Barnsley on a madness (2 Viewers)

[Grendel]

Your certainly ran better than us anyway let’s leave it there

maybe so but some comments here are interesting

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also the Barnsley guy seemed quite at odds when confronted with the accounts which really were not great in operating terms and it’s I suspect going to continue

 

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[Deleted member 5849]

James is ok, had a couple of really good games when he came in but has been pretty average since. He did bring some experience to the side whilst Kelly was injured but we have played as well with him in the side as we do with Kelly. I really don't get the sheaf bashing, I think he's had a decent season and nowhere near as bad as some make out. We have missed him at times.

That said re: James. I wouldn't want to sign him in the summer, we should be adequately covered with Kelly, Sheaf and Hamer for those defensive midfield roles, and it wouldn't be worth the decent wedge he would command.

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Eccles will be a season older and wiser too, and will need to either be pushing for a place next season, or be moved on.

 

[cc84cov]

Eccles will be a season older and wiser too, and will need to either be pushing for a place next season, or be moved on.

Eccles has come on quickly looks a very good prospect

 

[cc84cov]

maybe so but some comments here are interesting

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also the Barnsley guy seemed quite at odds when confronted with the accounts which really were not great in operating terms and it’s I suspect going to continue

Not only are they better ran they are 100% gonna be playing championship football next season

 

[Barnsley]

maybe so but some comments here are interesting

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also the Barnsley guy seemed quite at odds when confronted with the accounts which really were not great in operating terms and it’s I suspect going to continue

you can make accounts say what you want, not worth the paper they’re printed on, that’s why accountants live in big houses, we’re a well run club punching above our weight, any short fall is sorted out the following year. Them accounts aren’t worth reading.

 

[Hobo]

I’d imagine there was a better striker than Bakayoko and Biamou at that cost available

You "imagine" but you might be wrong?

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I wouldn't mind seeing Jame playing alongside Kelly to see how that goes and as a comparison of Sheaf next to Kelly. Hamer has been a bit off form recently so maybe have a game with him being brought on as the sub for Kelly an hour in as seems to be the norm at the moment would be fine.

Only fear is Hamer might be a bit wound up having been on the bench and be a bit silly when he comes on and make some rash challenges.

 

[shmmeee]

Hamer definitely needs a game or two out the side.

 

[Deleted member 9744]

I wouldn't mind seeing Jame playing alongside Kelly to see how that goes and as a comparison of Sheaf next to Kelly. Hamer has been a bit off form recently so maybe have a game with him being brought on as the sub for Kelly an hour in as seems to be the norm at the moment would be fine.

Only fear is Hamer might be a bit wound up having been on the bench and be a bit silly when he comes on and make some rash challenges.

Hamer was brilliant when he came off the bench at Wycombe.

 

[SG21]

Aaand there we go. After your first post on the site being in the Wasps Downward Spiral chat (30 mins after signing up...), I had this funny feeling you'd then start posting anti-SISU stuff...

Not really. Don't care for the politics of it all just as long as it's not being messed around. This happens in any club regardless of owners.

 

[Grendel]

you can make accounts say what you want, not worth the paper they’re printed on, that’s why accountants live in big houses, we’re a well run club punching above our weight, any short fall is sorted out the following year. Them accounts aren’t worth reading.

Well your directors signed them off

 

[Grendel]

It’s also interesting the Barnsley chairman backed this and was very vocal about it

Barnsley FC co-chairman Paul Conway backs Project Big Picture

BARNSLEY co-chairman Paul Conway has voiced his support for 'Project Big Picture' - widely seen as the biggest proposed shake-up in English football since the creation of the Premier League in 1992.

www.google.co.uk

 

[Grendel]

Not only are they better ran they are 100% gonna be playing championship football next season

In your opinion other than the ground issue what sets them apart from us. It seems there are a lot of potential issues and they don’t seem to bothered about hiding them either

 

[Barnsley]

In your opinion other than the ground issue what sets them apart from us. It seems there are a lot of potential issues and they don’t seem to bothered about hiding them either

You’re a lunatic. I bet you believe in fairytales don’t ya.

 

[Grendel]

You’re a lunatic. I bet you believe in fairytales don’t ya.

