Boycott of Home Games v Lack of Squad Investment (3 Viewers)

[stupot07]

SISU didn't term it cover losses did they? Didn't they actually say they could cover the loss in income caused by the move? That's a different thing and implies there will be zero impact on playing budget as SISU will make up any lost revenue. If SISU had said we need to fill Sixfields every week or we're going to need to sell players that's a different story but that's not really how they presented it.

That's a bit naive given that we've always sold players to help fund losses, even before sisu came to town.


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[Brighton Sky Blue]

SISU didn't term it cover losses did they? Didn't they actually say they could cover the loss in income caused by the move? That's a different thing and implies there will be zero impact on playing budget as SISU will make up any lost revenue. If SISU had said we need to fill Sixfields every week or we're going to need to sell players that's a different story but that's not really how they presented it.

Even if Sixfields were full every week we would still be losing huge sums on the gate receipts and ST income compared to the Ricoh-that's how stupid this whole idea is.

 

[stupot07]

Even if Sixfields were full every week we would still be losing huge sums on the gate receipts and ST income compared to the Ricoh-that's how stupid this whole idea is.

We'd still be losing money at the Ricoh even with cheaper rent, albeit less than we are now.

I don think there's anyone who disagrees that it makes no apparent short term financial sense to be at Sixfields.


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[magic82ball]

SISU didn't term it cover losses did they? Didn't they actually say they could cover the loss in income caused by the move? That's a different thing and implies there will be zero impact on playing budget as SISU will make up any lost revenue. If SISU had said we need to fill Sixfields every week or we're going to need to sell players that's a different story but that's not really how they presented it.

How do you get from "cover the loss of income caused by the move" to playing budget being protected? SISU will cover the cost in anyway they can to make good on their promise to the FL, where, and I'm happy to be proven wrong with any links you may have, do SISU say that this will not be made up in part by the playing budget?

Further more, if it is their intention to imply business as usual on the playing side, then what is different now with the budget compared to the last 2 years? We have been cutting the wage bill and transfer fee's steadily for the previous 2 years have we not so is it not "business as usual" anyway?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

We'd still be losing money at the Ricoh even with cheaper rent, albeit less than we are now.

I don think there's anyone who disagrees that it makes no apparent short term financial sense to be at Sixfields.


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I'm not saying that everything would be fantastic there but undeniably we would be better off.

 

[chiefdave]

How do you get from "cover the loss of income caused by the move" to playing budget being protected?

No idea of actual figures but as an example lets say we had £10m in revenue last year but spent £15m so a loss of £5m.

Now at Sixfields lets say we have £5m in revenue. If, as SISU said, they could cover the loss of revenue caused by the move to Sixfields I would expect them to put in the additional £5m so in real terms you still have £10m in and £15m out.

Now of course SISU could then say we've reduced expenditure by £5m to attempt to break even but they haven't said that as far as I'm aware.

It's not a case of saying the playing budget is protected more saying we shouldn't be in a different situation financially now to when we were at the Ricoh. If they are cutting the playing budget to break even then come out and say it. As much as we've always sold players and in recent years had a young squad we've not normally had to resort to playing defenders up front!

 

[Captain Dart]

We'd still be losing money at the Ricoh even with cheaper rent, albeit less than we are now.

I don think there's anyone who disagrees that it makes no apparent short term financial sense to be at Sixfields.


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By that logic if the club loses money at the Ricoh and at Northampton there is no business case for SISU to sustain the club, it is just an exercise in throwing good money after bad.

 

[stupot07]

By that logic if the club loses money at the Ricoh and at Northampton there is no business case for SISU to sustain the club, it is just an exercise in throwing good money after bad.

That's exactly what happens at 99% of English football clubs which is why the vast majority of them (including us) are in huge debt.


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[stupot07]

No idea of actual figures but as an example lets say we had £10m in revenue last year but spent £15m so a loss of £5m.

Now at Sixfields lets say we have £5m in revenue. If, as SISU said, they could cover the loss of revenue caused by the move to Sixfields I would expect them to put in the additional £5m so in real terms you still have £10m in and £15m out.

Now of course SISU could then say we've reduced expenditure by £5m to attempt to break even but they haven't said that as far as I'm aware.

It's not a case of saying the playing budget is protected more saying we shouldn't be in a different situation financially now to when we were at the Ricoh. If they are cutting the playing budget to break even then come out and say it. As much as we've always sold players and in recent years had a young squad we've not normally had to resort to playing defenders up front!

