Otis
Well-Known Member
At the moment by all accounts, we can't defend against anybody.
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- Thread starter ccfc92
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At the moment by all accounts, we can't defend against anybody.
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
paying money to something is supporting it, be it politics or football. Surely you can see that ?
Paying to watch football, results in a transaction where someone gets your money, that will be the owners, who are SISU.
Nick
Administrator
I'm not saying they are directly doing it to support to sisu, I don't think anybody hands over money for the love of sisu. By your working anybody who has handed over money supports them.
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
I wont be giving them anything. They have taken my club away from my city !
Astute
Well-Known Member
I love to have a good debate. We don't have the full facts. So it helps us all having a debate where we keep to the facts of what we know and try and fill out the middle bit. But certain people turn it into a shitfest by twisting the truth all the time. For instance we recently had a poll. It was on how much we blame who for our predicament. A certain poster was throwing it down our necks that the majority of us blamed the council. Just over 50% gave at least some of the blame to them. But using the stats in the same way 93% blamed SISUE. But this was not mentioned whatever question was asked. So as he wanted it just turned into the normal slanging match.
Most people know why we are in Northampton. I will give you a clue. It is nothing to do with pie money. It is nothing to do with the rent. If it was we would be back home now. The money being lost through lower income would take many years to get back....and that is even if most of us go back once we are home. Facts are counteracted with if's and what if's. This is defending against facts. The worse thing is it stops us from filling in the info we don't know.
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
It's all out of spite. "Cut your nose off to spite your face"
That would sum up the Northampton move IMO
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
Just to clarify, is there a freehold and a sharehold? Or something similar? and if so, what's the difference?
Agreed btw
Otis
Well-Known Member
Just to clarify, is there a freehold and a sharehold? Or something similar? and if so, what's the difference?
Agreed btw
There is a freehold, a sharehold and a leasehold.
Unfortunately Sisu have us in a stranglehold.
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Otis
Well-Known Member
can you explain the 3 please? in general terms, nothing too in depth needed
Well my understanding is that sharehold is just having a share in the freehold. Leasehold just renting or leasing a property. with not owning the land and freehold, having ownership of property and land.
And if you look up stranglehold in the dictionary it is listed as 'Sisu/ACL/CCC.'
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
the only 2 you really need to worry about are freehold and leasehold. The freehold is currently owned by CCC and it's basically the bricks and mortar. ACL purchased a 50(?) year lease for the Ricoh and as such anyone that wishes to use the Ricoh deals with them. Our lease was with ACL as would be the casino, hotel etc. Then things like like live shows, sporting events are either bought in by ACL (ACL pay a set amount for an event and keep ticket money) or a rental by a third party (promoter such as AEG hires the Ricoh for x number of days at set price and keeps revenues). There are exceptions for some events, for example with live music it is usual that the venue will run F&B and keep any profits and they also usually get a share of merchandise, the venue will also often provide additional staff (local crew for loading, merchandise sellers etc) which they will get paid for and usually charge more for than the cost to them.
In my opinion CCFC would benefit by owning the leasehold. They would get all the revenues from the Ricoh but the council would retain the security of owning the freehold. The only reason I can see for SISU needing to own the freehold is to use it to secure debt against. They could mortgage to at least 100% of the freehold value and then use that money to pay off the 'debts' owed to other SISU companies. Then they can walk away from the club with their money back (and possibly a profit) but CCFC are left with a huge debt to service. Default on that debt and the ownership of the ground will go to the bank who provided the loan.
In my opinion CCFC would benefit by owning the leasehold. They would get all the revenues from the Ricoh but the council would retain the security of owning the freehold. The only reason I can see for SISU needing to own the freehold is to use it to secure debt against. They could mortgage to at least 100% of the freehold value and then use that money to pay off the 'debts' owed to other SISU companies. Then they can walk away from the club with their money back (and possibly a profit) but CCFC are left with a huge debt to service. Default on that debt and the ownership of the ground will go to the bank who provided the loan.
skybluefred
New Member
The club owned the revenues you talk about,but the owners sold them. I believe for £5 or £6m. If the club now want them back they must surely have to buy them at a similar price.Or do you believe in Santa Claus ?.
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
I presume then that no one will be going to Barnsley next weekend? And who pays the players?
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
I'm not.
Oh, SISU pay the players, as they "will cover the loses" from moving us to Northampton
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
And neither will anyone else as that would be giving cash to SISU. That will cause a few headlines next week, zero away support at Barnsley.
Nick
Administrator
Supporting sisu you mean. Half the shouty sisu out people will be supporting them.
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
Oh, yes I'm sure those who attack scum like me for attending Sixfields wouldn't be hypocritical enough to go to Barnsley as SISU get a cut of the ticket sales.
Nick
Administrator
Like you Nick
How like me? I haven't given sisu a penny so don't support them like the shouty sisu out people who went to wimbledon or going to barnsley
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
I meant are you going Barnsley?
Nick
Administrator
Course you did, and no I'm not.
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
Erm okay? N oh right. But those that are, are hypocrites yeah?
Nick
Administrator
Yes every single fan is, of course they are. (Sarcasm)
Back in the real world, if people shout about not giving sisu a penny or anybody who gives then money and supports them and then goes to Barnsley then they are shooting themselves in the foot. That isn't every fan by any means, far from it.
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
so only the loyal, superior sixfields attendees maybe go?
Nick
Administrator
What are you on about?
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
you said if those not going to sixfields go to Barnsley, they are shooting themselves in the foot. so I asked, only those who go to sixfields can go to Barnsley?
ccfc92
Well-Known Member
apologies, it was meant to say "may go"
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
You have people saying everyone who boycotts Sixfields shouldn't be going to away games cup games as it gives SISU money, doesn't that make the assumption that everyone boycotting is subscribing to NOPM? Maybe people are not going to Sixfields as they feel we shouldn't be playing home games there, if that's the case then they aren't shooting themselves in the foot / being hypocritical by going to away cup games.
Even if they do support NOPM there's no fixed set of rules or are people thinking SISU are going to make so much on away ticket sales in the cup it's going to offset all other lost revenue under NOPM?
Even if they do support NOPM there's no fixed set of rules or are people thinking SISU are going to make so much on away ticket sales in the cup it's going to offset all other lost revenue under NOPM?
Nick
Administrator
No, only those who say they won't go because they won't give sisu any money, nopm etc which isnt.all fans by far. By.ccfcways logic these people are supporting sisu if they go.
Anybody can go if they want and I hope they have a good day out.
Nick
Administrator
Surely the rules are not giving then a penny if they are supporting and going on about it in every thread? It is the same as saying they won't make much from ticket sales at sixfields so it's ok.