Marketing Thoughts (8 Viewers)

Grendel

Well-Known Member
I cannot believe the forum is imploding again – and now it is over ticket pricing.

Well I am getting the usual statements of derision from, to quote one in particular, the usual suspects so what from a marketing perspective would you do?

Pricing

Pricing isn’t an isolated department in marketing and if it was it would maximise price and not lower it. To set a reasonable price you would benchmark other competitors in your industry to establish a “list price”

- Look at the average pricing structure in the League
- Look at the concession and children’s offers
- Analyse special offers that clubs may do
- Look at what they charge for on-line bookings and also postage and walk up charges

If you look at the pricing structure of most clubs, like it or not, they have done this as the pricing is almost identical. You would expect newly promoted clubs to have cheaper (they have) and Inner London to be higher (they are)

Customer Loyalty

What the debate is missing is that customer loyalty is essential and repeat purchase vital for Long Term success. This will in an industry like this have a huge influence on pricing policy and strategy.

Loyalty in football is the season ticket buyer. He pays up front so guarantees revenue and long term commitment so needs to be secured.

In my view the Season Ticket offer is competitive. It meets the criteria set out above. The securing of a large base of loyal customers allows the club to set a competitive individual pricing strategy in that season to attract other customers in the hope that they will then become loyal customers in the future. This is undoubtedly the case with Sheffield United who have a very high percentage of Season Ticket holders. This is why they have offered a lower price for one stand. It is not to do with an acknowledgement of a lower demographic or an urgency to generate short term revenue. It’s the opposite; it’s to secure a long term commitment next season and at a higher rate than CCFC.

Coventry has a problem in that it has a very competitive offering for the season but a lower take up of the offer so it relies now on attracting the floating fan on a more permanent basis.

Personally I would focus on this aspect as a priority and offer a reduced offer of a season ticket purchase until the end of September with reductions match by match. I would also look to offer a 3 year ticket with a 20% reduction off annual prices and an offer of free cup tickets as part of the deal up to a specified round. I would also look at working with ACL to offer season tickets with reduced parking prices to be used in conjunction. All promotes loyalty.


Price Subvention

Lowering prices is panacea to the sales department as it makes life so much easier. Sales people will always site “the markets on its arse” so lower prices. Good or bad? Well the marketing slogan is Fixed is good and Variable is bad. Why?

- It suggests an inferior product (you would expect smaller clubs to use the strategy)
- It reduces revenue unless the numbers exceed prior revenue (very unlikely unless the original strategy was hopelessly miscalculated)
- It does not always work and does not increase revenue (disaster)
- Importantly it’s very hard to extract yourself from and sets an expectancy for a long time to come even if the product offering improves
- It doesn’t secure loyalty (purchase of a season ticket) actually it endangers loyalty as it rewards short termism over loyalty

Possible Alternatives

The pricing structure once announced should not be reduced – lower prices equals’ distress and as stated does not encourage loyalty. So on an match by match basis look at alternatives;

- Loyalty on a medium term – package “unpopular matches” together and give a very good offer on five match deals with an inducement to purchase a further package on completion
- Family tickets – Important to have loyal family groups. So if two adults attend certain games allow up to two of their children under 12 to go with them for free
- Special promotions (Food and Drink vouchers and reduced car parking rates) at specified games
- Membership scheme. We have one apparently as do over 50% of clubs in the league. Is it well advertised and is it a competitive offer? Decide a rate and offer significant discounts on match tickers and a free JPT or F A Cup round 1 ticket.

Summary

- Focus most attention on the season ticket percentage – this is unacceptably low and the main issue
- Do not randomly slash prices – distressful and ultimately damaging to consumer loyalty, the brand and profitability.
- Promote targeted packaged offers with genuine appeal
- Make sure the awareness is there via fixed marketing. Awareness is vital.

Let the ridicule begin………………….
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
I cannot believe the forum is imploding again – and now it is over ticket pricing.

Well I am getting the usual statements of derision from, to quote one in particular, the usual suspects so what from a marketing perspective would you do?

