32000 crowd (27 Viewers)

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Dec 26, 2016

Otis said:
I don't get it either.

For me, if you are pro Coventry City, you are anti Wasps.

It really baffles me. As Coventry supporters we've always accepted we were shit, and everyone I've ever known to support them was proud to have an identity of following their local small club compared to the masses that support the franchised Man Utd, Chelsea etc, but as soon as Wasps come to town that's all forgotten. That's point 1 of about 500 I could make.

Even if Wasps moved into Leamington Brakes' stadium, i'd still be questioning people that ditch the Ricoh for The Windmill, despite how bad we are at the moment. The fact that Wasps moved their own club out of their home (despite the Northampton exodus outcry), belittled CRFC (another small local team), and did their best to conspire with the council to effectively wipe us out (HELLO) makes me squirm at any supposed grown adult that even buys a scarf, let alone walks in and watches a match. Even though SISU fucked up with the Ricoh, it amazes me the amount of so called CCFC fans who use that as an excuse to justify their Wasps attendance. 'Well SISU fucked up, so you can't blame Wasps.' - Give me a fucking break.

'I just want to watch some top class Premier League Rugby.' - Did you ever give a fuck about Leicester Tigers? CRFC? The entire sport of Rugby? No, it is pathetic. Hang your head in shame.

Otis · Dec 26, 2016

chiefdave said:
The worry is there is another option. With Wasps refusing to speak to the club and the council, no matter what they now say, publicly being seen to block a move to the Butts I suspect the FL would not hesitate to approve another temporary move out of the city.

Its very odd, to say the least, after what we went through for people to welcome Wasps with open arms. When someone starts talking to me about Wasps I always make a point of asking them how often they go to the Butts to watch CRFC.

Well that's what I am saying Dave. It is either the Ricoh or a move away as it stands.

The Butts I am sure would be two years minimum. Personally, I think it will be a lot longer because of objections etc.

The Rioch has to be better than going back to Northampton surely.

I think moving out of the city would be the death knell. Even more fans would turn their backs on the club.

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Dec 26, 2016

Are we still giving Italia the wasps wanker the time of day? I thought we'd move passed that and we're all now just pretending this little twat doesn't exist?

Otis · Dec 26, 2016

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Are we still giving Italia the wasps wanker the time of day? I thought we'd move passed that and we're all now just pretending this little twat doesn't exist?

I think he is entitled to his opinion, whether we disagree with him or not.

I don't think we should be name calling just because he disagrees.

Wouldn't know the figures on it, but my guess would be that 80%+ of City fans would be against Wasps being here and also of the notion to not back them.

We don't all have the same moral compass though unfortunately.

chiefdave · Dec 26, 2016

Otis said:
The Butts I am sure would be two years minimum. Personally, I think it will be a lot longer because of objections etc.

I think you could get temporary stands up pretty quick to bring it to around 10K but that would still need planning permission which as you say could take months if not years.

Otis · Dec 26, 2016

chiefdave said:
I think you could get temporary stands up pretty quick to bring it to around 10K but that would still need planning permission which as you say could take months if not years.

Yeah, that's where I see the problems. Planning permission and objections.

You only need to go down there and have a look around (would urge everyone to do so) to see just how tight space is down there.

The tighter the space the greater the possibility of impinging on local homes and businesses and the greater that is, the more likely the objection.

Captain Dart · Dec 26, 2016

SkyBlueZack said:
You hate them but wish they would buy us? Just because they own the Ricoh? How is that not insistent on being at the Ricoh? The Butts is deemed too small at 15000 and too problematic. Yet it has lapsed planning permission for a stadium that size and Jon Sharp has said plans have been drawn for 25000, yet it is played down by others, including yourself. People state but we would be renting off another rugby club. The rugby club in question though is CRFC, which is beneficial to both parties. There is another option but you have nailed your flag firmly to the Ricoh mast. A stadium that has caused us nothing but problems. Which I would suggest will do in future if Wasps rent to us or own us.

