Ched Evans (3 Viewers)

[wingy]

This pseudo defence of Evans has to stop. The questions and innuendo raised of here about the "new evidence" by posters with zero knowledge of what this might be, or the law, is exactly what he and his appalling clan of followers want.

Looking at the behaviour and approach they take it's fairly clear that this is an approach their team want to take. It's not inconceivable that some of the remarks on here would be posted on Evans site to create the suggestion "she may have made false allegations before"

It's clear what Evans and his team are doing here. They welcomed on their site one notorious Twitter user showing his picture with an Evans is innocent T Shirt. This charming individual is known for the harassment of feminists and freely posted a link from the site which exposed the raped girls identity. He constantly has argued against anonymity for those who go to court having made allegations of rape.

Evans whole stance shows arrogance at best but male dominance and mysoginy seeps through the whole unsavoury campaign.

Consider this charming tweet - "she is stupid c**t - I hope Ched rapes her" this charming note was aimed at Jessicca Ennis - no doubt a successful female star doesn't sit well with the mantra followed by a large element of his followers.

The only facts we should be interested in are that Evans raped a 19 year old and was convicted,

His subsequent vile campaign has ruined the victims life forever and his lack of humility and acceptance has whipped up such fervour that women who are raped will never step forward.

That's his true crime and it's a crime he should hang his head in shame for but shame and Ched Evans are, I suspect, not natural bedfellows.

Agreed!
He should do more time for the effect all his post trial behaviour has had on her life.
Disgusting vile excuse of a man.

 

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[Otis]

Will the victim be offered compensation if, in the likely event, Evans remains guilty? No doubt there will be little consideraton given to her once again.

Hardly surprising that so many rapes aren't reported.

#pray4ched

Surely she could sue for defamation of character couldn't she. If the conviction remains safe and he has been slinging mud around, then she would have a great case for damages.

 

[Specs WT-R75]

I think you have a decent point about the law, I don't think it was designed with this sort of case i mind. As for your question if that person can demonstrate they genuinely believed they had your consent then as far as I understand then no they wouldn't be guilty.

Okay, I agree 100% with your comment. If I go out tonight get a bit tipsy and take someone back to my place, how exactly do I demonstrate that I genuinely believed I had consent.... and I guess herein lies the problem.

 

[Sick Boy]

Surely she could sue for defamation of character couldn't she. If the conviction remains safe and he has been slinging mud around, then she would have a great case for damages.

Let's hope so. It is hardly going to encourage over women to come forward after they've been raped either, is it?

 

[Otis]

Let's hope so. It is hardly going to encourage over women to come forward after they've been raped either, is it?

Nope. This is why police have to dot all the i's and cross all the t's in future. Make sure they get witness statements from everyone and look at all evidence. There seems to be evidence that was not submitted at trial.

Not fair for any rape victim to have to go through all this and then have to go through it all again.

 

[Grendel]

Surely she could sue for defamation of character couldn't she. If the conviction remains safe and he has been slinging mud around, then she would have a great case for damages.

Really, from who?

 

[Sick Boy]

Another thing no one has bothered to question; if he was convicted of rape, why he served such a short sentence?

Would an 'ordinary' member of the public be offered the same treatment as him?

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Okay, I agree 100% with your comment. If I go out tonight get a bit tipsy and take someone back to my place, how exactly do I demonstrate that I genuinely believed I had consent.... and I guess herein lies the problem.

They'd look at cctv evidence in the pub, club, street or wherever of you two meeting, possibly socialising for a bit and then leaving together willingly. As well as witnesses statements who saw the two of you together backing up the above cctv evidence. Exactly like happened with Macdonald

 

[Macca]

It's a grubby little world football

 

[Otis]

We've created a monster.

Sent from my Hudl 2 using Tapatalk

 

[dutchman]

Not fair for any rape victim to have to go through all this and then have to go through it all again.

It's also not fair for any man falsely accused of rape to have to go through all this.

 

[Otis]

It's also not fair for any man falsely accused of rape to have to go through all this.

Well that is entirely true too. That's why these cases have to make sure that all evidence is obtained and every single witness interviewed and statemented.

 

[Grendel]

It's also not fair for any man falsely accused of rape to have to go through all this.

Go through all of what?

 

[Otis]

Errm, stop being naughty, Grendel.

In this case, if it is proved the conviction is unsafe, then obviously, prison, loss of earnings, loss of credibility, tarnishing of name etc. etc. etc.

 

[Grendel]

Errm, stop being naughty, Grendel.

In this case, if it is proved the conviction is unsafe, then obviously, prison, loss of earnings, loss of credibility, tarnishing of name etc. etc. etc.

