, protestors outside a police station getting violent disgusting thugs released, the Leeds riots with the police running off. I think this has caused the riots, call me what you want these are just some of the problems that some people think, the over stretched NHS, over stretched housing market, over stretched schools, over stretched police. Its not a racist its what a lot of people are thinking but are not listened too

if it is about any of these things then why are they attacking people and communities that had nothing to do this this?

your argument is weak

 

[torchomatic]

Its about lawless people blowing children's pop concerts, innocent little girls being stabbed to death at a summer play scheme, teenagers being raped in the sea, soldiers being stabbed and killed on the streets, innocent married couples being stabbed to death on the beach in Bournemouth, University students being stabbed to death after a night out, protestors outside a police station getting violent disgusting thugs released, the Leeds riots with the police running off. I think this has caused the riots, call me what you want these are just some of the problems that some people think, the over stretched NHS, over stretched housing market, over stretched schools, over stretched police. Its not a racist its what a lot of people are thinking but are not listened too

How much of that has happened in the last month of a Labour Government and how much in the previous fourteen years of a Conservative Government? I'm partisan, a lifelong Labour member, but fuck that is simplifying stuff to the nth degree.

 

[torchomatic]

if it is about any of these things then why are they attacking people and communities that had nothing to do this this?

your argument is weak

Yep. Weak, weak, weak.

 

[David O'Day]

How much of that has happened in the last month of a Labour Government and how much in the previous fourteen years of a Conservative Government? I'm partisan, a lifelong Labour member, but fuck that is simplifying stuff to the nth degree.

I also can't see how you can believe those are reasons for people attacking anyone non white and trying to attack mosques?

 

[torchomatic]

I also can't see how you can believe those are reasons for people attacking anyone non white and trying to attack mosques?

Dumb. Thick as pigshit.

 

[torchomatic]

I had no sympathy with Just Stop Oil (although I agree with their broad message) for the way they caused chaos. To think they got basically double the sentences of these fucking morons beggars belief.

 

[rob9872]

I had no sympathy with Just Stop Oil (although I agree with their broad message) for the way they caused chaos. To think they got basically double the sentences of these fucking morons beggars belief.

According to the courts over 50,000 additional queuing hours, over £1m in costs and strategically planned to cause maximum disruption rather than any spontaneity.

I'm not suggesting it's right they carry more, but understandable on its own merits and to compare is like comparing other crimes not committed or the lad that was let out early on this thread that was rightly shot down as being unrelated.

 

[skybluecam]

I had no sympathy with Just Stop Oil (although I agree with their broad message) for the way they caused chaos. To think they got basically double the sentences of these fucking morons beggars belief.

There’s a lot of false equivalency being drawn between JSO and these protests.

The JSO activists convicted were both planning and carrying out the actions and basically showed no remorse. That plays a part in sentencing.