Ched Evans signing for a League One Club... (1 Viewer)

skybluebeduff said:

You should say the same about Lee Hughes and Luke McCormick for actually killing innocent people, but each to their own I guess.

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The fact that you are clambering to make apologies for a rapist makes you an utter c**t.

skybluebeduff said:

You should say the same about Lee Hughes and Luke McCormick for actually killing innocent people, but each to their own I guess.

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Show me the current Hughes or McCormick threads & I'll happily slag them off......until then, just accept that Ched Evans is an un-repentant rapist c**t.....

skybluebeduff said:

You should say the same about Lee Hughes and Luke McCormick for actually killing innocent people, but each to their own I guess.

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Luke McCormack never set out to kill anyone. You can't say the same of a convicted rapist, its a premeditated crime that he thought he had the right to do only confirmed by his lack of remorse. On the other hand Luke McCormack was remorseful by the deaths caused by his actions. IIRC he pleaded guilty for starters and he also didn't think he had the right to waltz back into the professional game. He actually went and did a normal job when he got out and played non league before being offered a professional contract.

Don't you think you're also being more than a little bit of a hypocrite expecting people to accept a convicted rapist has served his time and should be allowed to get on with his life while trying to make a villain out of someone else?

If someone is a danger to society then they should be locked up. If they aren't they should be free to get on with their lives. That's my opinion.

Someone is either a freeman or they are not. That has been the principal of justice for 800 years.

The bloke is clearly a c**t but has served his time and should be entitled to resume his career.

skybluelee said:

The bloke is clearly a c**t but has served his time and should be entitled to resume his career.

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I just hope he's forced to resume it outside of British football.......

...or he could just get a real job...

skybluelee said:

The bloke is clearly a c**t but has served his time and should be entitled to resume his career.

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Even though the average man on the street would have no chance of returning to their old job?

for all the talk of petitions the Sheff Utd one had 160000 signatures Oldham have only managed to 30000. You start to get the feeling in a month or two he'll sign for a club and people will care even less.
For me it's a sad indictment of the justice system that he only got 5 years and is out & about in 2.5 years.

Sick Boy said:

Even though the average man on the street would have no chance of returning to their old job?

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Exactly, if I got convicted of any criminal offence I would be out on my ear, and no chance of getting back into the same line of business at all, and that's now nigh on 27 years in that area in one capacity or another.

I think the argument some people are making is that he still protests his innocence, and if you look into the details of the case (correct me if im wrong) the victim doesn't actually remember anything about the night whatsoever, just woke up in the morning with no idea what had happened. Had cocaine and cannabis in her system the next day.
He got charged with rape because she was deemed too intoxicated to consent to it. I'm sure there was a lot more work done than what I can read up on but I for one have said all sorts of things and done all sorts of things and had no recollection whatsoever the next day. Perhaps she was absolutely hammered and a more respectable (or sober..?) man would have realised this and not gone ahead. But for all we actually know she could have said anything. She could have said get off me im too drunk. She could have said come on then lets do this. Noone knows.

Before i get called all sorts - I have not said for one second I would have him at our club. Nor should he play for any other club until the unlikely event that his conviction is overturned. But I think that some people are saying some pretty condemning things and attacking people who are even suggesting that things could have happened differently.

Wouldn't be the first time the law got it wrong would it?

That said - no thanks, maybe one day if his conviction is overturned. I agree he should find a normal job until then.

i wouldnt touch him with a barge pole, but at the same time - defending Luke Mccormick is also hideous

somebody who drives intoxicated/ too fast/ no insurance - is much worse than what ched did
Mccormick effectively took a loaded gun on to the M6 and took pot shots - and happened to kill young children

Ched evans is a c**t - but he didnt kill anybody

Huckerby said:

I think the argument some people are making is that he still protests his innocence, and if you look into the details of the case (correct me if im wrong) the victim doesn't actually remember anything about the night whatsoever, just woke up in the morning with no idea what had happened. Had cocaine and cannabis in her system the next day.
He got charged with rape because she was deemed too intoxicated to consent to it. I'm sure there was a lot more work done than what I can read up on but I for one have said all sorts of things and done all sorts of things and had no recollection whatsoever the next day. Perhaps she was absolutely hammered and a more respectable (or sober..?) man would have realised this and not gone ahead. But for all we actually know she could have said anything. She could have said get off me im too drunk. She could have said come on then lets do this. Noone knows.