The other thing about the Butts is we're told it isn't big enough, talk of potential fanbase and catchment area. Yet here's the twist, when discussing the Ricoh and CCC's decision to sell to Wasps, those that claim 'too small', 'lack of ambition', they also claim CCC made the right decision for CCC taxpayers as most don't care about the football club. Now, what is it? Large catchment area full of potential fans or potential fanbase that don't really care about the club but might pop along if there winning or playing a big team, should thsoe people be thought of when planning a stadium?

When I worked in Civil Engineering I saw and even drew up a number of plans that were never implemented, having plans and having someone with the means, motivation and determination to finance them are 2 entirely different things. That's the real world.

Otis · Dec 26, 2016

Captain Dart said:
When I worked in Civil Engineering I saw and even drew up a number of plans that were never implemented, having plans and having someone with the means, motivation and determination to finance them are 2 entirely different things. That's the real world.

Tis indeed. Plans drawn up mean jack shit unfortunately.

It's like an artist's impression.

I remember one of the City centre supposedly becoming the new Venice with boats sailing round the streets.

italiahorse · Dec 26, 2016

Excuse me but this is a Wasps thread on a forum space allocated for Wasps.
Is it only for slagging off Wasps or is it to apply a little logic to the dire CCFC situation?
People need to realise that Wasps are here to stay, they are going from strength to strength and any hope of getting the Ricoh have long gone.
We can't afford a stadium and in all reality we are not pursuing one.
So at some point Sisu (and fans) will need to bite the bullet, stop fighting everybody and get the best deal available.
We are going nowhere but the Ricoh, unless Sisu take the stupid option to move us away to someone else's stadium.
Even fewer fans will travel this time and TF will just cut the budget to the income ...... again !. Effectively the death of the club.
Stop the court actions, get a long term deal with Wasps and plan work on a long term stadium plan that can be achieved.

Otis · Dec 26, 2016

italiahorse said:
Excuse me but this is a Wasps thread on a forum space allocated for Wasps.
Is it only for slagging off Wasps or is it to apply a little logic to the dire CCFC situation?
People need to realise that Wasps are here to stay, they are going from strength to strength and any hope of getting the Ricoh have long gone.
We can't afford a stadium and in all reality we are not pursuing one.
So at some point Sisu (and fans) will need to bite the bullet, stop fighting everybody and get the best deal available.
We are going nowhere but the Ricoh, unless Sisu take the stupid option to move us away to someone else's stadium.
Even fewer fans will travel this time and TF will just cut the budget to the income ...... again !. Effectively the death of the club.
Stop the court actions, get a long term deal with Wasps and plan work on a long term stadium plan that can be achieved.

All makes sense to me.

If there is to be a new stadium it will be under new owners and surely will be at least 4 or 5 years away. Therefore, the only realistic (moving away I see as anything but realistic) option is to get a deal at the Ricoh for at least 5 years.

It is what it is and we have no leverage and are not at all in a strong position.

stupot07 · Dec 26, 2016

Otis said:
All makes sense to me.

If there is to be a new stadium it will be under new owners and surely will be at least 4 or 5 years away. Therefore, the only realistic (moving away I see as anything but realistic) option is to get a deal at the Ricoh for at least 5 years.

It is what it is and we have no leverage and are not at all in a strong position.

I may have missed it but has anyone said we should move immediately from the Ricoh and play 20 miles away rather than stay short term at the Ricoh?

I'm as anti-wasps as it gets, and even I've said our short-medium term future is at the Ricoh, and I'm not at all panicked by the current deal running down as I'm certain when push comes to shove, wasps will agree another short term deal.

Long term however (10+ years) our future is surely away from the Ricoh, we just need an owner with enough will and cash to build one.

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Otis · Dec 26, 2016

stupot07 said:
I may have missed it but has anyone said we should move immediately from the Ricoh and play 20 miles away rather than stay short term at the Ricoh?