But who's to say that they hadn't already planned to reduce the wage bill prior to the decision to move to Sixfields? This is what most relegated teams have to do, which is why PL teams get parachute payments to enable them to do so.


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[Malaka]

My head hurts reading this lot. There is no right or wrong. If the UDA and the IRA can sit down and sort some sort of compromise, I am baffled as to why ACL and SISU can't. This situation is appalling. I take my young kids to Sixfields due to the fact that one was asking for a Arsenal kit and the other Man U (and I missed it). It is heartbreaking, I want my kids to love this club as much as I do, I want my kids when they are men and have their own families to take me and my grand kids to watch us play.
I got called a scabby bastard from the hill when leaving Sixfields with my 6 and 8 year old kids. I am not a violent man but I would have happily smashed his foul mouth in for abusing me in front of my kids who don't understand what is going on.
In Sixfields, my kids do not hear offensive language, the people in there are friendly towards each other due to the fact that some of us hate what we are doing as we are old we are disloyal etc etc so there is a bond. Personally I am past caring what anyone thinks. I will do what I want to do. And by the way, The Ricoh is a lovely stadium, but wasted on a City that cant fill it, when was the last time we had crowds averaging 28000? We need a different stadium that we can fill and generate an atmosphere like we did at Highfield Rd. Leaving there has cost us about 10 points a season. Lets get a smaller ground and fill it, let SISU sell CCFC and move on.

 

[skybluefred]

Sisu do NOT buy players--they do very well at selling any that have any value.

Sisu do not reinvest money from sales of players in the team.

Sisu only want to make huge profits for their investors--in choosing Football as a medium
to do that,given that they know nothing about Football,was a huge mistake.

Making the ludicrous move to Northampton in the hope of bullying CCC cost them an enormous
amount of their investors money.Do they not know you cannot bully Coventry folk?

We will SUPPORT CCFC playing INSIDE COVENTRY'S boundary--not outside.

 

[fernandopartridge]

We will SUPPORT CCFC playing INSIDE COVENTRIES boundary--not outside.

Fuckin hell

 

[georgehudson]

furthermore, Sisu / Otium, don't give a Flying **** for Coventry City fans

 

[Samo]

furthermore, Sisu / Otium, don't give a Flying **** for Coventry City fans

and in other news... :thinking about:

 

[The Gentleman]

My head hurts reading this lot. There is no right or wrong. If the UDA and the IRA can sit down and sort some sort of compromise, I am baffled as to why ACL and SISU can't. This situation is appalling. I take my young kids to Sixfields due to the fact that one was asking for a Arsenal kit and the other Man U (and I missed it). It is heartbreaking, I want my kids to love this club as much as I do, I want my kids when they are men and have their own families to take me and my grand kids to watch us play.
I got called a scabby bastard from the hill when leaving Sixfields with my 6 and 8 year old kids. I am not a violent man but I would have happily smashed his foul mouth in for abusing me in front of my kids who don't understand what is going on.
In Sixfields, my kids do not hear offensive language, the people in there are friendly towards each other due to the fact that some of us hate what we are doing as we are old we are disloyal etc etc so there is a bond. Personally I am past caring what anyone thinks. I will do what I want to do. And by the way, The Ricoh is a lovely stadium, but wasted on a City that cant fill it, when was the last time we had crowds averaging 28000? We need a different stadium that we can fill and generate an atmosphere like we did at Highfield Rd. Leaving there has cost us about 10 points a season. Lets get a smaller ground and fill it, let SISU sell CCFC and move on.

A smaller ground outside Coventry with a drastically reduced fanbase, I bet people will be lining up to buy us. With money Sisu have put in and coupled together with current debts and debts likely to be in place for Legoland, who exactly is going to buy a L1/L2 side for around 80-100 million which is the only way Sisu can get a return on their investment? I loved Highfield Road but I have been in there on a night game with crowds of 13k and it was shit

 

[Malaka]

A smaller ground outside Coventry with a drastically reduced fanbase, I bet people will be lining up to buy us. With money Sisu have put in and coupled together with current debts and debts likely to be in place for Legoland, who exactly is going to buy a L1/L2 side for around 80-100 million which is the only way Sisu can get a return on their investment? I loved Highfield Road but I have been in there on a night game with crowds of 13k and it was shit

Gent, thank you for your comment. I to have been there with less than 13k, hence me asking when was the last time we averaged about 28000. We have to face the fact that we are a small club and the city of Coventry has the size of club it deserves (sadly).
As an optimist, I think we can do a Southampton and do a rapid rise. If we do get back into the premier league, I think we would have around 22-25 thousand for a few weeks and then average out about 18-20 thousand. Hence the need for a stadium that is fit for our purposes, Rattling around in The Ricoh with a rubbish atmosphere, it is just too big for us.
I do think people would come back, slowly as the team becomes successful. I also think that SISU will be here until we get to the Premier League so that they do have a sale-able asset, so unfortunately I think they will be around for a while yet. They wont sell at a low value, they will sell when it is at it's most valuable.