Pricing

Pricing isn’t an isolated department in marketing and if it was it would maximise price and not lower it. To set a reasonable price you would benchmark other competitors in your industry to establish a “list price”

- Look at the average pricing structure in the League
- Look at the concession and children’s offers
- Analyse special offers that clubs may do
- Look at what they charge for on-line bookings and also postage and walk up charges

If you look at the pricing structure of most clubs, like it or not, they have done this as the pricing is almost identical. You would expect newly promoted clubs to have cheaper (they have) and Inner London to be higher (they are)

Customer Loyalty

What the debate is missing is that customer loyalty is essential and repeat purchase vital for Long Term success. This will in an industry like this have a huge influence on pricing policy and strategy.

Loyalty in football is the season ticket buyer. He pays up front so guarantees revenue and long term commitment so needs to be secured.

In my view the Season Ticket offer is competitive. It meets the criteria set out above. The securing of a large base of loyal customers allows the club to set a competitive individual pricing strategy in that season to attract other customers in the hope that they will then become loyal customers in the future. This is undoubtedly the case with Sheffield United who have a very high percentage of Season Ticket holders. This is why they have offered a lower price for one stand. It is not to do with an acknowledgement of a lower demographic or an urgency to generate short term revenue. It’s the opposite; it’s to secure a long term commitment next season and at a higher rate than CCFC.

Coventry has a problem in that it has a very competitive offering for the season but a lower take up of the offer so it relies now on attracting the floating fan on a more permanent basis.

Personally I would focus on this aspect as a priority and offer a reduced offer of a season ticket purchase until the end of September with reductions match by match. I would also look to offer a 3 year ticket with a 20% reduction off annual prices and an offer of free cup tickets as part of the deal up to a specified round. I would also look at working with ACL to offer season tickets with reduced parking prices to be used in conjunction. All promotes loyalty.


Price Subvention

Lowering prices is panacea to the sales department as it makes life so much easier. Sales people will always site “the markets on its arse” so lower prices. Good or bad? Well the marketing slogan is Fixed is good and Variable is bad. Why?

- It suggests an inferior product (you would expect smaller clubs to use the strategy)
- It reduces revenue unless the numbers exceed prior revenue (very unlikely unless the original strategy was hopelessly miscalculated)
- It does not always work and does not increase revenue (disaster)
- Importantly it’s very hard to extract yourself from and sets an expectancy for a long time to come even if the product offering improves
- It doesn’t secure loyalty (purchase of a season ticket) actually it endangers loyalty as it rewards short termism over loyalty

Possible Alternatives

The pricing structure once announced should not be reduced – lower prices equals’ distress and as stated does not encourage loyalty. So on an match by match basis look at alternatives;

- Loyalty on a medium term – package “unpopular matches” together and give a very good offer on five match deals with an inducement to purchase a further package on completion
- Family tickets – Important to have loyal family groups. So if two adults attend certain games allow up to two of their children under 12 to go with them for free
- Special promotions (Food and Drink vouchers and reduced car parking rates) at specified games
- Membership scheme. We have one apparently as do over 50% of clubs in the league. Is it well advertised and is it a competitive offer? Decide a rate and offer significant discounts on match tickers and a free JPT or F A Cup round 1 ticket.

Summary

- Focus most attention on the season ticket percentage – this is unacceptably low and the main issue
- Do not randomly slash prices – distressful and ultimately damaging to consumer loyalty, the brand and profitability.
- Promote targeted packaged offers with genuine appeal
- Make sure the awareness is there via fixed marketing. Awareness is vital.

Let the ridicule begin………………….

Can you do one of these again? I enjoyed the peace.
 

Nick

Administrator
I agree, we should do offers but there should always be a catch to ensure they come again!
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
I agree, we should do offers but there should always be a catch to ensure they come again!