I'm as anti-wasps as it gets, and even I've said our short-medium term future is at the Ricoh, and I'm not at all panicked by the current deal running down as I'm certain when push comes to shove, wasps will agree another short term deal.

Long term however (10+ years) our future is surely away from the Ricoh, we just need an owner with enough will and cash to build one.

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I agree.

Don't think you have missed anything, Stu.

From me there is no insistence to stay at the Ricoh. I am happy to go to the Butts but honestly, hand on heart can never, ever believe we could get anything close to 25,000 there. Be surprised if it were to be half.

Short term deal at the Ricoh and hope someone buys us

italiahorse · Dec 26, 2016

stupot07 said:
I may have missed it but has anyone said we should move immediately from the Ricoh and play 20 miles away rather than stay short term at the Ricoh?

I'm as anti-wasps as it gets, and even I've said our short-medium term future is at the Ricoh, and I'm not at all panicked by the current deal running down as I'm certain when push comes to shove, wasps will agree another short term deal.

Long term however (10+ years) our future is surely away from the Ricoh, we just need an owner with enough will and cash to build one.

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SISU are not selling.
As long as it's at break even they won't care where we are.
TF has already said that the budget will be cut as fans stop coming.
It's a spiral that Sisu won't let us get out of.

stupot07 · Dec 26, 2016

italiahorse said:
SISU are not selling.
As long as it's at break even they won't care where we are.
TF has already said that the budget will be cut as fans stop coming.
It's a spiral that Sisu won't let us get out of.

And? What's that got to do with the long-term? Sisu will go eventually. I did say we need to find owners with the will and cash to do it. Short term we're stuck at the Ricoh as Wasps Bitch

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italiahorse · Dec 26, 2016

stupot07 said:
And? What's that got to do with the long-term? Sisu will go eventually. I did say we need to find owners with the will and cash to do it. Short term we're stuck at the Ricoh as Wasps Bitch
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Long term we will just go down the leagues.
Don't kid yourself that cutting the budget does not mean exactly that.

Terry Gibson's perm · Dec 26, 2016

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It really baffles me. As Coventry supporters we've always accepted we were shit, and everyone I've ever known to support them was proud to have an identity of following their local small club compared to the masses that support the franchised Man Utd, Chelsea etc, but as soon as Wasps come to town that's all forgotten. That's point 1 of about 500 I could make.

Even if Wasps moved into Leamington Brakes' stadium, i'd still be questioning people that ditch the Ricoh for The Windmill, despite how bad we are at the moment. The fact that Wasps moved their own club out of their home (despite the Northampton exodus outcry), belittled CRFC (another small local team), and did their best to conspire with the council to effectively wipe us out (HELLO) makes me squirm at any supposed grown adult that even buys a scarf, let alone walks in and watches a match. Even though SISU fucked up with the Ricoh, it amazes me the amount of so called CCFC fans who use that as an excuse to justify their Wasps attendance. 'Well SISU fucked up, so you can't blame Wasps.' - Give me a fucking break.

'I just want to watch some top class Premier League Rugby.' - Did you ever give a fuck about Leicester Tigers? CRFC? The entire sport of Rugby? No, it is pathetic. Hang your head in shame.

What I can't work out is why they follow Wasps now when there has been a team in the city for over a hundred years yet didn't seem to go there. If they were at the bottom of the league or got relegated (I assume you can be) would they all go off, I can't work rugby followers out (they are not fans) saw a thing on Facebook of somebody saying it's not as good as watching tigers but it will do when watching Wasps.

italiahorse · Dec 26, 2016

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It really baffles me. As Coventry supporters we've always accepted we were shit, and everyone I've ever known to support them was proud to have an identity of following their local small club compared to the masses that support the franchised Man Utd, Chelsea etc, but as soon as Wasps come to town that's all forgotten. That's point 1 of about 500 I could make.