 

[italiahorse]

Gent, thank you for your comment. I to have been there with less than 13k, hence me asking when was the last time we averaged about 28000. We have to face the fact that we are a small club and the city of Coventry has the size of club it deserves (sadly).
As an optimist, I think we can do a Southampton and do a rapid rise. If we do get back into the premier league, I think we would have around 22-25 thousand for a few weeks and then average out about 18-20 thousand. Hence the need for a stadium that is fit for our purposes, Rattling around in The Ricoh with a rubbish atmosphere, it is just too big for us.
I do think people would come back, slowly as the team becomes successful. I also think that SISU will be here until we get to the Premier League so that they do have a sale-able asset, so unfortunately I think they will be around for a while yet. They wont sell at a low value, they will sell when it is at it's most valuable.

The support is there but it comes out the woodwork when we are playing well.
Just watched the highlights of the 6th round tie against Sheff Wed in 1987 and we took 15,000 and we wanted more.
(Interesting to see the barriers in front of us that later killed those Liverpool fans)

Clearly playing poorly with ever decreasing quality in the team is an issue in this respect.

I have no idea how our moron owners will turn this round.
I think they now they can't so have settled on L1 status with a L2 ground.

 

[dongonzalos]

The support is there but it comes out the woodwork when we are playing well.
Just watched the highlights of the 6th round tie against Sheff Wed in 1987 and we took 15,000 and we wanted more.
(Interesting to see the barriers in front of us that later killed those Liverpool fans)

Clearly playing poorly with ever decreasing quality in the team is an issue in this respect.

I have no idea how our moron owners will turn this round.
I think they now they can't so have settled on L1 status with a L2 ground.

Maybe their plan isn't long enough to require fully turning it around...

 

[letsallsingtogether]

I can see where your coming from, but Seriously sisu here till we are in the prem?
Come on even they are not that stupid would cost them Millions more for players and wages need the backing of the fans in a 12000 seater stadium never in our time.
As for the Atmosphere it is well known apart from a few clubs the away fans bring more atmosphere then the home fans it has always been that way even at highfield road.
that is why away games are that much more special you only have to look at the 2 biggest attended grounds in the country to see that.

Gent, thank you for your comment. I to have been there with less than 13k, hence me asking when was the last time we averaged about 28000. We have to face the fact that we are a small club and the city of Coventry has the size of club it deserves (sadly).
As an optimist, I think we can do a Southampton and do a rapid rise. If we do get back into the premier league, I think we would have around 22-25 thousand for a few weeks and then average out about 18-20 thousand. Hence the need for a stadium that is fit for our purposes, Rattling around in The Ricoh with a rubbish atmosphere, it is just too big for us.
I do think people would come back, slowly as the team becomes successful. I also think that SISU will be here until we get to the Premier League so that they do have a sale-able asset, so unfortunately I think they will be around for a while yet. They wont sell at a low value, they will sell when it is at it's most valuable.

 

[Noggin]

Gent, thank you for your comment. I to have been there with less than 13k, hence me asking when was the last time we averaged about 28000. We have to face the fact that we are a small club and the city of Coventry has the size of club it deserves (sadly).
As an optimist, I think we can do a Southampton and do a rapid rise. If we do get back into the premier league, I think we would have around 22-25 thousand for a few weeks and then average out about 18-20 thousand. Hence the need for a stadium that is fit for our purposes, Rattling around in The Ricoh with a rubbish atmosphere, it is just too big for us.
I do think people would come back, slowly as the team becomes successful. I also think that SISU will be here until we get to the Premier League so that they do have a sale-able asset, so unfortunately I think they will be around for a while yet. They wont sell at a low value, they will sell when it is at it's most valuable.

now is when the club is most valuable, it's only downhill from here, sisu aren't getting us to the prem, at all, EVER! This year we'll probably stay up, next season we probably won't. The season after that we'll probably be mid table league 2 with an average crowd of 1000 and they would just be getting started on building the ground (giving you and them the benefit of the doubt and assuming they build it, which they won't) season after that with the smallest crowds in league 2 we'll be in a relegation fight. Being exceptionally generous and assuming we stay up and they finish the stadium in time for the next season, we move to the Coventry area as a league 2 team with a league one quality stadium, fans who have moved on with their lives and you think we will then do a Southampton and rapidly rise to the Premier?