Hardly you do seem very angry when financial issues regarding your club are mentioned- accounts aren’t made up by people in big houses - they are an accurate representation of a business at that time - the reality for Barnsley is they gambled in a l1 promotion and achieved it but if they did not - as the directors you hold in high regard admit - they would be on fragile territory

To me it’s an odd set up actually with a co-ownership structure and a strange strategy which implies cross movement of players across a portfolio of clubs and a clear and obvious intent to benefit from post Brexit rules

You clearly have zero comprehension of club accounts and yes if what you said previously was accurate about your chairman he is a liar (he won’t me you’ve just lapped up phrases and taken it for gospel)

 

[Barnsley]

Hardly you do seem very angry when financial issues regarding your club are mentioned- accounts aren’t made up by people in big houses - they are an accurate representation of a business at that time - the reality for Barnsley is they gambled in a l1 promotion and achieved it but if they did not - as the directors you hold in high regard admit - they would be on fragile territory

To me it’s an odd set up actually with a co-ownership structure and a strange strategy which implies cross movement of players across a portfolio of clubs and a clear and obvious intent to benefit from post Brexit rules

You clearly have zero comprehension of club accounts and yes if what you said previously was accurate about your chairman he is a liar (he won’t me you’ve just lapped up phrases and taken it for gospel)

You’re a silly billy pal

 

[Grendel]

You’re a silly billy pal

Amazing response

Loss of £3.4m revealed in Barnsley FC's latest financial figures

BARNSLEY recorded losses of £3.4m for the year ending May 31, 2019 - according to their latest set of financial results.

www.google.co.uk

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Hardly you do seem very angry when financial issues regarding your club are mentioned- accounts aren’t made up by people in big houses - they are an accurate representation of a business at that time - the reality for Barnsley is they gambled in a l1 promotion and achieved it but if they did not - as the directors you hold in high regard admit - they would be on fragile territory

To me it’s an odd set up actually with a co-ownership structure and a strange strategy which implies cross movement of players across a portfolio of clubs and a clear and obvious intent to benefit from post Brexit rules

You clearly have zero comprehension of club accounts and yes if what you said previously was accurate about your chairman he is a liar (he won’t me you’ve just lapped up phrases and taken it for gospel)

Accounts can be deliberately misleading and affected by all sorts of accounting policies and conventions to give the impression the owners want, all well within the law. Profit has no relation to anything 'real' and is literally just a number on a piece of paper. Assets are often under/overstated due to depreciation/amortisation not reflecting the true worth of those assets or due to intangibles. Every set of financial statements should be taken with a pinch of salt and a very critical/cynical approach.

I've known pretty successful businesses looking unprofitable because the owner wants to reduce their tax and poor businesses looking pretty good because they're trying to maximise value in a sale of the business. Some that look strong in terms of profit and assets go out of business due to lack of liquidity while others seemingly struggle on making losses perpetually.

First 'rule' of accounting - when an owner asks you how much profit they've made the correct answer is "how much profit do you want it to have made?"

 

[Grendel]

Accounts can be deliberately misleading and affected by all sorts of accounting policies and conventions to give the impression the owners want, all well within the law. Profit has no relation to anything 'real' and is literally just a number on a piece of paper. Assets are often under/overstated due to depreciation/amortisation not reflecting the true worth of those assets or due to intangibles. Every set of financial statements should be taken with a pinch of salt and a very critical/cynical approach.

I've known pretty successful businesses looking unprofitable because the owner wants to reduce their tax and poor businesses looking pretty good because they're trying to maximise value in a sale of the business. Some that look strong in terms of profit and assets go out of business due to lack of liquidity while others seemingly struggle on making losses perpetually.

First 'rule' of accounting - when an owner asks you how much profit they've made the correct answer is "how much profit do you want it to have made?"

So what’s your interpretation of the set of accounts in companies house from Barnsley FC? Also I’d like to see old Sku blue and his view on your experience of accounting which seems very disparaging of the profession

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

So what’s your interpretation of the set of accounts in companies house from Barnsley FC? Also I’d like to see old SKU blue and his view on your experience of accounting

Not read them.