Well no because ultimately he is guilty and the actual facts will not change. The putting of CCTV footage on his website and asking for conclusions to be drawn regarding her sobriety is hugely prejudicial.

I believe more than 10 of his followers have breached confidentiality laws and have been charged and fined.

Not once has Evans publically distanced himself from the people who have made rape threats and threats of violence and intimidation to anyone who has defending the young girl he raped.

Evans is from a repellant age of mysoginy that we should be looking to vilify. Where young women are just meat for his own gratification.

He should still be in prison and remain there for a long long time.

He is a monster.

 

[Otis]

Well no because ultimately he is guilty and the actual facts will not change. The putting of CCTV footage on his website and asking for conclusions to be drawn regarding her sobriety is hugely prejudicial.

I believe more than 10 of his followers have breached confidentiality laws and have been charged and fined.

Not once has Evans publically distanced himself from the people who have made rape threats and threats of violence and intimidation to anyone who has defending the young girl he raped.

Evans is from a repellant age of mysoginy that we should be looking to vilify. Where young women are just meat for his own gratification.

He should still be in prison and remain there for a long long time.

He is a monster.

Hang on a mo there chap. We don't even know what this new evidence is yet.

The bit I am interested in is that of the appeals panel, who have quite clearly said there is new evidence that aids the defences case. That has to be something of significance. They don't just grant right to appeals willy nilly.

While he remains guilty I agree with much of what of what you have said. If he proves his innocence then that is a different matter entirely. I don't see how anyone can still say he is guilty if he proves his innocence, other than that being on a technicality.

As I've said many times, there is an awful lot of conclusion jumping on here. Let's just see exactly what this new evidence is.

This case has been a complete mess from start to finish and it does now seem rather clear that the police made a number of mistakes. Let's hope to god that he doesn't get off on a technicality due to police incompetence. That would be the biggest crime of them all in this.

 

[Grendel]

Hang on a mo there chap. We don't even know what this new evidence is yet.

The bit I am interested in is that of the appeals panel, who have quite clearly said there is new evidence that aids the defences case. That has to be something of significance. They don't just grant right to appeals willy nilly.

While he remains guilty I agree with much of what of what you have said. If he proves his innocence then that is a different matter entirely. I don't see how anyone can still say he is guilty if he proves his innocence, other than that being on a technicality.

As I've said many times, there is an awful lot of conclusion jumping on here. Let's just see exactly what this new evidence is.

This case has been a complete mess from start to finish and it does now seem rather clear that the police made a number of mistakes. Let's hope to god that he doesn't get off on a technicality due to police incompetence. That would be the biggest crime of them all in this.

Well we do know what the evidence is - a character assination of the victim and also the fact the CCTV footage wasn't used or evaluated. Of course a jury can not consider this now anyway without prejudice - how convenient.

The point is missed by you. The victim has had to change identity 5 times. Killers and aids to killers such as Mary Bell and Maxine Carr have survived anonymity but the vitriol and lynch mob mentality pursued by Evans and his team have destroyed this persons like forever. Anyone who defends justice have been threatened and intimidated and not once has Evans denounced these tactics.

You seem to think this is like some episode of crown court - it isn't. This will set back women's rights and defence against rake and violence for years.

The tactics deployed are on the scale of Al Cappme for intimidation and law breaking.

Evans in my view should be also held to account for this.

Anyone, even Olympic heroines are fair game "rape the c**t Ched"

Ched doesn't ever say such comments are wrong.

What does that tell you?

 

[Samo]

Well we do know what the evidence is - a character assination of the victim and also the fact the CCTV footage wasn't used or evaluated. Of course a jury can not consider this now anyway without prejudice - how convenient.

The point is missed by you. The victim has had to change identity 5 times. Killers and aids to killers such as Mary Bell and Maxine Carr have survived anonymity but the vitriol and lynch mob mentality pursued by Evans and his team have destroyed this persons like forever. Anyone who defends justice have been threatened and intimidated and not once has Evans denounced these tactics.

You seem to think this is like some episode of crown court - it isn't. This will set back women's rights and defence against rake and violence for years.

The tactics deployed are on the scale of Al Cappme for intimidation and law breaking.

Evans in my view should be also held to account for this.

Anyone, even Olympic heroines are fair game "rape the c**t Ched"

Ched doesn't ever say such comments are wrong.

What does that tell you?

Unbelievable. The man who tells us CE is guilty no matter what the eventual verdict complaining of a lynch mob mentality. Priceless.

 

[Grendel]

Unbelievable. The man who tells use CE is guilty no matter what the eventual verdict complaining of a lynch mob mentality. Priceless.

So you approve of his tactics of intimidation and threats of rape and violence to you?