The Ricoh is bigger than we need at the moment though the rubbish atmosphere is due to mismanagement, loads of ways to get a good atmosphere there with 13k people (as we saw at Preston JPT game) but a 12k seater stadium is already too small and if you have further ambitions even just to be a championship club again it's much too small.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Some will say you are not a true fan for thinking that way.
Unfortunately for city fans every word you have said is correct, they need to open their eyes.

now is when the club is most valuable, it's only downhill from here, sisu aren't getting us to the prem, at all, EVER! This year we'll probably stay up, next season we probably won't. The season after that we'll probably be mid table league 2 with an average crowd of 1000 and they would just be getting started on building the ground (giving you and them the benefit of the doubt and assuming they build it, which they won't) season after that with the smallest crowds in league 2 we'll be in a relegation fight. Being exceptionally generous and assuming we stay up and they finish the stadium in time for the next season, we move to the Coventry area as a league 2 team with a league one quality stadium, fans who have moved on with their lives and you think we will then do a Southampton and rapidly rise to the Premier?

The Ricoh is bigger than we need at the moment though the rubbish atmosphere is due to mismanagement, loads of ways to get a good atmosphere there with 13k people (as we saw at Preston JPT game) but a 12k seater stadium is already too small and if you have further ambitions even just to be a championship club again it's much too small.

 

[Noggin]

Some will say you are not a true fan for thinking that way.
Unfortunately for city fans every word you have said is correct, they need to open their eyes.

I'm an optimistic guy generally, every season other than this one for about 20 years I expected us to do better than we did, but there is just nothing to be optimistic about anymore, our owners plans don't have our best interests at heart just their own, even if we could trust that they did have our best interests at heart the plan they have told us about makes no sense whatsoever and probably leads to our demise, at best it kills any hope of being a big club again.

 

[Malaka]

Just for the record, I do think a 12000 seater is too small, I would be happy with twice that capacity. As for the atmosphere generation at The Ricoh, I have thought about this and must confess I have blanked

 

[Noggin]

Just for the record, I do think a 12000 seater is too small, I would be happy with twice that capacity. As for the atmosphere generation at The Ricoh, I have thought about this and must confess I have blanked

I gave an example, the Preston JPT game which many people have down as the best game at the Ricoh including for atmosphere, how many people were there? 12655, its not difficult, you stick everyone together, there is all sorts of other things you can do too, encourage a singers area, no goal music, or loud music just before the game, blocking off certain areas, getting fans closer to away fans, there are more cheesy options too that may or may not work, like singing competitions, or rewarding the occasionally free season ticket to someone who is doing a great job of getting the crowd going, hell you can even seed the crowd with a couple of people you hired to get songs going (obviously you do this secretly) it might seem like a waste of money but I don't think it is, one of the main reasons crowds fall is that that the atmosphere is shit and for a huge amount of people the atmosphere is the reason to spend the money and go out in the cold to a game rather than just getting your football fix from tv games.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Gent, thank you for your comment. I to have been there with less than 13k, hence me asking when was the last time we averaged about 28000. We have to face the fact that we are a small club and the city of Coventry has the size of club it deserves (sadly).
As an optimist, I think we can do a Southampton and do a rapid rise. If we do get back into the premier league, I think we would have around 22-25 thousand for a few weeks and then average out about 18-20 thousand. Hence the need for a stadium that is fit for our purposes, Rattling around in The Ricoh with a rubbish atmosphere, it is just too big for us.
I do think people would come back, slowly as the team becomes successful. I also think that SISU will be here until we get to the Premier League so that they do have a sale-able asset, so unfortunately I think they will be around for a while yet. They wont sell at a low value, they will sell when it is at it's most valuable.

Disagree entirely.

 

[Malaka]

BSB, I think we are bigger and better than Barcelona, but the facts speak for themselves. We are poorly supported but you do have a point would you settle for a small to medium size club? My comparison for the city has always been Norwich or Southampton

 

[shmmeee]

BSB, I think we are bigger and better than Barcelona, but the facts speak for themselves. We are poorly supported but you do have a point would you settle for a small to medium size club? My comparison for the city has always been Norwich or Southampton

How are we poorly supported?

Have to agree with everything Noggin said. There's loads you can do to improve atmosphere, and let's remember that it's not like every ground we go to at this level is rocking is it?

I think we're too quick to do ourselves down and block off chances of improvement here.

