Ability or Application? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Tommo1993
- Start date
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
I think there's a huge attitude problem throughout this squad.
I don't think results like Portsmouth and yesterday hurt them enough and that's why I'm convinced we'll see a repeat of both if things don't change.
I don't think results like Portsmouth and yesterday hurt them enough and that's why I'm convinced we'll see a repeat of both if things don't change.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Both.
I have to agree, they should be furious at both capitulations but then you hear of them laughing and joking like it was just another day at the office.
Some of the most miserable and nasty characters in sport have also been the most successful. It has to hurt when you lose or why bother ?!
Some of the most miserable and nasty characters in sport have also been the most successful. It has to hurt when you lose or why bother ?!
It’s application all day long.
Fight, determination and motivation. Anyone see anyone have a go at anyone yesterday? Anyone see anyone try and motivate others? Heads down the whole fucking game just accepting what was going on around them.
One of the biggest disasters this year has been Sheaf as captain. Communication is so so poor - unless he’s wining at the ref.
Fight, determination and motivation. Anyone see anyone have a go at anyone yesterday? Anyone see anyone try and motivate others? Heads down the whole fucking game just accepting what was going on around them.
One of the biggest disasters this year has been Sheaf as captain. Communication is so so poor - unless he’s wining at the ref.
Torquay Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
The most they looked together yesterday was having a laugh and a joke after losing
Relieved to get off the pitch as per.
Application mainly for me, I think on their day with everyone fit we should be able to compete with anyone in the division. And have shown it at times - but the best teams do it consistently and we simply haven’t
but ability should include mentality and football intelligence and we are lacking - Cardiff there is no way their player should be allowed to run nearly 80/90 yards unchallenged in the 5th minute, and yesterday 1-0 up at 91 minutes when the game was only going until 94 and to lose - both are unforgivable. Sprint out to the player so he can’t get the shot away, lump it in the stands rather than waiting for a nudge.
agree on sheaf being captain - from what you see on the pitch from the stands I don’t think you can see the typical attributes you expect from a captain - Bidwell would have been much better - in fact there’s been a couple of times recently where he has been going spare at sheaf for certain things.
and I also agree on the look of not caring at final whistle - I don’t care if you’re best mates with some of the opposition, if you’ve lost like you just have you should be pissed off and show it.
but ability should include mentality and football intelligence and we are lacking - Cardiff there is no way their player should be allowed to run nearly 80/90 yards unchallenged in the 5th minute, and yesterday 1-0 up at 91 minutes when the game was only going until 94 and to lose - both are unforgivable. Sprint out to the player so he can’t get the shot away, lump it in the stands rather than waiting for a nudge.
agree on sheaf being captain - from what you see on the pitch from the stands I don’t think you can see the typical attributes you expect from a captain - Bidwell would have been much better - in fact there’s been a couple of times recently where he has been going spare at sheaf for certain things.
and I also agree on the look of not caring at final whistle - I don’t care if you’re best mates with some of the opposition, if you’ve lost like you just have you should be pissed off and show it.
2024/25 League 1 Champs?
Well-Known Member
I don’t think in the main it’s a lack of ability, I think it’s a mix of application, attitude and frustration
by way of example, Kitch looked good yesterday so he can play, and if he concentrates and applies himself to the task at hand he is probably our best centre half, but his attitude has been an issue (and time out the team may have helped)…
Eccles has a good game every seven or eight, but again has an attitude and believes he deserves a starting berth and being one of the longer standing members of the squad doesn’t help - he also makes most mistakes because of a lack of concentration, such as the pass that led to the Cardiff goal..
Sheaf, great player but frustrated I feel at what is around him and what has been going on at the club - I believe other players are making him look bad and the best players will also naturally drop their level if they don’t have players around them at the same level (also see MVE)
there are examples all over the squad of players who have ability and are definitely good enough for a promotion push, but just aren’t performing, and this is where a good manager comes in, and / or you would hope a ‘performance director’ - there needs to be a change in mindset, a bit like when apparently a season or so ago the team had a big sit down and aired all their issues
by way of example, Kitch looked good yesterday so he can play, and if he concentrates and applies himself to the task at hand he is probably our best centre half, but his attitude has been an issue (and time out the team may have helped)…
Eccles has a good game every seven or eight, but again has an attitude and believes he deserves a starting berth and being one of the longer standing members of the squad doesn’t help - he also makes most mistakes because of a lack of concentration, such as the pass that led to the Cardiff goal..
Sheaf, great player but frustrated I feel at what is around him and what has been going on at the club - I believe other players are making him look bad and the best players will also naturally drop their level if they don’t have players around them at the same level (also see MVE)
there are examples all over the squad of players who have ability and are definitely good enough for a promotion push, but just aren’t performing, and this is where a good manager comes in, and / or you would hope a ‘performance director’ - there needs to be a change in mindset, a bit like when apparently a season or so ago the team had a big sit down and aired all their issues
Winny the Bish
Well-Known Member
It is so clearly a lack of ability that I'm baffled by the responses here.
The players defended really well for 90 minutes yesterday, but we had to defend for that long because we don't have anywhere near the quality of a team like Norwich to be able to actually take the game to them. So we had to give up possession and wait for a mistake to score. When Sheaf went off we had zero midfielders on the pitch who could be trusted to keep the ball and find a teammate.
The players defended really well for 90 minutes yesterday, but we had to defend for that long because we don't have anywhere near the quality of a team like Norwich to be able to actually take the game to them. So we had to give up possession and wait for a mistake to score. When Sheaf went off we had zero midfielders on the pitch who could be trusted to keep the ball and find a teammate.