 

[skybluetony176]

At the end of the day the woman's character doesn't change anything if she either said no or was incapable of saying yes it's rape. And whether it's because she can't give consent because she's a raging alcoholic, drug taker with a reputation of being (for want of a better word) easy or she's a nun who's holy water has been spiked with Rohypnol makes no difference. If she's incapable of saying yes and some man decides to have sex with her that is rape.

 

[Otis]

Well we do know what the evidence is - a character assination of the victim and also the fact the CCTV footage wasn't used or evaluated. Of course a jury can not consider this now anyway without prejudice - how convenient.

The point is missed by you. The victim has had to change identity 5 times. Killers and aids to killers such as Mary Bell and Maxine Carr have survived anonymity but the vitriol and lynch mob mentality pursued by Evans and his team have destroyed this persons like forever. Anyone who defends justice have been threatened and intimidated and not once has Evans denounced these tactics.

You seem to think this is like some episode of crown court - it isn't. This will set back women's rights and defence against rake and violence for years.

The tactics deployed are on the scale of Al Cappme for intimidation and law breaking.

Evans in my view should be also held to account for this.

Anyone, even Olympic heroines are fair game "rape the c**t Ched"

Ched doesn't ever say such comments are wrong.

What does that tell you?

I do not think this is like some episode of Crown Court. What a ridiculous statement to make. Sorry but that is a total nonsense.

My stance has always been that he is guilty, because he has been proven guilty in a court of law. If however, he can prove his innocence, all I am saying is, let's see the evidence.

Are you saying the appeals board are incompetent? I have enough faith in the system that if the appeals board have granted the appeal, then there must be new evidence that needs to be heard.

That is common sense, logical and entirely the right mentlality to have and the way to go and the way the system works. If you have been found guilty you can appeal. Only if you can provide new evidence that questions your guilt, can an appeal be granted.

Judging by what some people have said on here, I would say there is a lynch mob mentality on both sides!

 

[Otis]

At the end of the day the woman's character doesn't change anything if she either said no or was incapable of saying yes it's rape. And whether it's because she can't give consent because she's a raging alcoholic, drug taker with a reputation of being (for want of a better word) easy or she's a nun who's holy water has been spiked with ryhipnol makes no difference. If she's incapable of saying yes and some man decides to have sex with her that is rape.

Yes. And therefore we need to know what this new evidence is. If it is as clear cut as you say, Tony, then why did the appeals board grant the appeal?

If he gets off on a technicality then that is an outrage, but let's wait and see what the basis of this appeal is.

Just because some stuff has been released to the papers it does not mean necessarily that this forms the basis of the entire defence appeal. They may well be stuff they haven't divulged.


There isn't half some nonsense spouted on here and that is from both sides (not a dig at you Tony). I am ashamed at some of the comments on here, on both sides of the argument.

Let's have the British justice system sort it out. Let's hear the appeal, let's see the new evidence. I am very concerned about the lynch mob attitude on here it has to be said.

 

[Grendel]

At the end of the day the woman's character doesn't change anything if she either said no or was incapable of saying yes it's rape. And whether it's because she can't give consent because she's a raging alcoholic, drug taker with a reputation of being (for want of a better word) easy or she's a nun who's holy water has been spiked with Rohypnol makes no difference. If she's incapable of saying yes and some man decides to have sex with her that is rape.

Skybluetony the voice of reason. Words I never thought were possible.

 

[Grendel]

Yes. And therefore we need to know what this new evidence is. If it is as clear cut as you say, Tony, then why did the appeals board grant the appeal?

If he gets off on a technicality then that is an outrage, but let's wait and see what the basis of this appeal is.

Just because some stuff has been released to the papers it does not mean necessarily that this forms the basis of the entire defence appeal. They may well be stuff they haven't divulged.


There isn't half some nonsense spouted on here and that is from both sides (not a dig at you Tony). I am ashamed at some of the comments on here, on both sides of the argument.

Let's have the British justice system sort it out. Let's hear the appeal, let's see the new evidence. I am very concerned about the lynch mob attitude on here it has to be said.

You do know a jury won't hear the evidence don't you?

Why won't you answer the questions regarding intimidation violence and threats of rape to anyone who publically criticises Evans? Why do you avoid discussing that? Disturbing.

 

[Otis]

I don't need to answer it. It is so obviously very, very wrong. Bleedin obvious.

There's no jury? Really? Wow! I had no idea at all about that at all. Not even an inkling. As it was Crown Court I thought there would be a jury and cameras and everything! How remiss of me. :facepalm:

Can I ask though, why are you not outraged and disgusted with the appeals board? I mean, how dare they? This bloke is guilty, guilty, guilty! You should be totally outraged that they have allowed this appeal. It's an absolute disgrace.

