Ability or Application? (2 Viewers)

[shmmeee]

Who did you want brought on to see the game out? Dasilva? Binks? Fabio Tavares?

Literally anyone the point is to waste time and break up momentum.

 

---

[robbiethemole]

So we’ve spent c£40 million on players who, half way into the season are not good enough and we still need 2/4 more to be a playoff side?
I give up!
Seems like Frank needs to get shithousing some of the fuckers and be the gaffer, not pally pally with them.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Yes the main complaint is the awful game management. We had subs left. We were still attacking and leaving ourselves open after the equaliser.

I’m not too bothered by the result, we always lose to Norwich, but it’s yet more evidence we’ve got a team and a manager who can’t do the basics.

What subs would you have made? It does irritate me when fans just want a manager to make changes for the sake of it.

Looking at our bench, there was only really Torp to bring on. Sakamoto was supposedly not 100% so that leaves:
Binks
JDS
Tavares
Rapha

Kitching was having a good game so would you change Binks for him? I’m assuming you wouldn’t bring on JDS for Bidwell when defending a lead. Tavares and Rapha, no evidence they can impact the game. So really, the only sub he possibly should’ve made was Torp for Allen.

It’s individual errors that led to their second. First was Lati trying to buy a foul which let the winger in. When the cross was made, the shape of the midfielders (Allen and Eccles) collapsed in the box and they dropped deeper. Watching it closely, you see Thomas and Kitching push past them and Kitching ended up being closest to the shooter. It should’ve been Allen/Eccles who was closing them down.

 

[shmmeee]

What subs would you have made? It does irritate me when fans just want a manager to make changes for the sake of it.

Looking at our bench, there was only really Torp to bring on. Sakamoto was supposedly not 100% so that leaves:
Binks
JDS
Tavares
Rapha

Kitching was having a good game so would you change Binks for him? I’m assuming you wouldn’t bring on JDS for Bidwell when defending a lead. Tavares and Rapha, no evidence they can impact the game. So really, the only sub he possibly should’ve made was Torp for Allen.

It’s individual errors that led to their second. First was Lati trying to buy a foul which let the winger in. When the cross was made, the shape of the midfielders (Allen and Eccles) collapsed in the box and they dropped deeper. Watching it closely, you see Thomas and Kitching push past them and Kitching ended up being closest to the shooter. It should’ve been Allen/Eccles who was closing them down.

We’d been under the cosh all half and had just conceded. At the very least I’d have told us to not be too risky. Again the point was running down the clock, the specific sub is irrelevant but a defender on for an attacker for four minutes would be the obvious one.

 

[skybluecam]

Literally anyone the point is to waste time and break up momentum.

All the subs available were probably a downgrade defensively on what we had on the pitch, and changing shape can be risky.

Don’t really see how it’s lampards fault, they score a good goal for the first and then it’s individual errors/bad luck (deflection) for the second.

 

[Bad Boy]

I've always said I can forgive the lack of ability but I can't and won't accept the lack of effort.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

So we’ve spent c£40 million on players who, half way into the season are not good enough and we still need 2/4 more to be a playoff side?
I give up!
Seems like Frank needs to get shithousing some of the fuckers and be the gaffer, not pally pally with them.

Yeah, did you see the state of the 22/23 after the loanees went back and selling Vik and Hamer?

It was a squad that’d struggle to stay up. The players remaining in that team are; Allen, Sheaf, Bidwell, Wilson, Eccles and Tavares.

We’ve signed 17 players since then so dividing that by £45 million is just over £2.6m per player. We’re competing with teams with Prem budgets or even teams still in receipt of parachute payments until recently.

The scale of the rebuild is not to be underestimated.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

We’d been under the cosh all half and had just conceded. At the very least I’d have told us to not be too risky. Again the point was running down the clock, the specific sub is irrelevant but a defender on for an attacker for four minutes would be the obvious one.

So who would you have brought on? Just saying anyone isn’t helpful. I could see a logic in bringing on Tavares to just stretch the play potentially or maybe Torp for BTA and play 5-4-1 to seal the draw

If anything, the more viable critique is that we seemed to consider going for the win when really we probably should’ve hunkered down for the draw. It’s why Lati was in the RB area of the pitch for their second rather than MVE.

A manager can’t do a lot if the team makes a few mistakes as we did for their winner. It’s not tactical and nor would a sub have necessarily stopped it happening.