Which is what most of us would agree on. Try and build attendances whilst not losing income whilst doing offers as well though.
 

skybluesam66

Well-Known Member
5 things without having to think about it - which would add to the attendance

1. Make buying a ticket easier (it is still so difficult)
2. Acknowledge price points - £20 is clearly a psychological barrier
3. do 3 game deals - £50 for 3 tickets
4. All inclusive ticket - pie/pint/programme/ticket for say £25
5. Free match travel from Cov and warks - (a small payment to local travel companies should cover this)
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
Speedway used to do that. I remember going to a meeting in Glasgow one Sunday. They couldn't charge for entry so they charged £10 for a programme.

Free match ticket with every £22 bag of crisps?
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
4 is a very good idea.

My local race course charges £18 to get in for the day,

They more than doubled their attendance one meeting with a "£25 punters package" of ticket, racecard, pint, pie and £2 free bet", as it was seen a s total package and "value".
 

Nick

Administrator
5 things without having to think about it - which would add to the attendance

1. Make buying a ticket easier (it is still so difficult)
2. Acknowledge price points - £20 is clearly a psychological barrier
3. do 3 game deals - £50 for 3 tickets
4. All inclusive ticket - pie/pint/programme/ticket for say £25
5. Free match travel from Cov and warks - (a small payment to local travel companies should cover this)

Good ideas, especially 1 and 4!
 

skybluesam66

Well-Known Member
no idea - but i am guessing you could give £3 per match ticket sold

Lets say you could get a package as mentioned for £27
£3 for the travel company
£2 for programme (higher volume so can do a discount)
£5 for pie and pint

Would still leave £17 for the club

While you are at it - an all inclusive season ticket for £500 with a free shirt thrown in to the above offer
 

Evans1883

New Member
I think they would do better selling ticket bundles , so buy a yeovil ticket get a preston ticket half price etc etc
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
I think they would do better selling ticket bundles , so buy a yeovil ticket get a preston ticket half price etc etc

We are just guessing on what is possible.

The ACL/CCFC deal may be on a price per person scale and might increase per person as attendances rise.
Eg. £1 up to 10,000 £2 up to 15,000 ................ £5 up to 30,000
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
While it's a novel idea if 5k adults turned up with 3 kids each that's 15k seats occupied for nothing.

We could do it easy at the moment in this league and hype it up for a super cup draw.
Incrementally you would increase the number of adults who are held back by having kids.
Kids would get hooked for the future.
F&B would be critical as they all need feeding.
 

skybluesam66

Well-Known Member
We are just guessing on what is possible.

The ACL/CCFC deal may be on a price per person scale and might increase per person as attendances rise.
Eg. £1 up to 10,000 £2 up to 15,000 ................ £5 up to 30,000

and to build a business takes proper investment- and targeted marketing
You have to make it affordable/ easy/ and not make it 100% dependent on the league position
jimmy hill did the pop and crisps - we should be 50 years ahead of that now - but really have we gone backwards
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
Not mine. I tell him it's against the law for under 10s to have food purchased for them at football stadiums.
We could do it easy at the moment in this league and hype it up for a super cup draw.
Incrementally you would increase the number of adults who are held back by having kids.
Kids would get hooked for the future.
F&B would be critical as they all need feeding.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
While it's a novel idea if 5k adults turned up with 3 kids each that's 15k seats occupied for nothing.

We have regularly had 15,000 seats unoccupied for nothing over the last 9 years so what's the difference?

That's potentially 15,000 future paying customers when they turn over the age of 12.
 
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SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Good points on the incentive to get people to buy season tickets. Family ticket deals are something that should also be done.

How about a loyalty reward card like they do in supermarkets or coffee shops?

Like attend 10 matches and then get a free ticket? Or for each ticket you buy you get points so you can either get reductions on future tickets or in the club shop?

I don't really agree with the everyone else charges this price so therefore we should, if everyone only ever copied each other then where is the opportunity for progress and innovative ideas. Somewhere down the line an English club with a strong willed owner with a vision to re-emulate the German model of football with ticketing/travel/stadium and it will either be a disaster or a great success and lead the way for other clubs to follow.
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
We seem to be one of the only clubs who don't offer a family experience of some sort. Like a family ticket or 4 people either 2 adults and 2 children or 3 adults and 1 kid.