Before i get called all sorts - I have not said for one second I would have him at our club. Nor should he play for any other club until the unlikely event that his conviction is overturned. But I think that some people are saying some pretty condemning things and attacking people who are even suggesting that things could have happened differently.

Wouldn't be the first time the law got it wrong would it?

That said - no thanks, maybe one day if his conviction is overturned. I agree he should find a normal job until then.

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Good post mate

Looks like Oldham will complete the signing today apparently, a very brave move by the club. I just dont think they have fully assessed the damage this could have on their club but maybe this will all die a death in a few months time. I would assume that their female supporters would take a stand on this, maybe away fans may not attend to support (although i doubt this will happen). Watch this space i guess.

You have to think, will Evans benefit them more than all of the sponsors that will pull out? Surely he is going to need to go there and single handedly get them promoted?

very mixed views from the Oldham camp, so either:
1) not attend and boycott or
2) Attend and give him abuse!

I wonder if they will do that if he scores!??

http://www.owtb.co.uk/index.php/topic/46522-the-boycott-of-home-matches/page-2

When he scores they will cheer and jump up and down just like we did with Marlon. Then they'll go home and pretend that they have mixed feelings despite doing cartwheels inside at the buzz of winning. We want our team to play well and win football matches. I want children to have parents, teachers, policemen (some of them) as role models not footballers. Some of you have greater ethics than me, some of you will be less than honest about your beliefs on a faceless football forum, but for me if they were good enough I'd have Hitler and Mugabe up front (not sure they'd get on though).

All this talk of role models, I wonder how many parents on here would buy their kids a city shirt with Madine on the back?

bigfatronssba said:

All this talk of role models, I wonder how many parents on here would buy their kids a city shirt with Madine on the back?

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None ... The club shop haven't had any stock for months..and when the they did they had run out of the letter n so it would have to have said madie

Radio news just said Oldham have pulled out of signing the rapist.....

...good.

Says here threats were made to club staff. Disgusting if true.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30727729

A friend of mine is doing five and a half years for assault on his missus and is halfway through his sentence.
They have been together for years and are both heavy drinkers and after a heavy session they ended up fighting each other. When he sobered up he found himself arrested for assault and attempted rape on her ! Like the Evans case it's unclear what really went on that night and it looks like it was her word against his. When I first heard what he was charged with I didn't want anything to do with him as I was disgusted. I've known him for thirty years and couldn't believe he would do anything like that even when drunk.Anyway she wanted the attempted rape charge dropped as she said she exaggerated that bit as it wasn't true.yet the prosecution carried it on for some reason and he ended up getting the longer sentence in the end.It just shows the dangers of what too much booze can do in certain situations.He is suffering with depression and was suicidal for a time but when he gets out it wouldn't surprise me to see them back together !

A friend of mine was wrongly accused of rape, it went to court and he was clearly but it was the longer year of his life. He had to move out of Cov as he was always tarred with that brush even though he was cleared.

I think clubs need to wait until after the appeal, if he gets cleared then he is free to take his pick at any club. If no joy then someone will have to take a gamble.

As I said earlier On the thread I think some of these small clubs may be exploiting the situation gaining all this publicity
They surely know well in advance how tochic making the move would be before involving themselves.
I find It tawdry and the hyprebole that ensues is hardly surprising
The previous two posts have alluded to the effects on men who believe they've been falsely accused but it's such a subjective huge grey area
What I would argue Is that It is not a simple proposition for a girl or woman to make a false accusation and be believed
There are huge hurdles as well as Ingrained male prejudice within the Police they have to get past first
Thankfully that aspect is changing and justice seems to be being better served JMO

I also think sponsors threatening to pull out get a higher profile than they otherwise would, hence why they too jump on the bandwagon. Shirts already sold ir printed and they get out of contract for free.

Covstu said:

A friend of mine was wrongly accused of rape, it went to court and he was clearly but it was the longer year of his life. He had to move out of Cov as he was always tarred with that brush even though he was cleared.

I think clubs need to wait until after the appeal, if he gets cleared then he is free to take his pick at any club. If no joy then someone will have to take a gamble.

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I think a quick point to make regarding Evans is that it isn't an appeal - he's had one of those, and the conviction was upheld. This is a case review, very unusual and not something he'd be likely to get if he wasn't high-profile and didn't have a lot of money behind him.