I've been banging the drum about blocking off areas to improve atmosphere for years (link to GMK thread from 2010) and at the time (not that thread) many said it would make us look "small time" and that others would laugh at us.

 

[ccfcway]

In the greater scheme of things most people realise that a relegation/promotion here and there mean nothing. .

whats this "promotion" you talk of, never seen it in my life time !

 

[Malaka]

How are we poorly supported?

Have to agree with everything Noggin said. There's loads you can do to improve atmosphere, and let's remember that it's not like every ground we go to at this level is rocking is it?

I think we're too quick to do ourselves down and block off chances of improvement here.

I've been banging the drum about blocking off areas to improve atmosphere for years (link to GMK thread from 2010) and at the time (not that thread) many said it would make us look "small time" and that others would laugh at us.

Coventry is larger than Nottingham, Leicester, Sunderland, Wolverhampton and Newcastle. By comparison we are poorly supported. After we won the cup, gates improved for a few weeks but soon dwindled. I take on board your comments about atmosphere; but some people like to sit behind the goal, some like me like to be away from the swearing as I take my young kids

 

[wingy]

Coventry is larger than Nottingham, Leicester, Sunderland, Wolverhampton and Newcastle. By comparison we are poorly supported. After we won the cup, gates improved for a few weeks but soon dwindled. I take on board your comments about atmosphere; but some people like to sit behind the goal, some like me like to be away from the swearing as I take my young kids

But strangely It was there through the sixties up to promotion coinciding with the cities manufacturing boom and population influx to meet the need
We can recognise the demise correlates entirely with the Downturn in the cities economy and the fact that. no physical effort is put in t engage the people

 

[Malaka]

But strangely It was there through the sixties up to promotion coinciding with the cities manufacturing boom and population influx to meet the need
We can recognise the demise correlates entirely with the Downturn in the cities economy and the fact that. no physical effort is put in t engage the people

A fair point. But it is only recently that clubs have really put in the effort to welcome and entertain fans outside and prior to the games. Coventry has always had lots of people wearing colours other than Sky Blue. Most of the people I have a go at don't go because we are shit! (their words not mine), we cant get them for a tenner. I have had a season ticket for years and many is the time when I have not been able to go and I couldn't give the thing away. It is heartbreaking. When I was growing up everyone supported Liverpool, now it's Man U or Chelsea, fans want to be associated with success, hence when we won something everyone was a City fan. It does my nut in, so I cant just put it down to economic factors. In fact I would go as far to say that no big club in England really gives a toss about their fans. and neither does the premier league as we are no longer the main source of income.

 

[torchomatic]

Even in the mid 70s I was the only person in my class to support City. A lot supported Man Utd (even though they were 2nd division then), Liverpool, Chelsea, etc. So, it's not a recent thing.

A fair point. But it is only recently that clubs have really put in the effort to welcome and entertain fans outside and prior to the games. Coventry has always had lots of people wearing colours other than Sky Blue. Most of the people I have a go at don't go because we are shit! (their words not mine), we cant get them for a tenner. I have had a season ticket for years and many is the time when I have not been able to go and I couldn't give the thing away. It is heartbreaking. When I was growing up everyone supported Liverpool, now it's Man U or Chelsea, fans want to be associated with success, hence when we won something everyone was a City fan. It does my nut in, so I cant just put it down to economic factors. In fact I would go as far to say that no big club in England really gives a toss about their fans. and neither does the premier league as we are no longer the main source of income.

 

[Samo]

Even in the mid 70s I was the only person in my class to support City. A lot supported Man Utd (even though they were 2nd division then), Liverpool, Chelsea, etc. So, it's not a recent thing.

Even Leeds!

 

[torchomatic]

Yes, them too. And Forest believe it or not. Though to be fair they were doing well in the late 70s.

Even Leeds!

 

[Noggin]

Coventry is larger than Nottingham, Leicester, Sunderland, Wolverhampton and Newcastle. By comparison we are poorly supported. After we won the cup, gates improved for a few weeks but soon dwindled. I take on board your comments about atmosphere; but some people like to sit behind the goal, some like me like to be away from the swearing as I take my young kids

I like to sit behind the goal too but my favourite game at the Ricoh was where that wasn't a choice, I think if it comes down to which is more important a good atmosphere or being behind the goal then I think the majority prefer the better atmosphere. If somepeople don't get exactly what they want but it's in the best interests of ccfc thats fine by me (and I say that as someone who wouldn't be getting what he wanted) But honestly there is no reason you can't do a good job of accommodating most people using 2 stands and some blocking off. Takes a little bit of thought before tickets go on sale thats all.