Even if Wasps moved into Leamington Brakes' stadium, i'd still be questioning people that ditch the Ricoh for The Windmill, despite how bad we are at the moment. The fact that Wasps moved their own club out of their home (despite the Northampton exodus outcry), belittled CRFC (another small local team), and did their best to conspire with the council to effectively wipe us out (HELLO) makes me squirm at any supposed grown adult that even buys a scarf, let alone walks in and watches a match. Even though SISU fucked up with the Ricoh, it amazes me the amount of so called CCFC fans who use that as an excuse to justify their Wasps attendance. 'Well SISU fucked up, so you can't blame Wasps.' - Give me a fucking break.

'I just want to watch some top class Premier League Rugby.' - Did you ever give a fuck about Leicester Tigers? CRFC? The entire sport of Rugby? No, it is pathetic. Hang your head in shame.

You don't have to ditch CCFC to watch Wasps. Although I know a few that have.
Wasps moved out of Wycombe as they had no home in their origin of London.
CRFC are evidently working with Wasps, certainly swapping players and to be honest CRFC crowds have increased since Wasps have been here with no real improvement in team performance.

If Wasps had not come we probably would still be in Northampton and ACL would have been limping on towards administration.
Do you find it acceptable that CCFC should remain there until ACL folded and then perhaps continue out there until CCC gave up the freehold (as implied by Joy Seppalla)?
The reason being that the majority of Coventry ratepayers would not.
You surely can't blame Wasps go picking up cheaply a facility that we apparently didn't want ( even at the price they paid for it - TF )and you can't blame CCC for taking the opportunity to offload the Ricoh to continue the development of Coventry North. Particularly with the pressure Sisu applied.
I can understand the logic as a CCFC fan of obtaining the freehold for the club cheaply and without debt but at the expense of the Coventry ratepayer but when CCC had another option they would always take that option even though there was a similar risk with Wasps taking on such a big undertaking. (Bias against Sisu ?)
I would say that CCC would now be more than happy with how Wasps have handled everything since they took over the complex.

A lot of people never really appreciated rugby as a sport but Wasps seem to have pulled them in with free tickets and the razzmatazz of the match day experience.
It's certainly a better family atmosphere at the moment and I can see why families come to the Ricoh.
Once the hook is taken it's a small step to take to appreciate the visual excitement of the attacking game that Wasps play and get into the rules of Rugby.

italiahorse · Dec 26, 2016

Terry Gibson's perm said:
What I can't work out is why they follow Wasps now when there has been a team in the city for over a hundred years yet didn't seem to go there. If they were at the bottom of the league or got relegated (I assume you can be) would they all go off, I can't work rugby followers out (they are not fans) saw a thing on Facebook of somebody saying it's not as good as watching tigers but it will do when watching Wasps.

Can't speak for others but I did watch low level Rugby before Wasps. Still do.
I must admit I have never been to CRFC even though I was around when CRFC were the top team in the country.
It's also quite convenient to walk to the Ricoh to watch both CCFC and Wasps.

Sick Boy · Dec 27, 2016

italiahorse said:
You don't have to ditch CCFC to watch Wasps. Although I know a few that have.
Wasps moved out of Wycombe as they had no home in their origin of London.

It has already been admitted that their main focus was on property with the rugby club as an 'add on'.

CCFC have no home in 'its origin' therefore is it fair enough that we move as well?

italiahorse · Dec 27, 2016

Sick Boy said:
It has already been admitted that their main focus was on property with the rugby club as an 'add on'.

CCFC have no home in 'its origin' therefore is it fair enough that we move as well?

Move where ?
Our home is the Ricoh. We have rented it from ACL since day one.
It did not stop being our home just because ACL changed ownership.
Once you look past Wasps you will see that.
When I turn up on matchdays it feels like our stadium.
Most away fans think it is as well.

Sick Boy · Dec 27, 2016

italiahorse said:
Move where ?
Our home is the Ricoh. We have rented it from ACL since day one.
It did not stop being our home just because ACL changed ownership.
Once you look past Wasps you will see that.
When I turn up on matchdays it feels like our stadium.
Most away fans think it is as well.

Is there a professional team in Cornwall? We could look to take advantage of that. It isn't our stadium and never has been. The huge franchise signs illustrate that even more.