Saddlebrains
Well-Known Member
Application 100%
These are talented players as shown last season / at previous clubs
Il say until im blue in the face, there are a lot of players in this squad not playing at 100% of what they're capable of
These are talented players as shown last season / at previous clubs
Il say until im blue in the face, there are a lot of players in this squad not playing at 100% of what they're capable of
alexccfc99
Well-Known Member
That's the difference between having players on less lucrative contracts who will bust a gut for a pay rise or a move elsewhere as opposed to players earning more on longer deals who know they are on easy street for the next 3/4 years
Skyblue Bangkok
Well-Known Member
Sheaf is a decent player , great players don't play at Championship level.
Winny the Bish
Well-Known Member
Are they "talented players"? Seriously?
Jack Rudoni came with a reputation of a guy who runs a lot but is poor on the ball. Same for BTA. When we signed Liam Kitching he wasn't even a Top 5 CB in League 1. Fans of all three of their clubs were delighted to get the fees for them that we paid.
Bristol City fans weren't bothered with losing Dasilva, same for Swansea with Latibeaudiere. Sunderland weren't too bothered to miss out on Simms either when they saw the price we paid.
2024/25 League 1 Champs?
Well-Known Member
I’m still giving Torp the benefit of the doubt, but there are admittedly a few players that have shown they are not good enough at this level, at least as starters
Lats and JDS still decent squad options though
I also think there’s a lack of appreciation amongst some as to how much Callum O’Hare brought the squad together and kept morale on a high throughout last season, his ability was a loss but just having him in the dressing room arguably a bigger one
Boicey
Well-Known Member
Just ask yourself whether these players can:
Pass decently
Trap a ball
Make themselves available for a pass
Beat a player
Get in front of a defender
Shoot well
Win a one on one battle
Tackle hard
Win a header
Use good pace to attack or defend
Do something creative.
The answer for the vast majority is NO.
Most are plain not good enough. We didn't buy quality.
Pass decently
Trap a ball
Make themselves available for a pass
Beat a player
Get in front of a defender
Shoot well
Win a one on one battle
Tackle hard
Win a header
Use good pace to attack or defend
Do something creative.
The answer for the vast majority is NO.
Most are plain not good enough. We didn't buy quality.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Problem is, consistency is part of talent. Any player can get good once every 6-7 games but good players are doing it on a consistent basis. Torp is a classic example. Can look like a world beater at times. They may be talented players, but are they consistent and therefore 'good' players.
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
Ability. Last season, our record showed this team cannot compete with the top end of the Championship.
There are good players in this group but quality is needed to be added and that is what Robins admitted at the end of last season. We need better quality leaders because we’ve gone from having people like Kelly, McFadz and Godden wearing the armband to Sheaf, Lati and…?
Sheaf is a captain, but a team needs more than just one leader and we don’t have that.
Yesterday, there was plenty of application but they just weren’t good enough to handle the pressure.
There are good players in this group but quality is needed to be added and that is what Robins admitted at the end of last season. We need better quality leaders because we’ve gone from having people like Kelly, McFadz and Godden wearing the armband to Sheaf, Lati and…?
Sheaf is a captain, but a team needs more than just one leader and we don’t have that.
Yesterday, there was plenty of application but they just weren’t good enough to handle the pressure.
covcity4life
Well-Known Member
The midfield is definitely an issue. We need better there
2024/25 League 1 Champs?
Well-Known Member
I’m not sure you can blame Lampard for losing the culture, Robins arguably destroyed what he had built with his decisions in respect of backroom / coaching staff, and again particularly the decision to part ways with AV.
Lampard can’t be expected to build / rebuild a culture in a couple of months, that’s ridiculous - judge him once he’s built his own team, back room and on the pitch, if it still hasn’t got better then by all means moan
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
He’s got his own backroom team. His remit was to get more from the players we’ve got. He’s failed. It’s absolute insanity for a club with our finances to throw money at a manager and head of recruitment who have shown nothing but terrible judgement in the transfer market in the hope it’ll turn around.
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
He’s been in the job just over a month…
And?
If you’re heading for London and spend an hour driving North are the passengers not allowed to complain until you’re in Scotland?
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
We’ve lost 3 games, two of which being WBA and Norwich… what are you talking about?
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
We’ve lost 3 games, two of which being WBA and Norwich… what are you talking about?
We’ve played the bottom four. I don’t know how much I can keep repeating this tbh. The results are poor. The football is even worse. If you’re happy then fair enough but I think it’s garbage.
Terry_dactyl
Well-Known Member
You think Torp lacks ability?
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
I do. I’ve seen nothing impressive from him since his debut goal tbh.
pusbccfc
Well-Known Member
So that makes two managers that have failed with this side?
Cally Fedora
Well-Known Member
It’s a mix. Some just aren’t good enough. Some are good enough but low in confidence. But what we really lack is footballing nous, a bit of nastiness and some hard nosed experience. I remember us bringing in Carlton Palmer short term a few years back. Saw us across the line in games like Norwich time after time.
covcity4life
Well-Known Member
For the love of god take up meditation my man
Tommo1993
Well-Known Member
Absolutely.
It’s ability. Not to say that everyone here is shit, but this is a sub-playoff standard team (see: last season) that was dressed up as a promotion-standard team this year. The fans, players and new manager have all bought into this narrative, and are all acting surprised when it doesn’t turn out that way.