I also think adding a pint to tickets and or a pie. People like stuff like this and it sells. As I've said many a time we are lucky enough to have a 32k stadium so let's use it.

I would rather force people to go in and fill it than continually see more than half empty.
 

Nick

Administrator
We have regularly had 15,000 seats unoccupied for nothing over the last 9 years so what's the difference?

That's potentially 15,000 future paying customers when they turn over the age of 12.

IF they are going to be empty anyway then why not? I wouldn't know how it would be done though as obviously if people paying want to then they would get priority. Maybe like a late rooms style where kids go in if it is going to be empty anyway.
 

Como

Well-Known Member
I remember being slightly pissed when I had a Season Ticket and they started doing deals, made my Season Ticket start to look expensive.

Also when they would switch matches to mid week which I could not make but still paid for.

I understand why the Club wants Season Ticket holders, from recollection this is a relatively new thing, back in the day most people paid on the day, but that was standing.

I guess it is a bit like the Cinema, I have never booked, but more and more people do.

It is a balance, they need to maximize revenue and keep as many people happy as possible.

Obviously if they took guidance from many suggestions on here they would be in major financial difficulties.

Kids for free, well as a kid I paid, probably not that much, but I tend to be of the view that if you do not pay then it has no value.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
We seem to be one of the only clubs who don't offer a family experience of some sort. Like a family ticket or 4 people either 2 adults and 2 children or 3 adults and 1 kid.

I also think adding a pint to tickets and or a pie. People like stuff like this and it sells. As I've said many a time we are lucky enough to have a 32k stadium so let's use it.

I would rather force people to go in and fill it than continually see more than half empty.
I don't see a pie and pint really enticing new supporters to come and watch, it's more just a little bonus for those who would have came anyway.
 

duffer

Well-Known Member
I cannot believe the forum is imploding again – and now it is over ticket pricing.

Let the ridicule begin………………….

No ridicule needed, I'm not sure I'd agree with every bit of it, but overall a really interesting analysis. Thank you.
 

Samo

Well-Known Member
I think there's so much more that could be done with the match day experience. They need to be a bit creative to drag the families/kids in.
Get some face painters in to give the kids some sky blue warpaint on the way in, give em some freebies, balloons or something. Get some entertainers in down by the bars... Jugglers or magicians. Install some games for the kids, footy simulators like you get in the arcades.
Anything to make the whole thing an experience so the kids will nag to come back.
 

duffer

Well-Known Member
While it's a novel idea if 5k adults turned up with 3 kids each that's 15k seats occupied for nothing.

I wouldn't worry - I've got three kids. If everyone elses are like mine, you couldn't pay me to take all three of them to the game on my own. There would be tears, tantrums, constant trips to the toilet, and endless begging for pop and crisps. And that's just me, imagine what the kids would be like. ;)
 

Johnnythespider

Well-Known Member
IF they are going to be empty anyway then why not? I wouldn't know how it would be done though as obviously if people paying want to then they would get priority. Maybe like a late rooms style where kids go in if it is going to be empty anyway.

I should think that on a Friday evening before a game they would be in a position to offer 2 or 3 blocks to 12-16 year olds for a couple of quid, get them in the habit and when they turn 16 bingo.
 

Nick

Administrator
I should think that on a Friday evening before a game they would be in a position to offer 2 or 3 blocks to 12-16 year olds for a couple of quid, get them in the habit and when they turn 16 bingo.

Exactly, doing more with the schools as well I think. Always good to see groups of kids from schools / scouts etc there.

In theory they will be supporters, they will want kits every year, they will want to go to games, they will want CCFC quilt covers and wall paper. I am sure I also had a CCFC bike (the back wheel had a disc on with the CCFC badge).
 

ccfc92

Well-Known Member
Just make under 12's free as long as they are accompanied by an adult.

Everything else will fall into place.

This is key IMO.

An adult might not mind £22. But when you add on (£10 is it for a child?), they might be more put off.