The only reason you want us to stay there is that you can make yourself money and that it would make your position even more indefensible.

Terry Gibson's perm · Dec 27, 2016

italiahorse said:
Move where ?
Our home is the Ricoh. We have rented it from ACL since day one.
It did not stop being our home just because ACL changed ownership.
Once you look past Wasps you will see that.
When I turn up on matchdays it feels like our stadium.
Most away fans think it is as well.

Past wasps they have made it impossible everywhere you look they rub our noses in it, when I turn up on match day I see their stadium with us borrowing it for a few hours.

italiahorse · Dec 27, 2016

Sick Boy said:
Is there a professional team in Cornwall? We could look to take advantage of that. It isn't our stadium and never has been. The only reason you want us to stay there is to make money.

No one would support us in Cornwall or anywhere else to be honest.
Moving would fall into Wasps hands and allow them to eventually pick up the name for nothing.
They will be seen as hero's for saving the club and bringing us home.
Far better to drop all the fights and get a 10 year running deal with as many access to incomes as we can.

italiahorse · Dec 27, 2016

Terry Gibson's perm said:
Past wasps they have made it impossible everywhere you look they rub our noses in it, when I turn up on match day I see their stadium with us borrowing it for a few hours.

Your only there for a few hours so just enjoy them.
If we get on with a long term deal we can personalise areas to give us a better feel.
Don't forget "All we have to do is ask"

chiefdave · Dec 27, 2016

italiahorse said:
Move where ?

Anywhere in the country would be fine wouldn't it? Just be good business. Wasn't there talk at one point of a FL team in Belfast, maybe we could move there.

italiahorse said:
When I turn up on matchdays it feels like our stadium.

Do you walk around with your eyes closed?

italiahorse said:
No one would support us in Cornwall or anywhere else to be honest.

Funnily enough most rugby fans were saying the same about Wasps when they moved here.

italiahorse · Dec 27, 2016

chiefdave said:
Anywhere in the country would be fine wouldn't it? Just be good business. Wasn't there talk at one point of a FL team in Belfast, maybe we could move there.
How would it be good business? No one would go.
Do you walk around with your eyes closed?
I don't walk round looking for Wasps items and frothing about it.
I'm sitting usually and looking at lots of sky Blue seats with huge CCFC letters showing. Always tap Jimmy as I walk around to my seat and glance at the additions in our memorial garden.
I usually look at all the gaps and think that if ever our management got their arse out there hands, committed to a medium term deal, we could personalise it.
I guess if I was a Wasps fan with nothing to do but moan, I'd complain about how all the infrastructure is based around the football team and Wasps is all signs and flags.
If I wanted to upset a few CCFC fans I'd even put it on Twitter and they would take it as fact.
Funnily enough most rugby fans were saying the same about Wasps when they moved here.
Wasps had a product that obviously people wanted here.

chiefdave · Dec 27, 2016

How on earth can you on one hand say nobody would go if CCFC moved but claim Wasps move is a great success.

The trick would be not moving somewhere like Northampton where there is already a similar level team.

I find it hard to believe you genuinely don't notice the Wasps signage and advertising everywhere. If it's unnoticeable why won't Wasps allow it to be replaced with CCFC on match days?

Grendel · Dec 27, 2016

Personally the one thing that will make me give up if we stay at the place much longer
It's a depressing souless stadium. Once gates went below 15,000 the atmosphere became shockingly bad. Now it's dire.
The rebranding is offensive and the stadium itself looks alarmingly in need of repair, it looks aged in comparison to some stadiums built years before.

We certainly must not commit to more than a 2 plus 2 deal. Unfortunately wasps at present want a 20 year deal hence the impasse.
If we could rent off the butts providing an alternative was found then that's probably a better option and would extract us from it.
You could get temporary stands in and I think there would be a struggle for local residents to win any objection to it.
I suspect wasps will back down but if they don't we move anyway and I'm sure some conversations will already have taken place regarding that.