Fact is you can produce a massive variance in accounts just by adopting different accounting policies or classifying things differently in terms of expenditure. You can turn a healthy profit into a loss just by not capitalising certain expenditures on the balance sheet and putting them into the P/L account, or vice versa if that's your desire. As long as you show any gain when you eventually dispose of the asset that's fine. You can change your depreciation or bad debt provision policies to do the same.

Some companies will choose to have a periodic 'big bath', whereby the next set of accounts effectively show previous statements weren't worth wiping your arse on. Tesla is the most valuable car company on the planet. It's never made a profit until this year. 18 years of losses.

 

[Grendel]

What I find remotely interesting is why the Barnsley guy is very defensive - they actually produce very detailed accounts which seem pretty easy to comprehend

 

[Grendel]

Not read them.

Fact is you can produce a massive variance in accounts just by adopting different accounting policies or classifying things differently in terms of expenditure. You can turn a healthy profit into a loss just by not capitalising certain expenditures on the balance sheet and putting them into the P/L account, or vice versa if that's your desire. As long as you show any gain when you eventually dispose of the asset that's fine. You can change your depreciation or bad debt provision policies to do the same.

Some companies will choose to have a periodic 'big bath', whereby the next set of accounts effectively show previous statements weren't worth wiping your arse on. Tesla is the most valuable car company on the planet. It's never made a profit.

So read the 31 pages of Barnsley’s accounts and tell me where they lack transparency - it’s my year end in March and I’ll be reviewing with my accountant shortly - are you suggesting they are lying about wages turnover and transfer fees which are the key YOY variances?

Oh I forgot - you haven’t read them

 

[Grendel]

Not read them.

Fact is you can produce a massive variance in accounts just by adopting different accounting policies or classifying things differently in terms of expenditure. You can turn a healthy profit into a loss just by not capitalising certain expenditures on the balance sheet and putting them into the P/L account, or vice versa if that's your desire. As long as you show any gain when you eventually dispose of the asset that's fine. You can change your depreciation or bad debt provision policies to do the same.

Some companies will choose to have a periodic 'big bath', whereby the next set of accounts effectively show previous statements weren't worth wiping your arse on. Tesla is the most valuable car company on the planet. It's never made a profit until this year. 18 years of losses.

Oh God your not one of those SME consultants the council fund through the EU are you?

 

[play_in_skyblue_stripes]

For our sake we desperately need to be promoted this season we’ve been too good not to be.

From your contributions to this site, glad its going well for you and Barnsley. Just shows anyone what is possible with the right conditions and players.

 

[Barnsley]

Amazing response

Loss of £3.4m revealed in Barnsley FC's latest financial figures

BARNSLEY recorded losses of £3.4m for the year ending May 31, 2019 - according to their latest set of financial results.

www.google.co.uk

In June, July, and August. Of 2019 we sold Pinnock, Moore, and Lindsay for around £9M to balance the books, as I already told you, any loss is put right the following year, but that doesn’t fit your agenda so you’re not listening, because you’re as silly as a bottle of chips.

 

[Deleted member 2477]

You’re a lunatic. I bet you believe in fairytales don’t ya.

Didnt take you long to work our Grendel out

 

[SBAndy]

So read the 31 pages of Barnsley’s accounts and tell me where they lack transparency - it’s my year end in March and I’ll be reviewing with my accountant shortly - are you suggesting they are lying about wages turnover and transfer fees which are the key YOY variances?

Oh I forgot - you haven’t read them

Basic EBITDA shows that their operational loss was somewhere in the region of £900k - you’ve got almost £2.4m of amortisation of players’ contracts which are notoriously difficult to accurately represent in accounting terms. Still not great to be losing money but I’d hardly call that throwing the kitchen sink at it.

As Barnsley also calls out, this is a snapshot from one particular time. If further transfer fees were brought in in the months after this then you’ve got little issue. It’s what makes the accounting process interesting - so much variance can come about in that 9 month reporting window (increased to 12 months this year).

 

[Grendel]

Basic EBITDA shows that their operational loss was somewhere in the region of £900k - you’ve got almost £2.4m of amortisation of players’ contracts which are notoriously difficult to accurately represent in accounting terms. Still not great to be losing money but I’d hardly call that throwing the kitchen sink at it.