I don't think it's right that anyone here should question the conviction - both the jury and then a subsequent panel of judges had access to all of the facts presented in detail in the court, and heard detailed and strongly-argued rebuttals from the best defence money could buy. They concluded that the girl involved either did not consent to sex with Evans or was incapable of consenting in the eyes of the law.

There's no doubt that an unfounded allegation of rape can cause a great deal of distress - I know of at least one case that involved someone known to me personally. However it seems there's also little doubt that a large proportion of rapes go unreported, and of those that go to trial, a large proportion do not result in convictions. Personally I think that innocent until found guilty is the right way ahead, and I don't really understand why all criminal defendants should not be allowed anonymity until convicted, but especially those accused of sexual crimes which carry a significant stigma.

Evans though, has been convicted. If I was an Oldham fan, or a sponsor, I wouldn't want a convicted rapist representing my club, especially one that only now, today, has come out to say that the people still hounding the girl involved (in part via a web-site funded by Evans father-in-law) are wrong to do so. It's worth remembering that the victim here continues to have her life ruined - she has had to change her name no less than five times.

Having been released from prison under licence Evans is rightly free to continue his life and find work, but he'll have to accept that his actions have had consequences, and as a result he may no longer be able to do so as a professional footballer. That would be true of him if he were a teacher, or a policeman, or a barrister, or a doctor - and indeed it's unlikely that he'd be able to find employment in a (edit: high-profile) public-facing role in any corporation other than a football club. I don't see that the ability to score goals should make him a special case, personally.

My issue isn't whether he done it or not, I accept the verdict of the court. Its about who administers justice in this country. The law, or the mob?

Ched Evans is a free man, entitled to the same things in life as the rest of us. Who, other than a court, has the right to interfere in his life? He was sentenced to X amount of years in prison, not X amount of years in prison and no playing football ever again.

Also my heart goes out to Clayton McDonald. He done nothing wrong and has had to go through hell. Imagine if you had your whole life turned upside down despite doing nothing illegal? Imagine having to prove your innocence? Imagine it was you saying this:

I was cleared of rape but Ched’s case and subsequent publicity have destroyed my life and career. I had a year of hell leading up the trial, and it’s not changed much since. To be falsely accused of rape is terrible. I wasn’t guilty of anything but had to prove it. I have tried to rebuild my life ever since the court case but have found it near impossible. As a pro you have to try and cope but it’s so hard.

bigfatronssba said:

My issue isn't whether he done it or not, I accept the verdict of the court. Its about who administers justice in this country. The law, or the mob?

Ched Evans is a free man, entitled to the same things in life as the rest of us. Who, other than a court, has the right to interfere in his life? He was sentenced to X amount of years in prison, not X amount of years in prison and no playing football ever again.

Also my heart goes out to Clayton McDonald. He done nothing wrong and has had to go through hell. Imagine if you had your whole life turned upside down despite doing nothing illegal? Imagine having to prove your innocence? Imagine it was you saying this:

I was cleared of rape but Ched’s case and subsequent publicity have destroyed my life and career. I had a year of hell leading up the trial, and it’s not changed much since. To be falsely accused of rape is terrible. I wasn’t guilty of anything but had to prove it. I have tried to rebuild my life ever since the court case but have found it near impossible. As a pro you have to try and cope but it’s so hard.

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The court administered justice. And there's no confusion here, Evans legally has got every right to play football again, and the supporters and sponsors that he's going to represent have got every right to say that they don't want him because of his previous conviction (and possibly subsequent lack of remorse). It's for potential employers to decide whether they want to employ him against the wishes of those people. Just because your opinion differs from theirs doesn't make them a 'mob' - he's chosen to try to revive his career in a public arena, and some of the public have spoken against it, whilst some like you choose to support it.*

Ched Evans is a free man in that he is released from jail, but actually because of his crime he is categorically not entitled to the same things as the rest of us. He cannot, for example, work as a policeman, or a doctor, or a teacher - and is a registered sex offender. So the years served in prison clearly do not completely wipe the slate clean for any man convicted of such an offence. The courts do not make a judgement on whether he is entitled to return to his previous career one way or another, that's down to his potential employers, and were he a professional such as those mentioned, the standards of behaviour required by his professional body.