 

[shmmeee]

So who would you have brought on? Just saying anyone isn’t helpful. I could see a logic in bringing on Tavares to just stretch the play potentially or maybe Torp for BTA and play 5-4-1 to seal the draw

If anything, the more viable critique is that we seemed to consider going for the win when really we probably should’ve hunkered down for the draw. It’s why Lati was in the RB area of the pitch for their second rather than MVE.

A manager can’t do a lot if the team makes a few mistakes as we did for their winner. It’s not tactical and nor would a sub have necessarily stopped it happening.

It’s five minutes to go and your backs are to the wall formations are irrelevant. Just throw Binks on for another body. Again the point was to break momentum and waste time not enact some tactical masterplan.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

It’s five minutes to go and your backs are to the wall formations are irrelevant. Just throw Binks on for another body. Again the point was to break momentum and waste time not enact some tactical masterplan.

Binks for who?

What happens if you play 6 defenders and still concede because you’ve just given up on the midfield and/or attack. So they have the remaining 5m to throw the kitchen sink at us.

It’s just not a sensible move, sorry.

 

[shmmeee]

Binks for who?

Fucking anyone. You’re entirely missing the point.

 

[skybluecam]

Fucking anyone. You’re entirely missing the point.

You’re just playing captain hindsight because we lost. There were no logical subs to make, wasting 30s which will likely be added back on anyway to make our team worse defensively would not have been a good choice.

 

[shmmeee]

You’re just playing captain hindsight because we lost. There were no logical subs to make, wasting 30s which will likely be added back on anyway to make our team worse defensively would not have been a good choice.

Sure. No team has ever played out the clock or sat in for five minutes to hold a draw. This is madness. Thank you for bringing me back from the edge.

 

[Hincha]

So who would you have brought on? Just saying anyone isn’t helpful. I could see a logic in bringing on Tavares to just stretch the play potentially or maybe Torp for BTA and play 5-4-1 to seal the draw

If anything, the more viable critique is that we seemed to consider going for the win when really we probably should’ve hunkered down for the draw. It’s why Lati was in the RB area of the pitch for their second rather than MVE.

A manager can’t do a lot if the team makes a few mistakes as we did for their winner. It’s not tactical and nor would a sub have necessarily stopped it happening.

Torp for BTA and go 5-4-1 to pack out the midfield and double up on the wingers was the obvious substitution on 85 minutes for me.

You could see we were getting overran and chances were coming.

 

[ptr]

“Accepting what was going on around them”… we were winning for the majority of the match?

Some criticism on here is totally baffling

Been happening all year, but there were points of the game on Sat that people needed telling and nothing was happening.

Winning the majority of the match isn’t enough btw.

 

[Hincha]

I don’t think it is application.

There are multiple reasons that all point towards poor squad building:

- Weak spine (GK,CB,CM)
- No cover at RB has ruined MvE and LB was always a problem meaning we concede far too many goals
- Confidence has dropped and we have nobody lifting it which causes poor body language and wrong decisions
- No experience or leadership recruited despite a lot of it exiting
- Playing slow possession play with midfielders who cannot unlock a deep block

We’ve seen in moments across the last 18 months that a lot of these players are better than mid-table championship (Wright, EMC, Simms, MvE, Sheaf, Saka, even Kitching).

The problem is the mentality is so frail and couple of positions really weak that it has come crumbling down quickly

 

[skybluecam]

Winning the majority of the match isn’t enough btw.

 

[chiefdave]

Not really sure why people thinking making subs in injury time when you're winning is some out there suggestion. Its a standard thing done by pretty much every club we play to waste time and break momentum. Its not about enacting some genius tactical switch.

 

[wingy]

Who did you want brought on to see the game out? Dasilva? Binks? Fabio Tavares?

Just two of them separately if it was allowed that's all.
Lesson learned we hope,guile added to the portfolio of this manager and the one before him.

 

[shmmeee]

Just two of them separately if it was allowed that's all.
Lesson learned we hope,guile added to the portfolio of this manager and the one before him.

We only had one more subs break left.

We saw at Cardiff that you can waste 90 seconds and not have it added back on.

 

[Legia Sky Blue]

Tavares for BTA would have been pretty risk free, while Allen was out on his feet by that time so Torp could have come on for him. The whole point though would have been for BTA & Allen to walk off the pitch very slowly, applauding the fans, shaking hands with the ref etc, and killing a bit of the momentum Norwich were building up.