Otis · Dec 27, 2016

Right. So if we moved 30 miles away you would carry on supporting, but if we continue to stay at the Ricoh you will give up.

Righto!! Ha.

You can be very amusing at times.

Grendel · Dec 27, 2016

Otis said:
Right. So if we moved 30 miles away you would carry on supporting, but if we continue to stay at the Ricoh you will give up.

Righto!! Ha.

You can be very amusing at times.

No I didn't say that did I?

I said if we can have a short term contract so be it but that's not available.

I believe the club has to move out. I think it's long term future is nil without it.

As for your sarcasm regarding my apparant contradiction have you not said how much you hate wasps but souls accept them as owners if we remained there?

Otis · Dec 27, 2016

Grendel said:
No I didn't say that did I?

I said if we can have a short term contract so be it but that's not available.

I believe the club has to move out. I think it's long term future is nil without it.

As for your sarcasm regarding my apparant contradiction have you not said how much you hate wasps but souls accept them as owners if we remained there?

Would accept them as a last resort, yes. If it is the ONLY option .

If it is Wasps buy us or we go out if existence, then yes.

I have consistently said that if Wasps bought us now I would be very much hoping we would be secretly hoping to destroy them from within.

Don't tell them I said that though.

Grendel · Dec 27, 2016

Otis said:
Would accept them as a last resort, yes. If it is the ONLY option .

If it is Wasps buy us or we go out if existence, then yes.

I have consistently said that if Wasps bought us now I would be very much hoping we would be secretly hoping to destroy them from within.

Don't tell them I said that though.

Just sounds to me that you want to stay at the Ricoh

Otis · Dec 27, 2016

Grendel said:
Just sounds to me that you want to stay at the Ricoh

And so the loop continues.

If you do not comprehend what I have clearly said many, many times then there is no further point continuing this conversation.

We get new owners and they talk of a new stadium I am all on board with it. I assume they would not be stupid enough to build something 15 miles away.

Sisu will not build a new stadium. While Sisu are here we only have the Ricoh or the option of groundshare.

Under THAT scenario I choose the Ricoh.

I only want to stay at the Ricoh because it is the only viable option right now at this EXACT moment in time.

italiahorse · Dec 27, 2016

chiefdave said:
How on earth can you on one hand say nobody would go if CCFC moved but claim Wasps move is a great success.

The trick would be not moving somewhere like Northampton where there is already a similar level team.

I find it hard to believe you genuinely don't notice the Wasps signage and advertising everywhere. If it's unnoticeable why won't Wasps allow it to be replaced with CCFC on match days?

So move to Cornwall and the locals would support CCFC.?
More like change the name to 'Newquay Sky Blues'.
I can't believe you actually think we could do the same as Wasps.

There is room for both.
We need to move to a situation where no one has to take stuff down.
Its only a problem if you make it one.
I enjoy my day watching CCFC and don't get effected by Wasps at all.

italiahorse · Dec 27, 2016

Grendel said:
Personally the one thing that will make me give up if we stay at the place much longer
It's a depressing souless stadium. Once gates went below 15,000 the atmosphere became shockingly bad. Now it's dire.
The rebranding is offensive and the stadium itself looks alarmingly in need of repair, it looks aged in comparison to some stadiums built years before.

We certainly must not commit to more than a 2 plus 2 deal. Unfortunately wasps at present want a 20 year deal hence the impasse.
If we could rent off the butts providing an alternative was found then that's probably a better option and would extract us from it.
You could get temporary stands in and I think there would be a struggle for local residents to win any objection to it.
I suspect wasps will back down but if they don't we move anyway and I'm sure some conversations will already have taken place regarding that.

What a load of tosh.
The stadium is not the problem it's the rubbish we are watching.

You guys moan that the stadium lacks a look for CCFC yet don't want to commit to a long term deal that would enable us to do that.
You say you will travel to a tinpot stadium anywhere but will be giving up at the Ricoh if we don't move out.

As I said ..... tosh

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