As Barnsley also calls out, this is a snapshot from one particular time. If further transfer fees were brought in in the months after this then you’ve got little issue. It’s what makes the accounting process interesting - so much variance can come about in that 9 month reporting window (increased to 12 months this year).

The only reason I find their accounts of some interest is because the two years of accounts show the impact of championship and subsequent championship relegation can bring.

The losses of TV revenue are stark and filter all the way through the accounts.

wage reductions I assume were factored into the accounts but regardless of playing tricks with player valuations bounce back promotion was required to prevent further squad depletion or borrowing

Amortisation I assume is an impact of contract extensions and / or revaluation of assets post relegation - but it works both ways so the sale of players won’t be for the figures being quoted of £8 million either

The point is fragile finances occur when the club is relegated due to mainly loss of TV income which results in player sales and reduced wages - and a need to recover ground quickly before further reductions needs to be taken

 

[Liquid Gold]

If accounts are always correct then CCFC were profitable when ours were last released no?

 

[Barnsley]

The only reason I find their accounts of some interest is because the two years of accounts show the impact of championship and subsequent championship relegation can bring.

The losses of TV revenue are stark and filter all the way through the accounts.

wage reductions I assume were factored into the accounts but regardless of playing tricks with player valuations bounce back promotion was required to prevent further squad depletion or borrowing

Amortisation I assume is an impact of contract extensions and / or revaluation of assets post relegation - but it works both ways so the sale of players won’t be for the figures being quoted of £8 million either

The point is fragile finances occur when the club is relegated due to mainly loss of TV income which results in player sales and reduced wages - and a need to recover ground quickly before further reductions needs to be taken

Even if we sold Pinnock, Moore, And Lindsay for half the reported £9M we’d still balanced the books, meaning we’re running on the money the club generates, which is exactly what I told you, which is exactly what the club told us fans, I can’t understand why it’s so hard for you to grasp.

I would be absolutely amazed if we sold them 3 for such little, Pinnock alone was reported as £3M with the same again should Brentford be promoted whilst he’s at the club.

 

[Grendel]

If accounts are always correct then CCFC were profitable when ours were last released no?

Well yes and no. Operating losses were high and offset by significant revenue from player sales. Asset disposal to achieve a revenue neutral position is probably not an indication of a sustainable business and of course the balance sheet looked horrific

This years published accounts of our promotion season will be interesting

 

[Grendel]

Even if we sold Pinnock, Moore, And Lindsay for half the reported £9M we’d still balanced the books, meaning we’re running on the money the club generates, which is exactly what I told you, which is exactly what the club told us fans, I can’t understand why it’s so hard for you to grasp.

I would be absolutely amazed if we sold them 3 for such little, Pinnock alone was reported as £3M with the same again should Brentford be promoted whilst he’s at the club.

You won’t receive the monies in one go and again it’s exactly the same as when ccfc showed a profit but essentially disposed of key assets to achieve that.

Headline transfer fees are spread over contract lengths

 

[Barnsley]

You won’t receive the monies in one go and again it’s exactly the same as when ccfc showed a profit but essentially disposed of key assets to achieve that.

Headline transfer fees are spread over contract lengths

you’re clutching at straws pal.

We’re a well run club, operating on the money the club generates, you know itbut for some reason refuse to acknowledge it.

Very odd behaviour.

 

[Grendel]

you’re clutching at straws pal.

We’re a well run club, operating on the money the club generates, you know itbut for some reason refuse to acknowledge it.

Very odd behaviour.

The most bizarre thing is your own fans agree with me - namely promotion was essential and it’s wholly reliant on championship tv funding to continue stability

BFC Accounts up to 31 May 2019 submitted today

Will be available in 5 days. Sorry for the anticlimax! Should make interesting reading though!

barnsleyfc.org.uk

 

[Barnsley]

The most bizarre thing is your own fans agree with me - namely promotion was essential and it’s wholly reliant on championship tv funding to continue stability

BFC Accounts up to 31 May 2019 submitted today

Will be available in 5 days. Sorry for the anticlimax! Should make interesting reading though!

barnsleyfc.org.uk

we sold £9M worth of players, to balance the books, we would have done the same without promotion, them on that forum are bigger lunatics than you pal.