It greatly concerns me some of the comments on here. Really does.

 

[Grendel]

I don't need to answer it. It is so obviously very, very wrong. Bleedin obvious.

There's no jury? Really? Wow! I had no idea at all about that at all. Not even an inkling. As it was Crown Court I thought there would be a jury and cameras and everything! How remiss of me. :facepalm:

Can I ask though, why are you not outraged and disgusted with the appeals board? I mean, how dare they? This bloke is guilty, guilty, guilty! You should be totally outraged that they have allowed this appeal. It's an absolute disgrace.

It greatly concerns me some of the comments on here. Really does.

Ched Evans website will applaud you -- “In particular, the support he received from football fans from many clubs kept his spirits high in the most difficult of circumstances

No jury would ever find in his favour - the appeals board will look at the safety of the verdict.

A retrial is a one in a million chance

 

[Otis]

Anyway, I know you never, ever back down in an argument (as can be witnessed in the incessant Italia/Tony battles).

I have better things to do than just argue the toss with you, when I know my stance is the reasoned one.


Just to make it clear one very last time, unless anyone missed the other eleventy billion times I have stated my stance and putting it in layman's terms:

1. Accused of rape - Sounds like he might be scum.

2. Guilty of rape - Scum.

3. Appeals against rape - Still scum. Still guilty.

4. Appeals again with new evidence against rape - Okay, scum feeling on hold due to the fact the appeals board grant his appeal, stating new evidence that aids the defences case.

Entirely the right way to think in my mind. Try and have faith in the British justice system as best we can. He was guilty. found guilty in a court of law. He remains guilty unless he can prove his innocence.

I'm walking away again. Too much nonsense and pitchforking for my liking.

Have a nice evening.




And yeah, of course, I have totally, totally supported Ched Evans. Well spotted. :facepalm:

Good god will this nonsense ever end?

 

[Grendel]

Anyway, I know you never, ever back down in an argument (as can be witnessed in the incessant Italia/Tony battles).

I have better things to do than just argue the toss with you, when I know my stance is the reasoned one.


Just to make it clear one very last time, unless anyone missed the other eleventy billion times I have stated my stance and putting it in layman's terms:

1. Accused of rape - Sounds like he might be scum.

2. Guilty of rape - Scum.

3. Appeals against rape - Still scum. Still guilty.

4. Appeals again with new evidence against rape - Okay, scum feeling on hold due to the fact the appeals board grant his appeal, stating new evidence that aids the defences case.

Entirely the right way to think in my mind. Try and have faith in the British justice system as best we can. He was guilty. found guilty in a court of law. He remains guilty unless he can prove his innocence.

I'm walking away again. Too much nonsense and pitchforking for my liking.

Have a nice evening.




And yeah, of course, I have totally, totally supported Ched Evans. Well spotted. :facepalm:

Good god will this nonsense ever end?

Well you are the only one on this forum defending his rights - who else is? Perhaps one other but Tony, sick boy NW Wingy etc. are firmly against what is happening

You are wrong and I can assure you if Evans defence team observed your posts they would quote you in their website as a supporter. You still refuse to acknowledge his intimidation tactics as a means to achieve his end.

Ultimately it matters not. The public will decide. Twelve of them decided the first time round. Excluding the public in an appeals court will mean one thing.

Most will view him for the filth he is and treat him as he deserves. He will never play football again and will be a broken man. Justice will prevail in the end.

 

[Samo]

Skybluetony the voice of reason. Words I never thought were possible.

Well, mob mentality tends to unite people.

 

[Grendel]

Well, mob mentality tends to unite people.

It certainly unites those on Ched Evans website

 

[Samo]

It certainly unites those on Ched Evans website

Oh i see... your mob is better than their mob? The absence of reason is a great leveler.

 

[Grendel]

Oh i see... your mob is better than their mob? The absence of reason is a great leveler.

The public will decide if he is worth of a place back in society -- let's see what they decide and all agree in what the outcome is.

 

[Samo]

The public will decide if he is worth of a place back in society -- let's see what they decide and all agree in what the outcome is.

The public? The mob you mean. I'm sure they will be every bit as reasonable as you. Call me naive if you will but I honestly thought you were better than this G.

 

[ccfc92]

The public will decide if he is worth of a place back in society -- let's see what they decide and all agree in what the outcome is.

But you've said he is guilty? So why wait until they decide?

 

[dancers lance]

I think this case directly reflects how the internet and social media are changing the face of court cases in this country.

It shows how it can be used to bully, leak names, gather support (pro and con) manipulate the media and seriously undermine the judicial system.

We should just do away with the courts and let the internet decide, because everyone that chats on it is always right.......me included.