Plus, if that £10 is in the adult's pocket, they will more than likely spend it on a drink or food in the stadium anyway, as they will think they got a good deal on match tickets.
 

ccfc92

Well-Known Member
I cannot believe the forum is imploding again – and now it is over ticket pricing.

Well I am getting the usual statements of derision from, to quote one in particular, the usual suspects so what from a marketing perspective would you do?

Pricing

Pricing isn’t an isolated department in marketing and if it was it would maximise price and not lower it. To set a reasonable price you would benchmark other competitors in your industry to establish a “list price”

- Look at the average pricing structure in the League
- Look at the concession and children’s offers
- Analyse special offers that clubs may do
- Look at what they charge for on-line bookings and also postage and walk up charges

If you look at the pricing structure of most clubs, like it or not, they have done this as the pricing is almost identical. You would expect newly promoted clubs to have cheaper (they have) and Inner London to be higher (they are)

Customer Loyalty

What the debate is missing is that customer loyalty is essential and repeat purchase vital for Long Term success. This will in an industry like this have a huge influence on pricing policy and strategy.

Loyalty in football is the season ticket buyer. He pays up front so guarantees revenue and long term commitment so needs to be secured.

In my view the Season Ticket offer is competitive. It meets the criteria set out above. The securing of a large base of loyal customers allows the club to set a competitive individual pricing strategy in that season to attract other customers in the hope that they will then become loyal customers in the future. This is undoubtedly the case with Sheffield United who have a very high percentage of Season Ticket holders. This is why they have offered a lower price for one stand. It is not to do with an acknowledgement of a lower demographic or an urgency to generate short term revenue. It’s the opposite; it’s to secure a long term commitment next season and at a higher rate than CCFC.

Coventry has a problem in that it has a very competitive offering for the season but a lower take up of the offer so it relies now on attracting the floating fan on a more permanent basis.

Personally I would focus on this aspect as a priority and offer a reduced offer of a season ticket purchase until the end of September with reductions match by match. I would also look to offer a 3 year ticket with a 20% reduction off annual prices and an offer of free cup tickets as part of the deal up to a specified round. I would also look at working with ACL to offer season tickets with reduced parking prices to be used in conjunction. All promotes loyalty.


Price Subvention

Lowering prices is panacea to the sales department as it makes life so much easier. Sales people will always site “the markets on its arse” so lower prices. Good or bad? Well the marketing slogan is Fixed is good and Variable is bad. Why?

- It suggests an inferior product (you would expect smaller clubs to use the strategy)
- It reduces revenue unless the numbers exceed prior revenue (very unlikely unless the original strategy was hopelessly miscalculated)
- It does not always work and does not increase revenue (disaster)
- Importantly it’s very hard to extract yourself from and sets an expectancy for a long time to come even if the product offering improves
- It doesn’t secure loyalty (purchase of a season ticket) actually it endangers loyalty as it rewards short termism over loyalty

Possible Alternatives

The pricing structure once announced should not be reduced – lower prices equals’ distress and as stated does not encourage loyalty. So on an match by match basis look at alternatives;

- Loyalty on a medium term – package “unpopular matches” together and give a very good offer on five match deals with an inducement to purchase a further package on completion
- Family tickets – Important to have loyal family groups. So if two adults attend certain games allow up to two of their children under 12 to go with them for free
- Special promotions (Food and Drink vouchers and reduced car parking rates) at specified games
- Membership scheme. We have one apparently as do over 50% of clubs in the league. Is it well advertised and is it a competitive offer? Decide a rate and offer significant discounts on match tickers and a free JPT or F A Cup round 1 ticket.

Summary

- Focus most attention on the season ticket percentage – this is unacceptably low and the main issue
- Do not randomly slash prices – distressful and ultimately damaging to consumer loyalty, the brand and profitability.
- Promote targeted packaged offers with genuine appeal
- Make sure the awareness is there via fixed marketing. Awareness is vital.

Let the ridicule begin………………….

Have to say, excellent post/ideas.

We need to target next seasons ST holders IMO, as (due to recent events) this is a unique ST period, and therefore hard to change. Get the business strategies in early ready for day 1 when STs go on sale for next season.
 

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