As for McDonald, he may have done nothing illegal, but I'm not sure that I'd agree that he did nothing wrong - that's a matter of opinion and taste though I guess, and I'll leave you to read through the details of the case and decide for yourself whether you'd consider his behaviour acceptable. As for his life being hell in the run up to the trial, I've already said that I'd favour anonymity in such cases. Regardless, having been found not guilty he should have been free to get on with his life, I'd say.

I've got more concern for the victim here in truth, and the other ones that might be too scared to come forward as a result of the ongoing and illegal campaign against her. Now there's what I'd call an attempt at mob-justice.

*Edit: That's your right too by the way, supporting what I'm sure you'd argue is his right to play professional football without hindrance. I'm not suggesting for a moment that you're supporting what he's done.

He's a rapist. He is NOT a role model for youngsters who want to watch a game of football. THAT is why he shouldn't be in the public spotlight, earning thousands a week! If he wants to work, fine, let him. But keep him away from the public spectacle of a football pitch. He can sweep the bloody streets if he wants a job!

duffer said:

The court administered justice. And there's no confusion here, Evans legally has got every right to play football again, and the supporters and sponsors that he's going to represent have got every right to say that they don't want him because of his previous conviction (and possibly subsequent lack of remorse). It's for potential employers to decide whether they want to employ him against the wishes of those people. Just because your opinion differs from theirs doesn't make them a 'mob' - he's chosen to try to revive his career in a public arena, and some of the public have spoken against it, whilst some like you choose to support it.*

Ched Evans is a free man in that he is released from jail, but actually because of his crime he is categorically not entitled to the same things as the rest of us. He cannot, for example, work as a policeman, or a doctor, or a teacher - and is a registered sex offender. So the years served in prison clearly do not completely wipe the slate clean for any man convicted of such an offence. The courts do not make a judgement on whether he is entitled to return to his previous career one way or another, that's down to his potential employers, and were he a professional such as those mentioned, the standards of behaviour required by his professional body.

As for McDonald, he may have done nothing illegal, but I'm not sure that I'd agree that he did nothing wrong - that's a matter of opinion and taste though I guess, and I'll leave you to read through the details of the case and decide for yourself whether you'd consider his behaviour acceptable. As for his life being hell in the run up to the trial, I've already said that I'd favour anonymity in such cases. Regardless, having been found not guilty he should have been free to get on with his life, I'd say.

I've got more concern for the victim here in truth, and the other ones that might be too scared to come forward as a result of the ongoing and illegal campaign against her. Now there's what I'd call an attempt at mob-justice.

*Edit: That's your right too by the way, supporting what I'm sure you'd argue is his right to play professional football without hindrance. I'm not suggesting for a moment that you're supporting what he's done.

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I take most of your points there, but I can't agree with you on McDonald I'm afraid. I don't agree that he did anything worse than most young lads on a night out.

Also, regarding mob rule, I wasn't saying that members of the public shouldnt be allowed an opinion, just that I really disliked the witch hunt mentality of it all.

Houchens Head said:

He's a rapist. He is NOT a role model for youngsters who want to watch a game of football. THAT is why he shouldn't be in the public spotlight, earning thousands a week! If he wants to work, fine, let him. But keep him away from the public spectacle of a football pitch. He can sweep the bloody streets if he wants a job!

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Most footballers aren't role models anyway. As I said before Gary Madine isn't exactly someone I would want my kids looking up to.

The way that crass website of his villainises the girl says everything about him. If he wasn't a footballer than he wouldn't be getting his case reviewed in the manner in which he is. He is a scumbag who deserves everything he gets and hopefully his actions will blight his life forever.

bigfatronssba said:

Most footballers aren't role models anyway. As I said before Gary Madine isn't exactly someone I would want my kids looking up to.

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I agree. If you are a parent and your son/daughter sees a footballer as a role model then something is wrong in my opinion.

bigfatronssba said:

Most footballers aren't role models anyway. As I said before Gary Madine isn't exactly someone I would want my kids looking up to.

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Maybe not role models but they are idols, if kids love football they will idolise players in their clubs or on the world stage i.e. Messi, Ronaldo etc. If they are in the limelight and do something silly, dont kids think this is acceptable??

I see that Steve Bruce has now started sticking up for him. I wonder if the 'everyday man' would be shown so much sympathy and be allowed to return to their old job? Football is even more misogynistic than I thought.